Er, I don't think so - the claim was Many houses just have 1 router. Maybe quite a number of houses have NO router as they don't have broadband. And routers also have at least one ethernet port, if people need more they buy a cheap switch (5-port or 8-port). If they want wireless somewhere, then an Access Point connected to the router, and another AP elsewhere in the house, with ethernet connectivity to the kit.




And so can ethernet cables (mine are). PVRs are not normally seen as portable, so will sit with all of the other wiring that inhabits the standard HiFi/Entertainment racking or corner of the room. But it was YOU that talked about cables being a hazard. Power cables can be just as much of a hazard (sometimes even more so) than a small ethernet cable.



What one? All of these wifi-enable devices that will be taking data off the internet?




WiFi is only going to be useful when there is a proven application requirement for it. Again as I stated before, STBs and PVRs pick up their information from the EPG. Yes, the Toppy can pick up RatioTimes data (with an additional few steps), but for most people the EPG data is more than sufficient. And those who are sufficiently moved to pick up such data will more than likely already have the necessary connectivity in place. You seem to be proffering a solution and then looking for the problem.


No, you are not really talking sense - you seemingly talk from a perspective of knowing a bit and assuming much.

That is, without doubt, the funniest thing I read/saw/heard today. Thanks ianmoticon

Yes, but Marc Davis, your laptop needs to access the internet, your baby monitor (possibly) can be listened to over the internet (if it's one of those advanced wireless ones). The point is that the Toppy is meant to be a beautiful, unique STB given the miracle of running applications on it, which are downloaded ... yes ... from the internet. And we pay a premium price for that miracle. It makes perfect sense to expel the wires from technology which accesses the internet at home. That's why Sony and Nintendo have done it. You know it makes sense.

Called a Topfield or somethin' or nuthin'

Apparantly you download these things called TAPs and supporting data. I believe that's done through the internet, although I believe the user has the option of going to the author's house with a memory stick, CD Rom or other device for transferring the data.

Depite the question being posed and repeated, ianmoticon has yet to come up with anything approaching an answer (which perhaps says much).

I was going to ask if you had never heard of using snail mail to circulate CD discs but then I remembered the top UK news story of today.

Yes, diverting attention away from all of those other devices that are being launched with WiFi connectivity that the Toppy will be competing against.

And of course it is not straightforward to pick up any data from any TV listings site and feed it into the Toppy's EPG (and it would probably be a waste of the Topfield programming resources to code such applications which would be of interest to a very small number)
As I say, the EPG provides sufficient data for most people (even those with the Toppy). The fact that the Toppy can do much more from basic internet listings with TAPs (things that most other PVRs cannot) is testament in itself.

Oh, a little reminder to tell us about these devices with wifi that the new Toppy will be competing against - manufacturer website links would be nice.

Does it matter? We've already established that any household item which accesses the internet is best to be wireless. Just look at the number of wireless items on the market for the home (listed earlier). They are wireless for a good reason (not least for not having an ethernet cable trailing all the way out the door to the router).

Also, the Toppy is not really living up to its potential without a wireless link. Think of the wealth of data made available to applications with a small addition of a live link. Updating TAPs and logo data could be done effortlessly. The Toppy is a bird - let it fly, don't clip its wings.

Updating TAPs and their data - obvious and straight forward application. Also downloading new TAPs.

Our resourceful TAP writers would work miracles given a simple wireless link, available on many every day domestic electronic devices.

So do you think that websites will provide the data in a format that the Toppy can easily digest, as well as harvest?

They already do


Yeah, such as fridges & nintendos & the like. But PVRs and STBs? I'm still waiting for that list of devices that the new Toppy will be competing against.

Unfortunately Nigel is not the only one sworn to secrecy on some issues.

[quote=ianmoticon;18468145]Does it matter? [quote]Well, it was YOU that made the claim, one which you seem reluctant or unable to justify (the one about devices that the new Toppy will be competing against, unless in its new guise it will also be able to chill food)..


No, YOU might have done, but WE haven't.



I already update many things with little effort, via a USB cable to SLUG, ethernet to firewall/router, ethernet to PC (in another room, couresy of a couple of CAT5E sockets). There are more things that would have to be coded on the Toppy to allow that (ftp client, ethernet protocol etc), when for the vast majority the important thing is for it to be able to record & playback TV.

The list expands. "Deluded" has now been added to "Ignorant".

mossy2103 - you seem to be acting on the premise that you don't think that WiFi is a natural and expected addition to a domestic device accessing the Internet.

It seems to me that the vast majority of Topfield users want wireless connections. They are no different to people sick of trailing ethernet wires to connect up games machines etc.

Do you want to be wireless or do you want to be trailing wires all over the shop for the next 5 years (or for however long you have your TF5810)? If someone comes into your living room in 2010 and sees your TF5810 with an ethernet cable hanging out the back, you'll be a laughing stock. The neighbours' kids will start laughing at you through the letter box, and you'll have "Old Man Ethernet Cable" sprayed on your front door. Is that seriously what you want for yourself and other Topfield users?

Do they? No-one asked me. Did I miss that poll?

In other words, you have no idea, and your earlier claim was without foundation

Oh, nwhitfield has posted some more info of the site regarding the new disk manufacturer and more importantly the likely size, so unlike you he does come up with the promised info.

No, it would be an addition seen as useful IF there was more than a passing need for it. This at the moment seems not to be the case for PVRs and STBs


Source for this info? Or do you have access to all of the market research data?




Like I said, I have no trailing wires, they are all tidy and in their place.


No, can't quite accept that. Wired ethernet will always be a faster and more stable solution. If you want cutting edge, then fibre connectivity would be preferable.

Yes but the thing is ian, the Toppy has already been made - you are too late with your suggestion. Try starting a wishlist thread so that it will make it easier for people to know what it is people want most - which may be incorporated into the existing machine softwarewise or future hardware.

The other problem is that Topfield dont really do taps or get much involved with them. They provide the recorder and just support that. Their newer PVR offerings dont seem to have tap scope even. So I can see why you may want easier ways to transfer them around but for Topfield they may look at things differently. Theres still hope - the facelift machine or the all new topfield in a couple of years or whenever that will be could have just what you are after.

Start a wishlist thread for Topfield users and see where it goes. You never know where it will impact future software and hardware development

I've already suggested you read up on this, but you don't like to let facts get in the way of misinformation, do you?

For media functions, wired ethernet is more robust, and far from needing cables trailing everywhere, all you need is a simple powerline adaptor, just like the ones being launched by lots of companies.

Take a look at the computer press, read a few web sites, open your eyes, and learn about things like network congestion, drop-outs, overlapping WiFi channels, and all the many other things that mean no one with half a brain would think of spraying "Old Man Ethernet Cable" on someone's door.

Now, I'm not saying WiFi is necessarily no good - it's useful for some things. But your belief that it's the only reasonable solution for home networking, especially for media, flies in the face of experience, of industry trends, and the knowledge of many people who have direct experience.

You keep coming out with ridiculous sweeping statements about what the Toppy is meant to be, about what Topfield promotes it as, and what the majority of Toppy users want - but you don't actually appear to have any evidence at all to back up any of it.

That's true, Marc Davis. But I believe that there are future models about to be released, staggered over the next few years.

Granted if you are streaming video, then WiFi is not ideal. However, this would imply a major re-write of the Topfield software and a re-definition/major extension to the functionality. I don't believe that it's reasonable to expect Topfield to do this.

Keeping the functionality "as is", i.e. a STB which requires access to the internet for TAPs and related data, a WiFi interface is a cheap, straight-forward feature to implement which would not require the Toppy to be anything more than it already is, just enhanced for the 21st century. Many would say that it is an essential addition.

Implemented many such interfaces have you? Or is that another one of your sweeping statements?


Many? Are you in market research?

And "essential"? Maybe, just maybe, there are some who might have indicated that it would be a nice feature to have (along with a proper Ethernet port), but essential? I don't think so.

Well, unless you are mates with one of the Turbosat guys, or have close ties with Topfield, we only know for certain that ONE model will be released shortly, however it is a racing certainty that other models will be released at some point in the future (and you don't really need much inside knowledge to arrive at that conclusion). But staggered over the next few years? It sounds good though .......