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Hit and run in Oldham


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Old 01-01-2017, 20:10
Hieronymous
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I don't wish to appear callous but, from the TV pictures I saw*, these two girls were crossing the road just yards away from a pelican crossing! The more vulnerable the road user the greater the stupidity it seems.

Not that any of this exonerates the driver, of course.


*I was visiting my Mother at the time in case and before anyone picks me up on that.
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Old 01-01-2017, 20:14
tim59
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I don't wish to appear callous but, from the TV pictures I saw*, these two girls were crossing the road just yards away from a pelican crossing! The more vulnerable the road user the greater the stupidity it seems.

Not that any of this exonerates the driver, of course.


*I was visiting my Mother at the time in case and before anyone picks me up on that.
Would have them crossing at pelican crossing stopped a hit and run driver from hiting them then driving of without stopping ?
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Old 01-01-2017, 20:28
miss_astrid
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Slightly off-topic, but the pictures I saw of the girls made them look more like 16-18 year olds than 12 year olds. Do a lot of 12 year olds wear makeup to that extent these days?

Needless to say I hope the driver is caught. No excuse for hitting and running - had the driver stopped and got medical assistance, may the girl that died be alive now I wonder?

Very sad.
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Old 01-01-2017, 20:29
Grouty
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Terrible

Only a matter of time before the scumbags caught.
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Old 01-01-2017, 20:32
Mr_Bee
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How can people just drive off and have something like that on their conscience? They must have known what had happened.
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Old 01-01-2017, 20:49
Evo102
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How can people just drive off and have something like that on their conscience? They must have known what had happened.
The fight or flight response can kick in many cases and there are those who have something to hide, not insured, drink or drug driving etc.

And of course it has to be remembered that despite someone not stopping it doesn't automatically mean they were at fault for the accident.
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Old 01-01-2017, 21:04
Grouty
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Looks like they've got the ****, 5 arrested on suspicion of causing death by dangerous driving.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-38486212
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Old 01-01-2017, 21:11
Finglonga
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Would have them crossing at pelican crossing stopped a hit and run driver from hiting them then driving of without stopping ?
Most probably as they may have spotted or expected someone to be crossing there.
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Old 01-01-2017, 21:12
Grafenwalder
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Slightly off-topic, but the pictures I saw of the girls made them look more like 16-18 year olds than 12 year olds. Do a lot of 12 year olds wear makeup to that extent these days?

Needless to say I hope the driver is caught. No excuse for hitting and running - had the driver stopped and got medical assistance, may the girl that died be alive now I wonder?

Very sad.
You are right. Certainly the girl on the left looks much older than 12!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england...ester-38483392
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Old 01-01-2017, 21:18
MagicCoppelia
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You are right. Certainly the girl on the left looks much older than 12!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england...ester-38483392
I thought that too. But then I looked about 8 when I was 12.

How awful for this to happen.
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Old 01-01-2017, 21:26
Grafenwalder
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I thought that too. But then I looked about 8 when I was 12.

How awful for this to happen.
Tragic and horrible though thankfully police have the culprits in custody. It wouldn't surprise me if the driver had been drinking but even if sober he's facing serious jail time.
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Old 01-01-2017, 21:27
tim59
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Most probably as they may have spotted or expected someone to be crossing there.
No because a hit and run driver will drive away just the same.
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Old 01-01-2017, 21:34
davidmcn
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The fight or flight response can kick in many cases and there are those who have something to hide, not insured, drink or drug driving etc.

And of course it has to be remembered that despite someone not stopping it doesn't automatically mean they were at fault for the accident.
I think it reasonable to presume that those prepared to hit-and-run probably haven't been diligently observing other road traffic laws.
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Old 01-01-2017, 22:56
Fizix
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I don't think where they were crossing, or that they look much older than 12 year olds really matters. When driving you should always be aware of your surroundings (although accidents do happen), but the driver failed to stop. Kids develop at different rates, some early teens look like 8 year olds, some can get into nightclubs. It's been that way since, probably forever, as has wearing makeup.


Tragic and horrible though thankfully police have the culprits in custody. It wouldn't surprise me if the driver had been drinking but even if sober he's facing serious jail time.

I think you're probably right.
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Old 02-01-2017, 00:02
gomezz
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Saw the BBC news bulleting with the on site reporter and most of the cars passing in the background were clearly doing nearer 40 than 30.

As to the girl's ages, any cashier selling them alcohol could not be accused of not thinking them old enough.
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Old 02-01-2017, 00:51
MK184
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What a horrific thing, sympathies are with the poor girls and their families'. So glad they've arrested the pondlife responsible, I honestly don't know how anybody could just drive off.
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Old 02-01-2017, 01:13
WhatJoeThinks
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...The more vulnerable the road user the greater the stupidity it seems...
That is the very reason why they are considered vulnerable, although we don't usually refer to children's lack of knowledge and awareness as stupidity, of course. Children are vulnerable road users on account of being children.
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Old 02-01-2017, 01:18
Hieronymous
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Would have them crossing at pelican crossing stopped a hit and run driver from hiting them then driving of without stopping ?
It's, obviously, not guaranteed but it's got to be that much safer.
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Old 02-01-2017, 01:20
Hieronymous
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That is the very reason why they are considered vulnerable, although we don't usually refer to children's lack of knowledge and awareness as stupidity, of course. Children are vulnerable road users on account of being children.
I would think that, by the ages of 11 and 12 (if that's what they were) they would have some degree of road sense.
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Old 02-01-2017, 01:24
WhatJoeThinks
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I would think that, by the ages of 11 and 12 (if that's what they were) they would have some degree of road sense.
Of course. But what did you mean by "the more vulnerable the road user"? Did you mean less likely to survive being hit by a car?
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Old 02-01-2017, 01:35
Hieronymous
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Of course. But what did you mean by "the more vulnerable the road user"? Did you mean less likely to survive being hit by a car?
That was something of a generalisation. Not true of everyone of course but it seems to me that a lot of cyclists and pedestrians are a danger to themselves. Examples being those cyclists who ignore red lights. How dangerous is that?

And pedestrians (and I'm talking adults) who cross the road 10 or 20 yards away from a pedestrian crossing having just walked past it or are heading towards it in many instances. 12 stone of flesh and bone versus 2 ton of metal.
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Old 02-01-2017, 01:44
WhatJoeThinks
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That was something of a generalisation. Not true of everyone of course but it seems to me that a lot of cyclists and pedestrians are a danger to themselves. Examples being those cyclists who ignore red lights. How dangerous is that?

And pedestrians (and I'm talking adults) who cross the road 10 or 20 yards away from a pedestrian crossing having just walked past it or are heading towards it in many instances. 12 stone of flesh and bone versus 2 ton of metal.
I see what you're saying. Cyclists are vulnerable road users on account of them having minimal protection in the event of an accident. Pedestrians aren't strictly road users, although they do have to cross the road at times. I think children are vulnerable insomuch as they might 'foolishly' and unpredictably run out into the road without thinking.

Poor little buggers.
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Old 02-01-2017, 01:46
Grafenwalder
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That was something of a generalisation. Not true of everyone of course but it seems to me that a lot of cyclists and pedestrians are a danger to themselves. Examples being those cyclists who ignore red lights. How dangerous is that?

And pedestrians (and I'm talking adults) who cross the road 10 or 20 yards away from a pedestrian crossing having just walked past it or are heading towards it in many instances. 12 stone of flesh and bone versus 2 ton of metal.
Bib is worth pointing out the car was said to have been traveling at excessive speed so it's safe to factor that in to your other comment as well. A speeding vehicle can appear from nowhere in split seconds. The road surface was also wet.
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Old 02-01-2017, 11:09
gomezz
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A speeding vehicle can appear from nowhere in split seconds
That never happens except in Back to the Future.
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Old 02-01-2017, 11:23
Hieronymous
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Bib is worth pointing out the car was said to have been traveling at excessive speed so it's safe to factor that in to your other comment as well. A speeding vehicle can appear from nowhere in split seconds. The road surface was also wet.
In one of the articles linked to it says that the police were looking for a second vehicle which makes me wonder if they were racing.
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