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Can they "force" me to go???? |
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#1 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 383
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Can they "force" me to go????
I sell cars for a living, and we have the launch of a new model in March 2017.
I have been asked to attend a pre-launch presentation of the car for dealer sales staff which I think is being held in Slovakia. I have a fear of flying, which is getting worse the older I get. Can't remember the last holiday I had where we had to fly, we normally go to France for a fortnight in the Summer as it means I can drive down. I appreciate all of the arguments that I am statistically more likely to die driving to the airport than on the actual flight, but even so, I hate flying. There is absolutely nothing I will be shown over there that I couldn't "pick up" myself prior to the UK launch. Could my company "force" me to go??? |
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#2 |
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Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 8,031
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no they can't, but they could potentially terminate your employment. particularly if your contract requires you to attend such events
you could potentially drive there or use other sources of transport. closer the time you may be ill and not able to attend. your issue sounds like it may cause an illness to flair up near the time |
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#3 |
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Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 2,777
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I'd keep stum, not tell a soul that you don't want to go, and pull a tummy bug sickie. Do people at the company know about your fear of flying?
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#4 |
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Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 25,048
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They can't force you, no, but a refusal could affect your potential for advancement with the company.
A lot depends on how long you've been with the company, how good you are otherwise at selling cars ( in other words, how dispensable you are ) and whether the travelling was specified at interview or in your contract. Pullling a sickie at the last minute will work only if you know that the situation will never arise again. You can't get away with that more than once. And bear in mind they will have shelled out on flights and hotels etc in anticipation. They won't be happy if that all goes to waste, even if they believe you are genuinely sick. |
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#5 |
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Join Date: May 2009
Location: Edinburgh
Posts: 9,454
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You can get from London to Bratislava by train in 22 hours.
I would suggest being open with the management, I doubt they'll resort to "Mr T"-style solutions for you. |
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#6 |
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Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Edinburgh
Posts: 8,946
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Quote:
You can get from London to Bratislava by train in 22 hours.
I would suggest being open with the management, I doubt they'll resort to "Mr T"-style solutions for you. We had a guy in our work who suffered from flying fear - we just got someone else to fly where road / train travel wasn't appropriate. You can, of course, go to your doctor and get him/her to sign a letter confirming your illness (yes - it IS an illness - aerophobia). This, they cannot ignore. |
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#7 |
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 383
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Quote:
They can't force you, no, but a refusal could affect your potential for advancement with the company.
A lot depends on how long you've been with the company, how good you are otherwise at selling cars ( in other words, how dispensable you are ) and whether the travelling was specified at interview or in your contract. Pullling a sickie at the last minute will work only if you know that the situation will never arise again. You can't get away with that more than once. And bear in mind they will have shelled out on flights and hotels etc in anticipation. They won't be happy if that all goes to waste, even if they believe you are genuinely sick. I am the top salesman throughout the group (we are a 5 showroom dealership) so whilst I would not say I am "indispensable" I feel that my job is as secure as it could be. My contract states that I must attend manufacturer training "as required" but makes no mention of foreign travel, but to be fair my phobia has got worse over the last few years. It wouldn't have been a problem when I sat my initial interview. |
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#8 |
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Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 25,048
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Can you negotiate with management to go by train as suggested up thread?
Personally, if it were me, I'd rather go by train anyway. Train journeys are much more interesting than planes. |
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#9 |
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 383
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Quote:
Can you negotiate with management to go by train as suggested up thread?
Personally, if it were me, I'd rather go by train anyway. Train journeys are much more interesting than planes. Nice idea but I think that this option wouldn't even be made available to me. |
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#10 |
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Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 25,048
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Ah right. That does change things.
One word of caution. If you do decide to throw a sickie you need to be absolutely sure that nobody at work will be reading this. Unlikely, I know, but I also know from personal experience on here what a small world it is. |
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#11 |
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: South West
Posts: 3,279
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Quote:
Can you negotiate with management to go by train as suggested up thread?
Personally, if it were me, I'd rather go by train anyway. Train journeys are much more interesting than planes. If you wanted to be really accommodating you could offer to use some of your holiday, but I can't see why you should have to do this, as it is the company that is insisting you travel. |
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#12 |
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 383
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Quote:
Ah right. That does change things.
One word of caution. If you do decide to throw a sickie you need to be absolutely sure that nobody at work will be reading this. Unlikely, I know, but I also know from personal experience on here what a small world it is. I'll just explain the situation clearly to them and if they insist then I will go to Doc's and get a letter. |
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#13 |
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: South West
Posts: 3,279
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Some people have had success in overcoming their fear of flying by attending courses or by using prescribed medication. Of course you would have to be sure that any medicine didn't affect your ability to drive!
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#14 |
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Join Date: May 2011
Location: Just here, inside my head.
Posts: 5,279
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Get pissed..👍😊
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#15 |
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Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 23
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What have you tried to overcome this fear?
I do think just refusing to go is only pushing the problem away, but it won't go away will it? There will be times in your life perhaps when you really need to fly, so can't you take this as the opportunity to sort this once and for all? I won't do links or talk of help because I'm not sure what you have tried. You just sound totally accepting of the situation and I think you ought to be fighting againt it and getting all the help you can to overcome it. I know of someone who did and her life opened up as a result. |
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#16 |
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Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Whimberry picking on t'hill
Posts: 3,589
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Quote:
You can get from London to Bratislava by train in 22 hours.
I would suggest being open with the management, I doubt they'll resort to "Mr T"-style solutions for you. Be adult about it. Edit: I have just read a previous post which explains why the above is probably not possible. I say probably because if your employers really want you to be there, they maybe prepared to pay your rail fare. Maybe March is a little too soon to really do anything major about dealing with your fear of flying. However, a similar situation could arise in the future and any phobia can be overcome with patience and commitment. Give it a try. |
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#17 |
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Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 3,406
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Quote:
You can get from London to Bratislava by train in 22 hours.
I would suggest being open with the management, I doubt they'll resort to "Mr T"-style solutions for you. What would do is my doctor and discuss make some tranquiler s for the flight or them writing a reference about it could be mentally damaging re the stress for you to do so, its basically anxiety which s we know a real problem in sufferers. I wouid offer to travel in my own time off the clock but negotiate for them to pay the fare of course. Just offering up a solution may win to brownie points and they may just say now dont worry we will train you here. But then you do run the risk that the manager may say, ih pull yourself together you big baby and that point I would be looking for a new job anyway. |
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#18 |
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Join Date: May 2009
Location: Devon
Posts: 12,835
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How about asking one of the other Sales Staff to go. Many would jump at a Jolly.
If they hoover up all the leaflets etc, they can give you a nice carrier bag full of bumpf on their return and give you the low down. At my last company, we tried to rotate who got to go on business trips and training courses anyway. |
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#19 |
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Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 135
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Just tell them that you don't have a passport.
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#20 |
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Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 11,776
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I don't fly either OP and made it clear from the off that that was the case. In my experience, if you make it very clear, in a very straightforward way that you don't fly it doesn't come up. If you have a new manager, restate the point that you don't fly and ask if they would like you to attend by train or Skype into the meeting (or whatever it is).
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#21 |
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Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 3,994
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I spent my entire working life with this problem. I was expected to fly to conferences and for work more generally. When I was younger I took every opportunity to fly as often as possible, once a week for quite a long time, in the hope that familiarity would "cure" my phobia. It made no difference! I never lost my fear and dislike of flying. Towards the latter part of my career I decided to be open with my employer. They accepted the situation but I think it may have limited my career progression. As it happened I didn't mind too much. Now I'm retired I choose not to fly and am much happier about it.
If it's not an imperative to fly to keep your job then I think openness with an employer is probably best. If it's not then they're probably not an employer worth working for anyway. As someone suggested earlier, if you can offer ways to get around any difficulties arising by not being able to fly to take part in technical training or whatever then all the better. Good luck with it!
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#22 |
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Join Date: May 2009
Location: Edinburgh
Posts: 9,454
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Quote:
Just tell them that you don't have a passport.
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#23 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 383
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Thanks for all of your replies and advice. Much appreciated.
I went to have a chat with our senior manager yesterday (sales manager was off for the day) to explain the situation. Whilst he was sympathetic, he said that the manufacturer (Nissan) have stated that there are to be "no exceptions". I then commented that I couldn't envisage anybody from Nissan trying to drag me kicking and screaming into the 'plane... ![]() ![]() He has said he will contact Nissan to explain the situation, I suggested getting a letter from my GP confirming my "phobia" which he said would obviously help. My sales manager is back in today, and will no doubt ask if I have bought my passport in with me (he text me on my day off on Weds to request this). Somehow I don't think the conversation with him is going to go down quite as calmly as it did with my senior manager. Will keep you posted. Thanks again. |
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#24 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,546
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Whilst I appreciate that it is not your situation there are many people who cannot fly for medical reasons so Nissan's attitude is unreasonable.
You could point that out to your Sales Manager if they decide to be difficult. Unless you were recruited specifically with the proviso that you would need to fly and the job cannot be done if you are unable to I don't really think they can make you go. |
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#25 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: South
Posts: 10,847
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Quote:
I agree - be open with your management - just tell them you have a fear of flying. Under Health & Safety rules, they cannot ignore and force you to fly. And unless your contract specifically says you must be able to travel by air, then they cannot sack you without good grounds for you to go to tribunal.
We had a guy in our work who suffered from flying fear - we just got someone else to fly where road / train travel wasn't appropriate. You can, of course, go to your doctor and get him/her to sign a letter confirming your illness (yes - it IS an illness - aerophobia). This, they cannot ignore. Essentially there are two issues here: 1. The company cannot add flying/foreign travel as a prerequisite to your job if it was not agreed on before. It doens't necessary have to be in your contract but the company would have to prove that it was made clear to you when you started that you would need to fly. If you've been in your role for any more than a year without flying than that pretty much voids any argument the company has that travel was necessary for your job. 2. Even if the above is the case, under discrimination legislation the company most make all reasonable accommodations if you have an illness that impacts your job. They can only dismiss you if it absolutely clear that you can't perform your role because of it - which in this situation would be pretty much impossible for them. Obviously the business world (especially sales) doesn't always follow the rules and you could find that your employment opportunities with them are effected - just make yourself aware of the law and be prepared to fight them if it comes down to it. |
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