• TV
  • MOVIES
  • MUSIC
  • SHOWBIZ
  • SOAPS
  • GAMING
  • TECH
  • FORUMS
  • Follow
    • Follow
    • facebook
    • twitter
    • google+
    • instagram
    • youtube
Hearst Corporation
  • TV
  • MOVIES
  • MUSIC
  • SHOWBIZ
  • SOAPS
  • GAMING
  • TECH
  • FORUMS
Forums
  • Register
  • Login
  • Forums
  • Entertainment Services
  • Online Entertainment Services
Tiscali Eyes HomeChoice At Half The Price!
<<
<
1 of 2
>>
>
flashdisk
10-08-2006
LONDON (Reuters) - TV-over-broadband firm HomeChoice could be set to merge its video-on-demand operations with the British arm of Italian Internet giant Tiscali, the Daily Telegraph reported on Thursday.

The paper, which gave no source, said the "complex" transaction could value the Video Networks division at around 100 million pounds.

Almost 10 months ago HomeChoice, which is controlled by Microsoft co-founder Chris Larson, warned that it could run out of money within a year unless it secured new funding. Earlier this year media reports said the entire business was up for sale with a price tag of around 200 million pounds.



http://www.telegraph.co.uk/money/mai.../cnvideo10.xml
Peter We
10-08-2006
Good I suppose.
If they have customer service like HC and not Tiscali. MY girlfriend's Tiscali ADSL line has been down for a month.
stud u like
10-08-2006
I am glad I dont have Homechoice. Tiscali are awful.
Peter We
10-08-2006
Apparently so. The Tiscali forum at ADSLguide is shocking. It seems that they have moved people over to LLU (without telling them) and it is a disaster. There seems to be something fundermentally wrong, I wonder if the plan is to use homechoice's network to bail them out?
mbear
10-08-2006
That's the second time that story has done the rounds. Would be a good fit, though perhaps too much crossover on the LLU side in London... Still, if Sky aren't interested then beggers can't be choosers!

But Tiscali are pretty bad and I'd have to be offered huge incentives to stay with them after the two businesses have been integrated...
Last edited by mbear : 10-08-2006 at 10:55
mbear
10-08-2006
also "VoD: Video Networks, owner of the video-on-demand service Home Choice, is set to merge with internet operator Tiscali UK. The company, whose shareholders include Microsoft co-founder Chris Larson, Walt Disney, Sony and Warner Bros, is thought to have ended plans to raise £100 million for a national roll-out "
Peter We
10-08-2006
For me, it would depend if the HC network was affected in anyway. If it simply means that HC expand nationaly and improve the Tiscali service then, well, who cares?
Changing from LLU can be problematic , the service would have to become unreliable to make it worth the inconvience.
mbear
10-08-2006
Yeah - I'm waiting at the moment as I don't want to be down for a couple of weeks. They'll need to sort out LLU to LLU migration imminently as so many people are using it now...
BBRealist
10-08-2006
With all due this doesn't look anything like Tiscali using Homechoice to save them in any way, shape or form. According to the story Homechoice had a matter of weeks of cash left.

For Tiscali it's a way into triple play, they can asset strip Homechoice and replicate the architecture across their network.

For Homechoice it keeps the company alive in some way as they are apparently out of cash and the backers evidently have had enough pumping money into the business.

I can't help but feel that it's the end of Homechoice. It will be interesting to see if there are any guarantees for Homechoice subscribers, or if this is a straight asset stripping.

I am not convinced that Homechoice / VNL are in any position to debate the issue though if the stories of them being virtually out of cash are true, more a case of salvaging something before the vultures that were circling get their way.

I sincerely hope that the Homechoice customer services and billing are retained as Tiscali are atrocious in both regards, their tech support is outsourced.

I'm using a Homechoice connection right now and can feel nothing but sympathy for the person who owns it.

Tiscali have a reputation with regards to the companies they assimilate. Just ask a former Screaming.net or Worldonline customer.
Peter We
10-08-2006
> The paper, which gave no source, said the "complex" transaction could value the Video Networks division at around 100 million pounds.

Basically its still a rumour.

LLU migration is still a mess, Offcom have to get their act in gear. Losing service for weeks is not an option
BBRealist
10-08-2006
Originally Posted by mbear:
“Yeah - I'm waiting at the moment as I don't want to be down for a couple of weeks. They'll need to sort out LLU to LLU migration imminently as so many people are using it now...”

It's a nightmare. I had huge amounts of debate with BT over this and got nowhere.

If you're really lucky downtime is a week, if you're not twice that.
BBRealist
10-08-2006
Originally Posted by Peter We:
“> The paper, which gave no source, said the "complex" transaction could value the Video Networks division at around 100 million pounds.

Basically its still a rumour.

LLU migration is still a mess, Offcom have to get their act in gear. Losing service for weeks is not an option”

This is the second time we've seen smoke on this from two different sources. It's probably a good bet that there's some fire there somewhere.

Also didn't realise how short they were of cash.

£100 million is a reasonable price for a distressed company, especially considering the level of investment put into it.
Peter We
10-08-2006
>With all due this doesn't look anything like Tiscali using Homechoice to save them in any way, shape or form. According to the story Homechoice had a matter of weeks of cash left.

Define 'end'? If the IPTV service continues as is then it is not 'the end'. As usual you take what is still a rumour and spin it to fit your fantasy.
Its described a merger, yet you change it to asset stripping. Of course Tiscali want HC technology and content contracts. What the terms of the 'complex transaction' will define what exactly happens. The deals with Sony etc will probably have special clauses that determine what happens in this situation (BBR, you don't believe in Triple play, content or anything but standard broadband so you can ignore this)
Also HC said 10months ago they would run out of money in a year, lots of things have changed in a year, like quadripling their customer base. So you cannot put a date on when their cash will run out.

>Also didn't realise how short they were of cash.

Well, you have absolutly no idea of their cash situation, its not published

>£100 million is a reasonable price for a distressed company, especially considering the level of investment put into it
Its a very good price, which makes it not a 'Distressed company' .
Last edited by Peter We : 10-08-2006 at 11:34
Peter We
10-08-2006
Hmm....


Tiscali Extends Credit Line as Loss Widens
Publication Date: 15 May 2006
Europe’s largest independent ISP, Tiscali SpA, which was last month at the center of market speculation that it would be purchased by Vodafone Group Plc as part of Vodafone's “converged service” offering, continues to eat its way through money after extending a credit line from Silver Point Finance.

Last year Tiscali negotiated a new 150m euro ($193.7m) loan from Silver Point and its affiliates. That facility comprised two tranches, with the first tranche of 50m euros ($80m) provided in August 2005, which Tiscali says it has already used. The second 100m euro ($129m) tranche was expected to be made available in September 2006.

However, with only 17.3m euros ($22.3m) in cash available, down 42% from 30m euros ($38.7m) at the end of December, Tiscali said it has reviewed its credit line. This drop has meant the loan has now been increased to 220m euros ($284m) from 150m euros ($193.7m). This extended credit line comes despite heavy asset sales over the past two years, as the ISP sought to tighten its focus on in Germany, Italy, the Netherlands, the UK, and the Czech Republic.
CONT>
http://www.computerwire.com/industri...F-9D0335D0E147

The recent takeover speculation surrounding its crown jewel (the UK operation), will no doubt increase these concerns. Net debt at Tiscali has now risen to 313.6m euros ($405m) from 290.1m euros ($374m) at the end of 2005 and many will continue to wonder whether it is living on borrowed time.

EDIT:
Ok,
Quote:
“New sources of funding for ca EUR 250 million”

http://investors.tiscali.com/tiscali...006UKFINAL.pdf
Last edited by Peter We : 10-08-2006 at 11:48
BBRealist
10-08-2006
Again you get touchy over someone commenting negatively on Homechoice.

I did not say anything definitive about anything I speculated on a number of alternatives.

Originally Posted by me:
“can't help but feel that it's the end of Homechoice. It will be interesting to see if there are any guarantees for Homechoice subscribers, or if this is a straight asset stripping.”

My opinion and commentary, I didn't say anything was fact, so you're disagreeing with, well, nothing.

May I again point out that the ntl-Telewest deal was described as a merger, legally a takeover of ntl by Telewest, but involved ntl paying a few billion in cash and shares for Telewest.

Quote:
“>£100 million is a reasonable price for a distressed company, especially considering the level of investment put into it
Its a very good price, which makes it not a 'Distressed company' .”

Of course, £100 million for a company that has had at least £200 million invested in it is of course a very good price

Quote:
“Also HC said 10months ago they would run out of money in a year, lots of things have changed in a year, like quadripling their customer base. So you cannot put a date on when their cash will run out.”

Why not? Homechoice did? You are now disagreeing with Homechoice over their own financial state? Also I don't think they quadrupled their customer base within a year, so kindly don't tell fibs.

Companies as a rule don't say they may run out of cash unless it's a seriously likely outcome Peter, as that kind of commentary tends to scare investors away.

I'm absolutely astounded that you are such a fanboy you now argue with the company's own assessment of its' finances.

Anyway this is OT.
Peter We
10-08-2006
Tiscali may buy HC, so you bash them. Thats OT.

Besides. Its all rumour.
BBRealist
10-08-2006
Originally Posted by Peter We:
“Tiscali may buy HC, so you bash them. Thats OT.

Besides. Its all rumour.”

I made a perfectly reasonable post based on a news story in a national paper, commenting on a rumour now heard from two seperate sources, with some speculation of possible outcomes.

The guy who wrote it is a pretty well connected chap, a fair few stories regarding my former employer were 'broken' by him.

If I bashed anyone though so did the Telegraph, go write to their editor, and perhaps write to Homechoice telling them not to speculate on their own financial status.
Last edited by BBRealist : 10-08-2006 at 12:05
masai
10-08-2006
ROFL - Here we go again!
Peter We
10-08-2006
No we don't. Don't feed the troll.
aprec
10-08-2006
This has got the feel of ITV digital in their last few months.

If HC is such a good product how can it only be valued at 100 milllion?

Also why is none of the big players interested?
jongatera
10-08-2006
Originally Posted by aprec:
“This has got the feel of ITV digital in their last few months.

If HC is such a good product how can it only be valued at 100 milllion?

Also why is none of the big players interested?”

Its valued at that price I guess because of the extra investment that will be needed to go national, and HC will have to go national to have a chance of becoming profitable. So whilst they may merge/purchase for £100 million its probably gonna cost them that again to expand (at least).

Other players have been mentioned: BskyB, Orange, Vodaphone. The articles just suggest that Tiscali is most likely.
Peter We
10-08-2006
Reuters seem to have spoken with the source

Tiscali UK set to merge with HomeChoice - sources
Thu Aug 10, 2006 1:04 PM BST162
Email This Article | Print This Article | RSS
[-] Text [+]

By Adam Pasick

LONDON (Reuters) - Italian Internet firm Tiscali is set to merge its UK operations with privately owned HomeChoice, which offers TV, broadband and telephone services, sources familiar with the situation told Reuters on Thursday.

The move comes as competition heats up in the UK broadband sector, with companies like BT, NTL and BSkyB vying for dominance by offering a bundle of services, putting standalone Internet firms like Tiscali under pressure.

A merger of the two companies, which would involve HomeChoice's parent company Video Networks receiving Tiscali shares, "may happen quite rapidly", said one of the sources. "(Tiscali UK) is very vulnerable because it doesn't have anything other than broadband. Unless they have a triple-play operation it's hard to see how they'd survive."

Tiscali has a 10 percent market share in the UK, behind BT, NTL and AOL. The UK unit made up 44 percent of Tiscali's revenues and nearly half its earnings before interest, tax, depreciation and amortisation last year.

HomeChoice, controlled by former Microsoft employee Chris Larson, was among the first companies to offer TV over a broadband connection (IPTV), but it has struggled to reach critical mass. Its service is available to about 2.4 million households, mostly in London, but it had only 45,000 subscribers as of June.

"They started a marketing push that coincided with a broadband meltdown, with Sky, (France Telecom's) Orange and Carphone Warehouse entering the sector," said Daiwa Securities telecom analyst James Enck. "It's very difficult to build a brand and get any traction in this environment."

Enck said many analysts expected Tiscali to eventually sell off its operations outside of Italy, but noted that could still happen after the deal with HomeChoice.

"The fact they're actually making acquisitions is surprising," he said. "People thought it would be sold to Vodafone or Orange or Telefonica.
CONT>
http://today.reuters.co.uk/news/news...CE-TISCALI.XML
BBRealist
10-08-2006
Originally Posted by Peter We:
“No we don't. Don't feed the troll.”

I'm actually rather bored of your insults.

As you're probably just a pathetic little man playing with himself over his Homechoice STB I'm sure your ego enjoys the boost you get from the Pro-Homechoice trolling and BS you've graced this forum with for the past several months.

Reporting you to moderators is apparently ineffective so I guess the ignore list will do. I might actually be able to post here without you jumping down my throat for daring to not agree with you that way.

Pathetic.
BBRealist
10-08-2006
Originally Posted by jongatera:
“Its valued at that price I guess because of the extra investment that will be needed to go national, and HC will have to go national to have a chance of becoming profitable. So whilst they may merge/purchase for £100 million its probably gonna cost them that again to expand (at least).

Other players have been mentioned: BskyB, Orange, Vodaphone. The articles just suggest that Tiscali is most likely.”

The thing there is that BSkyB and Orange would probably only be interested in the skill, technology and content deals (not so much Sky there obviously ). Tiscali, we'll have to wait and see.

Vodafone would be potentially good for current subscribers as they've a 'laissez faire' attitude towards deploying broadband, management's opinion is basically why do it yourself when you can pay others to do it. They might be perceptive to leaving Homechoice to it and just throwing money at them.

Should Tiscali happen the level of control Tiscali will take will probably be the key thing.

Interesting times ahead for Homechoice customers in any case.
pobrien100
10-08-2006
Journos always misuse the term 'merger'. This would be an acquisition of HC by Tiscali. HC as a technology may live on and be a success, but HC the company looks like a sad but brave failure. Compare the 100m pound valuation with the figures being bandied about 1-2 years ago. Larson's taking a big loss overall, in order to not lose everything he invested.
<<
<
1 of 2
>>
>
VIEW DESKTOP SITE TOP

JOIN US HERE

  • Facebook
  • Twitter

Hearst Corporation

Hearst Corporation

DIGITAL SPY, PART OF THE HEARST UK ENTERTAINMENT NETWORK

© 2015 Hearst Magazines UK is the trading name of the National Magazine Company Ltd, 72 Broadwick Street, London, W1F 9EP. Registered in England 112955. All rights reserved.

  • Terms & Conditions
  • Privacy Policy
  • Cookie Policy
  • Complaints
  • Site Map