I have read somewhere that it is possible to watch recordings from the Toppy on a PC connected by USB, and that PC can also make recordings available to other PCs on a home network. Has anyone tried this and does it work?
Watching recordings over network
There are various ways you can do this; for example, the ftp4t windows software runs on the PC connected to the Toppy via USB; it then presents the Toppy's hard drive to the rest of the network as an FTP server.
Then, you can start downloading a file using an FTP client on that PC or another, and play it using VLC while it's still transferring.
You'll find lots more in the Computer Connections section of the Toppy forums at www.toppy.org.uk
Then, you can start downloading a file using an FTP client on that PC or another, and play it using VLC while it's still transferring.
You'll find lots more in the Computer Connections section of the Toppy forums at www.toppy.org.uk
Originally Posted by brig001:
“I have read somewhere that it is possible to watch recordings from the Toppy on a PC connected by USB, and that PC can also make recordings available to other PCs on a home network. Has anyone tried this and does it work?”
“I have read somewhere that it is possible to watch recordings from the Toppy on a PC connected by USB, and that PC can also make recordings available to other PCs on a home network. Has anyone tried this and does it work?”
Hi brig001.
Great post. Hopefully the next Toppy models will have 802.11a so you can stream video over WiFi, although this has not been confirmed or denied as yet.
Streaming video over wifi is not a reasonable solution, other than for very compressed formats such as DivX; in many cases, it's unrealistic for high bit rate MPEG2.
Thanks for quick replies. Got FTP 4 Topfield running OK. No luck using IE6 (Win98) to FTP as had to transfer whole file before watching. Using Filezilla and working much better now. Didn't think the USB would be up to it, but no worries if I let it transfer for a couple of minutes before playing.
Can now watch Top Gear while SWMBO is watching Corrie. Huge improvement!
Can now watch Top Gear while SWMBO is watching Corrie. Huge improvement!
Originally Posted by brig001:
“Thanks for quick replies. Got FTP 4 Topfield running OK. No luck using IE6 (Win98) to FTP as had to transfer whole file before watching. Using Filezilla and working much better now. Didn't think the USB would be up to it, but no worries if I let it transfer for a couple of minutes before playing.
Can now watch Top Gear while SWMBO is watching Corrie. Huge improvement!”
“Thanks for quick replies. Got FTP 4 Topfield running OK. No luck using IE6 (Win98) to FTP as had to transfer whole file before watching. Using Filezilla and working much better now. Didn't think the USB would be up to it, but no worries if I let it transfer for a couple of minutes before playing.
Can now watch Top Gear while SWMBO is watching Corrie. Huge improvement!”
It's surprising. USB 2 is 480 Mbit/s, so it has quite a bit of oomph.
Originally Posted by ianmoticon:
“It's surprising. USB 2 is 480 Mbit/s, so it has quite a bit of oomph.”
“It's surprising. USB 2 is 480 Mbit/s, so it has quite a bit of oomph.”
I dont think it is. I'd be interested to see if anyone can say they get a quarter of that figure in fact. On PVRs you can expect even less in the real world atm
Originally Posted by marcdavis:
“I dont think it is. I'd be interested to see if anyone can say they get a quarter of that figure in fact. On PVRs you can expect even less in the real world atm”
“I dont think it is. I'd be interested to see if anyone can say they get a quarter of that figure in fact. On PVRs you can expect even less in the real world atm”
It certainly is 480 mbit/s. However, the device must have the right controllers to support this top speed. Otherwise, it operates at a reduced rate.
USB 2 transmits the packets of data at up to 480Mb/s, but the devices attached to the bus never deliver the data at that speed. Think big water pipe being fed by an old bloke with a thimble. For example, a USB pen drive will typically read at 80Mb/s and write at 40Mb/s, a USB external HDD at 240Mb/s and 80Mb/s. None of these are anywhere near the potential speed of USB 2. PVRs aren't any different, so with the Toppy you get 20Mb/s if you're lucky, have turbo switched on and the wind is behind you. Incidentally, I'd expect the Humax to be much the same, being based on the same hardware and reputedly the same software architecture.
Originally Posted by ianmoticon:
“It certainly is 480 mbit/s. However, the device must have the right controllers to support this top speed. Otherwise, it operates at a reduced rate.”
“It certainly is 480 mbit/s. However, the device must have the right controllers to support this top speed. Otherwise, it operates at a reduced rate.”
It doesnt happen unfortunately. But nice in theory.
Originally Posted by simoncapewell:
“Incidentally, I'd expect the Humax to be much the same, being based on the same hardware and reputedly the same software architecture.”
“Incidentally, I'd expect the Humax to be much the same, being based on the same hardware and reputedly the same software architecture.”
Its the same with the Humax but it doesnt have a turbo mode to give a slight boost. Connect the PVR hard drive directly and you should get 80MB/s. Alas the realities of USB.
480Mbps or a quarter of that? Makes no odds as I have a 100Mbps network between the PCs anyway. I don't know if the Toppy is the limit or Ethernet or the PCs (Toppy end is 600MHz), but it works OK for what I want to do.
Certified Wireless USB will be here very shortly; Ofcom spectrum approval was in August, though there were some last minute changes which meant a brief extra delay.
Originally Posted by marcdavis:
“Its the same with the Humax but it doesnt have a turbo mode to give a slight boost. Connect the PVR hard drive directly and you should get 80MB/s. Alas the realities of USB.”
“Its the same with the Humax but it doesnt have a turbo mode to give a slight boost. Connect the PVR hard drive directly and you should get 80MB/s. Alas the realities of USB.”
That's true in its basic configuration but with the simple, non-destructive Son_T/Phew modification download speeds of up 20MB/sec are readily attainable on the Humax. I attach the output for a test I ran recently:
http://aycu25.webshots.com/image/275...6648592_rs.jpg
The download was 9.49GB in 8 minutes 24 seconds, representing 18.83[b]MB/sec or 1.130GB/minute. That's actually close to the USB practical maximum (stated as 10-20MB/sec in the USB Wiki). Admittedly, this involves a (non-destructive) hardware modification which is not quite what is being discussed here. But the modification only amounts to a special 3-connector IDE cable plus a cheapo IDE/USB converter (RIII at £6-£9) whose USB connector pokes out of the CAM slot -- see here:
http://humaxdisk.wikispaces.com/Disk+Cabling+and+Mods
So, if you have a machine whose inadequate USB output setup can be easily circumvented, relatively high-speed USB download is here now. No real need for wired network or USB3.
Quote:
“so with the Toppy you get 20Mb/s if you're lucky, have turbo switched on and the wind is behind you”
“so with the Toppy you get 20Mb/s if you're lucky, have turbo switched on and the wind is behind you”
I fancy a second PVR but another Humax would involve remote control conflicts. So, I keep an eye on the Toppy scene as this is an obvious candidate. Search as I might (mainly on Toppy.org), though, I've never seen a download speed higher than 2.7MB/sec claimed (that used "turbo", I believe). And, if I understand things correctly, even if a network setup is used, data isn't delivered to the network faster than that. I'd be interested, therefore, if simoncapewell or another Toppy user would please outline what kind of setup could be used to achieve downloads approaching 20MB/sec.
Originally Posted by joegib:
“That's true in its basic configuration but with the simple, non-destructive Son_T/Phew modification download speeds of up 20MB/sec are readily attainable on the Humax.”
“That's true in its basic configuration but with the simple, non-destructive Son_T/Phew modification download speeds of up 20MB/sec are readily attainable on the Humax.”
There is a similar hardware mod for the Toppy, too. But they both have the major drawback that they only work when the PVR is in standby (or off). So, a bit more convenient than removing the disk, but not a complete solution by any means.
Originally Posted by joegib:
“I'd be interested, therefore, if simoncapewell or another Toppy user would please outline what kind of setup could be used to achieve downloads approaching 20MB/sec.”
“I'd be interested, therefore, if simoncapewell or another Toppy user would please outline what kind of setup could be used to achieve downloads approaching 20MB/sec.”
While the Toppy is in use and potentially using the disk, the maximum you're likely to get is 20Mbits/sec.
Originally Posted by R2-D2:
“While the Toppy is in use and potentially using the disk, the maximum you're likely to get is 20Mbits/sec.”
“While the Toppy is in use and potentially using the disk, the maximum you're likely to get is 20Mbits/sec.”
Yes, sorry simoncapewell, on re-reading your post I realise your reference to "Mb" meant Mbits, not Megabytes. So, this translates into 2.5MB/sec as a practical maximum.
Originally Posted by R2-D2:
“There is a similar hardware mod for the Toppy, too. But they both have the major drawback that they only work when the PVR is in standby (or off). So, a bit more convenient than removing the disk, but not a complete solution by any means.”
“There is a similar hardware mod for the Toppy, too. But they both have the major drawback that they only work when the PVR is in standby (or off). So, a bit more convenient than removing the disk, but not a complete solution by any means.”
True, but the difficulty is more apparent than real. If I accumulate, say, 50GB of material I want to archive over the course of a week, the download to PC takes something less than 50 minutes. Job done in less than an hour. Doing the same thing using Humax/Toppy in their basic configuration would take in excess of 5 hours. That, I accept, would potentially be a serious interruption in your recording programme. But an hour? It's neither here not there. In practice, my weekly downloads rarely exceed 20MB so, for me, machine "downtime" means minutes a week, not hours.
Do people routinely archive that much more material? I wonder, given the time it takes to edit/burn this stuff to disk. And if they don't generally, that raises the question whether a network connection is worthwhile if fast USB downloads are available as an alternative. Looking at the various Toppy networking schemes, they ain't cheap and they ain't trivial in software terms. Now fast USB downloads combined with networking would really be something special
There are some neat tricks that you can do to minimise the downtime; for example, there's a set of scripts just been posted on the Toppy forum that allows you to move recordings to folders on the Toppy, and then they're grabbed by the PC and, depending on which folder they were stored in, converted into various different formats, such as avi or mp3.
Scheduling something like that means that it needn't be too much of a hassle to move stuff.
I don't yet know how substantially the actual hardware platform of the 5810 will differ from the 5800; some of the bottleneck for USB at the moment is the processor, and if it's faster then of course that will help.
Scheduling something like that means that it needn't be too much of a hassle to move stuff.
I don't yet know how substantially the actual hardware platform of the 5810 will differ from the 5800; some of the bottleneck for USB at the moment is the processor, and if it's faster then of course that will help.
Originally Posted by nwhitfield:
“I don't yet know how substantially the actual hardware platform of the 5810 will differ from the 5800”
“I don't yet know how substantially the actual hardware platform of the 5810 will differ from the 5800”
My money's on the only hardware differences being the bolt-on upscaler, the prettier Front Panel and the shiny new case. (Can you tell that I prefer to be pleasantly surprised?)
Originally Posted by nwhitfield:
“There are some neat tricks that you can do to minimise the downtime; for example, there's a set of scripts just been posted on the Toppy forum that allows you to move recordings to folders on the Toppy, and then they're grabbed by the PC and, depending on which folder they were stored in, converted into various different formats, such as avi or mp3.
Scheduling something like that means that it needn't be too much of a hassle to move stuff.
I don't yet know how substantially the actual hardware platform of the 5810 will differ from the 5800; some of the bottleneck for USB at the moment is the processor, and if it's faster then of course that will help.”
“There are some neat tricks that you can do to minimise the downtime; for example, there's a set of scripts just been posted on the Toppy forum that allows you to move recordings to folders on the Toppy, and then they're grabbed by the PC and, depending on which folder they were stored in, converted into various different formats, such as avi or mp3.
Scheduling something like that means that it needn't be too much of a hassle to move stuff.
I don't yet know how substantially the actual hardware platform of the 5810 will differ from the 5800; some of the bottleneck for USB at the moment is the processor, and if it's faster then of course that will help.”
Thanks for that. Think I'll wait to see if Topfield update the USB interface to a true High Speed spec on the 5810.
A minor but important point: because it transfers faster than Full Speed, it's technically High Speed, even though it's not high speed, if you see what I mean.
Originally Posted by joegib:
“That's true in its basic configuration but with the simple, non-destructive Son_T/Phew modification download speeds of up 20MB/sec are readily attainable on the Humax. I attach the output for a test I ran recently:
http://aycu25.webshots.com/image/275...6648592_rs.jpg
The download was 9.49GB in 8 minutes 24 seconds, representing 18.83[b]MB/sec or 1.130GB/minute. That's actually close to the USB practical maximum (stated as 10-20MB/sec in the USB Wiki). Admittedly, this involves a (non-destructive) hardware modification which is not quite what is being discussed here. But the modification only amounts to a special 3-connector IDE cable plus a cheapo IDE/USB converter (RIII at £6-£9) whose USB connector pokes out of the CAM slot -- see here:
http://humaxdisk.wikispaces.com/Disk+Cabling+and+Mods
So, if you have a machine whose inadequate USB output setup can be easily circumvented, relatively high-speed USB download is here now. No real need for wired network or USB3.
I fancy a second PVR but another Humax would involve remote control conflicts. So, I keep an eye on the Toppy scene as this is an obvious candidate. Search as I might (mainly on Toppy.org), though, I've never seen a download speed higher than 2.7MB/sec claimed (that used "turbo", I believe). And, if I understand things correctly, even if a network setup is used, data isn't delivered to the network faster than that. I'd be interested, therefore, if simoncapewell or another Toppy user would please outline what kind of setup could be used to achieve downloads approaching 20MB/sec.”
“That's true in its basic configuration but with the simple, non-destructive Son_T/Phew modification download speeds of up 20MB/sec are readily attainable on the Humax. I attach the output for a test I ran recently:
http://aycu25.webshots.com/image/275...6648592_rs.jpg
The download was 9.49GB in 8 minutes 24 seconds, representing 18.83[b]MB/sec or 1.130GB/minute. That's actually close to the USB practical maximum (stated as 10-20MB/sec in the USB Wiki). Admittedly, this involves a (non-destructive) hardware modification which is not quite what is being discussed here. But the modification only amounts to a special 3-connector IDE cable plus a cheapo IDE/USB converter (RIII at £6-£9) whose USB connector pokes out of the CAM slot -- see here:
http://humaxdisk.wikispaces.com/Disk+Cabling+and+Mods
So, if you have a machine whose inadequate USB output setup can be easily circumvented, relatively high-speed USB download is here now. No real need for wired network or USB3.
I fancy a second PVR but another Humax would involve remote control conflicts. So, I keep an eye on the Toppy scene as this is an obvious candidate. Search as I might (mainly on Toppy.org), though, I've never seen a download speed higher than 2.7MB/sec claimed (that used "turbo", I believe). And, if I understand things correctly, even if a network setup is used, data isn't delivered to the network faster than that. I'd be interested, therefore, if simoncapewell or another Toppy user would please outline what kind of setup could be used to achieve downloads approaching 20MB/sec.”
Please pardon my newcomer ignornace. After a year with an Aldi/Tevion PVR 1620, soon to be returned, I have satisfied my need for a reliable pvr with a 9200, the current Comet £150 deal. Is your cabling solution additonal to the Humax GUI solution, or two differnt ways to get recordings off the Humax hard drive?
The HumaxGUI application is used for downloads via the Hummy's standard USB connection (as an alternative to E-Linker).
HummyReadFiles is a Windows application used to download via the IDE/USB modification as per the screenshots linked above.
If you want to explore this further suggest you look at the FAQs at Hummy.org.uk and post any queries on the forum there:
http://www.hummy.org.uk/invison/index.php?showforum=18
Don't suppose the Toppy users here want their sub-forum cluttered up with Hummy discussions.
HummyReadFiles is a Windows application used to download via the IDE/USB modification as per the screenshots linked above.
If you want to explore this further suggest you look at the FAQs at Hummy.org.uk and post any queries on the forum there:
http://www.hummy.org.uk/invison/index.php?showforum=18
Don't suppose the Toppy users here want their sub-forum cluttered up with Hummy discussions.
