5.1 Home Cinema System - Advice Please

AnMuZdY · 29-05-2006, 16:31

I'm looking for a home cinema system (amp & speakers only)
to connect up to my Sky HD box (when it finally gets installed) would appreciate any advice on this model by Yamaha,
Has anyone else got same model, whats sound quality etc,

http://www.yamaha-uk.com/pdf/product...ins/TSS-15.pdf

late8 · 29-05-2006, 17:01

I wouldn't go for that particular Yamaha system because it is for mainly PC use in a small room/ study, and you wont get the full home cinema experience.

Your probably best to go for the AV Packages on their website AV-57 or AV109 or buy separates.. Looking at the site again your best going for the RX-SL80 Amp and the NS-P240 Speaker pack.

JBlink · 29-05-2006, 17:08

Depends on your budget of course. I can recommend the Denon 1906 amp with Kef KHT 1005 speakers for £600.

AnMuZdY · 29-05-2006, 18:09

Quote:

Depends on your budget of course

Budget is a problem, i paid £1500 for tv/surround sound package in December (LG) I'm more than happy with the one ive got "BUT" have now realised there is no optical input to connect to my HD box.......

I will of course need to purchase a new dvd player as well with optical output, i was thinking the Yamaha amp £130 and a £100 LG upscaling dvd (total £230)

i dont and can't be a spending £400 +

As long as the 5.1 / Dts sound is of good quality, i don't need volume..

Would it be ok if i connected my existing LG speakers to the
Yamaha amp ?

link to dvd/surround i have now -

http://www.currys.co.uk/martprd/stor...ory_oid=-25997

Harveydog · 29-05-2006, 19:10

We have a Panasonic SCHT05 amp & speakers setup with a panasonic DMRE55EBS DVD recorder (multi region, progressive scan etc), that has component and digital optical output to go into the amp, going to a Sony 40 inch LCD and they are excellent. This amp & speakers were only 200 squids about a year ago, and you can get the equivalent even cheaper now.

Richard46 · 29-05-2006, 19:26

Are you not paying again for a set of speakers that you already have with no certainty that the new ones will be any better than the old ones. I would suggest looking at some of Richer sounds offers on decent (Yamaha) possibly discontinued or ex display stand alone amps. Cannot guarantee it will be compatible with your existing speakers but see no reason why not. For instance I got a really nice RX-SL80 from them a couple of weels ago for £120. Has 70 watts RMS per 5 channels which sounds a lot more than that Home Cinema system and power usually translates into quality not just volume. Dont suppose they still have that one but they have a high turnover of similar kit.
You could perhaps look to improve the speakers later if you start with some decent amplification.
I fear that Yamaha you are looking at may be a downgrade from what you have apart from the connectivity.

Richard

AnMuZdY · 29-05-2006, 19:37

thanks chaps, i'll look into both those suggestions,

have you got a link to "richer sounds"

how do you know if a set of speakers is compatible with a particular amp ? does the ohms/wattage have to be the same ? a speakers a speaker! isnt it ?

i am perfectly happy with the sound quality i have now and i dont use anywhere near the full volume,
i need an amp and dvd that i can connect to my sky HD box and get 5.1 when watching sky hd.

trouble is seperate amps seem to be £400 ++++

Astaroth · 29-05-2006, 20:46

No, speakers have a power handling capability but not only do you have to look at the wattage but the wattage at the correct impediance (ohms).

It is bad to get an amp that is not a good match in terms of power output but it is better for the amp to be too powerful for the speakers than under powered. The other thing to be careful of is the fact that many "budget" and "all in one" systems will use methods to ovre exagerate capabilities so getting these things paired up can be damned difficult.

Richard46 · 29-05-2006, 22:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by AnMuZdY

have you got a link to "richer sounds"

Top of the list if you google for Richer.

Loads here for lots less than £400 and different branches sometimes have one off display models for less than these prices.

http://www.richersounds.com/productl...ERS&sort=price

Richard

AnMuZdY · 30-05-2006, 22:57

Cheers, thats a big help, never even heard of them but theres one here in Hull, i'm gonna pop in and have a look as soon as i can get time...

they have this "basic" yamaha for £170, what do you think ? in the manual it says something about your sub-woofer having its own amp ???

http://www.yamaha-uk.com/pdf/product...ns/RX-V357.pdf

Astaroth · 31-05-2006, 08:37

Most sub-woofers are "active" as in they have their own amplifier built in... there is a small minority which are "passive" in that they dont have an amp and therefore you need a AVR which has an amplification channel for the sub.

RicherSounds are not my fav shop but are good for people on a tight budget. They predominately sell "last years model" at knocked down prices so you can get a good performing piece of equipment for a good price but it wont have the latest bells and whistles.

I personally have not had good experience with their sales staff as they have always simply tried to upsell to the next model and havent been very knowledgable but if you go in knowing this you can deal with it as appropriate. They do have a good returns policy however and have known many people buy something to try at home and then taken it back for a full refund when it hasnt been what they were looking for - make sure you check this is ok before doing it.

Richard46 · 31-05-2006, 09:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by AnMuZdY

they have this "basic" yamaha for £170, what do you think ? in the manual it says something about your sub-woofer having its own amp ???

Well if you are now calling that basic when 2 days ago you where considering that Home Cinema thingy you have sure moved on some. That is quite similar in lots of respects to my Yamaha RX-SL80 except it is better

So you are getting no more help from me.
Seriously that looks fine so long as it has all the connections you need. I really like the sound from my Yammy and I am just using a ragbag of old speakers I had lying around plus a Mission Centre I got from Richer for £30; and they even have cheaper ones. (It is not my main family system just my den toy).
As said above it is usual for the woofer to be line out only (no onboard amp) as the amps are usually built into the sub-woofer.
You do get very mixed reports on Richer but I have always found them very helpful and I have used a few of them over the years.

Richard

AnMuZdY · 31-05-2006, 22:26

Quote:

Most sub-woofers are "active" as in they have their own amplifier built in... there is a small minority which are "passive" in that they dont have an amp and therefore you need a AVR which has an amplification channel for the sub.

checked the spec of my LG speakers and wouldnt you just know it! my subwoofer is "passive"

im gonna get myself into Richer sounds and see whats what, thanks for your help, i'll let you know if i end up with anything, i dont want to have to replace my speakers as well, not yet anyway..

Richard46 · 31-05-2006, 23:46

A sub woofer does add to the surround sound experience but it is by no means essential. You can add a powered one when funds permit. I am sure that Yamaha amp you are considering will allow you to redirect the bass frequencies to the main speakers in the mean time.

Richard

Astaroth · 01-06-2006, 12:38

I would caveat what Richard has said in that it depends on the speakers - if they are "full size" speakers like stand mount/ floor standers then certainly a sub is a nice to rather than need to. If you only have satilite speakers then the sub often provides frequencies well above what should be the normal 80hz cut off point and so it really does become much more a need to have rather than nice to have.

Richard46 · 01-06-2006, 12:59

Astaroth

Agree entirely with your caveat. Actually my main system uses Castle Floor standers and have never felt need for a sub; the Castles give quite enough bass for my taste.

Richard

RobAnt · 01-06-2006, 17:54

Look, you really should be clear about one point. When it comes to audio equipment, you have to listen to it yourself and make up your own mind. You might not be able to do that in a "budget" place.

What might sound nice to you may sound to dull or bright or have tonal characteristics everyone else thinks are hideous.

Listen, listen, listen, before shelling out the best portion of £500 or more - sound quality is completely in the ear of the beholder. I've been and listened to kit 10 times more expensive than mine and, although in many ways it can be technically described as "better" sounds to hard, or wispy for my tastes.

JBlink · 01-06-2006, 19:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Astaroth

I would caveat what Richard has said in that it depends on the speakers - if they are "full size" speakers like stand mount/ floor standers then certainly a sub is a nice to rather than need to. If you only have satilite speakers then the sub often provides frequencies well above what should be the normal 80hz cut off point and so it really does become much more a need to have rather than nice to have.

Agree entirely. I have a budget AV setup (by many standards) with a Denon 1906 and Kef 1005s. This does have a powered sub and without it the sound is distinctly tinny. There is more bass in the TV speakers than the "eggs". With the sub the bass is pretty good but does not compared for music with the Hifi. When I put the front left / right through my Missions 782 SE speakers there is more than enough bass. For room geography reasons I cannot use the Missions with the AV kit - pity

Sofa Slob · 01-06-2006, 19:12

Mission speakers and either Denon or Yamaha or Pioneer amp.

All will run OK with the Missions.

JBlink · 01-06-2006, 19:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sofa Slob

Mission speakers and either Denon or Yamaha or Pioneer amp.

All will run OK with the Missions.

Don't rub it in!

Sofa Slob · 01-06-2006, 19:27

Finish that lot off with a Panasonic Viera HD television and I would be as happy as a pig in s**t

AnMuZdY · 01-06-2006, 19:50

Managed to get n to Richer Sounds today, he was very helpful (although he didnt suggest doing without a subwoofer alltogether)
anyway thanks to you chaps and Richer Sounds i at least know the basics now, and a rough idea of what i want,
I'M gonna leave it for now, wait till ive got HD fitted and working, might even wait till HD DVD players are out, i was considering a dvd upscaler with hdmi to go with the amp but the Richer sounds chappy said he didnt think it was worth it.

cheers ...

Sofa Slob · 01-06-2006, 20:01

You can already get HD DVD players, Toshiba one is excellent.

Richard46 · 01-06-2006, 20:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by RobAnt

Look, you really should be clear about one point. When it comes to audio equipment, you have to listen to it yourself and make up your own mind. You might not be able to do that in a "budget" place.

What might sound nice to you may sound to dull or bright or have tonal characteristics everyone else thinks are hideous.

Listen, listen, listen, before shelling out the best portion of £500 or more - sound quality is completely in the ear of the beholder. I've been and listened to kit 10 times more expensive than mine and, although in many ways it can be technically described as "better" sounds to hard, or wispy for my tastes.

Yes; but if you look through this thead you will see that the OP was not in the market for a £500 system. S/He was looking for some advice about getting the best sound within a budget.
The audition everything approach is in any event just another compromise. I have heard stuff in an audition studio that sounded completely different when I got it home. So I have found places (Like Sevenoaks) who will let you take amps/ speakers home for audition; even then realistically how many different bits of kit can you do that with; unless you have endless time and an infinitely patient retailer?

Richard

RobAnt · 01-06-2006, 23:26

Quote:

some advice about getting the best sound within a budget

What is the point of your post then? You seem somewhat confused by purporting to disagree that listening is of any value, but accepting the fact that he wants the best sound within a budget in the same (breathless) paragraph.

And you're absolutely right, environment is a contributing factor - so perhaps I should add that better places allow you to try equipment in your own home and exchange it if it doesn't work out as you expect.

£500 is still a lot of money, but perhaps you're angle is that you think £500 is too high to be classed as "budget"?

He is looking at high quality sources, £500 is probably the very minimum budget he's going to have to spend to make any valuable use of those sources in the audio domain.

29-05-2006, 16:31	#1
AnMuZdY Forum Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 15	5.1 Home Cinema System - Advice Please I'm looking for a home cinema system (amp & speakers only) to connect up to my Sky HD box (when it finally gets installed) would appreciate any advice on this model by Yamaha, Has anyone else got same model, whats sound quality etc, http://www.yamaha-uk.com/pdf/product...ins/TSS-15.pdf

29-05-2006, 17:01	#2
late8 Forum Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 7,052	I wouldn't go for that particular Yamaha system because it is for mainly PC use in a small room/ study, and you wont get the full home cinema experience. Your probably best to go for the AV Packages on their website AV-57 or AV109 or buy separates.. Looking at the site again your best going for the RX-SL80 Amp and the NS-P240 Speaker pack.

29-05-2006, 17:08	#3
JBlink Forum Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Hampshire Posts: 2,926	Depends on your budget of course. I can recommend the Denon 1906 amp with Kef KHT 1005 speakers for £600.

29-05-2006, 18:09	#4
AnMuZdY Forum Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 15	Quote: Depends on your budget of course Budget is a problem, i paid £1500 for tv/surround sound package in December (LG) I'm more than happy with the one ive got "BUT" have now realised there is no optical input to connect to my HD box....... I will of course need to purchase a new dvd player as well with optical output, i was thinking the Yamaha amp £130 and a £100 LG upscaling dvd (total £230) i dont and can't be a spending £400 + As long as the 5.1 / Dts sound is of good quality, i don't need volume.. Would it be ok if i connected my existing LG speakers to the Yamaha amp ? link to dvd/surround i have now - http://www.currys.co.uk/martprd/stor...ory_oid=-25997

29-05-2006, 19:10	#5
Harveydog Forum Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 167	We have a Panasonic SCHT05 amp & speakers setup with a panasonic DMRE55EBS DVD recorder (multi region, progressive scan etc), that has component and digital optical output to go into the amp, going to a Sony 40 inch LCD and they are excellent. This amp & speakers were only 200 squids about a year ago, and you can get the equivalent even cheaper now.

29-05-2006, 19:26	#6
Richard46 Forum Member Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: London Posts: 41,718	Are you not paying again for a set of speakers that you already have with no certainty that the new ones will be any better than the old ones. I would suggest looking at some of Richer sounds offers on decent (Yamaha) possibly discontinued or ex display stand alone amps. Cannot guarantee it will be compatible with your existing speakers but see no reason why not. For instance I got a really nice RX-SL80 from them a couple of weels ago for £120. Has 70 watts RMS per 5 channels which sounds a lot more than that Home Cinema system and power usually translates into quality not just volume. Dont suppose they still have that one but they have a high turnover of similar kit. You could perhaps look to improve the speakers later if you start with some decent amplification. I fear that Yamaha you are looking at may be a downgrade from what you have apart from the connectivity. Richard

29-05-2006, 19:37	#7
AnMuZdY Forum Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 15	thanks chaps, i'll look into both those suggestions, have you got a link to "richer sounds" how do you know if a set of speakers is compatible with a particular amp ? does the ohms/wattage have to be the same ? a speakers a speaker! isnt it ? i am perfectly happy with the sound quality i have now and i dont use anywhere near the full volume, i need an amp and dvd that i can connect to my sky HD box and get 5.1 when watching sky hd. trouble is seperate amps seem to be £400 ++++

29-05-2006, 20:46	#8
Astaroth Forum Member Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: London Posts: 3,421	No, speakers have a power handling capability but not only do you have to look at the wattage but the wattage at the correct impediance (ohms). It is bad to get an amp that is not a good match in terms of power output but it is better for the amp to be too powerful for the speakers than under powered. The other thing to be careful of is the fact that many "budget" and "all in one" systems will use methods to ovre exagerate capabilities so getting these things paired up can be damned difficult.

29-05-2006, 22:33	#9
Richard46 Forum Member Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: London Posts: 41,718	Quote: Originally Posted by AnMuZdY have you got a link to "richer sounds" Top of the list if you google for Richer. Loads here for lots less than £400 and different branches sometimes have one off display models for less than these prices. http://www.richersounds.com/productl...ERS&sort=price Richard

30-05-2006, 22:57	#10
AnMuZdY Forum Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 15	Cheers, thats a big help, never even heard of them but theres one here in Hull, i'm gonna pop in and have a look as soon as i can get time... they have this "basic" yamaha for £170, what do you think ? in the manual it says something about your sub-woofer having its own amp ??? http://www.yamaha-uk.com/pdf/product...ns/RX-V357.pdf

31-05-2006, 08:37	#11
Astaroth Forum Member Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: London Posts: 3,421	Most sub-woofers are "active" as in they have their own amplifier built in... there is a small minority which are "passive" in that they dont have an amp and therefore you need a AVR which has an amplification channel for the sub. RicherSounds are not my fav shop but are good for people on a tight budget. They predominately sell "last years model" at knocked down prices so you can get a good performing piece of equipment for a good price but it wont have the latest bells and whistles. I personally have not had good experience with their sales staff as they have always simply tried to upsell to the next model and havent been very knowledgable but if you go in knowing this you can deal with it as appropriate. They do have a good returns policy however and have known many people buy something to try at home and then taken it back for a full refund when it hasnt been what they were looking for - make sure you check this is ok before doing it.

31-05-2006, 09:41	#12
Richard46 Forum Member Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: London Posts: 41,718	Quote: Originally Posted by AnMuZdY they have this "basic" yamaha for £170, what do you think ? in the manual it says something about your sub-woofer having its own amp ??? Well if you are now calling that basic when 2 days ago you where considering that Home Cinema thingy you have sure moved on some. That is quite similar in lots of respects to my Yamaha RX-SL80 except it is better So you are getting no more help from me. Seriously that looks fine so long as it has all the connections you need. I really like the sound from my Yammy and I am just using a ragbag of old speakers I had lying around plus a Mission Centre I got from Richer for £30; and they even have cheaper ones. (It is not my main family system just my den toy). As said above it is usual for the woofer to be line out only (no onboard amp) as the amps are usually built into the sub-woofer. You do get very mixed reports on Richer but I have always found them very helpful and I have used a few of them over the years. Richard

31-05-2006, 22:26	#13
AnMuZdY Forum Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 15	Quote: Most sub-woofers are "active" as in they have their own amplifier built in... there is a small minority which are "passive" in that they dont have an amp and therefore you need a AVR which has an amplification channel for the sub. checked the spec of my LG speakers and wouldnt you just know it! my subwoofer is "passive" im gonna get myself into Richer sounds and see whats what, thanks for your help, i'll let you know if i end up with anything, i dont want to have to replace my speakers as well, not yet anyway..

31-05-2006, 23:46	#14
Richard46 Forum Member Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: London Posts: 41,718	A sub woofer does add to the surround sound experience but it is by no means essential. You can add a powered one when funds permit. I am sure that Yamaha amp you are considering will allow you to redirect the bass frequencies to the main speakers in the mean time. Richard

01-06-2006, 12:38	#15
Astaroth Forum Member Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: London Posts: 3,421	I would caveat what Richard has said in that it depends on the speakers - if they are "full size" speakers like stand mount/ floor standers then certainly a sub is a nice to rather than need to. If you only have satilite speakers then the sub often provides frequencies well above what should be the normal 80hz cut off point and so it really does become much more a need to have rather than nice to have.

01-06-2006, 12:59	#16
Richard46 Forum Member Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: London Posts: 41,718	Astaroth Agree entirely with your caveat. Actually my main system uses Castle Floor standers and have never felt need for a sub; the Castles give quite enough bass for my taste. Richard

01-06-2006, 17:54	#17
RobAnt Forum Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: South West Posts: 10,218	Look, you really should be clear about one point. When it comes to audio equipment, you have to listen to it yourself and make up your own mind. You might not be able to do that in a "budget" place. What might sound nice to you may sound to dull or bright or have tonal characteristics everyone else thinks are hideous. Listen, listen, listen, before shelling out the best portion of £500 or more - sound quality is completely in the ear of the beholder. I've been and listened to kit 10 times more expensive than mine and, although in many ways it can be technically described as "better" sounds to hard, or wispy for my tastes.

01-06-2006, 19:04	#18
JBlink Forum Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Hampshire Posts: 2,926	Quote: Originally Posted by Astaroth I would caveat what Richard has said in that it depends on the speakers - if they are "full size" speakers like stand mount/ floor standers then certainly a sub is a nice to rather than need to. If you only have satilite speakers then the sub often provides frequencies well above what should be the normal 80hz cut off point and so it really does become much more a need to have rather than nice to have. Agree entirely. I have a budget AV setup (by many standards) with a Denon 1906 and Kef 1005s. This does have a powered sub and without it the sound is distinctly tinny. There is more bass in the TV speakers than the "eggs". With the sub the bass is pretty good but does not compared for music with the Hifi. When I put the front left / right through my Missions 782 SE speakers there is more than enough bass. For room geography reasons I cannot use the Missions with the AV kit - pity

01-06-2006, 19:12	#19
Sofa Slob Forum Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Portsmouth, England Posts: 124	Mission speakers and either Denon or Yamaha or Pioneer amp. All will run OK with the Missions.

01-06-2006, 19:15	#20
JBlink Forum Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Hampshire Posts: 2,926	Quote: Originally Posted by Sofa Slob Mission speakers and either Denon or Yamaha or Pioneer amp. All will run OK with the Missions. Don't rub it in!

01-06-2006, 19:27	#21
Sofa Slob Forum Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Portsmouth, England Posts: 124	Finish that lot off with a Panasonic Viera HD television and I would be as happy as a pig in s**t

DS Forums

5.1 Home Cinema System - Advice Please

01-06-2006, 19:50	#22
AnMuZdY Forum Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 15	Managed to get n to Richer Sounds today, he was very helpful (although he didnt suggest doing without a subwoofer alltogether) anyway thanks to you chaps and Richer Sounds i at least know the basics now, and a rough idea of what i want, I'M gonna leave it for now, wait till ive got HD fitted and working, might even wait till HD DVD players are out, i was considering a dvd upscaler with hdmi to go with the amp but the Richer sounds chappy said he didnt think it was worth it. cheers ...

01-06-2006, 20:01	#23
Sofa Slob Forum Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Portsmouth, England Posts: 124	You can already get HD DVD players, Toshiba one is excellent.

01-06-2006, 20:04	#24
Richard46 Forum Member Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: London Posts: 41,718	Quote: Originally Posted by RobAnt Look, you really should be clear about one point. When it comes to audio equipment, you have to listen to it yourself and make up your own mind. You might not be able to do that in a "budget" place. What might sound nice to you may sound to dull or bright or have tonal characteristics everyone else thinks are hideous. Listen, listen, listen, before shelling out the best portion of £500 or more - sound quality is completely in the ear of the beholder. I've been and listened to kit 10 times more expensive than mine and, although in many ways it can be technically described as "better" sounds to hard, or wispy for my tastes. Yes; but if you look through this thead you will see that the OP was not in the market for a £500 system. S/He was looking for some advice about getting the best sound within a budget. The audition everything approach is in any event just another compromise. I have heard stuff in an audition studio that sounded completely different when I got it home. So I have found places (Like Sevenoaks) who will let you take amps/ speakers home for audition; even then realistically how many different bits of kit can you do that with; unless you have endless time and an infinitely patient retailer? Richard

01-06-2006, 23:26	#25
RobAnt Forum Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: South West Posts: 10,218	Quote: some advice about getting the best sound within a budget What is the point of your post then? You seem somewhat confused by purporting to disagree that listening is of any value, but accepting the fact that he wants the best sound within a budget in the same (breathless) paragraph. And you're absolutely right, environment is a contributing factor - so perhaps I should add that better places allow you to try equipment in your own home and exchange it if it doesn't work out as you expect. £500 is still a lot of money, but perhaps you're angle is that you think £500 is too high to be classed as "budget"? He is looking at high quality sources, £500 is probably the very minimum budget he's going to have to spend to make any valuable use of those sources in the audio domain.