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M62 Police Shooting
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jaycee331
06-01-2017
Originally Posted by wear thefoxhat:
“This man's parents knew exactly what kind of criminal activity their son was up to, the father stated 'my son has never been convicted of a drugs related offence', what an interesting choice of weasley words, any one else with an innocent son would state quite clearly 'my son is NOT a drug dealer'.”

Yup, the father's inability to answer the questions put to him speak volumes.

"As to whether his son had a criminal past and allegations that he was a drug dealer Mr Yaqub added: "
“He had no convictions for firearms or drugs only minor assault"

Classic misdirection. As if never being found out, busted or convicted has any bearing on what his son was or wasn't into.

I break speed limits every week. But I've never been convicted, so I must be innocent.
There's literally no connection between the two things.
EvieJ
06-01-2017
Originally Posted by Jellied Eel:
“Sure, or it could be unreliable and not capture what you want. So the 'body cams' as an example. Where would you mount those so they're not obstructed when an officer takes up a firing stance? Especially as officers may also want to be behind as much cover as they can find. Hence why they're still pretty much being trialed and options like gun or helmet mounted cameras being evaluated. Plus if the output's going to end up being used as evidence, it needs to meet evidential standards.

And assuming the police did have body cams, when should the footage get released, and who to? YT has lots of dashcam footage of US police work, but it'd be footage of someone losing their life. Should that really end up public? They do seem pretty popular though, so not sure what that says about society.”

It won't catch 'what you want' and that it the point, it will capture what it can. Be that visual or audio just the same as the police and any other independent witness, but unlike human beings its recall is not interpreted with personal perception or bias. I'm not suggesting footage is release on you tube or anything (but tbf their happy to release it when it suits) but it should be available to an enquiry and trial.
TeeGee
06-01-2017
Originally Posted by skp20040:
“Without wanting to point the finger for dubious activity it does look odd , I mean a car business that has declared on its accounts assets of less that £2000 with not much turnover and he is pictured standing in front of his Lamborghini ?”

Asian financial practices differ markedly from what one might expect in London. I am sure that HMRC are aware of this.
Deep Purple
06-01-2017
Originally Posted by EvieJ:
“It won't catch 'what you want' and that it the point, it will capture what it can. Be that visual or audio just the same as the police and any other independent witness, but unlike human beings its recall is not interpreted with personal perception or bias. I'm not suggesting footage is release on you tube or anything (but tbf their happy to release it when it suits) but it should be available to an enquiry and trial.”

Any footage found is made available, but that is very different to having equipment to the level required for proper evidential purposes.

If the police have recording equipment that doesn't show everything, then the allegations of tampering are forthcoming straight away, which detracts from the other evidence.

I'm sure that when they have gear that can be used accurately for firearms operations, it will be deployed. Even then, the footage will be argued over.
EvieJ
06-01-2017
Originally Posted by RichmondBlue:
“No, you didn't "deserve" to be shot. But if you were caught up in a police operation because you found it exciting to ride around with an armed criminal, I doubt there would be too much sympathy for you. Almost death by misadventure...taking a dangerous risk voluntarily.”

So re the poster who wondered how many people had died because of Yassers alleged drug dealing almost as a justification for his death, do you feel the same about those who chose to illegally seek out know drug dealers and illegally purchase an illegal substance?
razorback Tony
06-01-2017
Originally Posted by Brandy211:
“Duggan was shot in the middle of a High St, Baker in a residential estate”


At the risk of being accused of being pedantic, I may be wrong, but I thought that Duggan was shot in Forest Road, Walthamstow, near Blackhorse Road station, the nearest "High Roads" to there would be either Hoe Street, Walthamstow, or High Road, South Tottenham.
EvieJ
06-01-2017
Originally Posted by Deep Purple:
“Any footage found is made available, but that is very different to having equipment to the level required for proper evidential purposes.

If the police have recording equipment that doesn't show everything, then the allegations of tampering are forthcoming straight away, which detracts from the other evidence.

I'm sure that when they have gear that can be used accurately for firearms operations, it will be deployed. Even then, the footage will be argued over.”

The allegation at the moment is secrecy whilst carrying out a public duty, it could be taken a step further and suggest intentional avoidance of accountability. The shortfalls with ALL recording equipment is known, tampering is something else. I would hope those in a position to investigate crime can differentiate or do you not have as much faith as I?

And yes the footage should be argued over, thats what happens with evidence.
Bagshot85
06-01-2017
Originally Posted by TeeGee:
“Asian financial practices differ markedly from what one might expect in London. I am sure that HMRC are aware of this.”

How so?
That's kind of racist and slightly bitter sounding.
Brandy211
06-01-2017
Originally Posted by skp20040:
“Without wanting to point the finger for dubious activity it does look odd , I mean a car business that has declared on its accounts assets of less that £2000 with not much turnover and he is pictured standing in front of his Lamborghini ?”

Arrh but your forgetting the rent from the 100 properties too.
GusGus
06-01-2017
Originally Posted by Bagshot85:
“How so?
That's kind of racist and slightly bitter sounding.”

But so very true
Brandy211
06-01-2017
Originally Posted by EvieJ:
“So re the poster who wondered how many people had died because of Yassers alleged drug dealing almost as a justification for his death, do you feel the same about those who chose to illegally seek out know drug dealers and illegally purchase an illegal substance?”

There would be no business if the demand wasn't there
Brandy211
06-01-2017
Originally Posted by Bagshot85:
“How so?
.”

They bank under the principles of Sharia Law
skp20040
06-01-2017
Originally Posted by Brandy211:
“Arrh but your forgetting the rent from the 100 properties too. ”

That's one hell of a lot of rent to pay for his high end cars .
Brandy211
06-01-2017
Originally Posted by razorback Tony:
“At the risk of being accused of being pedantic, I may be wrong, but I thought that Duggan was shot in Forest Road, Walthamstow, near Blackhorse Road station, the nearest "High Roads" to there would be either Hoe Street, Walthamstow, or High Road, South Tottenham.”

I thought it was Tottenham High Road, by Tottenham Hale Station

That's next to a very busy retail park
Brandy211
06-01-2017
Originally Posted by TeeGee:
“Asian financial practices differ markedly from what one might expect in London. I am sure that HMRC are aware of this.”

Many banks offer Islamic banking including Lloyds. He most likely purchased his properties that way.
Deep Purple
06-01-2017
Originally Posted by EvieJ:
“The allegation at the moment is secrecy whilst carrying out a public duty, it could be taken a step further and suggest intentional avoidance of accountability. The shortfalls with ALL recording equipment is known, tampering is something else. I would hope those in a position to investigate crime can differentiate or do you not have as much faith as I?

And yes the footage should be argued over, thats what happens with evidence.”

Your allegation of secrecy is no better than the allegations of footage tampering. We have have long standing legal procedures in this country that do not allow evidence to be made public until the court case, and that is much better than what we saw in Germany at Xmas, and what we regularly see in the US.

If the equipment is available to the quality required, then it should be used. At the moment it isn't. I had faith in the Duggan enquiry, you're the one that didn't, so dont pretend you're all about simply wanting the truth, based on law. That's not what you're after.

You want a perfect world where suspects can be shot in the leg, whilst ignoring the practical, and legal impossibilities of that.
Malliday
06-01-2017
Originally Posted by testcard:
“BBC News coverage at lunchtime. "Community Leaders" coming out of the woodwork as usual on these occasions. How do you get to be a "Community Leader" anyway?”

They're usually self-appointed; and then the media, and politicians needing to mobilize the "community" for votes, turn up to bestow legitimacy upon them.

To hold the title you usually have to be adept at race-baiting, blaming everybody except your own "community" for everything and spouting cliches.

Often they will have their own dodgy past or current dodgy dealings and attitudes which the media, politicians and the "community" will ignore.

Mr. Yaqub himself could have become a "community leader" eventually. In fact, looking at all the dodgy looking people who turned up to his funeral they probably did view him as such in that "community". Such a nice chap, always giving money to vulnerable young girls for no apparent reason, giving "work" to troubled young men and protecting local businesses from being randomly burned down, no doubt.

And the media would have fawned over this man, ignored all the rumours about his behaviour and spouted the words of such a "community leader" as if they were gospel.

It's all just a hopelessly sickening spectacle.
skp20040
06-01-2017
Originally Posted by Brandy211:
“I thought it was Tottenham High Road ”

It was Ferry Lane

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@51.58...8i6656!6m1!1e1

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukne...fterwards.html
VicnBob
06-01-2017
Originally Posted by Deep Purple:
“Your allegation of secrecy is no better than the allegations of footage tampering. We have have long standing legal procedures in this country that do not allow evidence to be made public until the court case, and that is much better than what we saw in Germany at Xmas, and what we regularly see in the US.

If the equipment is available to the quality required, then it should be used. At the moment it isn't. I had faith in the Duggan enquiry, you're the one that didn't, so dont pretend you're all about simply wanting the truth, based on law. That's not what you're after.

You want a perfect world where suspects can be shot in the leg, whilst ignoring the practical, and legal impossibilities of that.”

You do realise due to all your valiant attempts to explain, you have now been nominated for patience of the year award. Get the man/woman a drink!
EvieJ
06-01-2017
Originally Posted by Deep Purple:
“Your allegation of secrecy is no better than the allegations of footage tampering. We have have long standing legal procedures in this country that do not allow evidence to be made public until the court case, and that is much better than what we saw in Germany at Xmas, and what we regularly see in the US.

If the equipment is available to the quality required, then it should be used. At the moment it isn't. I had faith in the Duggan enquiry, you're the one that didn't, so dont pretend you're all about simply wanting the truth, based on law. That's not what you're after.

You want a perfect world where suspects can be shot in the leg, whilst ignoring the practical, and legal impossibilities of that.”

Who suggested footage be released to the public?

That Duggan case got to you didn't it? I don't blame you, it set trust in the police back years but that was just one of a number of cases. Lets hope this one turns out very differently.

Now Mr policeman demonstrate your skills, what is it I'm after?
EvieJ
06-01-2017
Originally Posted by VicnBob:
“You do realise due to all your valiant attempts to explain, you have now been nominated for patience of the year award. Get the man/woman a drink!”

You confuse explain and excuse
Union Jock
06-01-2017
Originally Posted by soma_:
“very odd killing. unmarked cars, pre planned actrion, no body cams, on a slip road with no cctv, and the victim trapped in his car and shot at.

the family say its a pre-planned assassination. the gamble for the inherently racist west yorkshire police is that no one will mind much because the victim is muslim and the discredited ipcc does not in vast majority of cases act against the police.”

I don't see him as a Muslim and didn't even know he was, to me he's drug dealer who uses guns and society is better off without him.

You believe the family?
egghead1
06-01-2017
Originally Posted by skp20040:
“Unmarked cars which will all have blues and twos fitted, we don't know if they used them but they have them . he was the only one in the car and one other is in court tomorrow over the semi automatic gun with ammunition”

Havent seen it stated he was alone in the car,got a link?
Bagshot85
06-01-2017
Originally Posted by Brandy211:
“They bank under the principles of Sharia Law”

Not everyone does...
Also, banking under sharia law means you don't receive any interest, nor would would you pay any if you took out a loan. Not sure how that equates with dodgy dealings.
Bagshot85
06-01-2017
Originally Posted by GusGus:
“But so very true”

It's what bitter and ignorant people would tell themselves upon seeing a successful Asian business. Anything to quell the jealousy.
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