Sorry but what level of detail do you actually require? Do you doubt that he at very least shot at the police officer with intent to main and murder and that the response was appropriate?

The Berlin Police appear to be a bit Keystone Cops in their handling of the whole matter.

Understood your post.
He came onto sec serv radar in germany because of his connection to the group surrounding Abul Waala. Small fry connected to "king pin" recruiter.

WSJ article as previously linked, or here's another from the Sun from last month:
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/213829...-morning-raid/

I really have no idea of the state of his mental health, it's not something I've thought about.

Why do you think it's a choice between (a) the attack being part of a planned and sophisticated ISIS operation, or (b) the perpetrator being mentally ill? That seems like a completely false dichotomy to me.

Well of course this guy was heavily influenced by ISIS. But the way he carried out the attack and then attempted to flee looks rather amateurish (in marked contrast to, say, the Paris attacks).

I mean, leaving your identity papers in the truck, not wearing gloves, travelling by train out of the country and wandering the Milan streets at 3 in the morning. Not exactly a criminal genius, was he?

But hey, for all I know there isn't any sophisticated ISIS network and all the attacks have been as amateurish as this one. Maybe I'm giving them too much credit for organisation,

They're not mutually exclusive factors, of course.

Well just a little more detail than "police shot suspect" before I feel satisfied all was done before shooting someone.

I would like others here have preferred they didnt shoot to kill the gunman, so they could face a trial and maybe more info come out . But I accept sometimes police sometimes don't have a choice

Fact that he chose a detour thru France ( bypassingAus or Switz ) offers grist to the mill of Marine Le Pen?

I never said that I simply asked what you thought his motives were? You must have an opinion on the matter as you have already expressed the opinion that he wasn't linked to
ISIS.

For the record my opinion is that his motives were to kill infidels in the name of Islam in the bizarre belief that such an action will quicken the establishment of s worldwide caliphate in which Muslim men will have s permanent and unchallenged position at the head of society. In this he was inspired by the Nice attack and the goading of ISIS itself to use heavy vehicles as weapons.

What's your opinion as to his motives?

Well he was probably all full of bottle until it actually went down. Blowing yourself up means a definite end but driving a truck comes with all the aftermath and jihad goes out and human kicks in.

Pakistani Muslims don't believe on homosexuality. However, wherever a lot of men are together and there are no women, they just have sex with each other. But they are not gay

As previously posted upthread, intelligence experts had warned that a series of limited, "exploratory attacks" were planned. This may have been one of those and explain the somewhat haphazard execution.

ETA or as per Sifter

Murderous but connected amateur who seized his opportunity when the Polish driver parked up? The mosque he used is only a 15 min walk from the depot where the Pole tried to deliver his steel.

Just been seeing that . l hope so too, we can but hope for the best outcome here for all these people

But what details specifically? For a guy who seeks truth you're very reluctant to supply it yourself.

We live in an age of 24 hour news channels and cameras on every phone, and the updates have been in more or less real time from my observation. What specific details do you believe have been kept from you?

Seems like you are determined to misunderstand what I am saying.


My problem was with the people who said "good" at the news that the suspect had been shot, they didn't know any details other than that. I prefer to wait till more info comes in. Like where and why was he shot.

Where did I say he wasn't linked to ISIS? It seems as if you've taken my post and gone off on a tangent.

My point, to restate it, is that this attack and the man's actions afterwards look pretty amateurish. Perhaps that's because it was - it's not difficult to hijack a truck and drive it into a group of people, after all. My impression of ISIS is that they're a sophisticated group with a network of people across Europe - that something like this would be planned carefully, including ways to get the person out of the country afterwards. Established ways for people to get across borders while minimising the risk, providing fake identity papers, contacts in different cities who could provide people with a place to stay, that kind of thing.

But this attack looks like it was carried out by someone who, while undoubtedly being heavily influenced by ISIS and having links to them, pretty much decided to act on his own. It doesn't look sophisticated. In fact he looks like an idiot. If he'd worn gloves and not dropped his identity papers, they'd have had real difficulty catching him. And aside from being an idiot, it seems no one really helped him to flee after the attack either (I mean, he had 24 hours to get out! He could've been in Tunisia before they even knew it was him).

But as I said before, perhaps I'm simply wrong to assume ISIS are very organized. Perhaps it really is just individuals carrying out these attacks, without any strong organisational network behind them. Perhaps ISIS operates in this more haphazard way rather than with sophisticated world-wide planning (attacks like 9/11 aside).

There was a news report recently that showed Pakistan as having the highest number of downloads of gay porn...

It's similar to a (ultra macho, rugby playing, Alpha male) friend of mine who would never admit to being gay but likes going to gay dogging sites to get guys to give him BJs as it's "kinky".

It's all basically a load of lies...

But it's already been established where and why he was shot. He was shot in Milan because he fired at a police officer who had asked him for his ID. Do you have reason to doubt these reports? If so what are those reasons? The circumstances have been confirmed by multiple sources, not least of which are the Italian police.

Agreed, "murderous but connected amateur who seized his opportunity" seems pretty spot on.

I should have thought that a police officer being shot when asking for an ID was a reasonable response. What would you have liked the officer to do? Leave the shot officer on the ground and politely request to double-check the ID? Go and call for back-up, thus leaving an armed gunman, who had just proved he had no hesitation in using the gun, to go on his merry way? Say ' hang on a minute whilst I try and aim at your kneecap?

A specially trained marksman, in a controlled situation, may indeed have been able to bring down the man without killing him. A police officer, next to a shot colleague, at 3am, would have been in fear of his own life and acted accordingly

I'm another who doesn't quite understand. Before "the suspect" was shot (because he shot an Italian policeman), he had been identified as Amri Anis by his fingerprints on the outside and inside of the hijacked lorry. His fingerprints were on file because he had served several years in prison for setting fire to a refugee centre. Prior to that he had left Tunisia because he was wanted for armed robbery. During his time in prison in Italy he is recorded as bullying other prisoners and was consequently held in six different prisons in Sicily. All those details were known when he was on the run.

He then shot a policeman and was shot and killed in response at which point it was discovered by his fingerprints he was indeed Amri Anis. The gun he shot the policeman with was reported as being the same gun the Polish driver of the lorry was killed with. All this was reported when the announcement of his death was made.

For goodness sake. My post was aimed at those who said GOOD before any other details were given . What part of that are you not getting?

Seems like this is a habit of yours, replying too people to fast and not taking in what they are saying. Please do not reply to me again with the same type of post. I have clarified what I meant for you three or four times now!

I think that the truth is somewhere in the middle. Their propaganda machine is very well organised and slick. In their strongholds they are also well organised and have resources at hand to make them operationally very effective.

Their operations within Europe seem to depend on a bit of a mix of followers - some sophisticated and capable and others who are intent on committing atrocities but without any great planning skills. ISIS is without the organised structure of other groups such as the IRA. Any nutcase can watch a few videos online, claim to be one of them and then run around killing people.

I think there are probably far more along the lines of the guys in Four Lions than we realise.

They would be saying good on the assumption it was this man, and regardless if he opened fire on a policeman or not, I will say it is good that this evil scumbag is dead.

I didn't say "this is what they should have done" I said I would have like the man taken alive
What part of "But I accept sometimes police sometimes don't have a choice" do you not get?

I am allowed to say that of course its better to take people alive to get more info from them for any accomplices that does not mean I think the police were wrong. I wasn't there.. Nor were you.