iPhone price drop

jammers · 08-09-2007, 01:09

Quote:

I'm confused as to why everyone is waiting for the iPhone. It's great, but the monthly subscription is going to be like £50 a month or something. What's great about that?

Why? The AT&T iPhone plans are cheaper than their other plans as they offer no subsidy on the phone.

Sananda Maitreya · 08-09-2007, 01:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pingu

But the UK market doesn't work like that.

neither does the US market....but iphone isn't subsidised there.

supercool · 09-09-2007, 18:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by plasma-screen

i-phone.....haha

take a look at this 3G, 5 megapixel, turbo-broadband, stereo bluetoothed beauty..................

http://www.tech.co.uk/gadgets/phones...leid=826666802

And the software will be shit like all other mobile phones.

The key to the iPhone is the software people...so stop digging out phones with better hardware specs - its easy but prooves nothing.

For the record, 3G is over-hyped - its looking like O2 are upgrading their network to EDGE for the iPhone's release.

Phone cameras - the megapixels might be going up and up but the processing remains shit as do the quality of the images.

No mention of wifi either.

supercool · 09-09-2007, 18:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Master Ozzy

I'm confused as to why everyone is waiting for the iPhone. It's great, but the monthly subscription is going to be like £50 a month or something. What's great about that?

What are you, psychic? £50 - I highly doubt it.

neo6776 · 09-09-2007, 18:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by supercool

And the software will be shit like all other mobile phones.

The key to the iPhone is the software people...so stop digging out phones with better hardware specs - its easy but prooves nothing.

For the record, 3G is over-hyped - its looking like O2 are upgrading their network to EDGE for the iPhone's release.

Phone cameras - the megapixels might be going up and up but the processing remains shit as do the quality of the images.

No mention of wifi either.

Anyone who buys a phone based purely on software really needs slapped tbh.

I just think the iphone is the most overhyped piece of rubbish ever.

Whoopdeedo if it has OSX on it, that's nothing to shout about either.

Pingu · 09-09-2007, 19:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sananda Maitreya

neither does the US market....but iphone isn't subsidised there.

Well take a look at AT&T's phone prices:
http://www.wireless.att.com/cell-pho...PhonesBody.jsp

A Blackberry 8800 is $299 (after rebate - $349 otherwise), when purchased with a 2 year contract at $40+ a month (around £25). The price of the phone doesn't alter in relation to the cost of service package you subscribe to.

The same phone is free on Vodafone with a 12 month contract at £35/month:
http://shop.vodafone.co.uk/index.cfm...8&WT.svl=link1

jammers · 09-09-2007, 22:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by neo6776

Anyone who buys a phone based purely on software really needs slapped tbh.

I just think the iphone is the most overhyped piece of rubbish ever.

Whoopdeedo if it has OSX on it, that's nothing to shout about either.

lol, erm the software is what makes the phone - crap software makes a crap phone.

hobbes79 · 10-09-2007, 09:38

Apple gives $100 credit to early buyers, upset about the massive price drop.

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2007/09...iphone_buyers/

supercool · 10-09-2007, 10:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by jammers

lol, erm the software is what makes the phone - crap software makes a crap phone.

Exactly. Anybody who buys a phone based on hardware specs is the fool.

neo6776 · 10-09-2007, 10:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by supercool

Exactly. Anybody who buys a phone based on hardware specs is the fool.

Sorry but that gave me the best laugh in ages

Just you keep on believing that lol

neo6776 · 10-09-2007, 10:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by jammers

lol, erm the software is what makes the phone - crap software makes a crap phone.

What a load of crap.

MOST people don't care about the UI unless it is completely inoperable, most people go on what hardware specs the phone has got.

To believe otherwise is just plain foolishness.

The OS on the iphone may be swish but the rest of it is utter garbage hence why most people will not buy it. Only peopl with money to burn/apple nuts and fools that want to be seen with it a la ipod.

iain · 10-09-2007, 11:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Master Ozzy

I'm confused as to why everyone is waiting for the iPhone.

Quote:

It's great

you've kind of answered you're own question there, haven't you?

Quote:

but the monthly subscription is going to be like £50 a month or something. What's great about that?

when did they announce that?

Iain

iain · 10-09-2007, 11:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by neo6776

Anyone who buys a phone based purely on software really needs slapped tbh.

yeah - who are these crazy fools bothered by how usable a device is?

what's the point in better hardware specs, if the thing's a PITA to actually use?

Quote:

I just think the iphone is the most overhyped piece of rubbish ever.

even more over hyped rubbish since the last apple thing you thought was the most overhyped piece of rubbish ever?

Iain

Paul Evans · 10-09-2007, 13:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by supercool

Exactly. Anybody who buys a phone based on hardware specs is the fool.

Yeah, who needs a phone that has a 5mp camera (with one of those fancy flash things that lets you take pictures in the dark), the ability to create ringtones from my own MP3s (not iTunes), a fancy smancy physical keypad for dialling out those telephone number thingies (rather than trying to find the virtual keypad buried away under several options). 3G? So last century isn't it? Removeable batteries? Nah, who really needs their phone 24/7/365...

But, if you want to talk software:

Why no video recording?
Why can't I use my own MP3s as ringtones instead of paying Apple TWICE for the privilege?
Why is the main feature of any phone (the numeric keypad) buried away somewhere under some fancy OS? Obviously, I'd rather be playing with a pretty touchscreen rather than actually make calls.
Why no ability to use third-party applications?
In fact, why can't I do half the things with the iPhone that a cheaper phone can let me do with absolute ease?

Still, on the plus side, at least you can join the thousands of iClones out on the streets. Crap phone, but at least you'll think you look cool!

iain · 10-09-2007, 13:28

what if you have no need for any of that, and just prefer the UI / functionality of the iPhone?

i really don't get this idea that anyone who ever buys an apple product only does so to look cool.

surely different people have different pros and cons with a phone?

why, for example, would anyone with a decent DSLR camera want to use a phone to take photos?

i'd wager that, all other things being equal, a 5MP camera on a phone, isn't going to come close to half decent DSLR.

with the keypad - when you say buried' - what steps do you actually have to go through to find it?

Iain

Paul Evans · 10-09-2007, 13:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by iain

what if you have no need for any of that, and just prefer the UI / functionality of the iPhone?

You have no need to make phone calls on a, erm... phone?

i really don't get this idea that anyone who ever buys an apple product only does so to look cool.

surely different people have different pros and cons with a phone?

True, but let's not forget that this is a "phone five years ahead of the competition" (Steve Jobs). Those specs alone are two years behind the times. If Apple are going to make ludicrous claims like that, they need to back it up with hard facts. A fancy OS means nothing if the hardware isn't up to scratch. It's akin to putting a BMW badge on a Lada.

why, for example, would anyone with a decent DSLR camera want to use a phone to take photos?

No phone camera is ever going to match the quality of a DSLR, or even a budget point-and-click camera. However, more and more people are starting to make videos on their phones. Breaking news stories now seem to feature mobile phone footage from locals who get to the scene first. It seems ridiculous that with companies going on about convergence of technologies being the next best thing that Apple are leaving out something so basic that any other phone on the market can do with no hassles at all. Also, the iPhone has a YouTube portal doesn't it? YouTube's full of videos people have taken on their mobiles - something iPhone users can't do!

i'd wager that, all other things being equal, a 5MP camera on a phone, isn't going to come close to half decent DSLR.

with the keypad - when you say buried' - what steps do you actually have to go through to find it?

Apparently, you have to navigate a menu to make calls, something to the order of three taps on the screen before you can dial a number. That's a lot of arseing around if you need to dial 999.

Iain

My responses in bold.

iain · 10-09-2007, 14:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Evans

You have no need to make phone calls on a, erm... phone?

i'm pretty sure you can make phone calls on the iPhone.

(am i missing something here?

Quote:

True, but let's not forget that this is a "phone five years ahead of the competition" (Steve Jobs). Those specs alone are two years behind the times. If Apple are going to make ludicrous claims like that, they need to back it up with hard facts. A fancy OS means nothing if the hardware isn't up to scratch. It's akin to putting a BMW badge on a Lada.

perhaps - but it's ahead of the competition in many ways. i'm not sure how many ways a lada would be ahead of a BMW?

Quote:

No phone camera is ever going to match the quality of a DSLR, or even a budget point-and-click camera. However, more and more people are starting to make videos on their phones. Breaking news stories now seem to feature mobile phone footage from locals who get to the scene first. It seems ridiculous that with companies going on about convergence of technologies being the next best thing that Apple are leaving out something so basic that any other phone on the market can do with no hassles at all. Also, the iPhone has a YouTube portal doesn't it? YouTube's full of videos people have taken on their mobiles - something iPhone users can't do!

fair enough - but not everyone's interested in taking lame videos of their mates falling over to stick on you tube - so it's disingenuous to suggest that people who aren't bothered about that, and might buy an iPhone because it's UI or whatever is more important to them, that they're only buying one to look cool, and are foolish for doing so.

Quote:

Apparently, you have to navigate a menu to make calls, something to the order of three taps on the screen before you can dial a number. That's a lot of arseing around if you need to dial 999.

isn't there a phone icon - one tap. and maybe another tap to call up the keyboard.

not sure what your definition of a lot of arsing around is - how long would it take you to make a couple of taps on such a small screen?

Iain

moisie · 10-09-2007, 14:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by neo6776

MOST people don't care about the UI unless it is completely inoperable, most people go on what hardware specs the phone has got.

And the reason they do wouldn't have anything to do with the fact that mobile manufacturers advertise their products solely based on the hardware specs. You never see the benefits of these specs in the ads, you never see people listening to their music, making a call then going back to their music etc because typically the interfaces are crap and are not something that a manufacturer can use as a selling point. Most people who talk about what specs their phone has don't know what they actually mean and more often than not won't know how to use them.

TheSoulBrother · 10-09-2007, 14:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Evans

Yeah, who needs a phone that has a 5mp camera (with one of those fancy flash things that lets you take pictures in the dark), the ability to create ringtones from my own MP3s (not iTunes), a fancy smancy physical keypad for dialling out those telephone number thingies (rather than trying to find the virtual keypad buried away under several options). 3G? So last century isn't it? Removeable batteries? Nah, who really needs their phone 24/7/365...

But, if you want to talk software:

Why no video recording?
Why can't I use my own MP3s as ringtones instead of paying Apple TWICE for the privilege?
Why is the main feature of any phone (the numeric keypad) buried away somewhere under some fancy OS? Obviously, I'd rather be playing with a pretty touchscreen rather than actually make calls.
Why no ability to use third-party applications?
In fact, why can't I do half the things with the iPhone that a cheaper phone can let me do with absolute ease?

Still, on the plus side, at least you can join the thousands of iClones out on the streets. Crap phone, but at least you'll think you look cool!

The hate here is strong I see.

You press phone, then keypad. Hardly 'buried'. Ironic when you look at the UI of a S60 phone

Instead of enforcing the 'my opinion is the only right one' on everybody like some, let me tell you why the iPhone is for me, ahead of any other phone.

Mac OSX integration - sync with Address Book, iCal, iPhoto, iTunes.

Display - beautiful. High PPI. Perfect size for me. (not too small (N95), not too big (N800)

UI - in relative terms, probably the only thing that is 5 years ahead of anything else. Sure, now the phone is out, expect Nokia to have mimicked it in 2 years. And mimick it they will.

Browser - better than any other phone on the market. Near full Javascript/HTML support. Superb panning, scrolling, zooming capabilities. Syncs with bookmarks on my Mac.

iTunes integration - I live in iTunes. Any phone that can sync up with my music collection, smart playlists, podcasts (mark as read on the road then sync back up) and audiobooks has a huge advantage. Apple handle the entire software/hardware stack so it works beautifully. Its not for everybody but it is for me. Media management on my N series phone sucks balls. And media, after the phone itself, is the most important aspect of any device that sits in my pocket.

Yes, the camera is 2 year ago tech. luckily I have a nice digital camera so its not a huge deal.

Yes, paying for ringtone sucks. Luckily all my phones stay on silent/vibrate. So this is not a problem for me.

Yes, there is no official SDK. Luckily there is an amazingly active developer community for the iPhone that makes up for this. To say there is no ability for 3rd party applications is a lie.

http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z...oooz/lawlz.png

Themeing is easy too.

Official support would be fantastic, but this is no ordinary device. There are no physical buttons. It has specific design considerations (scrolling vs pointing, accellerometer). Apple probably havent even worked out their HIG for it (note the inconsistencies between their own apps). This stuff takes time. Especially as its a v.1 device.

So yeah, I will be purchasing an iPhone on day 1. NOT because im an 'iSheep'. Not because it looks cool (and it looks very cool). No, because of all the reasons outlined above, and because I have tremendous trust in Apple to deliver a coherent, easy to use piece of tech that actually treats design as a feature and not an afterthought.

Flame away.

neo6776 · 10-09-2007, 15:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by iain

perhaps - but it's ahead of the competition in many ways. i'm not sure how many ways a lada would be ahead of a BMW?

Iain

I would say in 1 way, the OS. Others its miles behind.

neo6776 · 10-09-2007, 15:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by moisie

you never see people listening to their music, making a call then going back to their music etc because typically the interfaces are crap and are not something that a manufacturer can use as a selling point.

I see people doing this ll the time on the bus. Also i do it with my SE k800i and it is extremely easy to do.

While the music is playing i can dial the number, press send, music fades out makes the call and the music fades back in when im done.

Cant see how easier it can be tbh.

TheSoulBrother · 10-09-2007, 15:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by neo6776

I would say in 1 way, the OS. Others its miles behind.

And this is the hardest thing to reproduce.

Adding a better quality camera or 3G is relatively trivial. Nokia, SE etc coming up with an OS and UI even halfway as good is not.

neo6776 · 10-09-2007, 15:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheSoulBrother

You press phone, then keypad. Hardly 'buried'. Ironic when you look at the UI of a S60 phone

The keypad is on the phone on a s60 phone so i see no irony at all. Its easier to dial a number on and other phone than it will ever be on the iphone. Kinda obvious really

Quote:

Mac OSX integration - sync with Address Book, iCal, iPhoto, iTunes.

And if you dont have a mac which the vast majority of folk dont?

Quote:

Display - beautiful. High PPI. Perfect size for me. (not too small (N95), not too big (N800)

Interesting.

Quote:

UI - in relative terms, probably the only thing that is 5 years ahead of anything else. Sure, now the phone is out, expect Nokia to have mimicked it in 2 years. And mimick it they will.

I doubt 5 years whatsoever.

Quote:

Browser - better than any other phone on the market. Near full Javascript/HTML support. Superb panning, scrolling, zooming capabilities. Syncs with bookmarks on my Mac.

Again, what if you dont have a mac. for the vast majority of folk that feature will be useless.

Quote:

iTunes integration - I live in iTunes.

No ones perfect

Quote:

Any phone that can sync up with my music collection, smart playlists, podcasts (mark as read on the road then sync back up) and audiobooks has a huge advantage. Apple handle the entire software/hardware stack so it works beautifully. Its not for everybody but it is for me. Media management on my N series phone sucks balls. And media, after the phone itself, is the most important aspect of any device that sits in my pocket.

tbh when i used my n73 all i di was drag ad drop in the music i wanted. All this syncing rubbish is just that, rubbish.

Quote:

Yes, the camera is 2 year ago tech. luckily I have a nice digital camera so its not a huge deal.

I dont bother really about the camera on my phone but it is handy to have aphone with a good one on it incase i dont have my digi camera with me.

Quote:

Yes, paying for ringtone sucks. Luckily all my phones stay on silent/vibrate. So this is not a problem for me.

more than sucks, its a disgrace tbh.

Most peoples phones dont stay on silent so for the majority its a joke.

iain · 10-09-2007, 15:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by neo6776

I would say in 1 way, the OS. Others its miles behind.

so it's way ahead in the one thing that makes it's usability so good - both in terms of using it, in terms of how well it integrates with your media on a computer, an

but not so much in a bunch of other random stuff that might not be important to everyone.

who's the bigger fool - someone taken in by a bunch of stuff they might not actually ever use...

..or someone who buys something based on the one or two things that are important to them?

(of course there's no right or wrong there, as it's all down to personal choice - i guess i just take issue to your usual line about how 'anyone who buys an apple product is a moron'.)

Iain

neo6776 · 10-09-2007, 15:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheSoulBrother

And this is the hardest thing to reproduce.

Adding a better quality camera or 3G is relatively trivial. Nokia, SE etc coming up with an OS and UI even halfway as good is not.

I use a K800i just now and i cant see anything wrong with the UI whatsoever. Its fast, very fast in fact, things are where there supposed to be so why would i need a UI that's fancier, 700mb in size larger and probably much slower?

08-09-2007, 01:09	#26
jammers Inactive Member Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: London Posts: 4,223	Quote: Originally Posted by Master Ozzy I'm confused as to why everyone is waiting for the iPhone. It's great, but the monthly subscription is going to be like £50 a month or something. What's great about that? Why? The AT&T iPhone plans are cheaper than their other plans as they offer no subsidy on the phone.

08-09-2007, 01:23	#27
Sananda Maitreya Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 5,687	Quote: Originally Posted by Pingu But the UK market doesn't work like that. neither does the US market....but iphone isn't subsidised there.

09-09-2007, 18:39	#28
supercool Banned User Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 1,110	Quote: Originally Posted by plasma-screen i-phone.....haha take a look at this 3G, 5 megapixel, turbo-broadband, stereo bluetoothed beauty.................. http://www.tech.co.uk/gadgets/phones...leid=826666802 And the software will be shit like all other mobile phones. The key to the iPhone is the software people...so stop digging out phones with better hardware specs - its easy but prooves nothing. For the record, 3G is over-hyped - its looking like O2 are upgrading their network to EDGE for the iPhone's release. Phone cameras - the megapixels might be going up and up but the processing remains shit as do the quality of the images. No mention of wifi either.

09-09-2007, 18:42	#29
supercool Banned User Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 1,110	Quote: Originally Posted by Master Ozzy I'm confused as to why everyone is waiting for the iPhone. It's great, but the monthly subscription is going to be like £50 a month or something. What's great about that? What are you, psychic? £50 - I highly doubt it.

09-09-2007, 18:58	#30
neo6776 Inactive Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Dundee, Scotland ♂ Posts: 9,026	Quote: Originally Posted by supercool And the software will be shit like all other mobile phones. The key to the iPhone is the software people...so stop digging out phones with better hardware specs - its easy but prooves nothing. For the record, 3G is over-hyped - its looking like O2 are upgrading their network to EDGE for the iPhone's release. Phone cameras - the megapixels might be going up and up but the processing remains shit as do the quality of the images. No mention of wifi either. Anyone who buys a phone based purely on software really needs slapped tbh. I just think the iphone is the most overhyped piece of rubbish ever. Whoopdeedo if it has OSX on it, that's nothing to shout about either.

09-09-2007, 19:28	#31
Pingu Forum Member Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Cornwall Posts: 10,529	Quote: Originally Posted by Sananda Maitreya neither does the US market....but iphone isn't subsidised there. Well take a look at AT&T's phone prices: http://www.wireless.att.com/cell-pho...PhonesBody.jsp A Blackberry 8800 is $299 (after rebate - $349 otherwise), when purchased with a 2 year contract at $40+ a month (around £25). The price of the phone doesn't alter in relation to the cost of service package you subscribe to. The same phone is free on Vodafone with a 12 month contract at £35/month: http://shop.vodafone.co.uk/index.cfm...8&WT.svl=link1

09-09-2007, 22:05	#32
jammers Inactive Member Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: London Posts: 4,223	Quote: Originally Posted by neo6776 Anyone who buys a phone based purely on software really needs slapped tbh. I just think the iphone is the most overhyped piece of rubbish ever. Whoopdeedo if it has OSX on it, that's nothing to shout about either. lol, erm the software is what makes the phone - crap software makes a crap phone.

10-09-2007, 09:38	#33
hobbes79 Forum Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: UK Posts: 337	Apple gives $100 credit to early buyers, upset about the massive price drop. http://www.theregister.co.uk/2007/09...iphone_buyers/

10-09-2007, 10:08	#34
supercool Banned User Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 1,110	Quote: Originally Posted by jammers lol, erm the software is what makes the phone - crap software makes a crap phone. Exactly. Anybody who buys a phone based on hardware specs is the fool.

10-09-2007, 10:32	#35
neo6776 Inactive Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Dundee, Scotland ♂ Posts: 9,026	Quote: Originally Posted by supercool Exactly. Anybody who buys a phone based on hardware specs is the fool. Sorry but that gave me the best laugh in ages Just you keep on believing that lol

10-09-2007, 10:37	#36
neo6776 Inactive Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Dundee, Scotland ♂ Posts: 9,026	Quote: Originally Posted by jammers lol, erm the software is what makes the phone - crap software makes a crap phone. What a load of crap. MOST people don't care about the UI unless it is completely inoperable, most people go on what hardware specs the phone has got. To believe otherwise is just plain foolishness. The OS on the iphone may be swish but the rest of it is utter garbage hence why most people will not buy it. Only peopl with money to burn/apple nuts and fools that want to be seen with it a la ipod.

10-09-2007, 11:18	#37
iain Guest Join Date: Mar 2000 Posts: 62,990	Quote: Originally Posted by Master Ozzy I'm confused as to why everyone is waiting for the iPhone. Quote: It's great you've kind of answered you're own question there, haven't you? Quote: but the monthly subscription is going to be like £50 a month or something. What's great about that? when did they announce that? Iain

10-09-2007, 11:21	#38
iain Guest Join Date: Mar 2000 Posts: 62,990	Quote: Originally Posted by neo6776 Anyone who buys a phone based purely on software really needs slapped tbh. yeah - who are these crazy fools bothered by how usable a device is? what's the point in better hardware specs, if the thing's a PITA to actually use? Quote: I just think the iphone is the most overhyped piece of rubbish ever. even more over hyped rubbish since the last apple thing you thought was the most overhyped piece of rubbish ever? Iain

10-09-2007, 13:19	#39
Paul Evans Forum Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: Manchester, UK not EU Posts: 1,564	Quote: Originally Posted by supercool Exactly. Anybody who buys a phone based on hardware specs is the fool. Yeah, who needs a phone that has a 5mp camera (with one of those fancy flash things that lets you take pictures in the dark), the ability to create ringtones from my own MP3s (not iTunes), a fancy smancy physical keypad for dialling out those telephone number thingies (rather than trying to find the virtual keypad buried away under several options). 3G? So last century isn't it? Removeable batteries? Nah, who really needs their phone 24/7/365... But, if you want to talk software: Why no video recording? Why can't I use my own MP3s as ringtones instead of paying Apple TWICE for the privilege? Why is the main feature of any phone (the numeric keypad) buried away somewhere under some fancy OS? Obviously, I'd rather be playing with a pretty touchscreen rather than actually make calls. Why no ability to use third-party applications? In fact, why can't I do half the things with the iPhone that a cheaper phone can let me do with absolute ease? Still, on the plus side, at least you can join the thousands of iClones out on the streets. Crap phone, but at least you'll think you look cool!

10-09-2007, 13:28	#40
iain Guest Join Date: Mar 2000 Posts: 62,990	what if you have no need for any of that, and just prefer the UI / functionality of the iPhone? i really don't get this idea that anyone who ever buys an apple product *only* does so to look cool. surely different people have different pros and cons with a phone? why, for example, would anyone with a decent DSLR camera want to use a phone to take photos? i'd wager that, all other things being equal, a 5MP camera on a phone, isn't going to come close to half decent DSLR. with the keypad - when you say buried' - what steps do you actually have to go through to find it? Iain

10-09-2007, 13:52	#41
Paul Evans Forum Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: Manchester, UK not EU Posts: 1,564	Quote: Originally Posted by iain what if you have no need for any of that, and just prefer the UI / functionality of the iPhone? You have no need to make phone calls on a, erm... phone? i really don't get this idea that anyone who ever buys an apple product *only* does so to look cool. surely different people have different pros and cons with a phone? True, but let's not forget that this is a "phone five years ahead of the competition" (Steve Jobs). Those specs alone are two years behind the times. If Apple are going to make ludicrous claims like that, they need to back it up with hard facts. A fancy OS means nothing if the hardware isn't up to scratch. It's akin to putting a BMW badge on a Lada. why, for example, would anyone with a decent DSLR camera want to use a phone to take photos? No phone camera is ever going to match the quality of a DSLR, or even a budget point-and-click camera. However, more and more people are starting to make videos on their phones. Breaking news stories now seem to feature mobile phone footage from locals who get to the scene first. It seems ridiculous that with companies going on about convergence of technologies being the next best thing that Apple are leaving out something so basic that any other phone on the market can do with no hassles at all. Also, the iPhone has a YouTube portal doesn't it? YouTube's full of videos people have taken on their mobiles - something iPhone users can't do! i'd wager that, all other things being equal, a 5MP camera on a phone, isn't going to come close to half decent DSLR. with the keypad - when you say buried' - what steps do you actually have to go through to find it? Apparently, you have to navigate a menu to make calls, something to the order of three taps on the screen before you can dial a number. That's a lot of arseing around if you need to dial 999. Iain My responses in bold.

10-09-2007, 14:08	#42
iain Guest Join Date: Mar 2000 Posts: 62,990	Quote: Originally Posted by Paul Evans You have no need to make phone calls on a, erm... phone? i'm pretty sure you *can* make phone calls on the iPhone. (am i missing something here? Quote: True, but let's not forget that this is a "phone five years ahead of the competition" (Steve Jobs). Those specs alone are two years behind the times. If Apple are going to make ludicrous claims like that, they need to back it up with hard facts. A fancy OS means nothing if the hardware isn't up to scratch. It's akin to putting a BMW badge on a Lada. perhaps - but it's ahead of the competition in many ways. i'm not sure how many ways a lada would be ahead of a BMW? Quote: No phone camera is ever going to match the quality of a DSLR, or even a budget point-and-click camera. However, more and more people are starting to make videos on their phones. Breaking news stories now seem to feature mobile phone footage from locals who get to the scene first. It seems ridiculous that with companies going on about convergence of technologies being the next best thing that Apple are leaving out something so basic that any other phone on the market can do with no hassles at all. Also, the iPhone has a YouTube portal doesn't it? YouTube's full of videos people have taken on their mobiles - something iPhone users can't do! fair enough - but not everyone's interested in taking lame videos of their mates falling over to stick on you tube - so it's disingenuous to suggest that people who aren't bothered about that, and might buy an iPhone because it's UI or whatever is more important to them, that they're only buying one to look cool, and are foolish for doing so. Quote: Apparently, you have to navigate a menu to make calls, something to the order of three taps on the screen before you can dial a number. That's a lot of arseing around if you need to dial 999. isn't there a phone icon - one tap. and maybe another tap to call up the keyboard. not sure what your definition of a lot of arsing around is - how long would it take you to make a couple of taps on such a small screen? Iain

10-09-2007, 14:33	#43
moisie Forum Member Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Herts Posts: 2,378	Quote: Originally Posted by neo6776 MOST people don't care about the UI unless it is completely inoperable, most people go on what hardware specs the phone has got. And the reason they do wouldn't have anything to do with the fact that mobile manufacturers advertise their products solely based on the hardware specs. You never see the benefits of these specs in the ads, you never see people listening to their music, making a call then going back to their music etc because typically the interfaces are crap and are not something that a manufacturer can use as a selling point. Most people who talk about what specs their phone has don't know what they actually mean and more often than not won't know how to use them.

10-09-2007, 14:48	#44
TheSoulBrother Forum Member Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 2,940	Quote: Originally Posted by Paul Evans Yeah, who needs a phone that has a 5mp camera (with one of those fancy flash things that lets you take pictures in the dark), the ability to create ringtones from my own MP3s (not iTunes), a fancy smancy physical keypad for dialling out those telephone number thingies (rather than trying to find the virtual keypad buried away under several options). 3G? So last century isn't it? Removeable batteries? Nah, who really needs their phone 24/7/365... But, if you want to talk software: Why no video recording? Why can't I use my own MP3s as ringtones instead of paying Apple TWICE for the privilege? Why is the main feature of any phone (the numeric keypad) buried away somewhere under some fancy OS? Obviously, I'd rather be playing with a pretty touchscreen rather than actually make calls. Why no ability to use third-party applications? In fact, why can't I do half the things with the iPhone that a cheaper phone can let me do with absolute ease? Still, on the plus side, at least you can join the thousands of iClones out on the streets. Crap phone, but at least you'll think you look cool! The hate here is strong I see. You press phone, then keypad. Hardly 'buried'. Ironic when you look at the UI of a S60 phone Instead of enforcing the 'my opinion is the only right one' on everybody like some, let me tell you why the iPhone is for me, ahead of any other phone. Mac OSX integration - sync with Address Book, iCal, iPhoto, iTunes. Display - beautiful. High PPI. Perfect size for me. (not too small (N95), not too big (N800) UI - in relative terms, probably the only thing that is 5 years ahead of anything else. Sure, now the phone is out, expect Nokia to have mimicked it in 2 years. And mimick it they will. Browser - better than any other phone on the market. Near full Javascript/HTML support. Superb panning, scrolling, zooming capabilities. Syncs with bookmarks on my Mac. iTunes integration - I live in iTunes. Any phone that can sync up with my music collection, smart playlists, podcasts (mark as read on the road then sync back up) and audiobooks has a huge advantage. Apple handle the entire software/hardware stack so it works beautifully. Its not for everybody but it is for me. Media management on my N series phone sucks balls. And media, after the phone itself, is the most important aspect of any device that sits in my pocket. Yes, the camera is 2 year ago tech. luckily I have a nice digital camera so its not a huge deal. Yes, paying for ringtone sucks. Luckily all my phones stay on silent/vibrate. So this is not a problem for me. Yes, there is no official SDK. Luckily there is an amazingly active developer community for the iPhone that makes up for this. To say there is no ability for 3rd party applications is a lie. http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z...oooz/lawlz.png Themeing is easy too. Official support would be fantastic, but this is no ordinary device. There are no physical buttons. It has specific design considerations (scrolling vs pointing, accellerometer). Apple probably havent even worked out their HIG for it (note the inconsistencies between their own apps). This stuff takes time. Especially as its a v.1 device. So yeah, I will be purchasing an iPhone on day 1. NOT because im an 'iSheep'. Not because it looks cool (and it looks very cool). No, because of all the reasons outlined above, and because I have tremendous trust in Apple to deliver a coherent, easy to use piece of tech that actually treats design as a feature and not an afterthought. Flame away.

10-09-2007, 15:03	#45
neo6776 Inactive Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Dundee, Scotland ♂ Posts: 9,026	Quote: Originally Posted by iain perhaps - but it's ahead of the competition in many ways. i'm not sure how many ways a lada would be ahead of a BMW? Iain I would say in 1 way, the OS. Others its miles behind.

10-09-2007, 15:08	#46
neo6776 Inactive Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Dundee, Scotland ♂ Posts: 9,026	Quote: Originally Posted by moisie you never see people listening to their music, making a call then going back to their music etc because typically the interfaces are crap and are not something that a manufacturer can use as a selling point. I see people doing this ll the time on the bus. Also i do it with my SE k800i and it is extremely easy to do. While the music is playing i can dial the number, press send, music fades out makes the call and the music fades back in when im done. Cant see how easier it can be tbh.

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10-09-2007, 15:14	#47
TheSoulBrother Forum Member Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 2,940	Quote: Originally Posted by neo6776 I would say in 1 way, the OS. Others its miles behind. And this is the hardest thing to reproduce. Adding a better quality camera or 3G is relatively trivial. Nokia, SE etc coming up with an OS and UI even halfway as good is not.

10-09-2007, 15:18	#48
neo6776 Inactive Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Dundee, Scotland ♂ Posts: 9,026	Quote: Originally Posted by TheSoulBrother You press phone, then keypad. Hardly 'buried'. Ironic when you look at the UI of a S60 phone The keypad is on the phone on a s60 phone so i see no irony at all. Its easier to dial a number on and other phone than it will ever be on the iphone. Kinda obvious really Quote: Mac OSX integration - sync with Address Book, iCal, iPhoto, iTunes. And if you dont have a mac which the vast majority of folk dont? Quote: Display - beautiful. High PPI. Perfect size for me. (not too small (N95), not too big (N800) Interesting. Quote: UI - in relative terms, probably the only thing that is 5 years ahead of anything else. Sure, now the phone is out, expect Nokia to have mimicked it in 2 years. And mimick it they will. I doubt 5 years whatsoever. Quote: Browser - better than any other phone on the market. Near full Javascript/HTML support. Superb panning, scrolling, zooming capabilities. Syncs with bookmarks on my Mac. Again, what if you dont have a mac. for the vast majority of folk that feature will be useless. Quote: iTunes integration - I live in iTunes. No ones perfect Quote: Any phone that can sync up with my music collection, smart playlists, podcasts (mark as read on the road then sync back up) and audiobooks has a huge advantage. Apple handle the entire software/hardware stack so it works beautifully. Its not for everybody but it is for me. Media management on my N series phone sucks balls. And media, after the phone itself, is the most important aspect of any device that sits in my pocket. tbh when i used my n73 all i di was drag ad drop in the music i wanted. All this syncing rubbish is just that, rubbish. Quote: Yes, the camera is 2 year ago tech. luckily I have a nice digital camera so its not a huge deal. I dont bother really about the camera on my phone but it is handy to have aphone with a good one on it incase i dont have my digi camera with me. Quote: Yes, paying for ringtone sucks. Luckily all my phones stay on silent/vibrate. So this is not a problem for me. more than sucks, its a disgrace tbh. Most peoples phones dont stay on silent so for the majority its a joke.

10-09-2007, 15:19	#50
neo6776 Inactive Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Dundee, Scotland ♂ Posts: 9,026	Quote: Originally Posted by TheSoulBrother And this is the hardest thing to reproduce. Adding a better quality camera or 3G is relatively trivial. Nokia, SE etc coming up with an OS and UI even halfway as good is not. I use a K800i just now and i cant see anything wrong with the UI whatsoever. Its fast, very fast in fact, things are where there supposed to be so why would i need a UI that's fancier, 700mb in size larger and probably much slower?