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Hit and run in Oldham


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Old 04-01-2017, 22:26
Grafenwalder
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Why would they need a translator?
They appear to be Hungarian, at least the driver certainly is. I expect all apart from the older man to be conversant with English. However, no matter how fluent, in a trial it is wise to have a translator present. Police know if someone is purposely using it to their advantage such as slowing down questioning.

This is the driver.

http://www.manchestereveningnews.co....t-run-12406698
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Old 04-01-2017, 22:35
tim59
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They appear to be Hungarian, at least the driver certainly is. I expect all apart from the older man to be conversant with English. However, no matter how fluent, in a trial it is wise to have a translator present. Police know if someone is purposely using it to their advantage such as slowing down questioning.

This is the driver.

http://www.manchestereveningnews.co....t-run-12406698
The four men, who had information relayed to them in Hungarian via a translator, appeared in the dock in grey tracksuits.
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Old 04-01-2017, 23:32
Malliday
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What are these people even doing here?
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Old 04-01-2017, 23:51
Grafenwalder
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What are these people even doing here?
Helena Kotlarova's family emigrated to UK eight years ago from Czech Republic. No information other than name and age on the four men charged for obvious reasons.
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Old Yesterday, 00:11
Malliday
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Helena Kotlarova's family emigrated to UK eight years ago from Czech Republic. No information other than name and age on the four men charged for obvious reasons.
I wasn't really referring to the victims. But your response still doesn't really answer my question.
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Old Yesterday, 00:38
Grafenwalder
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I wasn't really referring to the victims. But your response still doesn't really answer my question.
Who knows what they were "doing here". You have access to exactly the same reporting as anyone else. I'm not sure your question has any relevance at all though. Two young girls have been killed and four men have been charged one of whom is the driver and all remain in custody.
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Old Yesterday, 02:00
Malliday
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Who knows what they were "doing here". You have access to exactly the same reporting as anyone else. I'm not sure your question has any relevance at all though. Two young girls have been killed and four men have been charged one of whom is the driver and all remain in custody.
You know exactly what relevance my question has.

You've just insisted on trying to disingenuously answer a rhetorical question in a textbook attempt at deflection.
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Old Yesterday, 09:22
Dan Fortesque
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Yeah I noticed that, I did think 12, really?
This is probably a better photo that reflects one of the girl's appearance.

http://www.oldham-chronicle.co.uk/ne...-tragedy-girls
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Old Yesterday, 11:49
SaturnV
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Why the fascination with how old they looked ?
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Old Yesterday, 12:15
gomezz
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I can think of at least two reasons related to news in recent times.
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Old Yesterday, 14:09
MagicCoppelia
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They appear to be Hungarian, at least the driver certainly is. I expect all apart from the older man to be conversant with English. However, no matter how fluent, in a trial it is wise to have a translator present. Police know if someone is purposely using it to their advantage such as slowing down questioning.

This is the driver.

http://www.manchestereveningnews.co....t-run-12406698
Driver looks a proper thug.
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Old Yesterday, 15:15
TeeGee
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What are these people even doing here?
A classic rhetorical question! The real answer is that they are economic migrants just like all the rest of them that are here with large families needing housing, schools and healthcare at the taxpayers expense.

(Good phone in on Radio 5 this morning on this subject too!)
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Old Yesterday, 15:18
Grafenwalder
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You know exactly what relevance my question has.

You've just insisted on trying to disingenuously answer a rhetorical question in a textbook attempt at deflection.
Referring to the four charged you asked "what are they even doing here" which as you now say was a 'rhetorical question', so assume you really meant relating to them being a foreign nationality?

People of various foreign nationalities regularly travel in and out of UK on a daily basis and have been doing for years. Maybe they lived here, maybe they didn't. What matters is they were all quickly caught and now in custody.

But i still fail to see the relevance of their nationality to the offence committed. My reply was not 'deflection' or 'disingenuous' at all as no detail has been released regarding the four charged other than name and age.
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Old Yesterday, 15:22
Grafenwalder
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A classic rhetorical question! The real answer is that they are economic migrants just like all the rest of them that are here with large families needing housing, schools and healthcare at the taxpayers expense.

(Good phone in on Radio 5 this morning on this subject too!)
Is that based on your own personal speculation and conjecture or do you have some facts because as yet there has been nothing released to the media other than their names and age.
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Old Yesterday, 15:33
TeeGee
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Is that based on your own personal speculation and conjecture or do you have some facts because as yet there has been nothing released to the media other than their names and age.
You are obviously not familiar with the locality......
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Old Yesterday, 15:47
Malliday
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People of various foreign nationalities regularly travel in and out of UK on a daily basis and have been doing for years. Maybe they lived here, maybe they didn't. What matters is they were all quickly caught and now in custody.
Yes, that's what matters, isn't it? Not the possibility that the victims' deaths could have been avoided altogether.

Not the fact that it could have been any one of us mowed down by people who may have been allowed by our government to roam this country for no good reason.

Never mind the fact that thousands of foreign criminals now clog up our prisons.

No, it's always after the fact that "lessons will be learned", isn't it?

How many people need to die on the streets of this country because every single individual in the entire EU, even convicted criminals and murderers (e.g. Arnis Zalkalns, Jamshid Piruz), is allowed to waltz into this country and do as they please?

And that's before we even get on to those from outside the EU who waltz across our borders every year for ever more spurious reasons.

But i still fail to see the relevance of their nationality to the offence committed. My reply was not 'deflection' or 'disingenuous' at all as no detail has been released regarding the four charged other than name and age.
Classic disingenuous deflection. Nobody's buying it anymore.

You might want to bury your head in the sand and ignore the ludicrous farce of our near open borders, but others don't have to.

Who knows, maybe one day it'll be somebody you care about left to die on the street thanks to somebody who need not ever have been allowed into the country.

But as long as they're caught quickly, eh? That's all that matters.
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Old Yesterday, 15:58
Chihiro77
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Yes, that's what matters, isn't it? Not the possibility that the victims' deaths could have been avoided altogether.

Not the fact that it could have been any one of us mowed down by people who may have been allowed by our government to roam this country for no good reason.

Never mind the fact that thousands of foreign criminals now clog up our prisons.

No, it's always after the fact that "lessons will be learned", isn't it?

How many people need to die on the streets of this country because every single individual in the entire EU, even convicted criminals and murderers (e.g. Arnis Zalkalns, Jamshid Piruz), is allowed to waltz into this country and do as they please?

And that's before we even get on to those from outside the EU who waltz across our borders every year for ever more spurious reasons.



Classic disingenuous deflection. Nobody's buying it anymore.

You might want to bury your head in the sand and ignore the ludicrous farce of our near open borders, but others don't have to.

Who knows, maybe one day it'll be somebody you care about left to die on the street thanks to somebody who need not ever have been allowed into the country.

But as long as they're caught quickly, eh? That's all that matters.
This is the most ridiculous post I have ever seen on DS and that's saying something. You are a proper idiot and I don't give a flying **** if this is against the rules of posting.
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Old Yesterday, 15:59
tim59
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Yes, that's what matters, isn't it? Not the possibility that the victims' deaths could have been avoided altogether.

Not the fact that it could have been any one of us mowed down by people who may have been allowed by our government to roam this country for no good reason.

Never mind the fact that thousands of foreign criminals now clog up our prisons.

No, it's always after the fact that "lessons will be learned", isn't it?

How many people need to die on the streets of this country because every single individual in the entire EU, even convicted criminals and murderers (e.g. Arnis Zalkalns, Jamshid Piruz), is allowed to waltz into this country and do as they please?

And that's before we even get on to those from outside the EU who waltz across our borders every year for ever more spurious reasons.



Classic disingenuous deflection. Nobody's buying it anymore.

You might want to bury your head in the sand and ignore the ludicrous farce of our near open borders, but others don't have to.

Who knows, maybe one day it'll be somebody you care about left to die on the street thanks to somebody who need not ever have been allowed into the country.

But as long as they're caught quickly, eh? That's all that matters.
Don't millions of tourists come to the uk every year, to roam this country for no good reason ?
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Old Yesterday, 16:11
TeeGee
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This is the most ridiculous post I have ever seen on DS and that's saying something. You are a proper idiot and I don't give a flying **** if this is against the rules of posting.
You seem to object to quite a few valid points. Is it possible you could comment further on those that you disagree with. This is a discussion forun, after all!

Don't millions of tourists come to the uk every year, to roam this country for no good reason ?
Most come here, spend money, enjoy themselves and then go home - without causing anybody any harm.
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Old Yesterday, 18:01
Grafenwalder
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You are obviously not familiar with the locality......
This is what you stated, "the real answer is that they are economic migrants just like all the rest of them" which suggests you know they are 'economic migrants' as fact. Where is this information?


Yes, that's what matters, isn't it? Not the possibility that the victims' deaths could have been avoided altogether.

Not the fact that it could have been any one of us mowed down by people who may have been allowed by our government to roam this country for no good reason.
The majority of road deaths are avoidable but they do happen, many have over Christmas and New year period. The nationality of the drivers concerned in each incident has absolutely no relevance at all. Correct legal requirements such as licence, valid MOT, insurance etc are what police concern themselves with in all road traffic accidents/deaths as well as actual cause.

Sadly it's very clear now you've chosen to use the thread topic to turn into a personal political agenda about immigrants which imo is wholly inappropriate and unacceptable.
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