My Current Problem:
I am decorating the 1st floor bedroom in the house I have recently moved to. The Master Linebox is located next to the window ledge of the window (1st floor) in this bedroom at the front of the house. The BT external drop cable routes from the external junction box at the point where the cable from the pole joins the house to the window frame, through the frame and to the master socket.
The position of the Master socket is completely impractical as the two extension wires currently trail down the wall and out around the bedroom floor, it is also not in a position where to you would want to plug in a phone (or modem/router in this case).

I wish to move the Master socket from this location to either the lounge wall downstairs or the office room.

Ideally what is required is to re-route the external drop cable (orange/white/Green/Black wires), from the external junction box to the new location. Here lies the problem.

The existing wire is short, therefore I cannot re-use this.
I don't think you can buy this wire.

What I have done so far:
I have rung BT and asked for the Master Box to be re-locted, standard charge £104.87. However when I mentioned it was mainly external work, they said that this isn't covered (They move the master box by adding internal wiring) definitely not what I want.

They also offer a "Line Plant re-arrange". This is also a fixed fee (about £75) but they didn't think it applied to what I want.

Only other option is a "Timescale order" where I pay by the hour for the work. £135 for the 1st hour and £70 an hour after that. All of a sudden this seems a bit pricey for what I want.

Therefore I have put the BT engineer on Hold.

What Are my options?
I beleive I am quite capable of doing the work myself, but I do not have the correct wire and am also aware that it is illegal (although not to worried by this).

Has anybody any experience of this? essentially all I want it the external wire to enter the house at a different location.

Ideas or suggestions from the forum?
Last edited by Gavin1977 : 03-01-2006 at 15:39

Personally i'd get an weather proof junction box (similar to this http://www.screwfix.com/app/sfd/cat/...11549&ts=03468) and mount it outside somewhere in reach of your drop cable, feeding this into the box through a relevent gromet connect the wires to a terminal block (i.e. http://www.screwfix.com/app/sfd/cat/...16924&ts=03637) and then get some external telephone cable (http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Main_Ind...able_External/) and then connect that to the terminal block and then run to wherever you want to install your master socket. It doesnt matter if you cant get the same colour cables as long as you make a not of how its connected in the junction box

Touch the Master Socket yourself and you could end up with a much larger bill than £104.87, especially if you cause damage to the network

Firstly please remember that the master line jack is the BT network terminating point in your house. You should NOT undertake any work past this point. It is also the point for the end of BTs responsibility.

This is, I suggest, what you could do:

Just leave the BT master LJU where it is.

Hopefully if its at the window it will be behind the curtain.

Then run your own new cables from that point. If necessary going back through the window frame/wall to the outside of the house.

Then terminate new secondary LJUs where you want then inside the house.

At the point where the BT master LJU is terminated depending on which type of LJU BT have provided you have a couple of options.

Later BT Master LJUs had an option to remove the front bottom part of the LJU and terminate customer wiring at that point. Then you plugged the front of the Master LJU in again and screwed it up. In the event of a fault BT would come along unplug the front of the Master LJU and test with all customer wiring disconnected.

However earlier BT Master LJUs did not support this option so what you can do is terminate your new wiring in a small telecoms 3 pair type box and then add to this a 'fly lead' that has a BT jack plug fitted on the end. This you can then plug into the Master LJU. Result you have NOT interferred with the BT wiring, you have a point where you can disconnect your wiring in the event of a fault. Should you decide to go with an indirect operator that provides a 'dialler box' this would be an ideal point to connect this. as it would provide service to all extensions in your home.

Thank you for the responses. My preference is to modify in the correct way, as BT would do it. Having inspected the line more carefully today, perhaps you could comment on whether what I have is even correct as it is - perhaps its already been bodged by the installers of the uPVC window!

Coming into the house via the corner of the window frame is the drop wire. However it is not CW1411 as I expected. It has 3 additional tension wires so is therefore similar to CW1378 used for the telegraph pole to building span. Inside the house it only has about 7cm of wire and is terminated at an old GPO 52A Terminal Block on thw indow ledge. From this terminal block there is standard internal CW1308 cable for about 20cm to the NTE5 box which does have the removable front cover.

Therefore:
1) is my termination point the 52A Terminal block or the NTE5?
2) Is the drop wire type correct, or am I trying to preserve something that is already incorrect?

Anyway, I'm not really sure what I'm asking anymore! I suppose I want to know whether its worth persevering with what I have and perhaps making a bad job worse, or whether I should just start all over.

I would suggest that the termination point, the handover from BT to you the customer is the NTE5 box.

Your installation sounds very typical from the 'Good old days of the G.P.O'

The drop wire from the street pole would be run from the pole across to the property and then the same length, without joints or any connectors would be run into the property. Then the PO706 or PO746 instrument would be connected - hardwired! - via a 52A

If you open the 52A terminal box you could well find 4 terminals on each side of the box and an interlinking between the opposite screws. The incoming drop wire in GPO days would have been terminated on the outside 2 screws on one side of the box. The phones RED and White would have been terminated on the other. Today I suspect the onwards cablings from the drop wire is either Blue & Orange or if its in the newer color code Blue & Blue/White.

Whilst BT may take a dim view of you doing this: I mean they would rather change you ££££ for the same! Perhaps you might believe it appropriate to move the NTE5 to a point next to the 52A or if the wires coming in through the window onto the 52A are long enough then connect them directly onto the NTE5.

From there you can then onwards cable yourself as per my earlier post.

What is the purpose of a junction box or terminal box? Could the drop wire from the BT mast not be connected directly to the NTE5 master socket when it enters the house?

I'm asking as I would rather have the NTE5 master socket at the point where the drop wire actually enters the house. I'm experiencing a HORRENDOUS amount of noise (wind and crackle... can barely hear the person sometimes).. and can never get through to TalkTalk line fault department (wish I was still with BT where I would dial 150 and be connected within 20 mins... [trust me it's better than holding for an hour with talktalk only to be rudely disconnected automatically in the middle of the hold music])

At the moment the telephone wire goes all the way round the house to the front of the house. From observing the trail of wire to the front of the house I can see that it has been extended by attaching another cable (drop cable from the mast is grey and the extended part is black that's how it's obvious) onto the last 30 metres or so, and it's been attached using sticky electrical tape by the looks of it.

I'm hoping that if i remove this "extended bit" and have the original grey drop wire that comes from the mast directly into the back of my house and connect it to an NTE5 master socket there will it eliminate this noise im experiencing?

I always remember having some minor noise on the line but after moving to TalkTalk it's gotten much worse. I don't think it's anything to do with TalkTalk but the problem now obviously is that it's IMPOSSIBLE to get through to their line faults department.

Any thoughts?
Riad

0800 800 150. "Hello BT, I'd like to come back please"

Sounds to me like one of two things happened at some time in the past.

1/ The original BT termination point was somewhere round the back of the house. Then someone decided to re-locate it round the front and had an extension wired in.
2/ The original feed was continuous all the way to the front but broke. So a new bit of cable was put in to repair the damage.

Either way a very likely cause of your noise is the joint between the two bits of cable. Especially if the tape covering it has worked loose. Water getting into the joints is a possibility. I've watched BT engineers have to re-terminate 50+ pair cables before now because a manhole filled with water and got into what is supposed to be a sealed joint

I would lay odds on this joint being the cause of the line noise. If you can see the insulation round the joint and it seems to be coming adrift then that makes it even more likely water has got in and is degrading the joint.

It would be worth mentioning this to BT or Talk-Talk fault line (if you ever get trough to a real human being ) You might find that they come out and repair it free. If you are very very lucky you might even get a helpful BT engineer (there are a few around )who will rip out the extension cable for you and put a new one in to where you want it. Got to be worth a try though......

OK I just got though to TalkTalk Line Faults (after a record hold time of only 15 minutes... VERY IMPRESSED !!!).

I described the noise problem and the extention etc problem I've had to the gentleman on the phone who has logged this into a report for BT; and they will contact me in the next 24 hours to advise me when a BT engineer will come out.

I asked the guy on the phone whether this would be done for free.. and very worringly he told me that if the fault is down to my equipment then I will be charged £204!!! Does this apply for the call-out alone if after engineer tells me that it's due to my equipment that I don't want the work done anymore (i.e. cos I'll do it myself on the sly..) ??

I'm worried because the noise isn't present all the time, i.e. when I spoke to the bloke on the phone there wasn't any noise! But when it is there it's unbearable you can't hear ANYTHING! Plus the noise happens on both my cordless and my corded phone so I'm pretty sure it's the line. But if they don't hear the noise surely they'll put it down to my paranoia, say the line is perfect nothing wrong and land me with a big bill ??

So worried !!
Riad

Cancel post.

BT charge £50 if your equipment is found to be the cause of the problem.

Now you know Talk Talk's mark-up (profit).

A reasonable charge is fair enough. £204 is a bit excessive.


BT charge you £85+VAT if the fault is on the internal subscriber wiring\equipment, or at least that's what they tell me every time I ring up to report a fault.

Since the work that needs to be done is related to the extension wire that's been attached outside the house does that mean I technically won't have to pay? Even if they don't hear any noise on the line when they visit?

If the line is OK when they visit they will charge you for the callout and log it as no fault found. This usually depends on the engineer so make sure the kettle is on and the chocolate biscuits are flowing from the outset.

Just to clarify, the extension cabling is any cabling after the master socket.