Pompous I may be; but I have no idea if I am right. As I've just replied above, I don't know if Matt's being machiavellian or if he's just an immature twerp.

Nor was i having a go at mint. I really do envy his naivety. What a lovely place the world would be if everybody thought the best of everybody else.... lovely but boring.

Thanks for the welcome. It will be a great final , I am sure
Mac

Umm? you pre-empted my reply?

Mac

Thanks for the welcome, and so agree with many of your points
Mac

I can't see as it's the week before the final, when the question could have been asked in any other way.

The question was not 'do you think Matt is worthy of the final?' which I would fully understand would be out of order but 'was the dance worth 4 10s?'

As few of the 10s that have been awarded this series have been REALLY merited IMO I see nothing wrong with questioning the 4 muppets weird marking.

If I were Matt I'd feel determined to go and unleash hell on the dance floor aka Maximus.

Thank you
Mac

Alright isn't I really have been posting on Yank forums too long.
It is a bit more comprehensible than noy though. Oh and you just did reply.

It's a question that everyone would want to know the answer to - whether that was the right time to ask it is another thing: I suspect opinion would be split on that one.

But why focus the whole thing on Matt?

How do you think Gethin and Camilla felt, hearing what PJ said?

How do you think Alesha feels, when the BBC is shifting everyone's attention on to Matt?

It cuts both ways - something rather a lot of people here seem to forget ...

Though seeing as it's so unhelpful and unconstructive to everyone I don't see why it has to be asked so many times - once or twice may be OK but the constant reference to "will he remember all 5 routines?" or "did it deserve 40" is getting very stale for all parties concerned.

I'm not so much annoyed with the 40/40 thing, rather the whole question of "Did he deserve to go through?". Now that the decision is made and it is irreversible, it surely undermines the effort that Matt is making right now for the final, as well as make Gethin feel worse.

it looks that way.
Mac

I doubt 'everyone' would. Most would accept the marks, as they have for all of the others.
The question being asked, and the 'shock, horror' people are being asked to display, seriously undermines the contestant
I don't think everyones attention is being shifted onto Matt at all, I believe Alesha is getting the praise she deserves

Mac

I think all three semi finalists has had their fair share of insults/name-calling/snide comments, not just Matt. And even as a Matt fan, I have absolutely no problems of people discussing his dancing and whether it was worth a 40 in a rational way. What does irritate me though are the flippant and snide remarks people keep making about him unnecessarily, in an unrelated thread and where the comment would add nothing to the discussion - whenever Matt's name is mentioned there is always someone who goes "he is a bad dancer" or "he won't be able to complete 5 dances" etc. Then the thread, which started off with a reasonably intelligent discussion, ends up being a bitch fight between the two schools of supporters.

And that might have belonged better in the tantrum thread actually....!

I'm a girl. And like I said, I can very well imagine the celebs sending people to these boards and adjusting their behaviour accordingly, in fact, part of me doesn't blame them. I also know how well edited these shows are and am always prepared to give people I get a negative impression of the benefit of the doubt (even Gabby!). My gripe was with the (rightfully or wrongfully understood) implication that he had a meltdown on purpose that night.

I don't really see why if he isn't being machiavellian he must be an immature twerp but I'm not gonna argue with you on something you've obviously made your mind up on based on the footage we are shown, after all, that's all we can base our opinions on.

This is what bugs me too.

Having just been accused of pomposity, I'll risk sounding pompous again. There's a bigger picture than your comment acknowledges. The BBC introduced a number of format changes this year, none of which imho have worked. The worst of them is the dance-off. Had last year's voting system been in operation, I would be willing to bet that Matt would not be in the final. Maybe nor would Alesha.

There is a fair weight of opinion among posters that the BBC should consider reversing the changes (although I appreciate that lots of people like the new format and that it probably won't change), so the debate has to be kept going. A debate about the pros and cons of various programme formats would last five minutes. So it has to be personalised.

I lost interest in the programme when it because obvious (a) that the judges were mangling the process, in order to ensure that their favoured two couples reached the final and (b) who they were determined would win it. I would like the programme back the way it was before and so would many others. That's why the "should Matt be in the final?" question isn't going to go away.

I don't think he was having a go but thanks very much for sticking up for me kittles

Yes, I understand that and to an extent I agree with the judges' manipulation. I think it's fair that it is being discussed in forums such as this because that's what the point of it is after all. However, what I do object to is having this discussion on ITT, where the discussion is very public and is an official programme from the BBC, as opposed to a discussion by anonymous members on a message board. The contestants don't need conspiracy theories, discouragement or undermining at this stage in such a public medium.

IMO of course.

I wasn't; but I do apologise for masculinising you. I should have realised that somebody with your monicker just had to be female (although I'm not sure why because I am a boring individual who couldn't get through the evening without a mint choc chip cornetto!).

John Taylor, obviously!!

I personally like a bit of argy bargy and banter - it doesn't really hurt anyone and I get sick and tired of constantly having to gush

if I don't like someone, I should be allowed to say so!!

Personally I have no problem with Philip Jackson answering a direct question when asked. He's entitled to his opinion, there's no evidence anyone is influenced by it and he only said it once.

Completely different is Craig undermining Matt repeatedly on ITT, particularly implying more than once that it will be a miracle if he remembers his dances. I think Craig saved Matt because he genuinely thought Matt was the better choice for the final, because they have never only voted on the dance in front of them, but is now cowardly trying to cover himself if Matt's nerves do get to him again. The failure of the judges to behave like impartial judges really annoys me.

Lol...it is THE BEST ice cream flavour undoubtedly.

Ditto - you've said it more eloquently than I would've been able to!

And for the record, I can't stand mint choc chip ice cream - and I'm female!

How can you not love the mintiness? And the chocolatiness?!!!

I have to say I don't like it generally - but After Eight ice cream for some reason, I adore.

Nobody has discussed it on ITT more's the pity. One question one opinion one "really!!" hardly a discussion. I haven't looked at the BBC forums but rumour has it that people are more miffed than here.