I've just got back from Canada where HDTV is about standard everywhere. TVs are cheap, there are several HDTV cable channels available. Once people have seen it, they never go back.

I think it's only a matter of a year at the most before we see HDTV become standard in every UK home.

It will be a long time before every channel is in HD - for example I have had HD for over a year now - there are no more HD channels now than there were at launch.

Why start this thread in the Topfield section? Is not every other Freeview PVR equally affected?

IIRC, there's an HD CAM with an HDMI i/f connector being developed...

K

I've heard about that HD CAM with the HDMI connector for the Toppy, but wouldn't that mean the HDMI connector would be on the front and you'd need to leave the flap over the CAM slot open all the time? Or is there some cleaver way to add a HDMI connector on the rear?

No, I think you're right. I guess it would look a bit untidy...

K

As others have pointed out, the Toppy is no more threatened by HD than any other currently sold PVR in the UK.

Since there aren't actually any firm plans to broadcast an HD service on terrestrial at the moment, the assertion that it's a year at most before we see it as standard in every home seems somewhat wide of the mark.

In fact, the ONLY broadcaster to have even hinted at a terrestrial service is the BBC; they have suggested that it may be possible to run an overnight service, of a few hours a day, and that in theory that could be done by next summer.

But that's dependent upon approval by the BBC Trust, and by Ofcom - the latter because of the changes to broadcast specs that would be needed.

Other broadcasters are concentrating on obtaining spectrum at DSO, which won't be complete until 2012.

So, given that there's only a possibility of a few hours terrestrial broadcast a day next year, from one broadcaster, which isn't yet confirmed, to assert firstly that HDTV will be standard in every UK home in a year's time and secondly that it will somehow uniquely threaten the current Topfield model, seems bizarre.

Things look so much better in HD.

Well, they do indeed. But it's not going to get into every home within a year unless there's a sudden rush of people subscribing to Sky's HD service or taking out Virgin's option.

Unless and until the BBC get approval for their overnight service, there will be no HD on terrestrial in the short term. And no one is going to spend money adapting new kit for the UK market until they're sure there will be a service.

Presently there's precisely one PVR that would work with the BBC's proposal - the somewhat flawed Evesham iPlayer HD. Even though there are HD boxes around elsewhere in the world, they're unlikely to launch in the UK without having MHEG added to them - they won't get a digital tick mark otherwise. And I think many companies won't commit to that until they're sure there's a need to do it. They'd rather shift higher margin MPEG2 units.

If the BBC get the go-ahead, I'm sure we shall see some compatible equipment. But for a few hours a day, requiring a premium piece of equipment - when even an ordinary PVR is a long way from being in every home - I really don't see terrestrial HD being in every home too quickly.

Many people will be reluctant to buy expensive kit just for a few hours a day; it will not take off terrestrially until there is more content, and ideally a peak hours service.

And in the meantime, while the growth of pay HD has been quite impressive, there is still a large chunk of the population that is resistant to pay TV services, let alone premium ones, and that in itself will be sufficient to stop HD being in every home any time soon.

Things may well look better in HD. But it's going to be quite a while yet before anything approaching a majority of people are using something better than SD.

Dream on, just look at how long it's taking to switch to digital.
Most people in the UK don't want to pay more than there licence fee for TV, the goverment would not dream of telling everyone, by the way you've got to buy a new box to watch eastenders on.
Another 10, 15 years maybe.

I thought the analogue service switch-off is about to begin - certainly not 10/15 yrs time.

When it is switched off many will require a new box to be able to watch Eastenders and all other terrestial tv.

I was talking about after the switch off, the possibility of HD terrestial tv.
I'm saying that it's taken many years to get to this point with digital tv, no one wants to turn around and say by the way you now need a new box.
The public outcry is one reason why it won't happen any time soon.

You are missing my point - they are saying exactly that at present as many millions of tvs will become useless pieces of junk without a digital tuner box.

Funny haven't heard much of a 'public outcry' as yet.

Well, there are people who are grumbking here and there about the need to buy a box for digital; just not that many. But even so, look at some of the scare stories in the papers, and some people are upset and confused, wondering why they're being 'forced' to move to Freeview.

A second change, to HD, will probably produce more of that, if it happens relatively soon after the majority of people have just had to buy a box for SD terrestrial.

It is likely that many people will think a) "Why didn't they tell me HD was almost here when I was buying my box for switchoff" or b) "I've just bought a box for Freeview, I'm not going to spend more money upgrading to get HD until this one breaks."

It's not the purchase of a box that's at issue; it's the potential need to buy a second box in a relatively short time-frame after people have had to buy a first.

Arguably, that's one reason why it would be better to have clarity on HD sooner, rather than later, and ideally at least some services announced or running, enabling people to buy a dual standard SD/HD unit now.

Unfortunately, everyone concerned is dragging their feet, and unless services are announced - and arguably more compelling than a few hours in the dead of night - equipment makers will find it the market for dual standard boxes so small that many of them simply won't bother.

And so, we will end up with the Daily Mail and Express reading hordes complaining that someone - they'll probably pick on the BBC; they usually do - is "forcing" them to buy a newer box, only a little while after they switched to Freeview.

Wasn't an update to the Evesham iPlayer released to cripple the HD reception of the HD trial? I seem to remember it happening and it being said that it would be reversed if/when a "public" licenced HD service launches. Given that Evesham dumped their iPlayer have recently had financial problems and Netgem don't have a great reputation for long term support of the products they develop, I wouldn't want to rely on one for my HD viewing. I had enough trouble getting my BT branded iPlayer to work last night (blank channel list) whilst I was dual recording on the Toppy.

And that would be viewed via the Topup TV PVR that automatically skips the adverts for you, would it?

Why does nobody ever mention content? HD is great if your programmes have been recorded in HD but pointless if it hasn't, so whilst sports, film or wildlife fans might get lucky and find some HD content, everyone else won't. I doubt UKTV Gold/History or ITV3 viewers would see a great benefit with HD.

Sky and cable will continue to be the only broadcasters that provide more than a token HD service for the foreseeable future. If you're going to spend £1000 on a fancy telly, bite the bullet and subscribe to a decent HD service.

Well, Evesham sent out press units of the iPlayer, which were able to receive the trial; they always said shipping units wouldn't be able to - but quite a lot of people reported otherwise, so I don't know if they ever did do the update, and I suspect not.

And yes, with Evesham in a bit of a sorry state, the TV Max service never really appearing, and the annoying bugs in the iPlayer HD, I wouldn't hold out much hope of further support.

But if someone had one already, there's a chance it would work if an HD service were launched. As I said, perhaps generously, it's somewhat flawed. And if I hadn't mentioned it, some pedant would probably have said "Oh yes, there are HD capable boxes available."

Isnt their already a HD version of the toppy available in other countries?

There is the 7000 series, for Australia's terrestrial service, which is MPEG2 only, so not much use for HD here. And there's an announced (but not yet shipping) 7700 series PVR, which is MPEG4 capable, for the European satellite market.

I daresay that when they believe there to be a market for a terrestrial model in the 7700 series, Topfield will produce one, and they'd likely consider one with MHEG too.

But, as said so many times, why launch a product for a market that might not even be there for some years? Neither Topfield, nor anyone else, is going to jump up and down and make a big fuss about HD terrestrial products for the UK, until they have some certainty about the launch of a service.

http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/broadcas...-possible.html

The BBC Trust has called for BBC HD to be launched "as soon as possible" following the conclusion of its public value test.

Ofcom's market impact assessment released earlier today effectively cleared the channel for launch, and the Trust's own public value assessment has concluded that the service "would deliver a medium to high level of public value".

Both Ofcom and the Trust said that it would be preferable for BBC HD to broadcast in a full nine hour slot on digital terrestrial TV instead of a four hour overnight period, although the Trust said that "the operation of any DTT service should comply with the BBC Parliament service licence and commitments previously given to Parliament."

The Trust said this afternoon that BBC HD "should launch on Sky and digital cable platforms as soon as possible after any public value test decision and on Freesat from platform launch."

It added that the service should broadcast "the best of HD content from other BBC channels between 19:30 and 22:00 and not just simulcast BBC One."

The BBC Trust expects to publish its final decision on or before Wednesday November 21.

Or, in other words, they're still not certain what form a potential terrestrial service will have.

Of course everyone would like it to be on for as many hours as possible; I don't know why they bothered stating the obvious.

What is interesting, though, is that they're not sure of the public value of the terrestrial service if it's only a few hours a day. "However, the PVA highlights some issues about the relative public value of a more limited service on DTT."

So, while some people are getting over-excited about this, there are some core facts that remain:

On satellite and cable, there is no reason for the service not to go ahead as soon as the consultation period ends.

On terrestrial, while everyone might like to see a 9 hour service, there isn't the capacity to do that, unless other services are closed.

The Trust has suggested that commitments previously given to Parliament need to be considered - even the 4 hour service would have an impact on BBC Parliament, as detailed in the proposal.

Until the final results of the Trust's deliberations are known in November, we're really no closer to finding out whether or not there will be a terrestrial service. It's not a foregone conclusion, and they're going to have to weigh up the various factors outlined in the reports, eg platform erosion, promotion of MPEG4, and value to licence fee payers.

I very much doubt that any other terrestrial broadcasters will be making a leap until the BBC has made their decision. Nor will many PVR makers be rushing to adapt equipment for the UK market, until it's a little clearer what's really going to happen.

It's green, green, green for GO!!!

I think we're going to see the BBC move swiftly and effectively in bringing HD on DTT to the great British public. I'm confident that it will be a matter of months.

How will they do that then?
theres no agreed standard ( mpeg2/4, lwt alone the rest of it
theres no boxes

and the slight issue of available sapce on DTT.

As for the proposed/forthcoming freesat service, Topfeild and other manufactureres will no doubt have some equipemnt ready.

for now HD on DTT is a while off, and you can keep on using your toppy as is for now, before its relegated to a door stop or small heater.

Green for go?

Read the actual information. There's not even a decision on the service for satellite until November 21st.

And there are still questions about the value of a terrestrial service - expressed in the quote I posted. Let alone the bandwidth issues.

There may be a reasonable degree of likelihood, but anyone who thinks today's announcement is tantamount to a firm decision to launch a full HD service on Freeview is living in cloud cuckoo land.

Even the BBC themselves have not suggested in any of their proposals to the Trust - try reading them, being informed always helps this sort of debate - a timescale much before next summer, if they were to get approval for terrestrial.

There's an HD DTT area on DS, you know, where people are rather less prone to over-excitement. You may find it useful to read.

It all adds up ... The service is "medium to high value" to the public. So much so, that they want it to have a full 9 hour slot rather than an originally proposed 4 hour overnight slot. They want it to launch "as soon as possible".

Even though it may launch on other platforms first, I think with this level of commitment, we can expect to see a rapid agreement on DTT format. Ergo HD will appear very soon on Freeview.