I don't get it. Is this TW hand-in-a-jar the Dr's hand that was cut off by the Sycorax??? And if it is then how does it get to Torchwood? Was it picked up off the streets of London by that woman and taken too Torchwood London and then taken by Jack to Cardiff? And if it is the same hand how does it get back into the TARDIS for series 4?????????/

???????????/

Right firstly in terms of how it got to Torchwood....well as they tend to go around collecting Alien tech and so on, it won't be a suprise that they picked up the hand, and it won't be a suprise that as Jack had the intention of finding the Doctor, he would have got hold of it.....

And as for how it ended up in the Tardis in series 4....did you watch series 3????????

If not then basically Jack, as we know had it, made a Doctor detector out of it, Took it with him as he left Torchwood and jumped on the Tardis in Utopia, and then the Master took it, and made the Doctor old in the Valient in Sound Of Drums, and after the whole Hoo Haa ended, the Doctor took it with him......

The doctor keeps the hand from the end of series 3.

Why can't I be as simple as that

I've watched Utopia several times and never saw/heard mention of the hand!

And does Utopia post-date Torchwood? So Utopia hadn't happened when the first series of TW was broadcast? Do we see the hand in the end of series 3 of Who? (although I loathe, detest and hate The Sound of Drums and Last of the Timelords so maybe I missed something as I cringed with the embarrassment of it all).

So...
Doctor loses the hand
TW gets the hand
Jack uses hand to get to the Doctor
Doctor takes hand back
Doctor uses hand to create double-Doctor

RIGHT??

P.S Thank you for filling me in

Okay....In Utopia, we see the Hand quite a few times....firstly Utopia is set right at the moment where Jack disapears in series 1 episode 13 of Torchwood, then in the silo Martha hears some bubbling noises coming from Jack's Bag that he brought with him, as he puts the bag down, Martha opens it and finds the hand, to which she is horrofied, and shocked further when the Doctor says that it is his Hand, and then explains the whole Christmas event in a few words, later on the Master (Jacobi) when he is getting himself into the Tardis at one point is shown going towards the hand, and the next thing we see when the Master is shot and locks himself up, the hand is there already, then when Simms comes along, on the floor we see the hand again.....

The next time we see the hand is in Sound of drums when the Master tells the Doctor of his plans to age him, and shows him his hand, then we don't really see it untill the LOTTL when the Doctor has obviously brought it back into the Tardis, and since then has been there.....and I know you don't like the Doctor's Daughter, but it kind of plays a part in that as well, as well as JE as we know....

Oooh I think I need to start paying attention to what I'm watching

It is all clear now, especially the bit about Utopia starting just as Jack leaves TW at the end of series 1

Btw, why does the Doctor fly off in Utopia when he sees Jack running to meet him??

I've never understood that either

Oh it happens....I'm just a bit obsessive

He knows that Jack is a 'fixed point in time' and that is something that isn't right. The Doctor just tries to run away rather than dealing with Jack's stiuation... it's covered in Utopia and he apologies for it. The Doctor running away from his reponsibilities... surely not

He also abandoned Jack at the end of series one after Rose had bought him back to lifer. Heseemed a bit embaressed about that.

Jack's situation is something he can't explain - he does try to run away rather than confront Jack. He knows Jack will want answers, obviously!! WHY can't I die????? The Doctor feels bad. He does apologise to Jack and by the end of it all, the Doctor has got over his embarrassment and invites Jack to join him and Martha in the TARDIS. So, in series 4, he is glad to see Jack, all friends again and this time not jealous of him and Rose!

OP

I'm really surprised you don't recall the hand seen from Utopia. Its quite long and there's a flash back to the Christmas Invasion.

Also, I don't think we need an explanation of how TW ended up with the hand as they hone into and collect lots of alien artifacts.

Really surprised you missed the explanation to Rose in JE after the Doctor doesn't regenerate. He even tells her its the hand the Sycorax cut off.

Pay attention naughty!

I'm going to rewatch Utopia later just to make sure

Did The Doctor not also say that The TARDIS wanted to get away from Jack too, because he is "Wrong"?

This is a sore point with me. The Doctor NEVER apologised to Jack for abandoning him. He explained why he did it. He never said the words "I'm sorry." He only says that when someone is dying.

And yes, the Tardis did try to run away from Jack. It also got the heebie jeebies from Jack's wrongness. But as we have also seen, it got over it. Probably the Doctor did some tinkering to make it accept Jack. The Doctor did offer to take Jack back as a companion, so we can assume that at the latest by that time he had done what was necessary. We have seen Jack with the rest of Dad's army, excuse me, The Doctor's army flying the earth back to it's correct orbit.

The fact remains, and will always remain, that the Doctor abandoned, Jack's word, Jack on a defunct satellite full of corpses above a devastated planet two hundred thousand years in the future with no idea of what had happened to him. Jack, who the Doctor had heard not two hours before say of him, the Doctor, "Never doubted him, never will.", and who then gave his life, with no expectation of resurrection, for the Doctor and all of humanity. What kind of cad would do such a thing?

Please don't anybody give me the "The Doctor was dying and Rose was ill and the Tardis was wonky and he had other things to think about" line. The Tardis is a time machine. The Doctor could have taken off, regenerated, let Rose rest up, (and as we've seen, the went immediately to her house and she was ok) and fine tuned the Tardis to accept Jack, taken all the time he needed, and then popped back in and picked up Jack, two of Jack's minutes after he had left. He could have told Jack, "Sorry, mate, but you are an abomination and the sight of you makes me sick. But I'll take you anywhere you want to go and you can start over." That would have been the honourable course of action. The Doctor didn't take it. He ran away. His words.

I understand that Rose made a reference to going and finding Jack and the Doctor told her that Jack was busy helping rebuild the earth. I did not see that, but if it is so, then the Doctor also lied to Rose.

I confess that there is no Captain save Jack Harkness and that John Barrowman is his Avatar.

well, as you all know ..... when a severed hand comes falling from a big giant alien spaceship .....

it's going to end up at the back of the cupboard

and I'm sure we can all imagine what use Jack found for it!!

Sorry totally unnecessary, but couldn't resist!!!

I'm glad you said something first because I was going to say that I hoped that the hand did spend most of the time in cupboard than anywhere else....

Well, we all know Jack!!!!! And it was the Doctor's hand!! Oh no, let's stop right there!!!!!

Oh please yes lets just stop right there....my mind only can take so much

The answer is buried in Torchwood Series One IIRC. Jack is supposed to have gone into the ruins of Canary Wharf Torchwood and "brought stuff out" in the chaos after the Cybermen-Dalek battle. I always presumed he brought it with him then?