If I recollect it was a government reliant on Scottish and Welsh MPs that took us into the Iraq war.

Can you name a recent war the UK entered into which only England supported?

The EU wants an EU army - if they have their way there will soon be exactly the situation you describe. Why have an EU army otherwise if you don't intend to use it?

PS Scotland and Wales are not independent nations - indeed in 2014 the former said very clearly they didn't want to be.

Not an answer to my question but you have form for that v

A country still retains its sovereignty. It is a voluntary organisation. As we see with the UK, you can leave if you so wish

You are the one who stated regarding Scotland's status -


Utter twaddle.

No it isn't. I have no problem with any country wanting to be independent. It's what we're in the process of doing now. But don't pretend that giving your sovereignty to Brussels and having your economic policy decided on by the ECB makes you independent. It doesn't. Stand on your own two feet. Get your own currency if that's the case. And may I remind you a majority of your country voted to stay as part of the UK? They know a good thing when they see it.

You recall incorrectly.

You could have taken every Scottish, Northern Irish and Welsh MP who voted for the Iraq war and switched them to the against side and the for side would still have won.

They did. Over two years ago. On the promises of retaining EU membership and super-duper Devolution-max.

Neither of which has transpired.

Member States have agreed "the Union must have the capacity for autonomous action, backed up by credible military forces, the means to decide to use them, and a readiness to do so, in order to respond to international crises".

The EU has the Common Security and Defence Policy (CSDP) and the European Security Strategy (ESS). This includes both defence and military actions abroad.

The Lisbon treaty includes a mutual assistance and a solidarity clause and allows for the creation of a European External Action Service (EEAS) under the authority of the High Representative of the Union for Foreign Affairs & Security Policy/Vice-President of the European Commission.

The defence pact is pretty strong. ‘if a Member State is the victim of armed aggression on its territory, the other Member States shall have towards it an obligation of aid and assistance by all the means in their power"

EU led military actions abroad including in non-EU nations are limited to the Petersberg tasks which include
joint disarmament operations
humanitarian and rescue tasks
military advice and assistance tasks
conflict prevention and peace-keeping tasks
tasks of combat forces in crisis management
peace-making and post-conflict stabilisation.
supporting third countries in combating terrorism in their territories.

The EU has
The General Affairs Council (GAC), including, when appropriate, national defence ministers.
The Political and Security Committee (PSC), consisting of representatives at ambassador level with political/military (pol/mil) expertise.
The EU Military Committee consisting of military representatives that make recommendations to the PSC.
An EU Military Staff including a Situation Centre and if needed satellite situation centres.
Military personnel for EU military actions are provide on loan from EU member state military forces.
The EU also has arrangements that allow the EU to make use of NATO assets and capabilities.

There are currently 16 EU led military operations taking place around the world from Afghanistan to Somalia to Ukraine to Libya, etc.

It is, you just don't like it. Hilarious to see your utter lack of irony given the unanswered question from me to you on the other thread.

There were no promises made about retaining EU membership. Even if they were, you'd have to be as thick as two short planks to believe it seeing as the EU referendum was announced by then.

The (developed) world has changed radically since the 1930s. This is the era of the internet and globalisation and migration (and people being able to emigrate for a few months or a few years and then return home). The age of hard borders and customs posts and sovereign nation states living in splendid isolation is at an end.

Really? I'd tell the rest of the world outside the EU that. They don't appear to be receiving that message.

Most countries around the world have relatively open relations with their nearest neighbours ie. freedom of movement of some description and free trade deals with them.

The UK has around 30 such countries on its doorstep but bizarrely is trying to distance itself from them and make it much more difficult for people to migrate either backwards or forwards. If we look at the title of this thread, that is certainly a form of isolationism.

Most countries in the world do not enter political union, unless they're in the EU. Most countries in the world are not failing economically and politically. Unless there in the EU. We are not distancing ourselves at all from the other member countries. We just don't want to be intertwined politically in the disastrous EU.

The EU is not failing economically, it's growing nicely:

http://www.tradingeconomics.com/euro...al-growth-rate

An even bigger form of isolationism is when conditions in countries like Ireland and Scotland have forced their peoples to bugger of to somewhere better.

Perhaps you could explain why Ireland comfortably currently has a higher foreign born population per head to that of Briatin?

Yes it is. It's the only area of the world where trade is declining. Growth is flat in the Eirozone in the last 10 years.

The EU is growing economically.
I could list atleast 15 countries within the EU which will grow faster than Briatin in 2016 and 2017.

Growth has been flat for the last 10 years in the Eurozone. And it's the only block in the world whose share of world trade is declining.

But most Scottish and Welsh MPs backed it ddnt they as Labour was in government

Because they desperately need them to replace those who have left over a long period of time. The increased birth rate in Ireland is almost certainly largely due to immigrant births but your population is still well below what it was nearly two hundred years ago.

Or perhaps Ireland is a dynamic and prosperous country.
Ireland currently has net immigration.
A country that is outward looking and embraces the EU.
A country with an excellent education system and highest 3rd level achievement of its people per head in the EU.
A country that attracts the big, big American and other multinationals to come and do business here.
A country that does not have a right wing xenophobic media.

They are just a few examples.

All of which has little to do with what I wrote.

A common remoaner tactic.

History (assuming that's not one of your #madeupfacts) it's growing nicely now:

http://www.tradingeconomics.com/euro...al-growth-rate

Being the only "block" without developing countries. And you seemed terrified of answering questions on that claim earlier, preferring to spend your time hypocritically demanding answers from others.