ditto .........................

THe choice was all about careful manoeuvring like a game of chess. ALW did not want Seamus (nor Ben) as Joseph, but he knows that Ben will fall to the likes of Lee & Daniel (swoon) at some later point. Seamus is vocally strong and may survive ALW's favoured Joseph. Seen these tactics on other shows - get rid of the strong competition to pave the way for the favourite, afterall there's too much riding on the success of the musical to leave the choice to the public.

Yes, that's my view (apart from the 'swoon'). ALW is not as daft as he looks.

Well he couldn't possibly be

Yes I agree Seamus sang the song to the camera.
Ben sang it to the camera, the audience and Seamus. Ben turned that song into an emotional unification. I've watched it back already and it is really touching. He was the one with the emotion, just as ALW had asked for. Seamus I found impressive, but not particularly likeable. Ben's still got a lot to prove, but he surprised me tonight.

I think ALW made the right decision. I think what many of you are forgetting is after the public vote Seamus had the least amount of votes, so it is obvious that the GBP didn't want him to be their Joseph.


As for who was better in the sing off, there was no contest, Ben wiped the floor with Seamus.


Seamus was not a team player and thought he was far better than he actually was, he would have been a nightmare to work with.

Thats my take. Get rid of the ones that can do it but are wrong (in this case too old). Keep someone the pubic doesn't like and keep the one or two people who really look like they could do it (Lee and Daniel) then let the public pick one of the two pros.

Tonight was another case of someone going for going on first and then the public getting behind someone who ended up in next to last place without actually hearing any more singing which just meant someone less obviously lacking votes would go. If you want someone to go put ting them on first seems to work far too often on BBc shows.

Same last year. They pretended Abi couldn't sing in tune 8 shows a week when she has been singing in tune on stage 8 shows a week for the last 5 months and pretended Aoife couldn't play Maria and was fourth when she is now singing the part two days a week. They got rid of Belinda just like Seamus and they kept Helena knowing she wouldn't get the extra votes to challenge Connie.
Last edited by thenetworkbabe : 29-04-2007 at 01:38

Very true.


I couldn't agree more.

I had to laugh at your first sentence. Briliant


Not to mention critics.



That's also my view too (including the swoon )


It happens on the ITV shows too. It didn't work with Daniel las week though.
Last edited by Nurse Betty : 29-04-2007 at 02:02

I have to say that Seamus was my favoruite (based on performance on stage) but he shot himself in the foot, in 2 ways.

1) Mentioing "clever editting" and arguing back about being a team leader. a SMART man would ahve said "Yes you're quite right, There's ntohign I like mroe than being a team player!". After all in a job interview are you going to tell the panel that you don't like being part of a team, it's who you are and you won't change?

2) His sing off performance. He didn't listen to ALW, he didn't emote and by singing first he didn't get a chance to see JUST HOW MUCH Ben would emote and pull out all the plugs. Ben (despite IMo being a pretty average singer) sang for his LIFE and people responded to that.

His behaviour on losing did make me think what an utter twonk, but my OH thought he was just trying to grasp back some dignity, so I gues it's down to interpretation. I would still have loved to see him as my Jospeh, and I shall now back the lovely Keith. Afraid I can't get on the Daniel band wagon, as he leaves me cold.

I think that was a large part of it. Also IMO Seamus gave his weakest performance in the sing-off whereas Ben gave his best which made it easier for ALW to give him the boot.

The point here is not so much that Ben was seeking Seamus's support, but that they were singing "he ain't heavy, he's my brother" and whilst Ben seemed to be trying to emote that and reach out to Seamus in the context of the song, it looked as if Seamus couldn't/wouldn't reciprocate.
Last edited by kippery : 29-04-2007 at 06:56

yes I expected that when they came back on the second show - they would sing another song, just to refresh the publics mind for last minute voters. It all seemed a bit weird that they weren't given another chamce to sing.
Last edited by rosieeee : 29-04-2007 at 08:12

yes I have to agree - I think Seamus is a better singer than Ben - but Ben did give the emotion - and a better performance - I think Seamus just realised he was going to go whatever he did.

Threecheeses, this is something to think about.

ALW is probably the most successful person in the musical world today, his shows are still selling out the West End and Broadway years after their first showing. If you think about what he has acheived he has the right to be a little arroagant if he wants to, as he has so much to back him up with.

I would like to know what Seamus has acheived to back up his arrogance, he is a 35 year old singing teacher, so if he is the special one, as he would have you believe, why has he not done anything of note in his career.

You also mention it should be the down to the public and now ALW. We all knew the rules at the start of the show and exuse me if I am missing something but it was left to the public and that is why he was in the bottom 2. he also had the lowest number of votes and if it was left to the public Seamus would not have even had the chance of the sing off.

ALW gave him another chance in the sing off which he failed to take through his arrogancce by ignoring ALW's request for emotion and just trying to outsing Ben with no emotion.

Thanks Kippery, that was the point I was trying to make last night about Ben looking at Seamus, but I think the wine had kicked in!

Sounds sensible until you remember that this programme exposes the contestants' personalities to the paying public in a way that simply isn't the case with other performers. Joseph is a stage show that's driven by one lead player, and in the context of a televised audition process, that performer has got to gain the approval of the viewers both as a talent, and as a person.

Seamus did not show the wisdom of his years in comments such as "I don't understand the meaning of team player"; "My talent is a gift from God"; "Lee is my only real competition" etc etc.

The show didn't have to manipulate the viewers - Seamus was hoisted by his own petard. He was talented but objectionable, conceited, and utterly charmless. ALW is no fool - he saw his opportunity to ditch an unpopular and swaggering ego that he knew would be difficult to work with. Good riddance.

Does anyone else think it's ironic that last night was supposed to be all about star quality, so we end up with Seamus, who oozes charisma, being eliminated in favour of Ben, who just doesn't have it?

Totally agree with point 2 ikkleosu, Bens performance really moved me and it was obvious from the audience reaction that he'd moved them too (despite the earlier gasps of disbelief when Seamus's name was mentioned). His voice was great, he did exactly what he'd been asked to do and my goodness did he pull it off.

I agree with your first point too although imo that gives a reason why he was bottom rather than why ALW got rid of him.

Tbh neither of them are Joseph imo so it didn't really matter which one of them left but based on the sing off (which after all is what they are supposed to be judged on) ALW definitely made the right decision.

There is much more to it. ALW has never been impressed with Ben (same with the other judges) - and he keeps him over Seamus? Very strange

It would be like Simon Cowell saving The MacDonald Brothers over Ray Quinn for example.

Yes but surely people would rather be listening to people that can actually sing really well. I really liked Seamus but knew he wouldn't win it but I'd still rather see him in than see him, or anyone else ALW doesn't like, be kicked off in favour of a weaker singer because it makes a joke out of the whole show.

The show is absolutely about star quality - and Seamus simply doesn't have that.

Seamus does not ooze charisma. Seamus oozes arrogance, cockiness and a massive ego. He has a great voice - and he knows it - which is fine - but he SHOWS that he knows it - and that isn't.

He was like a peacock last night - strutting around the stage with his arms outstretched as if to say "Hey - audience - I really am very good aren't I - listen to me hit those high notes - yup this is me - f*cking amazing aren't I?"

I'm very glad that ALW got rid of him last night. This is a musical theatre role - and Ben ACTED that final sing-off song far better - and emoted - and PERFORMED. Seamus just stood there with a pained look on his face. There is a big difference between SINGING a song and SELLING a song.

I always remember Judi Dench singing "Send in the Clowns" during "A Little Night Music". She can't sing very well - her voice was off-key and a bit shaky - but the performance was mesmorising as she ACTED it so well. For me, that is what makes a brilliant musical theatre performer - and I suspect that is what ALW is looking for. An actor who can sing brilliantly. Presumedly that is why he is continually reminding contestants about the lyrics - and the story that is being told.

Seamus hasn't acted a song well yet - and that, for me, is why ALW was absolutely right to get rid of him last night.
Last edited by FeelTheForce : 29-04-2007 at 11:52

The fact of the matter though is that Seamus was in the bottom 2. Not enough people voted for him. If he were as great as people on this forum think he is he would have received more votes and would have been safe from the bottom two.

Although I liked Seamus an had him in the running his acting just hasn't come through as the weeks have gone on. Bens kicked it at the perfect moment (just as Chris Cs kicked in at the very worst moment - becoming brilliant as he left the show) . ALW is making decisions now on far more than we see. He is, also, only making the decision based on the two the public don't like and we are the ones paying 55 quid a ticket. Despite liking his singing very much I don't see him being able to play the whole role better than some of the others left and, unfortunately, that is what it was about.

It was Ben's second time - he hardly has a much bigger fan base

If ALW did this, Ben would have been long gone. There's far more evidence to suggest the GBP doesn't want Ben as Joseph than Seamus.