I think they were lucky to win. I think if the other team had had the gumption to put a couple of decent pack shots in that would have swung it the other way.

I have to both agree and disagree with this post. I missed the first 15 minutes of the programme so I didn't see the task allocation. When I switched on I assumed she was team leader again from what I saw and was quite surprised to see Alex being team leader.

I agree with her that he was a crap team leader. I disagree that he had nothing to do with the alienation. You say she alienated Alex, therefore by definition it was to do with him. I also found his behind the back-stabbing with Lee quite grotesque.

However, she was unduly negative and it would have been much more diplomatic of her to let the little boys play, since it was clear there was a little boys' club thing going on there.

It would have been better to humour them and wait for better times. In fact in the end isn't this just exactly what she did? Even Alex admitted she did.

I don't like either Lee or Alex, and I do like Lucinda. However, on this occasion, I don't think the two guys were ganging up. I felt that they just genuinely couldn't understand what she was getting so worked up over.

She wasn't totally wrong in some of her criticisms, but I think the time comes, once you've put your point, to accept that the decision's gone against you and let it go.

Although I'm not a massive fan of either Lee nor Alex, I genuinely don't believe either were actually bullying her.

There definately appears a trend where people on this forum believe she is a victim, however I don't believe this does her justice.

I think she is a contender in her own right, but this view presides over any notion of her being treated unfairly.

I think in terms of strong challengers to the title of apprentice she falls shy of Claire or Helene who would be my favourites but she has time to turn things round.

This certainly will only happen if it is in terms of her strengths. Certainly not if she continues to play the victim.

There's a lot of talk about what Lee and Alex said behind Lucinda's back. Could someone tell me what they're referring to. I've assumed all along is was the bit in the casting session where, after Lucinda interrupted the casting to say that she wasn't convinced by the family concept (a concept on which the box has already been designed and in respect of which the casting call was all about), she left the room. Is that the bit?

If it is, can somebody tell me what they heard that was snide, because what I thought they were saying was that she shouldn't be bringing this stuff up now when the decision to go this direction had already been made.

I don't think Lucinda was bullied or victimised...but I do think that as pammi_i put it there was a "little boys club" thing going on....which basically meant that her skills were under utilised in the task....I suspect Alex preferred to hang out with his mate so tasks were allocated based on that criteria rather than business considerations. Which basically stinks.

I think it must have been incredibley frustrating. After building up, what looked like a very good working relationship with Lee ...she was basically relegated to making the tea again....as in earlier tasks.

Lucinda isn't an angel but I think it's very easy to understand her reaction. When someone has genuine concerns and isn't given an adequate opportunity to discuss them ... and perhaps more importantly to "feel heard" ..... well it's pretty obvious they'll start to express themselves negatively.

If Alex and Lee had consciously decided to go down a "tacky" cillit bang type route then fine but it was obvious that they considered their box design as some sort of visual masterpiece....utterly cringe making.....if I had been Lucinda I'd have been seriously worried too........in the end they won by being the least bad....

I didn't see Alex and Lee ganging up on Lucinda at all.

I saw a shrewish, slightly spiteful and bitter woman who was stacking up ammunition throughout the whole task to go into the boardroom with in case they lost (which she so obviously thought they had).

In other tasks where she hasn't agreed with team leaders or concepts she has become lazy and uncoperative - in this one she became aggressive and patronising "naughty naughty naughty" indeed!!! - who does this silly woman think she is talking to? Kindergarten children!

yuk - thoroughly dislike our Lucinda lately.

I also think if I'd been Alex I would have got her as far away from the ad campaign as possible too - she was disruptive the whole time she was in a group situation.

Lucinda is great when she's in charge, but poor at working for anyone else. Even when she's right (as she was most of the time this week), she complains too much and for too long; once decisions are made, sometimes you just have to get on with it. People like that can bring everyone else down with them, and that's why she's not popular when she's not in charge.

And that idea of having tissues for gay men is seriously deluded. Even if 10% of the population are gay, then only 5% are gay men. And no one targets that market yet, as it's a sad fact that a fair % of the population aren't comfortable with homosexuality.

Hence beer adverts always have precicesly 3 men:

1 looks like a saddo
2 could be gay
4+ rabble

It wasnt that off the wall a suggestion. Who buys tissues?? Men, on the whole, historically dont. Women and modern men (young professionals, metrosexuals, men in touch with their feminine side, gay men etc) do. And it's not like an advert featuring a gay couple or family unit would have appealed ONLY to gays and excluded all other demographics (unless you're seriously homophobic...) - otherwise I would never have bought anything that I'd seen in adverts that feature only heterosexual men, women, couples, family units etc.

An advert based on something a bit more modern couldn't have been any worse than the advert they ended up producing

I honestly felt the opposite - that Lucinda was the one out of line. She took it upon herself to moan at everything the boys did.



^^ That's it in a nutshell.

I know what you mean, but most of Britain isn't metrosexual. Didn't Becks or someone stop sponsoring Queer as Folk because it was affecting their sales? It's a brand association thing. If it was a new product fair enough, but as I straight man, I would just buy Kleenex or something. It's not homophobia, I wouldn't buy ones in a pink box aimed at women either. Unless of course they were much cheaper, but they weren't allowed to say that.

P.S. there is also the imagary suggested by the old Frank Skinner joke:

"I always think you can tell how good a film is by the number of tissues you go through when you're watching it."

You got it exactly right, thats all they said

Please watch this video of a crazy old lady protesting against Raef getting fired at BoreMe.com

http://www.boreme.com/boreme/funny-2...rentice-p1.php

Naughty Naughty Naughty!!

We can't really judge based on one idea that came up during a brainstorming session....how a product brand might have been developed etc...all we can really say is what they did produce was unintentionally hillarious.

Why do have you a picture of sneezing on the box Alex ?
Sneeze = tissue
And a blanket ?
Blanket = cozy dunnit?
Ah yes I suppose it does....

Common sense really, but where does a person sitting on an armchair sipping tea come into the tissue saga .... oooo maybe if the spill some, lol nice one Lucinda, your idea is far superior :yawn:

While I think you have a point....
I'd refine it and say

Lucinda is great when she's in charge, but poor at working for anyone else if she feels she is being badly managed..

Well she seemed to work fine with Lee when he was PM......she's been called negative and disruptive when managed by Jenny/ Helene and Alex......

Questions only become negative and destabalizing when the PM doesn't have any answers.....This week Alex & team didn't have a plan.... they plodded along and got lucky.

You need energy and critical thinking...

Lee's boundless (but sometimes over the top) enthusiam and Lucinda's questioning (although sometimes irritating) are definately a good mix of skills if used effectively...Alex imo is useless, had no real plan and didn't really manage the team... He was lucky.

Oh my god that's the same argument Alex made...are you Alex go on admit it

Lucinda was NOT suggesting they make a tissue box with someone on the front sipping tea...

She was trying to point out that you can convey an abstract idea like say "warmth", through association and with more subtlety.

Isn't 90% of what makes advertising effective the manipulation of specific associations and desires?

Looks like next week she has a awful time as the task manager.

she's not project manager next week!

Im sure she is, in the clip we saw.

no she's not. definitely!!!

I think alot of people have fallen for Lucindas victim act. She's always been difficult to manage but now she's really pushy too. She was very critical but what ideas diod she cpome up with herself? The gay advert? Great! Haqng on, what did she contribute this week apart from aggro?