I’ve just been doing some more overanalysing and a thought struck me, that although I’m leaning towards a Chester, Laurence, Alexander final three, that perhaps Cameron Mack won’t pick both Laurence and Alexander because they are too similar (especially if Chester is picked too which is very likely). Okay they don’t resemble each other in looks like Alex and Jonny do, but they are similar in that they both have that very traditional, pure, almost choir-boy soprano vocal, which I think is traditionally associated with the part of Oliver.

I think it’s very likely that CM will want three very different and distinct Oliver’s, so he’ll probably pick one ‘traditional’ Oliver (Laurence or Alexander) one ‘cheeky and/or adorable’ Oliver (Gwion, Arthur or Harry, and I guess Kway falls under this as well although adorable isn’t really the right word…) and one who is in-between the two- or as I like to call them the Billy Elliot Oliver’s- (Chester or Jonny). This would also explain why Gareth didn’t get through to the final eight because he would have definitely fallen under ‘cheeky’ and as talented as he is… he isn’t as adorable as Gwion, as individual as Arthur, doesn’t have the acting ability of Harry or the voice of Kwayedza.

Of the traditional Oliver’s I would go with Laurence, when they are both on form there is very little to choose from vocally between the two (possibly I would give the edge to Alex), but Laurence is more consistent and less prone to nerves. Also from the little we’ve seen Laurence seems like the stronger actor of the two.

Of the ‘Cheeky’ Oliver’s I would say it’s between Harry and Gwion, Harry (as I’ve said before) would be a safe, reliable choice for CM, but he does come across as a Dodger to me. Gwion on the other hand would be so adorable and completely different in the role compared to the likes of Laurence, Chester etc. but his accent is an issue. I do think both would add a slight comedic edge to the role which would be interesting. As for the other two… Kway’s voice is simply too deep for the role and I think Arthur will be kept on and trained up as a ‘future’ Oliver rather than go straight into the role immediately.

And finally the ‘commercial’ Oliver’s: for me it is no contest, it has to be Chester, he is just fantastic. I think Jonny has something special but isn’t particularly suited to this role, his voice is quite poppy and contemporary which is great for Billy Elliot but Oliver is a much more traditional musical, and of the two Chester’s voice is the more traditional (although it still has a more contemporary edge to it than Laurence or Alexander’s).

So, in conclusion I want it to be a Chester, Laurence, Alex final three but think it will be Chester, Laurence, Harry/Gwion.

final 3: chester (of course), alex and laurence - reserve: jonny.

harry doesnt look quite right for oliver. kwayedzas voice is awesome but will be breaking in a few months. Gwion's diction when speaking isnt quiet right.. oliver does a lot of speaking in the show and gwions words will be lost.

I love the fact that we always agree. And if your theory turns out to be true, what a perfect outcome that would be!


*applause* I think your analysis here is spot on - I completely agree with the way you divided up the boys. Chester & Jonny are definitely the commercial ones - they immediately attract attention, move particularly well on stage and they have contemporary good looks that appeal to the masses. Out of the two I would still go for Chester, because I think he has the best voice by far, and Jonny is growing up too quickly.

Alex & Laurence both have a beautiful bell-like, pure quality to their voices but perhaps fade into the background at first glance. I'm not sure which he'd pick between these two. As you say Laurence is perhaps the most reliable vocally and from the little we've seen he's the best actor for Oliver (Harry is also good, but in a completely different way to the Oliver character). On the other hand, I think Alex moves less clumsily on stage, has the vocal edge when he's on form and (this is just my personal opinion but) I think he does have a spark that Laurence lacks a little.

The other four are less strong vocally than the other four, but more individual and quirky. Gwion is probably the best for the role, though - he crosses over with both groups, as he does have the commercial "aww" factor, as well as being young enough/having a pure enough voice to suit the image of Oliver better than the other three. I think Arthur needs a few more years, Kwayedza is getting too old and Harry is just the wrong type. It would be perfect if Chaperone is right and Harry is picked for Dodger - I think he's too good to waste; I never grow tired of watching his expressions/movements on screen and you can rely on him never to crack under pressure.

In the end, I think I agree with you - if CM is looking for three different Olivers (as opposed to the ones most suited to our traditional perceptions of the role), he'll probably pick Chester, Gwion and Laurence. Those three are also on the younger side so would be less likely to lose their voices as quickly (as opposed to Kwayedza, Jonny and Harry). Now, if Gwion can't hack toning down his accent - his major drawback - maybe they'd go for Arthur instead.

I'd be really, really gutted if Alexander doesn't get the part though - more so than for any other contestant.

I was listening to 'Where is Love' by Joseph McManus on Youtube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LxqZZJv8cSY, and that's given me a better idea of who I think will win.

Unfortunately I don't think Harry, Kwayedza or ... even Jonny could get that high up. I can't see them changing the key of the song in order to suit a kid who may be in the role just a few months.

I think going by "Where is Love": Chester, Gwion, Alex and Laurence have the best hope.

Gwion as the "Aww" Oliver
Chester/Alex as the traditional Oliver
Laurence as the darker-skinned Oliver

I think to boys are quite good with looking the part and most of them are good movers, dancers. I dont think that any of them have strong enough voices for the west end.
My son played Gavroche in Les Mis when he was their age and he never got a note wrong. The boys need serious singing lessons before staring in the show.
I feel that the three they pick wont do the show for any long amount of time. There are much better boys in stageschools and in theatre groups all over the country.
Also it is very difficult for a boy not based close to London to do it.
My son was based in Luton and when he got home at night it was around 00.15.
He was allowed to go to school an hour later in the morning and it wasnt easy. The main cast get to sleep in late in the morning. Children usually have to do at least 12 late nights a month and one of those are after a matinee.
However it is lovely to see children especialy boys enjoying performing and we couldnt have chosen a Nancy without having some Olivers for her to work with.
I hope Samantha wins.

I was rewatching the initial audition (Nancy School) episodes of IDA yesterday, and I'm beginning to wonder if ALW and CM are still looking for the Oliver they described in the early stages of auditions- a boy with attitude, a certain ballsiness. Very unlike Mark Lester. If they are, I don't know which of the boys they'll pick - I don't get any of that sort of attitude from Alex, Laurence, or Johnny. I know we've seen very little of them, but if they're looking for a more ballsy Oliver, maybe someone like Harry or Arthur stands more of a chance than we think?

By the way, check out the VTs for the four that didn't get through on the website:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/oliver/video/in...eek=24&video=4

Joseph's fish. Haha.

Something wrong with the sound at the end of Gareth's VT?

Don't they always change the key of songs to suit the singer? It's not that difficult to do and it makes the singer sound much better.

So do I! I find myself thinking 'yay, Ashrell replied!" and then just nodding my head whilst reading your posts
Maybe my theory is more wishful thinking than anything else, but I hope it's true nonetheless.

I'm all for overanalysing and think you did a great job overanalysing the Oliversituation!
It is indeed quite easy to divide the 8 remaining boys in three categories so to speak. This makes it easier for CM and ALW to choose three boys to play the part in the end. They'd just have to choose one from each "group".
I hope you're wrong though because I also would really like it to be Chester, Alex and Laurence. However, if they do decide to pick one out of Alex and Laurence, my vote goes to Alex as well, mostly because I think he has a certain amount of stage presence that Laurence lacks. Don't get me wrong though, I think Laurence really should also be one of the winners.

Like Ashrell I'd also be really gutted if Alex isn't one the winners. Same goes for Chester btw, but I don’t think that will happen.

Well, personally I enjoy watching a good, "regular" kid who just really loves to perform having the time of his/her life on stage MUCH more than a perfect "stageschool" kid who might sing every note without a single fault but to whom performing has just become part of everyday life. But maybe that's just me...

That's so sweet. Aww, just watching little Joseph had me all welled up with tears again... He was so devastated last Saturday

Hi, I've been reading this thread all along and now I've decided to join too!

My absolute firm favourite is Jonny but I also like Gwion and Alexander. I wish Gareth had gotten through too.

My Views on the Olivers are...

Gwion - Really, really sweet, would make a perfect Oliver. I think he has very good chances of being picked. He's a good age, size, people find him really cute and he's Welsh, also a little different with his accent. I would love to go and see him in the West End and he could do a really good job of Oliver.

Chester - I have to agree that Chester is very good for the role, and there is really no fault in him. But he doesn't really stand out for me as some of the others do, I think he can be a little too plain and boring and flawless. I think he should get the role (and that he will), but I'm not his biggest fan. I have to admitt though, the 'I cross my fingers everynight thing' was really sweet!

Arthur - I think people have been a bit harsh to Arthur, especially when Olivers they liked didn't get in and he became the one everyone wanted to replace. He's not my favourite but I do think he is quite sweet and I've kept warming to him throughout the show. He probably won't get the part, thought he might because he is a good size and age, and at least you can see that he is really enjoying himself and improving.

Kwayedza - I think Kwayedza is really sweet and I love his voice but I don't think he his Oliver. He can definitely go really far but I don't think it will be by playing Oliver. I'm glad hes been in the show because he's showcased his talent but I don't think he is suited to Oliver.

Alexander - At first I didn't really like Alex, but I've started to like him a lot more recently. He doesn't tend to stand out that much but I do think he'd make a really good Oliver because he looks right for the part. It was also so sweet when he got told he was through, his reaction!

Harry - I do like Harry but I don't see him as Oliver, nor as Dodger. A lot of people have been saying he could be Dodger but for me Dodger really has to be something special, Dodger has to be a boy who can't fail to make you love him, look a bit more scruffy like Jack Wild (Dodger in the film) with longer hair and freckles. And Dodger HAS to have a cockney accent, which you can learn, so maybe Harry could become more Dodgerish. But it seems to me that someone who would be considered for the role of Oliver shouldn't be Dodger, as Dodger is not really at all like Oliver.

Laurence - I never really noticed Laurence untile he got through and since rewatching the Victorian school task I have decided that he would make a good Oliver (his 'Please sir I want some more) and also I like his voice, I think he is sweet, but I think he won't get the part as he doesn't stand out. I think if he did stand out a bit more, he would have very, very good chances of landing the part.

Gareth - Soooo sweet! I loved Gareth, he had the most Dodgerish character for me! I loved his 'I love working with the Nancys.. because... they're hot!' He was for me the most charismatic and I feel he really will go far. I think that maybe he wasn't Oliver, but he's definitely something else.

Jordan - I've always quite liked Jordan, though he's not an Oliver, because he's such a born entertainer. I love how showy and stage schooly he is in all his performances, and how much effort he puts into everything. He always seemed to have this massive grin, even when he was told he wasn't Oliver. I think he will go on to do more because it's really obvious how passionate he is which is a really big thing, espeically in musical theatre if you have to give out a brilliant performance night after night. But maybe he's suited to something with a bit more dancing and things then Oliver. I also noticed in Reach that he is a natural dancer, if you watch him closely in it he can certainly dance!

Sam - I really liked Sam in Electricity, but my liking for him wore off over the weeks. Now I don't really have an opinion on him, though I think he looks good for the part and when he was told he wasn't Oliver they said 'maybe he could be an Oliver in the future' and I think that would be a very good idea. I see some people dislike him but I don't think there is that much to dislike.

Joseph - I used to laugh at Joseph's lack of co-ordination a lot and view him as a total joke but I think he has gained himself a bit more respect over the weeks. I think he said 'please sir, i want somemore' really well and I think he is really sweet to. Though I would never back him to be Oliver I think he's not really that bad.

Jonny - Jonny is definitely the best! He is definitely the best at working the cameras, he is really charismatic. I have joined his Bebo fan club, even thoguh I hardly use Bebo anymore, which is apparently almost beating the Chester one. He can dance, and he can certainly act, and he's not bad at singing either, the only problem would be voice breaking. I can't really fault Jonny, I think he's far more with it then the other boys, he's a bit older then most of them and has a much better fashion sense then quite a few. About him looking blank at the begining, I don't think it was because he was bored or forced to be in the show. It may well have been being self concious, but I also think it could have been him trying to look like hes taking things seriously to impress the judges. While some of the other boys seemed a bit more jokey, I think he was trying to look more professional and appear to Cameron as reliable, well behaved and eager to please ect. I think that near the end this wore of a bit and he started showing more experssion, maybe realising that it would be a good thing. And it certainly was, I'm so glad he got through, I think he was fantastic on Sunday considering his nerves and that he isn't the best vocally there. JONNY FOR OLIVER!

Welcome to the boards. And great post. (Same goes for everyone else on this page. As usual on this particular thread, I agree with pretty much all of the analyses. )

I hadn't rated Jordan until this week but noticed like you, in his very last performance unfortunately, that he was a good little mover. I thought 'Reach' was the worst group performance by a long stretch but it was only Jordan who didn't look look awkward and clumsy with the choreography. Plus because he's very theatrical in a stage school kind of way, he was the only one who didn't look daft in that 'Playschool Presenter' costume.

What really impressed me though was his grace and good sportsmanship. He was happily swaying his arms during 'I have a dream' and was the first up on his feet to cheer the six semi-finalists. That's such a beautiful quality to see in someone so young.

I think you raise a valid point. ALW did say that they were trying to veer away from the Mark Lester stereotypes (although he also talked of an Amy Winehouse Nancy so who knows). As much as I love both Laurence and Alex, they are similar in style and are both the closest to the traditional type of Oliver. Therefore, if they want a slightly different Oliver, they would be unlikely to choose both of them. And in the back of my mind, I have always fhad a feeling that it was going to be one or the other.

The way that you've split the boys make sense. I am just hoping that Cameron is more of a traditionalist, because like you I want (and think it should be) Chester, Laurence and Alex in the final three.

I do wonder if Cameron has other plans for some of the other boys. It is interesting that he has already had some links to Harry through Harry's stint as Mary Poppins . I also wonder if he has alternative plans for Jonny. He's very marketable, and I imagine Cameron would want to take advantage of that, perhaps in a role more likely to attract the fangirls.

I liked your whole post, but I agree with this about Arthur. (I know I keep posting about Arthur but I'm really warming to him!) Although I was one of those people saying he should be replaced I've started to like him more and more. I still don't think he'll get Oliver because there are just better boys than him in the competition, but he definitey is improving; I Have A Dream proved this for me. I also find him very individual and quite quirky, I think with a couple of years and some careful training he could do very well

Looks like the Chester, Laurence, Alexander combination is popular amongst us


Actually, I thought Jordan was more theatrical than ever in Reach - but I thought it was endearing this time, like he tried to do that deliberately to lighten the mood and cheer the boys up (I noticed that Jonny and Alex in the background were laughing with him when Jordan was doing some crazy moves ). I think someone pointed out before that he was never afraid to laugh at himself when he made a mistake in the VTs and he showed in general good sportsmanship; I too was pleased to see him not showing any sign of sulking and jumping to his feet at the end of Sunday's performance. Good on you, Jordan


Hey, and welcome to overanalysis-central I enjoyed reading your views - it's always great to hear other opinions, even if I don't agree with everything!

I think it is going to be a tough choice for Cameron and co.

Jonny I thought he was a sure winner till i heard his solo on sunday. It was quite good but the others showed him up a bit. But i still think he has a good chance of being chosen.

Chester He has been my favourite since show one, i think he has the strongest voice ( i have never heard it falter but i may be wrong!) I also think he can act well and looks the part. I think he will be chosen because he is definately safe.

Alexander I didnt really notice him at the beginning but he has grown on me and i think he has an ideal oliver voice and look. He has a likeable personality aswell. I think he has a strong chance.

Arthur He gets better every week, especially on his last solo! He is not one of my favourites but i think if he does get chosen he will greatly improve and surprise a few people!

Gwion Sweet and looks the part but i think his accent is just that little bit too strong and sometimes when he sings he cannot be understood, for that reason he might not be chosen.

Kwayedza Beautiful voice and quite a strong actor but i think he is too old and too tall to be oliver. He is talented though, but his voice may break in the next few months, which may be a problem!

Harry I love Harry! His solo with sarah was brilliant! He is a good little actor and mover and his voice is quite good too. He is a strong contender and cameron seems to like him.

Laurence Beautiful voice but he moves wierdly, not really a problem though. He has surprised a few people i think, he was in the background at the beginning then his solo was amazing. He is a natural actor also, he has a good chance.

I think it will ultimately come down too how diverse cameron and co want to be. i would personally like Chester, Alexander and Laurence/ Harry. But they all could do it so i don't really mind

Great post, I agree with most of it
To be fair to Jonny, he was the last through and hadn't had the 'experience' as such, of being at the front, leading the other boys etc as the other 7 boys had had; although Harry and Laurence are fairly new to it as well, Harry had Sarah and Laurence had Niamh in they're solos.

Really though, I'd be happy for any of them to go through, although some of them are more suited to the role than others. Ideally, I'd like Chester, Jonny and Harry through - I think Chester is a dead cert, and seems to be a favourite amongst most people, Jonny I love, but is maybe suited to a different role such as Billy Elliot, I also feel that he is perhaps a bit too old, and I haven't seen the more vunerable side to Harry yet. I think the last three will be Chester, Jonny/Laurence, and Alex, though as I said I'd be glad to see any of them get Oliver - I love them all!

For me it has to be little Gwion. He is so sweet. I also like Chester and Johny, but perhaps he's a bit too old.

Since Gareth didn't get through I'm hoping the three boys will be Gwion, Chester and Laurence. I think they're the boys with the best voices and apart from Laurence who will need a bit of work they move quite well.

Hmm. To be fair, all 8 of them (with the exception of Chester and Gwion, who had solos in "A whole new world") have only had one chance each to lead solo - they were obviously down the steps with the others, but they sung in groups, so I don't think they had substantially more experience! I think some just get more nervous than others (which is completely understandable!)


Great post - I think I just about agree with everything you say

I just feel that Jonny maybe wanted to 'prove himself' more, as the last boy through. But I do agree, obviously some of the boys do just get more nervous than others!

I haven't seen any nerves from any of them in the group performances though, I think all 12 are incredibly brave to get up there every Saturday night.

I'm really looking forward to the final, but I really do hope they get more than the five minutes we're normally given.

Gwion. So sweet.

Jonny for Oliver...brilliant actor........all rounder.........