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the one reason ITV Southern deserved to lose their franchise...


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Old 17-07-2006, 19:34
adam_fransella
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...is because their ident, both visually and in terms of the music that went with it, was perhaps the most dull and subdued ever to be used by any ITV company, and when TVS came along, it was their idents alone that made them a superior South/South East region. The same can be said of those for Meridian - until the ITV1 we know today was created.

As you've guessed, I believe TV continuity is as important as the programmes they introduce -
sad, but true!
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Old 17-07-2006, 19:46
russnet
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I'm afraid I disagree with you there. The Southern Star was a favourite of mine and in terms of idents, at least it made more sense than the chopsticks of Border!

The problem with Southern is that it was stuck in it's own little world and didn't really want to change as such which was one of the reasons why the IBA didn't want to give them the contract for the original 1982-1990 contract round (later extended during the 80's until 1992) Plus they had outside interest which the IBA didn't like.

Whilst TVS gave the viewers in the South and South East a bit of kick of colour into the television sets. Their initial logo (in terms of background and ident) had more black on the screen than any other colour and you thought Southern's blue background was depressing!
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Old 17-07-2006, 20:19
adam_fransella
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...maybe there was a black background, making it dull when compared to the bright blue background of Southern, but at least the first idents on TVS had many colours and more up-beat music than Southern's harpsichord jingle. I would feel the same way when comparing Yorkshire's first colour ident
to that of Southern, too.
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Old 17-07-2006, 21:02
Fred Flintstone
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TVS had a slight advantage over Southern in terms of coverage also. The Bluebell Hill transmitter in the Medway towns switched from carrying Thames/LWT to TVS at the '82 franchise round so for the first time North/Mid Kent had it's own "local" news coverage when TVS came along as Thames/LWT never really covered events and news in that area.
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Old 17-07-2006, 22:41
finlux
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TVS also made more interesting programmes for the ITV network (Catchphrase, Cats EYES, plus many others I've forgotton ). If TVS was around for a little longer, I think it would have become the sixth major ITV programme provider.
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Old 18-07-2006, 06:25
retro.ron
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The scottish television ident in the 80s was terrible! it was like bertie bassett.The newly launched s.t.v indent reminds me of the old brittish steel symbol .you were not alone southern tv with dodgey station ident!!
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Old 18-07-2006, 06:28
structure
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Originally Posted by adam_fransella

As you've guessed, I believe TV continuity is as important as the programmes they introduce -
sad, but true!
So you would watch a programme you hated for 2 hours just because you liked the continuity in the idents etc???? What utter rubbish.
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Old 18-07-2006, 08:29
Tony Richards
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OK but you can't compare the Southern logo with TVS - they belong to a different era. Compare the Southern star and music with the morse code of Associated Rediffusion and the logo, and what was my favourite the twangy ABC ident and triangle, but TVS was much more up to date.
I still maintain that Southern was fine for its region and its time and loved and respected. But time changes things.
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Old 18-07-2006, 09:37
dolby
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Southern Television's logo I think stands up pretty well and looks less dated than a couple, (I won't mention) maybe because it's simply a 'less is more' thing, White on blue, standard bold text, star central above' 'Nice......' (said in jazz club 'Fast Show' voice obviously).
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Old 18-07-2006, 10:47
adam_fransella
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Originally Posted by structure
So you would watch a programme you hated for 2 hours just because you liked the continuity in the idents etc???? What utter rubbish.
No, no, no, of course not. What I mean is: whatever I watch (or used to watch), the ident that comes before it adds a bit of 'sparkle' to enhance enjoyment. A strange way of looking at broadcasting, I know, but that's how I've always felt.
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Old 18-07-2006, 12:18
BringBackThames
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I used to love the Southern star. I don't live in the south so it was a bit of a treat to see it (it was less rare than Westward, Grampian, Ulster (never seen actually) and Channel (also never saw it) but on about as much as HTV and Tyne Tees and Anglia.

Plus the Southern star preceded two great shows of the time. Namely "How" and "Worzel Gummidge".

Oh how I wish the current ITV made shows remotely as good

PS I also liked the TVS logo and jingle but never once saw the Meridian ident (it might have been that they had all been phased out when Meridian started??)
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Old 18-07-2006, 14:15
MikeGne
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It's a bit unfair to say its worthy of losing its licence just because it had a quiet ident.

Who's to say come January 1st 1982 Southern wouldn't have launched a brand new look with a more dramatic fanfare. (ATV were planning one, prior to their change. It was returning to being "ATV Midlands" on-screen had they not had to Centralise.)
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Old 18-07-2006, 17:34
adam_fransella
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(1) Go to http://www.tv-ark.org.uk/;

(2) on the home-page, click on the top-left hand section
marked "ITV" (under "Channels");

(3) once in "ITV", go to the section towards the bottom of the list, called "South & S. East England", and click on it;

(4) look for the section marked "Meridian Broadcasting, 1993-present", and click on "Idents", underneath;

(5) enjoy!
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Old 18-07-2006, 17:37
adam_fransella
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Originally Posted by retro.ron
The scottish television ident in the 80s was terrible! it was like bertie bassett.The newly launched s.t.v indent reminds me of the old brittish steel symbol .you were not alone southern tv with dodgey station ident!!
I disagree. Although perhaps the most dated of all idents, I like it, as it was bright and colourful, with decent music too.
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Old 18-07-2006, 20:59
vinegar vera
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I hated the TVS ident and even more so the Meridian one. This region did not make anything decent either EVER!!

TSW's Thats My Dog was better than Southern/TVS/Meridian
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Old 18-07-2006, 21:01
red16v
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Some facts from someone who actually used to playout The Southern Television 'rolling ident' from telecine 3. It was a white 'star' on a cobalt blue background. The music was especially composed by Steve Race who played it himself on an acoustic guitar. It was an evolution from previous idents and Southern obviously thought fit to evolve the 'new' colour idents from the previous black and white versions. Southern TV had no outside financial interests other than its franchise - it was private company owned by Associated Newspapers, The Thomson Newpaper group and the Rank organisation.
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Old 18-07-2006, 22:30
adam_fransella
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Originally Posted by red16v
Some facts from someone who actually used to playout The Southern Television 'rolling ident' from telecine 3. It was a white 'star' on a cobalt blue background. The music was especially composed by Steve Race who played it himself on an acoustic guitar. It was an evolution from previous idents and Southern obviously thought fit to evolve the 'new' colour idents from the previous black and white versions. Southern TV had no outside financial interests other than its franchise - it was private company owned by Associated Newspapers, The Thomson Newpaper group and the Rank organisation.
Interesting!
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Old 21-07-2006, 01:02
wombatofludham
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Originally Posted by adam_fransella
No, no, no, of course not. What I mean is: whatever I watch (or used to watch), the ident that comes before it adds a bit of 'sparkle' to enhance enjoyment. A strange way of looking at broadcasting, I know, but that's how I've always felt.
You don't have to justify yourself to someone who clearly is incapapble of understanding that many many people find the presentation interesting - sometimes more interesting than the programmes. Just look at all the websites dedicated to station idents and presentation. There's even a Testcard Society. If people enjoy tv graphics and presentation there's no harm in that, and it's certainly not strange, nor is it particularly bizarre.

I personally used to like the Southern guitar jingle, which I thought was a bit more classy than our local ATV Foghorn Fanfare which could seriously damage the hearing of young children! I also used to like the HTV warble, although a friend once said it sounded like electronic vomit. Whatever that is.
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Old 21-07-2006, 10:57
elan_vital
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H'mm. They were all shocked at Southern when they lost the franchise, it really was a political battle and nothing to do with the programmes they produced. The only weakness was the lack of local news (for local people) in the east part of the franchise.

Thy knew their remit - the last chord played by Steve Race was accompanied by an onscreen slogan 'The station that serves the south' No mention of shareholders.

Brian Nissen, one of the on-screen continuity announcers passed away not that long ago.
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Old 21-07-2006, 22:22
red16v
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Brian Nissen actually passed away quite some time ago. 'The Station that Serves the South' ending predated the colour rolling ident by many many years, ie it was there with some of the monochrome idents.
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Old 21-07-2006, 22:54
Carl Stock
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Originally Posted by red16v
Some facts from someone who actually used to playout The Southern Television 'rolling ident' from telecine 3. It was a white 'star' on a cobalt blue background. The music was especially composed by Steve Race who played it himself on an acoustic guitar. It was an evolution from previous idents and Southern obviously thought fit to evolve the 'new' colour idents from the previous black and white versions. Southern TV had no outside financial interests other than its franchise - it was private company owned by Associated Newspapers, The Thomson Newpaper group and the Rank organisation.
That is very interesting, red16v. Thank you for mentioning all of that.
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Old 22-07-2006, 02:44
Phil 2804
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Originally Posted by vinegar vera
I hated the TVS ident and even more so the Meridian one. This region did not make anything decent either EVER!!

TSW's Thats My Dog was better than Southern/TVS/Meridian

How can you say that- TVS gave us No.73 The Fraggles, Art Attack, How 2, Finders Keepers etc.

80s CITV wouldn't have been half as good without TVS.
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Old 22-07-2006, 10:29
Fred Flintstone
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Originally Posted by Phil 2804
How can you say that- TVS gave us No.73 The Fraggles, Art Attack, How 2, Finders Keepers etc.

80s CITV wouldn't have been half as good without TVS.
Not to mention the Inspector Wexford series with George Baker.
Did TVS keep Out of Town going?
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Old 22-07-2006, 12:16
red16v
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No, Jack Hargreaves moved his program to The Limehouse studios in what was then an undeveloped part of Docklands. He didn't own the title rights to 'Out of Town' so he re-titled it 'In the Country'. Went out on C4 if I remember correctly. (The Limehouse Studios were owned by some ex-Southern management colleagues of Jack - bit of a co-incidence)
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Old 22-07-2006, 12:37
Adam14
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Didn't TVS also make the brilliant All Clued Up?! Who presented it again? I just remember his last name was Hamilton, I think....

I used to love that! I think TVS had it's blue logo with "Television South" then.
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