I was just watching 'Utopia' again and am a bit puzzled by something. When Martha is talking to Yana about where he got the watch from, he says he was found with it as a child on the Silver Devastation. Does this mean that The Master regenerated into a child and then put his soul in to the watch? Can Timelords regenerate into children or was he brought back to life as a child by the Timelords during the Time War?

Sorry if this has already been asked before.

Happy New Year to all.

That's an interesting thought. I'm unsure whether the memories are real or totally fabricated by the use of the FOB watch. Remember that when the Doctor was hiding in the Family Of Blood, he believed that his parents were called Sydney and Verity, a nice nod to the original series creators.
At a guess, I'd say that the Master resurrected to fight in the Time War was a younger version of Derek Jacobi, he then used the chameleon arch and became Yana, growing into the old man we saw in Utopia.....

We don't know, he might have regenerated into the form of a child or it's possible that all of that backstory was part of the invented human memories he had as Professor Yana.

EDIT: Damnit, beaten to it by a matter of seconds!

i believe it was just a back story like the doctor gave during the family of blood episodes

I always thought these are memories that were placed in his mind by the transformation process. The same way that the Doctor remembered his parent's (Sydney and Verity) in Human Nature.

Doh - all together now!!!
Last edited by Urban Bassman : 30-12-2007 at 18:21

This thread has got me thinking , which version of the Master did the Time Lords resurrect to fight in the Time War. I'm guessing it would be Eric Roberts master from the TV movie, as he'd used up all his lives before falling into the EOH.
I suppose the TL's could have taken the Ainley master out of his time stream, although I presume it's him turned into superglue in the '96 TVM. All this wibbly wobbly timey wimey stuff makes my head hurt.

That explains a lot, thanks for clearing that up.

I'm watching the 3rd season at the moment on DVD. On the commentary for Utopia, Russell T Davies talks about his vision of what happened when the master put his soul in the watch - he says he believes he was that desperate to not be found, that he became a child, rather than just inventing a backstory as the Doctor did when he did this.

I assumed they revived The Master is a new regenerated form, that was Jacobis form, he took a Tardis, fled to the end of the universe, used the arc and stayed there and grew older until the Doctor arrived there.

Now correct me if I'm wrong and I may be BUT.... The Master or rather YANA was supposedly found as a child on the Silver Devastation, Jack claims he was known as the Face of Boe as a kid and we know that Boe came from there.

So how about this for a theory.

A reborn Jack travels back lives through Earth's history, skip a few million years and he's part of the time war. At some point there's a connection and either Boe/Jack hides the Master (and maybe thats a big secret Jack is holding thinking he is being kind to the Doctor in making sure another Time Lord survives) or Jack is there at the Time War and finds the baby. Either way Jack must be implicated...

So the question is, what is the Silver Devastation, sounds like something caused by the Cybermen. Could that be a story ark for Season 4?

The problem is... the Face of Boe died in the year Five Billion and something, whereas Professor Yana is around in the year *Thirty Trillion*. Even though they both have a connection to 'The Silver Devastation' that's a colossal difference in time. So unless there's some time travel involved...?

So the Master goes to all the trouble of putting himself into the Watch and the turning himself into a child? Whats to stop whoever finds him throwing away the watch. Any person who finds him would just think it was a broken old watch.

That would all depend on who found him, and if they knew who he was beforehand. Maybe The face Of Boe, as otheres have said, he was the one that told the Dr he wasnt alone after all.

The Face of Boe knew that the The Master was alive because he remembered what happened when he was Captain Jack. So he just had to wait for the right time to tell The Doctor that he was not alone.

No it was all fake memories created for him to help him fit in as a human. Remember when the asked the Doctor talked of his parents and his life in Norwich as a child yet it was a bit vague. Enough for casual conversation but not enough to withstand deep probing questions.

The Master's memories were the same.

Exactly, the Doctor had invented memories about his parents and childhood, interspersed with flashes of his real past as noted in his journal. The Master simply has the same, he has an invented past as a baby found on the shores of the Silver Devastation, but also has the constant sound of drumming in his head due to real events from the Master's past such as atacking the Earth with the Toclafane

The Master's attack with the Toclafane didn't happen in Yana's past, it happened in his future.

The Master has had the sound of drums since his (real) childhood on Galifrey

True enough with DW timelines and wibbley wobbley space stuff the toclafane attack was in Yana's future, but technically it happened in the past. Yana is the Master living in the year 1 trillion and something whereas the events oon Earth with the toclfane happened on earth now.

Yes, it happened in "the" wibbley-wobbley past, but it absolutely did not happen in HIS personal past, so the sound of drums absolutely cannot be a memory he has from the attack on earth, which was in his future.

This bugs me so much! It was such a big deal that Yana would turn out to be the Master, I mean near-annihilation, devastation for DW. A year spent living in a tent off the scraps. Would you translate that information as 'You are not etc?' I know it would ruin the story, but stoopid blinking message to carry with you through time.

Why not just say Yana is the Master, kill him as soon as you lay eyes on him - but only if it doesn't bolster your god complex and sits happily with the self image you try to portray and doesn't upset too many of your chosen demographic?