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Do You Agree With Brendan's Criticism Of The Judges? |
| View Poll Results: Do You Agree With Brendan's Criticism Of The Judges? | |||
| Yes |
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244 | 82.15% |
| No |
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53 | 17.85% |
| Voters: 297. You can't vote on this poll right now - are you signed in? | |||
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#26 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,055
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Actually getting sick to death talking about him
but 100% agree with what he said 100% disgree about how , when and where he did it |
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#27 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Scotland
Posts: 514
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I voted yes I agree. It's obvious the judges have favourites and mark accordingly. Craig even said I think in Week 2 or maybe even Week 1 to Louisa, "it looks like Emma has competition". In other words, he'd decided who was going to win it and who cares about any other of the dancers who might actually have potential or already be quite good.
I also don't think they can have it both ways. Either they are judging it technically or they aren't. How can they say to somebody for example "your hands are all wrong" (Matt this year, Darren last year) and mark them down for that and yet Emma can a) nearly fall over and b) do a technically incorrect fox-trot and not be penalised? Although I thought Peter's dance was ugly to watch, I accept that technically there was nothing wrong with it, therefore how can it get a 2? I think it should be a bit like skating used to be and they think of the marks as 5 for technical merit and 5 for artisitic impression. That way Peter would have got a 5 for it and not a 2. As he said himself, people should only get a 2 if they fall over or completely forget the routine. I think however that the column inches and TV time this has generated has been way out of proportion to what actually happened. I do think however, that Brendan was voicing what a lot of viewers had been thinking for some time. Their are "teachers' pets" and there are the rest of the class and that isn't fair. However, I suppose that is also human nature and I don't see how that can be avoided in any subjective competition. |
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#28 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 8,960
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I completely agree with what Brendan said. A few people I have spoken to about it said they were having the same conversation in their home before Brendan spoke out and I was thinking exactly the same. Some people are saying it wasn't the right time to say what he did but I can't think of a better time to put his point across. Any other time wouldn't have had the same impact. Its certainly got everyone on this forum and elsewhere talking! Some of the judging was unprofessional on Saturday night and they need to sort themselves out and be fair to everyone
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#29 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Peach's Peachdom
Posts: 5,664
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DenJ
I completely agree with what Brendan said. A few people I have spoken to about it said they were having the same conversation in their home before Brendan spoke out and I was thinking exactly the same. Some people are saying it wasn't the right time to say what he did but I can't think of a better time to put his point across. Any other time wouldn't have had the same impact. Its certainly got everyone on this forum and elsewhere talking! Some of the judging was unprofessional on Saturday night and they need to sort themselves out and be fair to everyone
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#30 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 3,019
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I just hope now everyone has been, or will have been by Friday, asked their opinion (on ITT) it is left. The Judges do need to listen and learn and change their practice but, I accept, will never admit that, and Brendan needs to be allowed to move on for Claires sake.
If the judges don't change I can see Claire and Brendan being over voted by the public, I really can. It matters not at the moment as they still deserve to be there but unless they improve immensely, or others fail, they do not deserve a final spot and that could happen. Judges, please be careful, and listen to what you have been told. Some are worse than others - granted - but all have something that needs changing to being SCD back to where it was. In addition to Brendans comments......Arlene and Bruno, watch what you say, my young kids are watching. |
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#31 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 778
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Quote:
Originally posted by Bruno's Girl I completely agree. The judges appear to have become very arrogant this series. There is minimal constructive criticism just negative and personal comments. If there is no improvement in judges behaviour and sleazy comments this week I won't bother watching anymore.
Up until last Saturday, I could just about tolerate two of the judges, and was not too bothered about one, and I had enormous respect for the other. Now, none of them have my respect, and Len fell from the highest height. To say that I no longer respect their views is a big concern, but it is a fact. I cannot bear to watch or hear any of them utter any comment on any dance ever again. Even if it sounds right, I will no longer believe what they say, and will be looking for ulterior motives. With each series of SCD, they have grown in more confidence, and perhaps have become a little too comfortable and maybe complacent in their role in SCD, and in doing so, have slowly chipped away at any regard I had for them. Last Saturday's 'performance' was the last nail in the coffin. I thought that the behaviour and personal insults went beyond unprofessional, and if any BBC executive is reading this, make no mistake, this cannot be glossed over with a few smiles and a few 'constructive' remarks thrown in here and there. They have lost credibility, and if left for another series, so will the programme. The professional veneer of all the judges, some more than others, slipped on Saturday, and I saw a really nasty side at certain points throughout the show. I stopped watching the main show from week 2, but I heard about what went on from others, and saw the results show, and I was dismayed at what I saw on national tv, in the name of entertainment. When I watched the highlights show on Sunday, I could not believe how 'nasty' some of the comments were. If someone else had said the things that Brendan said, even more people would be in agreement. Something needed to be said, as the judges were getting 'way too big for their boots', but because Brendan is known as the Bad Boy of Dance, no doubt more capital will be made out of why he said what he said etc., but trust me when I say, this matter is not over, and the repercussions will go on long after this series is finished. A line was crossed on Saturday, and the BBC and the judges know it, and now it is all about damage limitation. All of the professionals who want to stay on the right side of the BBC/judges will take a stance, that is their perogative, but I for one admire Brendan for what he said, and the way that he said it, because if nothing else, it has been the catalyst for many a debate, and that after all, cannot be a bad thing. |
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#32 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 7,558
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I am 100% behind Brendan , it is such a pity he didn't get some support from his fellow pros. Imo Camilla was the only one that put her hand up .
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#33 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 4,491
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I'm new to the forum so I'm sorry if I'm repeating what's been said by others. I'd like it if the judges stopped criticising each other. If it is OK for Bruno to say to Len 'you are picking on the little kid, you bad man,' why isn't it OK for Brendan to criticise them? Len rubbishes everyone else's opinion often. I agree with the point that we want to let it calm down now or it will spoil the show, but I think that could start with the judges being calmer. If Craig had said, 'It is live TV, we only have seconds, sometimes we don't express ourselves as well as we could, but we stand by our scores' I would have had much more respect for him.
But then if I were competing I would pay the judges to be irrationally nasty to me - I think having them on your side is the kiss of death. |
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#34 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Matteshadom South West
Posts: 11,683
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kez100
In addition to Brendans comments......Arlene and Bruno, watch what you say, my young kids are watching.
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#35 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 135
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I agree with the point Brendan made, but I don't think it will do much good. I would find it helpful if the judges made it clear (either on ITT or at the start of the main show) what criteria they are each marking on, so that scores like Peter's 2 and the 8s for Emma and Georgina would be more understandable. And I definitely think the judges should stick to constructive criticism, rather than bewildering comments like "You know how I feel about you", "Stick to the filthy stuff" and "I lose all perspective when you dance". However, if the judges change anything this week it will be like admitting Brendan was right, and Craig's ITT appearance showed us that that isn't going to happen.
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#36 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 535
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Arlene Drools Over The Men (comments On Thier Taurt Buttocks ),
And Rips Into The Women.........very Sexist |
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#37 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 164
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We sat in front of the TV on Sturday and wondered what was going on with the judges. Brendan was right to speak his mind, he'd seen what had happened all the way through and it was showing no sign of letting up.
Incosistency in the judges remarks compared to their marking as well as the bickering only made the whole show tedious to watch. Congratulations to Bruce and Tess for holding it all together - live shows are hell to control. Arlene needs to have her HRT checked - all she can concentrate on is how tight the trousers are and how firm a certain cricketers buttocks are. If a man had made similar remarks about a female dancer, there would have been hell to pay - I know the BBC switchboard lit up like a christmas tree on Saturday |
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#38 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 164
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Just another thought - if the judges are supposed to be professional dancers etc, surely they should all be looking at the dances in the same frame of mind. We all know there are certain disciplines for each style of dance and surely that's what the marking is based on
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#39 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 3,019
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sarah-flute
It's worth making a formal complaint to the BBC about that - if enough people did, they would have to take notice.
As a Mum, these two issues, the outright clear swearing by a judge and Arlenes letchy behaviour, are likely to be glossed over in the recent drama, and IMO are of major importance and need to be addressed. I'd like to think that Bruno has seen the error of his ways, but Arlene is getting worse, she really is. I cringe when Mark, and Ray have danced and are stood in front of her and my two are glued to what she has to say. Last edited by Kez100 : 02-11-2006 at 12:13. |
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#40 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Matteshadom South West
Posts: 11,683
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dancingdog
If a man had made similar remarks about a female dancer, there would have been hell to pay - I know the BBC switchboard lit up like a christmas tree on Saturday
I end up feeling rather sorry for Ray and Mark... Kez: good - I made a formal complaint too. Let's hope someone gives Arlene some sedatives, or maybe just a gag
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#41 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Geneva, Switzerland
Posts: 8,044
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I voted no - simply because I think this should have been sorted out between judges, contestants and professionals in private. I do largely agree with what he was saying though, and have particularly disliked the very personal comments this series. Fortunately, my no vote doesn't look as though it will make much difference. Now how's that for being undecided!
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#42 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,299
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marval
Young children watch and Arlene is completely out of control....there should not be any "filthy", " horny," "dirty"
etc. There are enough bad influences on the young and a dancing programme should not be one of them, at 6.00 o'clock on a Saturday Night
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#43 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Coventry area.
Posts: 1,143
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Have to say personally I don't like Brendan at all, I find him really creepy. But I've voted yes, as i applaud him for standing up and dealing with the farce that has been called judging. I cringe every week when I listen to their comments. I'm all for constructive critiscm, but personal remarks, bad language and lewd comments, should not be allowed.
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#44 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 5,188
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but should the judges verdict be final good or bad??
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#45 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,299
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Quote:
Originally Posted by squirts mum
Have to say personally I don't like Brendan at all, I find him really creepy. But I've voted yes, as i applaud him for standing up and dealing with the farce that has been called judging. I cringe every week when I listen to their comments. I'm all for constructive critiscm, but personal remarks, bad language and lewd comments, should not be allowed.
Yep, I'm not a Brendan fan either, but also voted yes as it was about time something was said. This series is getting farcical. Still not 100% certain it was the time & place to do it, but I do see why it happened the way it did. |
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#46 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 613
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Quote:
Originally Posted by waterloosunset
I think it should be a bit like skating used to be and they think of the marks as 5 for technical merit and 5 for artisitic impression.
I would like to see something transferred from skating competition though, which is the introduction of a set technical step/move for the Latin dances. It happens quite naturally in the Ballroom dances, where there is limited scope for choreography outside of the standard steps. So all the ladies who dance Foxtrot will dance a heel turn or a feather step. This makes it easy to compare dancers and judge accordingly. But some of the Latin dances are a triumph of style over substance and contain few steps of technical merit. EG: Say Claire and Brendan and Carole and Matthew both dance the Rumba. Both couples would be required to incorporate a Natural Top in their routines. It would be easy to compare the two ladies on their technical ability. What does everyone else think? And for the record, I think that Brendan was absolutely correct in what he said, but not when he said it. Last edited by Thess : 02-11-2006 at 14:09. |
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#47 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: pimple on the bum of back end
Posts: 18,770
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thess
But that is not the system used in Ballroom dancing and since this is a Ballroom dancing show I do not think it should be adopted.
I would like to see something transferred from skating competition though, which is the introduction of a set technical step/move for the Latin dances. It happens quite naturally in the Ballroom dances, where there is limited scope for choreography outside of the standard steps. So all the ladies who dance Foxtrot will dance a heel turn or a feather step. This makes it easy to compare dancers and judge accordingly. But some of the Latin dances are a triumph of style over substance and contain few steps of technical merit. EG: Say Claire and Brendan and Carole and Matthew both dance the Rumba. Both couples would be required to incorporate a Natural Top in their routines. It would be easy to compare the two ladies on their technical ability. What does everyone else think? And for the record, I think that Brendan was absolutely correct in what he said, but not when he said it. Could the routines also be assessed for content before the show - so that a harder routine has a higher theoretical score, like in diving or gymnastics? |
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#48 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Completely Lost
Posts: 1,250
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kez100
......Arlene and Bruno, watch what you say, my young kids are watching.
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#49 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 778
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marval I also made a formal complaint to the BBC on Monday regarding this. I am really tired of listening to such language on a "family" show.
Young children watch and Arlene is completely out of control....there should not be any "filthy", " horny," "dirty" etc. There are enough bad influences on the young and a dancing programme should not be one of them, at 6.00 o'clock on a Saturday Night |
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#50 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: On an enforced UK holiday.
Posts: 19,360
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marval
I have voted yes without hesitation. I hated the personal remarks made and it was getting worse and worse now perhaps the judges will be controlled and mark in a fair way .Young children watch and Arlene is completely out of control....there should not be any "filthy", " horny," "dirty"
etc. There are enough bad influences on the young and a dancing programme should not be one of them, at 6.00 o'clock on a Saturday Night I had started my SCD Producers thread long before the week 4 show. Also I think Brendan was right in raising it when he did, it's difficult to see when else he could have done it in a way that anybody would notice. Rather a shock to see the 'real' Len. I won't be able to watch a Masterclass again when it returns with anything like the same enjoyment. And the judges simply can't be told anything any more. Congratulations to them for killing stone dead what used to be a delightful, fun family show. But bravo to Brendan, he was on the nail. |
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