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Electoral fraud: Voters will have to show ID in pilot scheme


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Old 28-12-2016, 03:06
Tassium
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The Conservatives are engaged in widespread gerrymandering and it's Labour who need to be watched...

That's the sort of propaganda that is endless these days.



People should be concerned about where this country is heading under the Conservatives and especially Theresa May.
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Old 28-12-2016, 07:04
tim59
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What happens if Royal Mail tries to deliver a parcel and you are out and you have to collect from the Post Office? Or do you never leave the house (other than to vote).
Very simple, i would take bank statement council tax bill and other things like this with me, and say i have no form of photo ID, also you can tell them that in the uk there is no law which states every person must carry or have photo. And just remember the law says you need a passport to leave and enter the uk and the law says you need to driving licence to drive on uk roads. So if you dont do either you have no need for either. And just to add if you check on royal mail website it lists the forms of ID you can show, it does NOT say you must have photo ID
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Old 28-12-2016, 07:39
Gordon g
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They interviewed some people abut this on the BBC yesterday. An Asian lady piped up that this wouldn't stop Asian voters being coerced into voting a certain way, and the interviewer didn't know how respond.
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Old 28-12-2016, 08:45
noise747
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Anything to discourage people from voting.
Yep, and it do not take much to make me think why bother.
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Old 28-12-2016, 08:47
noise747
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I only have an old paper licence as I have lived at the same address for 26 years and have never had to update it.

I don't have a passport either for the very simple reason that I don't go abroad.
And i expect there are plenty of people like us. i know many people who do not drive and they may have had a passport, but have not bothered to renew it or just do not have a passport./
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Old 28-12-2016, 08:51
niceguy1966
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BIB: They just don't give a shit.
What a nasty comment. There are many people that have unpredictable jobs and have no control over whether they will be a short walk from their polling station on a random Thursday. Far more people in this situation than everyone ever elected due to voter fraud.
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Old 28-12-2016, 08:51
noise747
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If Pickles claims that ID will be "no more than would be required to pick a parcel up at the Post Office" and if it is likely that the appetite for tackling voter fraud will be limited to photo ID, then by that process of deliberation, provisional driving licences and PASS accredited ID will NOT be accepted as valid forms of photo ID - that'll make the forms of ID accepted very limited and costly. Just for clarification, the forms of ID accepted at the Post Office as Pickles claims:

http://www.postoffice.co.uk/mail/collection-services

Labour are right to be concerned.
The only thing I need to pick a parcel up at the post office is the card that says a parcel is at the post office and my debit card to show who I am.

i do not see why we need more ID anyway, we get a polling card through the post, so why can't we use that?
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Old 28-12-2016, 08:53
razorboy
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And i expect there are plenty of people like us. i know many people who do not drive and they may have had a passport, but have not bothered to renew it or just do not have a passport./
The vast majority of my friends do not have a driving licence and quite a few do not have a passport. My friend who is blind was refused a braille driving licence, they would not even issue one for his guide dog.
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Old 28-12-2016, 08:53
noise747
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Whats the big deal? Just bring your driving licence or passport. I agree with the government on this one.
Not everyone have got a driving licence or passport, have you not read any replies in this thread?
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Old 28-12-2016, 08:55
noise747
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Get one. Don't be so helpless.
Why should we? I do not drive, I have a motorbike licence, but it is a paper one and since i do not ride motobikes anymore, I have no need to update it, I have not been out of the country for years and have no intention of doing so, so why would I need to go through the hassle and expense of getting a passport?
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Old 28-12-2016, 08:56
razorboy
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Very simple, i would take bank statement council tax bill and other things like this with me, and say i have no form of photo ID, also you can tell them that in the uk there is no law which states every person must carry or have photo. And just remember the law says you need a passport to leave and enter the uk and the law says you need to driving licence to drive on uk roads. So if you dont do either you have no need for either. And just to add if you check on royal mail website it lists the forms of ID you can show, it does NOT say you must have photo ID
You can also get someone else to collect the parcel for you or ask them to deliver on another day or redirect to another address.
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Old 28-12-2016, 08:59
noise747
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I explain to my son who has just turned 18
People have died for the right for you to vote in elections in this country.
I don't care who you vote for - but you WILL go and vote.
Yes, people have died for people to have that right, but it is also the right of people not to vote, i think at 18 your son have the right to choose if he wants to vote or not.
If my parents said that when I was his age, i would not be happy.
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Old 28-12-2016, 14:28
Watcher #1
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Yes, people have died for people to have that right, but it is also the right of people not to vote, i think at 18 your son have the right to choose if he wants to vote or not.
If my parents said that when I was his age, i would not be happy.
Agreed - I'm encouraging my kids to vote when they turn 18, but they don't have to. Choosing the least bad option isn't something everyone wants to do, and if you live in a safe seat like I do, a protest vote isn't going to register
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Old 28-12-2016, 14:44
Morlock
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Most companies issue photo ID...
Do they, or are you just guessing?
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Old 28-12-2016, 14:47
MARTYM8
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The only thing I need to pick a parcel up at the post office is the card that says a parcel is at the post office and my debit card to show who I am.

i do not see why we need more ID anyway, we get a polling card through the post, so why can't we use that?
Polling cards can be intercepted - not everyone lives in a house with their own letterbox.

Perhaps I could borrow your debit card and pretend to be you. After all there is no photo on it so presumably it's ok for anyone to use it?
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Old 28-12-2016, 14:54
Mark_Jones9
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They interviewed some people abut this on the BBC yesterday. An Asian lady piped up that this wouldn't stop Asian voters being coerced into voting a certain way, and the interviewer didn't know how respond.
Maybe because what the Asain lady said was nonsense. If a imposter is using your vote at a polling station it is not you being coerced to vote a certain way.
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Old 28-12-2016, 14:55
Morlock
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I explain to my son who has just turned 18
People have died for the right for you to vote in elections in this country.
I don't care who you vote for - but you WILL go and vote.
Only if he has the correct ID.
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Old 28-12-2016, 16:00
briggsy1
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Is this opening the way for another debate on whether we should all carry ID cards? Please god, we aren't going to have to go through years of that debate again.
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Old 28-12-2016, 16:26
jjwales
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Agreed - I'm encouraging my kids to vote when they turn 18, but they don't have to. Choosing the least bad option isn't something everyone wants to do, and if you live in a safe seat like I do, a protest vote isn't going to register
It sort of does when the national votes for minor parties are tallied up. So UKIP can point to its 4m votes as an argument for PR, for example.
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Old 28-12-2016, 16:28
jjwales
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Is this opening the way for another debate on whether we should all carry ID cards? Please god, we aren't going to have to go through years of that debate again.
Know what you mean. I've already seen the "nothing to hide, nothing to fear" nonsense on another forum in a discussion about national borders.
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Old 28-12-2016, 17:16
Dotheboyshall
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Is this opening the way for another debate on whether we should all carry ID cards? Please god, we aren't going to have to go through years of that debate again.
They can be used to stop terrorism, stop health tourism, stop benefit fraud, prove your entitlements, make the tea and a rather nice fruit scone.
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Old 28-12-2016, 17:20
Nodger
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What a nasty comment. There are many people that have unpredictable jobs and have no control over whether they will be a short walk from their polling station on a random Thursday. Far more people in this situation than everyone ever elected due to voter fraud.
Some people just do not give a shit about politics or voting. Nasty comment or an actual actuality 66? Well, which is it?

You know full well that that is a real world actuality and not the result of a few people who can't find the time between 7am and 10pm to attend a polling station. Of course, if their circumstances require it, there's postal voting to. Or are you actually trying to claim your scenario for 'lets say' the 36% who didn't vote on a 64% turnout result? Put a % (a tiny one that is in reality) on your scenario and what would you call those that are left, I say they don't give shit.

Let's go a stage further, 25% turnout for a Police & Crime Commisioner vote, did the other 75% all fall into your category or mine?

Edit: Oh, and it's not a "random" Thursday either is it? Stop making things up as you go along 66.
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Old 29-12-2016, 10:54
DianaFire
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And i expect there are plenty of people like us. i know many people who do not drive and they may have had a passport, but have not bothered to renew it or just do not have a passport./
Lots of young people in particular don't have driving licences or passports, and they're not householders. A move like this could in effect disenfranchise many voters aged 24 and under.

I didn't get a passport until last year.
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Old 29-12-2016, 11:03
Doctor_Wibble
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Is there a list somewhere of people who were fraudulently elected? I hadn't realised there were quite so many.
I've looked through the thread and don't see an answer to this question, which is surely an important one when proposing a solution to something, i.e. the confirmation that the problem (a) exists to the degree implied and (b) is actually addressed by the measures proposed?
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Old 29-12-2016, 11:09
niceguy1966
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Some people just do not give a shit about politics or voting. Nasty comment or an actual actuality 66? Well, which is it?

You know full well that that is a real world actuality and not the result of a few people who can't find the time between 7am and 10pm to attend a polling station. Of course, if their circumstances require it, there's postal voting to. Or are you actually trying to claim your scenario for 'lets say' the 36% who didn't vote on a 64% turnout result? Put a % (a tiny one that is in reality) on your scenario and what would you call those that are left, I say they don't give shit.

Let's go a stage further, 25% turnout for a Police & Crime Commisioner vote, did the other 75% all fall into your category or mine?

Edit: Oh, and it's not a "random" Thursday either is it? Stop making things up as you go along 66.
You made a very nasty comment, grouping everyone using postal votes together and insulting all of them. Now you try to pretend you and Annesyre were discussing people that don't vote, rather than people that do vote using the postal vote option. Re-read the comment you replied to. And even if Annesyre had been commenting on people that didn't vote, that's their right too. No need to be nasty to them either.

And yes, it is a random Thursday. Do you really expect any employer to set rotas so that all employees can be at home on election days?
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