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"New" BT line |
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#1 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Falkirk
Posts: 3,312
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"New" BT line
I'm moving to a new build home on a developers estate next month and am looking at getting a supplier for the phone. We know telewest aren't in the area and that there are phone points in the house.
I looked on BT's website and their question was.."is there or has there ever been a BT phone line in the property" My initial resonse was no and on looking they say it will cost about £125 quid to get one. This, to me, is more the order of cost if you have to have the actual line installed into a property. My question is, if the developer has fitted a phone line into the property (and assuming they have connected it to the BT infrastructure) does this count as a BT line into the property? I did call them to ask, at 8.50 this evening. Got a helpful recorded message saying they were open until 9pm and to visit their website for help - then got cut off..... I emailed a complaint - I'll need something to barter with if I'm going to negotiate over a £125 connection fee! |
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#2 |
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Banned User
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Middle Earth.
Posts: 1,121
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If the property is a new build and you are the first to move into the building, or the person who moved in before didn't have the BT line switched on then you have to pay the £125 as the work was carried out during the building of the home instead of you having to call and wait for it to be installed afterwards. It's just esaier for BT to do the work or pay the builder to do the work during the build, you if you want the BT line enable have to pay for that work.
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#3 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: NE Essex,6½m SSW of Sudbury TX
Posts: 7,107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by foogirl
I'm moving to a new build home on a developers estate next month and am looking at getting a supplier for the phone. We know telewest aren't in the area and that there are phone points in the house.
I looked on BT's website and their question was.."is there or has there ever been a BT phone line in the property" My initial resonse was no and on looking they say it will cost about £125 quid to get one. This, to me, is more the order of cost if you have to have the actual line installed into a property. My question is, if the developer has fitted a phone line into the property (and assuming they have connected it to the BT infrastructure) does this count as a BT line into the property? I did call them to ask, at 8.50 this evening. Got a helpful recorded message saying they were open until 9pm and to visit their website for help - then got cut off..... I emailed a complaint - I'll need something to barter with if I'm going to negotiate over a £125 connection fee! It is likely (but not always the case) that BT will have wired the new estate (dug trenches and/or erected poles etc.) and, if so, will have connected that wiring to the builder's at the main phone socket in each property and to their own network in the street nearby. They normally do that, at their expense, in the hope that someone will rent a line and/or broadband from them at some time in the future so that they can recover £124.99 of their (vastly higher) costs. The internal wiring in a new build will have been installed by the builder. The BT infrastructure is theirs and only BT personnel are permitted to make connections. How would a builder know which pair of wires out of the hundreds of thousands at a typical exchange they should connect? And to what? Having moved into a new property myself 3 years ago, I am aware of the costs involved in doing so. Indeed, most people moving into a new property will have taken out a mortgage of over £100,000 and spent in excess of £2,000 on paying a solicitor to make a few phone calls, write a few letters and shuffle standard contract paperwork around for a few weeks. Paying for a telephone line to be installed (yes, mine appeared not to involve BT in doing anything - because they'd already done everything except make the final connection at the exchange) was an annoying additional cost - but, in the overall plan of things, not a major issue. At the end of the day, what choices do you have? You have no choice of landline provider (although there will be no need to make ANY calls via BT once their line is installed) and, although using a cellphone may be an alternative for telephony, broadband will not be possible without a BT line./ Remember that, after the initial 12 month contract, you would be able to transfer line rental to one of the plethora of firms now re-selling BT wholesale line rental. IMHO, you'd be silly to do so (just read a few of the threads on MSE about Talk Talk and others) but it'd be an option you'd have. Last edited by Heinz : 22-08-2006 at 10:48. |
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#4 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: NE Essex,6½m SSW of Sudbury TX
Posts: 7,107
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There's a lot more HERE.
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#5 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Falkirk
Posts: 3,312
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heinz
If you consider £124.99 to be more than installing a line would cost, I'm afraid you are mistaken (just ask your garage how much they charge for an hour of a fitter's labour).
It is likely (but not always the case) that BT will have wired the new estate (dug trenches and/or erected poles etc.) and, if so, will have connected that wiring to the builder's at the main phone socket in each property and to their own network in the street nearby. They normally do that, at their expense, in the hope that someone will rent a line and/or broadband from them at some time in the future so that they can recover £124.99 of their (vastly higher) costs. The internal wiring in a new build will have been installed by the builder. The BT infrastructure is theirs and only BT personnel are permitted to make connections. How would a builder know which pair of wires out of the hundreds of thousands at a typical exchange they should connect? And to what? Having moved into a new property myself 3 years ago, I am aware of the costs involved in doing so. Indeed, most people moving into a new property will have taken out a mortgage of over £100,000 and spent in excess of £2,000 on paying a solicitor to make a few phone calls, write a few letters and shuffle standard contract paperwork around for a few weeks. Paying for a telephone line to be installed (yes, mine appeared not to involve BT in doing anything - because they'd already done everything except make the final connection at the exchange) was an annoying additional cost - but, in the overall plan of things, not a major issue. At the end of the day, what choices do you have? You have no choice of landline provider (although there will be no need to make ANY calls via BT once their line is installed) and, although using a cellphone may be an alternative for telephony, broadband will not be possible without a BT line./ Remember that, after the initial 12 month contract, you would be able to transfer line rental to one of the plethora of firms now re-selling BT wholesale line rental. IMHO, you'd be silly to do so (just read a few of the threads on MSE about Talk Talk and others) but it'd be an option you'd have. Either way I will guarantee I wont pay it. |
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#6 |
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Inactive Member
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 4,238
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Quote:
Originally Posted by foogirl
Either way I will guarantee I wont pay it.
What will you do about a net connection? |
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#7 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Newcastle upon Tyne
Posts: 867
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Quote:
Originally Posted by qpw3141
I gather quite a few people are just using mobiles now.
What will you do about a net connection? Does my head in. Last edited by Kev_Akas : 23-08-2006 at 12:36. |
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#8 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: NE Essex,6½m SSW of Sudbury TX
Posts: 7,107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by foogirl
The cost of £125 is either over inflated for what they need to do, or it is the wrong estimate for my property.
Either way I will guarantee I wont pay it. I don't understand the "won't pay" part. If you don't, you don't get a landline, it's as simple as that. Last edited by Heinz : 23-08-2006 at 12:54. |
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#9 |
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Banned User
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Middle Earth.
Posts: 1,121
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Quote:
Originally Posted by foogirl
I am well aware of how much a labourer costs. The cost of £125 is either over inflated for what they need to do, or it is the wrong estimate for my property.
Either way I will guarantee I wont pay it. |
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#10 |
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Posts: n/a
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Quote:
Originally Posted by foogirl
Either way I will guarantee I wont pay it.
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#11 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Newcastle upon Tyne
Posts: 867
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At the end of the day, you're going to be the person missing out when you can't get ADSL or anything. Contract mobiles aren't as cheap as
£11 a month too. |
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#12 |
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Banned User
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: West Midlands
Posts: 184
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You are better of getting the new line... as lets say you do want to go for broadband then because of the new line... it will be clean and wont have rust damage or other damage. Also the surface has just been clean and it will be a new line run all the way to the exchange.... I do understand that £125.00 is a high amount but in the long run it will be better........
so when you get a broadband connection it will be better through a line put in, in 2006. then a line put in in the 1960's etc etc.... |
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#13 |
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Banned User
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: West Midlands
Posts: 184
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Also mobiles arent reliable.... because of its wireless infastructure if in heavy winds and emargancies if a tower blows down and that network dosent have aback-up carrier. or lets say its really bad storm and the network or phone fails.... because all BTs cabling is underground you will be more likely able to use the BT phone and not the mobile....
couple of options to consider. |
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#14 |
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Inactive Member
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Dundee, Scotland ♂
Posts: 9,026
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fibreoptic
Also mobiles arent reliable.... because of its wireless infastructure if in heavy winds and emargancies if a tower blows down and that network dosent have aback-up carrier. or lets say its really bad storm and the network or phone fails.... because all BTs cabling is underground you will be more likely able to use the BT phone and not the mobile....
couple of options to consider. Lol a very unlikely senario. Why not just go with a cable company if you in an area. Broadband from a cable company is much better than ADSL by miles. |
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#15 |
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Banned User
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: West Midlands
Posts: 184
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Cable Broadband!
cable broadband is suited better, but like he says that he needs a phone connection first........ cable broadband is an option but they install for free as i never had a line with them... they put on in....
lol im pessimistic (spell check needed )i always think of the bad things only...
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#16 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: NE Essex,6½m SSW of Sudbury TX
Posts: 7,107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neo6776
Why not just go with a cable company if you in an area.
Quote:
Originally Posted by foogirl
We know telewest aren't in the area
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#17 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 32
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T.o.s.h
What aload of tosh.
BT pay there engineers a sallary to work for them whatever jobs they do or how long they take. If you really believe that £125 is a good price to pay then please explain why TW/NTL do it for free? If you want people to become customer then send an engineer out for the thirty mins to one hour job of a new install, it really isn't hard. Don't beleive the rubbish - its a rip off, thats why you have line rental, to cover the cost and upkeep of the network. Why on earth we as potential customers should also have to pay for the expansion of that network is ludicrous. We are giving BT a resource (an extra house attached to their network) which they can use for the next decade - for lets face it FREE. Just my thoughts. |
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#18 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: NE Essex,6½m SSW of Sudbury TX
Posts: 7,107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by twtco
What aload of tosh.
BT pay there engineers a sallary to work for them whatever jobs they do or how long they take. If you really believe that £125 is a good price to pay then please explain why TW/NTL do it for free? And they refused to install for me because, as they said, 'We're not in that area'. BT didn't refuse (unlike the cable companies, they aren't allowed to) even though it was a new build. Last edited by Heinz : 24-08-2006 at 20:05. |
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#19 |
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Inactive Member
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Dundee, Scotland ♂
Posts: 9,026
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heinz
However, the OP stated
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#20 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Berwickshire (not Berkshire)
Posts: 738
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Quote:
Originally Posted by twtco
BT pay there engineers a sallary to work for them whatever jobs they do or how long they take. If you really believe that £125 is a good price to pay then please explain why TW/NTL do it for free?
As others have said BT have a universal service obligation to provide to all premises - TW/NTL can't even do that universally within their defined franchise areas because they burned up cash putting infrastructure in that was then vastly underused and ran out before they finished building the networks - they now can't afford to extend so they're in a self-limited market. |
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#21 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 26,381
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Quote:
Originally Posted by twtco
What aload of tosh.
BT pay there engineers a sallary to work for them whatever jobs they do or how long they take. If you really believe that £125 is a good price to pay then please explain why TW/NTL do it for free? If you want people to become customer then send an engineer out for the thirty mins to one hour job of a new install, it really isn't hard. Don't beleive the rubbish - its a rip off, thats why you have line rental, to cover the cost and upkeep of the network. Why on earth we as potential customers should also have to pay for the expansion of that network is ludicrous. We are giving BT a resource (an extra house attached to their network) which they can use for the next decade - for lets face it FREE. Just my thoughts. Yip it might only take a short engineers visit to connect the line but what about the cost of the work before the engineers vist? Digging up the roads to fit new cables and ducting to a site, the cost of installing new external cabinets, the cost of installing the poles if required etc etc. It isn't cheap and is covered by the installation fee. |
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#22 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 32
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:)
Your not getting my point. BT are asking customers to pay for extending their network. How about I move into a new build and pay one hundred quid to get an install. Then I leave and move into a 2nd newbuild. Not only do I have to pay another £100, the person who moves into my last house doens't pay a bean.
That is called investment my friend, customers dont invest - companies do. Get your head round it. |
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#23 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: NE Essex,6½m SSW of Sudbury TX
Posts: 7,107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by twtco
Your not getting my point. BT are asking customers to pay for extending their network. How about I move into a new build and pay one hundred quid to get an install. Then I leave and move into a 2nd newbuild. Not only do I have to pay another £100, the person who moves into my last house doens't pay a bean.
That is called investment my friend, customers dont invest - companies do. Get your head round it. The answer is because it would've cost them too much and, unlike BT, they are not REQUIRED BY THEIR LICENCE to do so. |
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#24 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 26,381
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Quote:
Originally Posted by twtco
Your not getting my point. BT are asking customers to pay for extending their network. How about I move into a new build and pay one hundred quid to get an install. Then I leave and move into a 2nd newbuild. Not only do I have to pay another £100, the person who moves into my last house doens't pay a bean.
That is called investment my friend, customers dont invest - companies do. Get your head round it. If I want Sky TV and have a box but there is no dish I pay for the install of the dish. In both scenarios if I move out and someone else moves in then they will not pay anything either!! That is the way things are. Anyway, BT Retail get charged for the installation by BT Openreach/Wholesale so they will, of course, pass that on to the end user. If they did free installs for everyone then the rental fee would increase and they folk who didn't need to pay an installation fee would probably complain about that. I have to laugh at people who buy new builds that will probably cost at least £100,000 quibbling about a fee that is equivalent to 0.0125% of that amount. |
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#25 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 32
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hmmm
Quote:
Originally Posted by timboy
If I live in the middle of nowhere and want mains gas I would pay for the install.
If I want Sky TV and have a box but there is no dish I pay for the install of the dish. In both scenarios if I move out and someone else moves in then they will not pay anything either!! That is the way things are. Anyway, BT Retail get charged for the installation by BT Openreach/Wholesale so they will, of course, pass that on to the end user. If they did free installs for everyone then the rental fee would increase and they folk who didn't need to pay an installation fee would probably complain about that. I have to laugh at people who buy new builds that will probably cost at least £100,000 quibbling about a fee that is equivalent to 0.0125% of that amount. I really dont give two hoots if wholesale charge retail - so what. Surely you must be getting this now? BT are asking me to invest in a private companies network. Its not right. |
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)i always think of the bad things only...