It may not be "banned" as such. However I don't believe any school that has changed it to "white" is doing it to teach kids colours either. Surely holding up different coloured cards and saying "this is red and this is blue" would be simple to teach?

This is general discussion forum, Quite a lot of FM's son/daughter/stepson/stepdaughter/grandson/granddaughter/niece/nephew's come home from nursery every day , And there parents etc would like to discuss certain aspects of what happens there.

Yes it is a GD forum, but still if I had a pound for the threads started that mentioned children coming home from nursery school with a Baa Baa Black Sheep or Three Little Pigs story I'd be able to buy everyone a drink with the money. It's the same story every time.

according to lemoncurd, he/she is, so lemoncurd, have you phoned yet?

<THUNK!>

Yes, God forbid we should offend the otherly-coloured boards out there....

Right! Well, I phoned the number given. The secretary took my details and a very lovely lady called Gillian, who claimed to be the headmistress phoned me back. She was a little puzzled at my question (she first thought I was a parent and then thought I was from the press! ).
Apparently, her staff have no instructions not to teach the original form of the nursery rhyme, "baa baa black sheep". In fact, they have no specific curriculum on teaching rhymes full stop, although teachers sometimes sing the rhymes at book-reading and do art & craft activities based around what they learn in book-reading.

I think I was confusing her, so I didn't go into any more questioning, but suffice it to say, the school doesn't seem to have any PC policy relating to black sheep.

You are my bloody hero today.

She didn't confirm that they don't though, think I shall have to write a complaint on why my daughter is being taught white sheep then.

No, she didn't. But it rules out this idea that there is some politically correct edict that teachers can't teach "Baa baa black sheep" as opposed to a particular teacher's own teaching style. Had you considered, for example, that the teacher, not being aware of the history behind the rhyme had simply used "white sheep" because they are substantially more prevalent in south Wales and so it made more sense?
Why do you assume that it was motivated by political correctness?

Well he's the one always asking for phone numbers, and one has been given. So looks like somebody's bluff has been called

That could the be the reason but isn't everything a teacher uses authorised first, as to speak ?

But then you also have to think in this day would it be wise for her to confirm they do ? as you say she thought you were press !!!

I don't know it was changed I only assume it was PC, other schools have followed suit but changing it to white, rainbow, happy or green sheep and saying it's for educational purposes. If thats the case why change it ? it's historical as well as educational in it's original form.

Some interesting reading on wiki ..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baa%2C_...rsery_rhyme%29


I certainly hope they don't teach "Baa, baa, black sheep, have you any E? "


lol
Last edited by lostsworld : 16-03-2007 at 13:31

probably because 9/10 it usually is.

I think at infant schools, the teachers are given a certain amount of time to there own plan.


I don't suppose that much thought has gone into it, TBH. I think it's just a rhyme with a colour in it, that teachers know, and therefore use as a way to convey colours, instead of a starchy `point at coloured paper' approach.

I very much doubt it. If you go round and ask people whether what they do from day to day is motivated in any way by political correctness, I don't think you'll find many people who are.

We could ask on here (DS must be fairly representative of society).....when you do/say things, do you give much heed to politically correct ideals? I'm not talking about politeness and everyday good manners here, but things like not showing images of pigs or saying the word `black'?

I don't think teachers are much different from the rest of us.

I t would be far more appropriate to e-mail or write to the school. Also IMO phone numbers of schools should not really be posted.

9/10 is assumed, I presume you mean?

There has never been a convincing case of actual Political Correctness demonstrated on these boards. What we do know is a lot of people like the sound-bite because it stops them having to take on board a whole lot of troublesome facts.

right I have just e-mailed them.

I suggest no one else contacts them as it is not fair on the school.

probably so, as we are on topic i found this too ...

It don't actually mention any colour of wool in the history so I suppose schools can change as they feel.
I would have thought black wool would be rare and more costly but it don't even mention that.


Anyway, the OP has not stated why it was changed or the email/No of school, seems our local has been dragged into it.
Last edited by lostsworld : 16-03-2007 at 13:44

You could do that, I suppose, but bearing in minds that the kids we're talking about are pre-schoolers (under 5s) and "infants" (Key Stage 1, 5 - 7 years old) it's probably better / easier / more useful to do it in a fun way with a rhyme that they all know, as opposed to the rather dry approach of showing them coloured boards and getting them to repeat "this is red, this is blue".

probably never because it hasn't gone that far thank god, but those in authority like council leaders, police chiefs, and some teachers are the ones who try to bring such ridiculous changes, perhaps to make a name for themselves.

About the history. Posted this earlier but worth reiterating. The colour of the wool is significant because the wool industry back than relied on white wool as it had greater value as it could be dyed different colours. Black wool could not be dyed, so was therefore not as valuable in trade.

Did not know that!

Why did the 'Sir' want to know if he had any then?


'Baaaah baaah 'Evil Dirty, not as good as white sheep', have you any wool?'

'Yes sir. Yes sir. Three bags full'

'Well that's a shame cos it's Sh*t and nobody wants it... mmmm Mutton for dinner me thinks!'

'baaaaah humbug!'


Last edited by comedyfish : 16-03-2007 at 14:04

Yes I understand that, but you would think that as white wool was so common that would decrease the value, and black wool has a natural colour that a i bet most people wore.

Here's somore more on it:

The best wool in Europe was produced in England but the cloth workers from Flanders, Bruges and Lille were better skilled in the complex finishing trades such as dying and fulling (cleansing, shrinking, and thickening the cloth). King Edward II encouraged Flemmish weavers and cloth dyers to improve the quality of the final English products.

The rhyme links into this - sounds like some trade dispute across borders. Guessing now, but maybe the English thought, sod the tax on white wool as its only their to rip off the foreigners (who make the fabric out of the wool) and making it hard for the English, who produce the stuff, to afford to buy it so let's all wear stuff made out of black wool - irrespective of class (master/dame/little boy) and beat the silly tax. Or something.
Last edited by jon8769 : 16-03-2007 at 14:12

It certainly has. A phone number was posted, lemoncurd phoned it, and lo and behold, there was no school policy or political correctness involved. What a shock!

And yet people are still moaning.

I used to work in a nursery and we had to sing baa baa white sheep..
If anyone wants to know it goes like this

Baa Baa White sheep
Look over there
See all the billy goats going to the fair
With white hats and white coats and white curley hair
See all the billy goats going to the fair