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Corrie and the cultural mix


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Old 20-08-2005, 14:16
Polly_Perkins
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I happened to come across an old article accusing Corrie of being out of touch with its white dominance and lack of gay characters. This was from 1989.

Now hats off to Corrie for being the most diverse soaps on TV.

It has a core group of black characters, mixed race, asian, gay characters, transsexual, rich, poor, working and middle class.

They have weaved themselves to this point so well, really reflective of so many groups of people.

Its so rich with all these different groups of people.
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Old 20-08-2005, 14:18
bangersandmash
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i think they've tried to match it with what its actually like in manchester. which is extremely mixed
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Old 20-08-2005, 14:18
TOMMY C
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Yes well done to Corrie. Emmerdale is the worst soap for this.
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Old 20-08-2005, 14:20
corriander
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It is now but they have taken their time and maybe that's why it is so rich now. From the word go EastEnders was all about tokenism. There were always ethnic groups on EastEnders but they were given politically correct race-related storylines e.g. the notorious Clyde on the run storyline of 1991 when Clyde (?) fled with Michelle fearing he would be charged with the murder of Eddie Royle, the Vic landlord. Or much of the stuff around the whole Tavernier family.

Now in Corrie Dev and Sunita we are from time to time reminded that they are Asians, but they are fully integrated into the community and are only incidentally Asians or whatever. No one cares. Well done Corrie.

Kev
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Old 20-08-2005, 14:25
TOMMY C
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Originally Posted by corriander
It is now but they have taken their time and maybe that's why it is so rich now. From the word go EastEnders was all about tokenism. There were always ethnic groups on EastEnders but they were given politically correct race-related storylines e.g. the notorious Clyde on the run storyline of 1991 when Clyde (?) fled with Michelle fearing he would be charged with the murder of Eddie Royle, the Vic landlord. Or much of the stuff around the whole Tavernier family.

Around early/mid October in EE there is a race storyline with the Truemans and the Minute Mart. Sadly it is the world we live in.
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Old 20-08-2005, 14:25
Agent Krycek
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Originally Posted by corriander
Now in Corrie Dev and Sunita we are from time to time reminded that they are Asians, but they are fully integrated into the community and are only incidentally Asians or whatever. No one cares. Well done Corrie.

Kev
That's very true, it can also be said of Freda, Emily's niece, I was a bit nervous of how that storyline was going to be handled, would there be a big issues about her deafness, but it was just one aspect of the character, it didn't feel they'd brought her in to be a 'deaf character', more she was a character who just happened to be deaf - it wasn't her defining feature.
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Old 20-08-2005, 14:30
Polly_Perkins
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Originally Posted by corriander
It is now but they have taken their time and maybe that's why it is so rich now. From the word go EastEnders was all about tokenism. There were always ethnic groups on EastEnders but they were given politically correct race-related storylines e.g. the notorious Clyde on the run storyline of 1991 when Clyde (?) fled with Michelle fearing he would be charged with the murder of Eddie Royle, the Vic landlord. Or much of the stuff around the whole Tavernier family.

Now in Corrie Dev and Sunita we are from time to time reminded that they are Asians, but they are fully integrated into the community and are only incidentally Asians or whatever. No one cares. Well done Corrie.

Kev
Eastenders has always been tokenistic and thats why their black characters have not worked until now with the wonderful Yolande. Actualy Hattie was probably the nearest they came to working well with a black character.

Corrie does character first, as pointed out with Emily's niece.
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Old 20-08-2005, 14:36
chec2k
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I think Corrie is great at its diversity, especially, Dev and Sunita who are fully integrated into the community and their wedding was an educating testament to that.

Family Affairs is excellent at its representation of strong black characters, take Yasmin. She is sexy, sassy, vulnreable, and the cornerstone of the soap. Also, The Boulters, The McHughs, and Nikki's dual heritage children.

I think Emmerdale, can not really portray a strong ethnic mix, because of the soaps location in a rural village, where the ethnic mix would be low anyway. However, they have had some influences, such as Trisha the 'Bollywood Queen', Danny, and Deliah's ex-fiance Jay Aswar.
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Old 20-08-2005, 14:39
Polly_Perkins
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Emmerdale does the rich and poor well and I agree I think its the only soap that can honestly realistically get away with the white dominance. When I go into the Country I always notice how white it is. Coming from London its like a world away from where I live.
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Old 20-08-2005, 14:41
corriander
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Originally Posted by Polly_Perkins
Eastenders has always been tokenistic and thats why their black characters have not worked until now with the wonderful Yolande. Actualy Hattie was probably the nearest they came to working well with a black character.

Corrie does character first, as pointed out with Emily's niece.
Yes, indeed, but this can create problems because actors, especially young ones, want/need to leave the show after a while. That's what happened with Bruno Langley for example. I agree, however, that the handling of Emily's niece was excellent.

Hattie Tavernier was indeed probably their best black character until the Truemans. And she was very convincingly acted by Michelle Gayle, who ought to return to acting. I do think that EastEnders hit paydirt with Rudolph Walker who is utterly convincing. Corrie have not done such good black characters as EastEnders now does if you ask me. However, they have now got Craig Charles,who I think is going to turn into one of the best characters on that soap.

In a sense I hope that these positive signs in soaps are reflecting more positive signs in Britain. But trhe current Macki/Ali race storyline in Hollyoaks crepily mirrors the race murder of that young black lad in Liverpool two weeks ago. So we really have got a hell of a long way to go. Of course we do. However, in the area of soaps there has really been some improvement--for what it's worth.

Kev
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Old 20-08-2005, 14:59
Drifter
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Yeah, I suspect Emmerdale's location is the main reason. The Daggerts were their first black family in 2001, but only Danny is left.

Emmerdale has been the most consistent with gay characters over the past 10 years. As well as the rich/poor and middle class/working class divides - again, to do with the location.
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Old 20-08-2005, 15:38
Richie_lecturer1977
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Yes the countryside is a very 'white' area. Many from ethnic minorities, in particular the 'black' commnuity, portray the countryside as the 'wilderness', which is why Emmerdale does not need a non-white family 'for the sake of it'. An ex-colleague of mine, Dr Martin Philips, writes a lot on this sort of stuff. I'd recommend him for a good read if you've got a spare five minutes on your hands.
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Old 20-08-2005, 15:46
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I've got to hand it to Corrie and this is one of the reasons it has been so good over the past 18 months. I think the Farrarias? sorry about spelling! would have been a good addition to EE if the characters had not been so crap. Character is important not colour as Yolande and Noami are proving.
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Old 20-08-2005, 15:48
Richie_lecturer1977
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^^^ Agree.

P.S. It's the Ferreira's, I think.
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Old 20-08-2005, 22:39
Campcrusader
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Originally Posted by Polly_Perkins
Emmerdale does the rich and poor well and I agree I think its the only soap that can honestly realistically get away with the white dominance. When I go into the Country I always notice how white it is. Coming from London its like a world away from where I live.
Emmerdale has also had a continuous stream of gay/bisexual characters.
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Old 21-08-2005, 14:33
soapboyz2005
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Family Affairs probably had the highest ratio of gay characters in such a short time...
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Old 21-08-2005, 15:25
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Yeah, FA kept killing them all, Kelly Hurst and Sean for starters!
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Old 21-08-2005, 15:44
Agent Krycek
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Originally Posted by Richie_lecturer1977
^^^ Agree.

P.S. It's the Ferreira's, I think.
They were an awful missed opportunity for EE. The concept was good, some of the actors were extremely good - judging by other things I'd seen them it, but unfortuantely the plotlines and the writing let them down terribly. I still can't wrap my head around the fact that they were in planning for 2 years. Yes, I know the problems with the actor who played the Father (and who was an awful actor, by far the weakest of the bunch) caused problems with altered storylines etc, but they were never used like they could have been, and been the addition that they should have been.
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Old 21-08-2005, 17:24
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Originally Posted by soapboyz2005
Family Affairs probably had the highest ratio of gay characters in such a short time...
I agree. How many have we had in the last 5 years. Too many to remember them all.

Corrie is going the same way with Todd, Carl, Robbie, Sean, Louis, Tim, Tim's boyfriend (ok it was 1 scene) and that bloke from the bingo that sean went with - all in less than 2 years.
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Old 21-08-2005, 17:32
Polly_Perkins
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Well with Sean in it are we not going to see more gay people. They do exist, even in Weatherfield. Its nice to see Sean has a gay lifestyle.
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Old 21-08-2005, 17:43
corriander
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Originally Posted by Coronation St
I agree. How many have we had in the last 5 years. Too many to remember them all.

Corrie is going the same way with Todd, Carl, Robbie, Sean, Louis, Tim, Tim's boyfriend (ok it was 1 scene) and that bloke from the bingo that sean went with - all in less than 2 years.
Personally I think there ought to be more but better developed. Some of it is defo tokenism. They tried to have a long term gay in the Square, but Bruno Langley wisely opted out. Now they have got Sean who can only do so much. Most gay characters in soaps have been tokenistic, but Corrie did a great job with Todd and Karl, and they are now the standard to beat. And it will be a long time before any soap can come close.

Kev
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Old 21-08-2005, 18:16
Drifter
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Originally Posted by corriander
but Corrie did a great job with Todd and Karl, and they are now the standard to beat. And it will be a long time before any soap can come close.
Hardly, all we ever saw was the issue surrounding Todd realizing his sexuality, coming out and the fallout from that. We never saw them as an actual couple because Bruno left. I have no doubt it would be well handled, but we'll never know.

Of course I'm totally biased, but I think Zoe Tate is the best gay character in a British soap . That is, until the hideous Scott storyline last year, but at least they didn't randomly make her straight and it was for the sake of her child.
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Old 21-08-2005, 18:20
Drifter
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By the way, I hate the way all soaps make their gay characters TOTALLY STRAIGHT ACTING or completely camp and feminine. Where's the middle-ground? In my experience most gay men have just a few feminine traits at least...the type where you can sort of tell/wonder that someone's gay before being told, but don't actually KNOW for sure.

I suppose Paul in Emmerdale is quite close, but even he's more of the Sean-type than anything in-between...

Likewise, you don't see any butch lesbians, do you, or again, those in between
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Old 21-08-2005, 19:15
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Originally Posted by Drifter
By the way, I hate the way all soaps make their gay characters TOTALLY STRAIGHT ACTING or completely camp and feminine. Where's the middle-ground? In my experience most gay men have just a few feminine traits at least...the type where you can sort of tell/wonder that someone's gay before being told, but don't actually KNOW for sure.

I suppose Paul in Emmerdale is quite close, but even he's more of the Sean-type than anything in-between...

Likewise, you don't see any butch lesbians, do you, or again, those in between
I agree Drifter. It would be great to see a few more gay men who are in between straight acting and camp.

Wasnt one of Zoe's past girlfriends a butch lorry driver?
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Old 21-08-2005, 22:39
corriander
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Originally Posted by Drifter
Hardly, all we ever saw was the issue surrounding Todd realizing his sexuality, coming out and the fallout from that. We never saw them as an actual couple because Bruno left. I have no doubt it would be well handled, but we'll never know.

Of course I'm totally biased, but I think Zoe Tate is the best gay character in a British soap . That is, until the hideous Scott storyline last year, but at least they didn't randomly make her straight and it was for the sake of her child.
Actually you really have a point. Zoe Tate is indeed excellently played and the women that she becomes involve with are generally convincing.

I would also like to add a response to your second post: your point is ace and needs to be made. There seems to be this dichotomy between gay or straight-acting and nothing in between. That's rubbish. I am in between a gay acting and a straight acting gay. I always have been. I also can be incredibly camp (when I lived in a "gay" household and we used to just scream like little girls; but also incredibly butch-like when I threw a US marine down the stairs for not paying the rent.

I am not sure that soaps are subtle enough to deal with these complexities. Had Bruno Langley stayed on Corrie they might have been able to as they were the best team ever. But for now that story is over.

Kev
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