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UK ambassador to EU resigns in row over Brexit |
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#251 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 30,183
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That's the brexit way. Look at the hatchet job that the tabloids did when the supreme court had the sheer gall to state that Parliament should get a say in the process.
"openly gay fencing judges" was their response, plus they were branded as traitors etc. Brexshitters want there to be a total echo chamber, filled with nothing more than positive, if totally incorrect and false, "news" about how the UK will be the world leader in everything as soon as we leave Look how Iain Duncan Smith regularly pops up spitting venom, one would think it was orchestrated from within the cabinet. |
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#252 |
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Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Wammy's House
Posts: 4,783
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Daniel Hannan has been suggested for the job. Just as well the EU does not have an army or he'd have provoked armed conflict by mid-April.
IDS is claiming Rogers was not trusted by the Cabinet. And loyalty to the Govt seems to be the main requirement Rogers's replacement. It should be fun. |
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#253 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 2,307
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Yes it does look like that....way before the Brexit result I pointed out the ardent Brexit MPs on the Tory take no prisoners....as we saw with Michael Gove stabbing Johnson in the back. And briefings by certain Brexit Ministers to undermine their cfhancellor.
Look how Iain Duncan Smith regularly pops up spitting venom, one would think it was orchestrated from within the cabinet. |
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#254 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: London SW6
Posts: 37,469
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Daniel Hannan has been suggested for the job. Just as well the EU does not have an army or he'd have provoked armed conflict by mid-April.
IDS is claiming Rogers was not trusted by the Cabinet. And loyalty to the Govt seems to be the main requirement Rogers's replacement. It should be fun. |
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#255 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 30,183
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A great deal of hypocrisy on here by a number Leave votes...who throughout 2015 said the EU would offer Cameron nothing and it was a waste of time trying to negotiate with them.
Now in 2016 when a diplomat dares to tell the government what he knows following the Cameron negotiations, those same digital spy members are calling the EU Ambassador a traitor for confirming what they had been saying. ![]() It is clear May, Davies, Hammond, Johnson & Fox are not all signing from the same hymn sheet when it comes to Brexit. We've had public spates between Ministers, slaps on wrists from Number 10 for all 3 Brexit Ministers. |
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#256 |
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Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 10,876
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And loyalty to the Govt seems to be the main requirement Rogers's replacement.
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#257 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Kent
Posts: 3,027
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He's not capable, as his previous advice in negotiations last year proved.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...rs-months.html |
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#258 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Kent
Posts: 3,027
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Quote:
A great deal of hypocrisy on here by a number Leave votes...who throughout 2015 said the EU would offer Cameron nothing and it was a waste of time trying to negotiate with them.
Now in 2016 when a diplomat dares to tell the government what he knows following the Cameron negotiations, those same digital spy members are calling the EU Ambassador a traitor for confirming what they had been saying. ![]() It is clear May, Davies, Hammond, Johnson & Fox are not all signing from the same hymn sheet when it comes to Brexit. We've had public spates between Ministers, slaps on wrists from Number 10 for all 3 Brexit Ministers. |
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#259 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Dublin
Posts: 51,589
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Quote:
Daniel Hannan has been suggested for the job. Just as well the EU does not have an army or he'd have provoked armed conflict by mid-April.
IDS is claiming Rogers was not trusted by the Cabinet. And loyalty to the Govt seems to be the main requirement Rogers's replacement. It should be fun. |
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#260 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 7,550
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Precisely. If he was any good at negotiating he would have got Cameron a better deal. When the vote went against him he just wouldn't accept and kept throwing up barriers rather than helping. He is a clear remainer (being a PPS to Tony Blair and Ken Clarke helped) so has no heart in the job.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...rs-months.html |
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#261 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 12,662
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Good for him...we all learn that trying to holding a dialogue with the deliberately deaf and terminally stupid eventually damages your health...get out why you still have your sanity mate would be my advice.
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#262 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Kent
Posts: 3,027
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That article tells me all I need to know about the real reason why Rogers quit. He was being set up to be the fall guy when everything went pear shaped, and he was sharp enough to realise it. Now May and the three musketeers will have to look for another scapegoat when they come back with a shite deal.
Why would you want anyone to broker a deal for you who had the interests of the person you were dealing with ahead of your own? |
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#263 |
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Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 7,550
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Surely if he was set up to be the fall guy he would have been persuaded to stay. Nobody did.
Why would you want anyone to broker a deal for you who had the interests of the person you were dealing with ahead of your own? I can see this turning out to be like May's other pet project - the child abuse inquiry. Will we see one ambassador to the EU after another resigning when they realise they've been handed an impossible job? |
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#264 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Devon
Posts: 47,969
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Good for him...we all learn that trying to holding a dialogue with the deliberately deaf and terminally stupid eventually damages your health...get out why you still have your sanity mate would be my advice.
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#265 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Pimlico, central London, UK
Posts: 14,871
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Precisely. If he was any good at negotiating he would have got Cameron a better deal. When the vote went against him he just wouldn't accept and kept throwing up barriers rather than helping. He is a clear remainer (being a PPS to Tony Blair and Ken Clarke helped) so has no heart in the job.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...rs-months.html |
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#266 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 25,202
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I think it is the Remainers being hypocritical. How long have they been banging on about the referendum being only advisory had that the government can ignore it, now saying that a europhile ambassador's advice should be taken without question.
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#267 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Dublin
Posts: 51,589
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Surely if he was set up to be the fall guy he would have been persuaded to stay. Nobody did.
Why would you want anyone to broker a deal for you who had the interests of the person you were dealing with ahead of your own? |
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#268 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Kent
Posts: 3,027
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Sorry it's hard to take anyone seriously who gets their news on the EU from the Daily Mail.
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#269 |
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Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 14,633
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I think it is the Remainers being hypocritical. How long have they been banging on about the referendum being only advisory had that the government can ignore it, now saying that a europhile ambassador's advice should be taken without question.
It was that man's job to be clued up on this stuff. An expert, if you will. So his opinions (or rather, actual hard facts) should be listened to. There's no reason why "what the man down the pub/Farage/the Daily Mail/Vote Leave said" should be treated the same. |
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#270 |
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Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Kent
Posts: 3,027
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There's no evidence of this and it sounds like a lame excuse by the Brexit camp to justify his absence. The idea being put forward that he would conspire with the EU to screw over Britain in the negotiations is a slur on his character.
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#271 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 12,662
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Well yes, because there's a difference.
It was that man's job to be clued up on this stuff. An expert, if you will. So his opinions (or rather, actual hard facts) should be listened to. There's no reason why "what the man down the pub/Farage/the Daily Mail/Vote Leave said" should be treated the same.
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#272 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Dublin
Posts: 51,589
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I never said he conspired with the EU. The comment you highlight was about any deal in any business. You never get the right commitment if their heart isn't in the job.
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#273 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 348
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You make some very chilling predictions, Nick, which could well come about. If they do I can foresee big trouble right across the country, in the workplace, the streets, pubs, clubs, factories, shops, banks, businesses, schools, colleges, universities and worst of all within families. The results would be catastrophic for the unity of the country and social cohesion. Judging by some of the comments on this and other political threads the 'leave' element are quite prepared to purge the UK of any dissenting opinions which is very disturbing - so much for free speech. I hope I am wrong but I am concerned that my poor old country is drifting towards being ungovernable, with social unrest and civil strife likely. All because of lies, bigotry, racism, stupidity, ignorance, arrogance, greed and extreme nationalism. Heaven help us all. Our forebears would be deeply ashamed of what is going on and wonder why they were sacrificed for nothing. Get a grip UK before you self-destruct!
You do realise that worst and best case scenarios very rarely come to pass. What we'll end up with will be somewhere between what you describe above and the best possible exit deal. |
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#274 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Pimlico, central London, UK
Posts: 14,871
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Quote:
I never said he conspired with the EU. The comment you highlight was about any deal in any business. You never get the right commitment if their heart isn't in the job.
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#275 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 1,739
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He has got out because people like davis and others have got thier heads up the own arses have not got a clue about things and are not willing to take any notice of people who do know things. Government ministers are not experts in any field at all, its always made a smile that one day you can have a government minister in charge of something like defence, then day day they are in charge of the NHS but the truth is they know nothing about either jobs
Re Brexit, there is no mutually agreed message, either because the ministers have failed to take any steps to identify what their negotiating stance will be and/or won't accept the advice they are receiving. Either way an impasse has been reached and we're no further forward than we were 6 months ago... Brexiters really want to cherry pick aspects of US system, so the Tory party presently in government (or the right wing headbanging wing thereof) can appoint a series of yes men to all key civil service roles, and onward they bluster. This is yet another example of the Brexiters approach being entirely alien and contradictory to our system of parliamentary democracy. But in the world of the alt right, this is all just brushed away as a liberal, elitist, expert London conspiracy. Or something. |
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