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Apple Ad "Misleading" and pulled
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Gormond
27-08-2008
Originally Posted by neo6776:
“One question. why doesn't the iphone have flash and Java installed? Fairly basic things now.”

Because they are third party addons and require the third party to make them. Microsoft made there version of Java for Windows years ago and got hit by a law suit because of it and were forced to remove it.

Adobe have already said that they are working on Flash for the iPhone and i'm sure will will eventually see it in the App store.
prking
27-08-2008
I wonder why Apple chose not to enable Flash and Java on the iPhone. Other phone manufacturers have licensed Flash, so why didn't Apple. Even my cheap Nokia 5300 has Flash lite.
neo6776
27-08-2008
Originally Posted by Gormond:
“Maybe you should complain that Beans don't infact mean Heinz... ASA only got Apple to change this because Windows Fan Bois complained as most adverts could be deemed unfit if this incredible word scrutiny went on.”

Oh come on. You never stop to think it was people who bought the device who tried to go onto java or flash rich sites that complained?

Quote:
“Yeah who am I to question the ASA, they are ofcoarse always 100% correct and shouldn't be challenged ”

Indeed in some cases they should be challenged but this time they were correct. It will only require a small change to the ad anyway so no big deal really.
Staunchy
27-08-2008
Originally Posted by Gormond:
“Sigh... What i'm saying is Apple weren't being misleading, what they meant is that the iPhones web browser conforms to internet standards unlike alot of mobile devices (Windows Mobile Included) which it does.

What I was getting at is what the ASA are taking "all the parts of the internet" to mean IMO is wrong as under there definition nothing can.”

It's not down to what Apple meant, what matters is what a reasonably minded person would think after watching the ad.

Do you really believe they were talking about internet standards? Really? In an advert for a phone? Do you think that's deciding factor for most people when they buy a phone? I'm more likely to believe they were highlighting how good Safari is and accidentally used a misleading phrase.
brianwilson
27-08-2008
Originally Posted by Gormond:
“Maybe you should complain that Beans don't infact mean Heinz.”

Well perhaps we have something to work with here. You are comparing a rhyming advert slogan with a statement of fact. To some people beans does indeed mean Heinz, as they won't eat any other brand. Then we have Apple making a false statement. Of course they're comparable.
neo6776
27-08-2008
Originally Posted by Gormond:
“Because they are third party addons and require the third party to make them. Microsoft made there version of Java for Windows years ago and got hit by a law suit because of it and were forced to remove it.

Adobe have already said that they are working on Flash for the iPhone and i'm sure will will eventually see it in the App store.”

Ok so basically its not apples fault they don't have these features as yet. Still they shouldn't have advertised it as being a complete we experience when clearly it isn't. Small niggle tbh but still true.
brianwilson
27-08-2008
Originally Posted by Gormond:
“Because they are third party addons and require the third party to make them.”

Actually Java is open source, so Apple could easily port it themselves.
brianwilson
27-08-2008
Originally Posted by Gormond:
“Adobe have already said that they are working on Flash for the iPhone and i'm sure will will eventually see it in the App store.”

That's great news for will, assuming he owns an iphone.
flagpole
27-08-2008
I do wonder why it doesn't have flash and java, it can't be technically difficult.

i figure the two possibilities are they don't want to pay the licence and lose margin cos they just don't have to. it wont affect sales.

or they're holding back for the iPhone #3
Gormond
27-08-2008
Originally Posted by brianwilson:
“Actually Java is open source, so Apple could easily port it themselves.”

Not all of Java is Open Source and some components are still pre-compiled binaries from Sun.
Gormond
27-08-2008
Originally Posted by brianwilson:
“That's great news for will, assuming he owns an iphone.”

Sorry I didn't realise you were a member of the spelling and grammar police... Oh your not?

Just trolling then eh
flagpole
27-08-2008
oh i just posted this in the mobile phones forum, i didn't see it here.
Gormond
27-08-2008
Originally Posted by flagpole:
“I do wonder why it doesn't have flash and java, it can't be technically difficult.

i figure the two possibilities are they don't want to pay the licence and lose margin cos they just don't have to. it wont affect sales.

or they're holding back for the iPhone #3”

It isn't up to Apple to add third party plugins and Adobe have said they they are working on it.

Also Apple add any software upgrade to previous models unlike many other mobile manufacturers so if it was on iPhone #3 then iPhone #1 and #2 would get it too.
tuppy26
27-08-2008
Originally Posted by flagpole:
“oh i just posted this in the mobile phones forum, i didn't see it here.”

Flagpole unlike you to not notice something in the puter forum
Gormond
27-08-2008
Originally Posted by flagpole:
“oh i just posted this in the mobile phones forum, i didn't see it here.”

It should infact be in the mobile phone forum as it is about the iPhone.
flagpole
27-08-2008
Originally Posted by Gormond:
“It isn't up to Apple to add third party plugins and Adobe have said they they are working on it.

Also Apple add any software upgrade to previous models unlike many other mobile manufacturers so if it was on iPhone #3 then iPhone #1 and #2 would get it too.”

what??? who put flash lite on my n95??? i'm pretty sure it was nokia???
Gormond
27-08-2008
Originally Posted by flagpole:
“what??? who put flash lite on my n95??? i'm pretty sure it was nokia???”

Flash Lite for the N95 was made by Adobe.
flagpole
27-08-2008
Originally Posted by tuppy26:
“Flagpole unlike you to not notice something in the puter forum”

Yes well you know what it's like, you fire up the browser, computing and networking has 50 new threads since you last looked, it's all a bit much so you star in the mobile phone forum.

somone mentioned the story to me, i saw it wasn't in there....
whoever,hey
27-08-2008
I think this has got way to technical already. Advertising standards are about plain language and how joe blog on the streets will interpret the ad, not how technical people will interpret it.

I didn't even realise shockwave java wasn't supported on the iphone yet, and am shocked its not, so its hardly suprising the ASA also think its misleading to the typical customer. I'd be gutted if i was tied into an 18 month contract and hundreds of quid down the line to see i couldn't actually surf many sites on the net.

Shockwave/java, may not be internet standards, but they are treated like that by many many web developers. I cant remember the last time i saw a site that gave me the option to see either the html or shockwave version.
Gormond
27-08-2008
Originally Posted by whoever,hey:
“I think this has got way to technical already. Advertising standards are about plain language and how joe blog on the streets will interpret the ad, not how technical people will interpret it.

I didn't even realise shockwave java wasn't supported on the iphone yet, and am shocked its not, so its hardly suprising the ASA also think its misleading to the typical customer. I'd be gutted if i was tied into an 18 month contract and hundreds of quid down the line to see i couldn't actually surf many sites on the net.

Shockwave/java, may not be internet standards, but they are treated like that by many many web developers. I cant remember the last time i saw a site that gave me the option to see either the html or shockwave version.”

Every website I lookup works on my iPhone, which websites require flash or java?

Flash is mainly used for adverts from what I have seen, thank god there are flash blocking plugins available for FF
flagpole
27-08-2008
Originally Posted by Gormond:
“Flash Lite for the N95 was made by Adobe.”

yes but you can't absolve nokia/apple of an respocibility in the process at all. it's written by adobe, lots of plugins are written by third parties, the office suite for example.

but i don't imagine nokia just stumbled up on them and stuck them in.

if apple wanted a version of flash i'm sure they could have had one by now, but they'd have to pay a licence.
Gormond
27-08-2008
Originally Posted by flagpole:
“yes but you can't absolve nokia/apple of an respocibility in the process at all. it's written by adobe, lots of plugins are written by third parties, the office suite for example.

but i don't imagine nokia just stumbled up on them and stuck them in.

if apple wanted a version of flash i'm sure they could have had one by now, but they'd have to pay a licence.”

Apple do want flash for the iPhone and Adobe have previously said they are working on it.
brianwilson
27-08-2008
Originally Posted by Gormond:
“Every website I lookup works on my iPhone, which websites require flash or java?”

There's the solution then. The advert should say "all the parts of the internet that Gormond wants are on the iPhone", problem solved.
flagpole
27-08-2008
Originally Posted by Gormond:
“Every website I lookup works on my iPhone, which websites require flash or java?

Flash is mainly used for adverts from what I have seen, thank god there are flash blocking plugins available for FF ”

you can turn it off in most browsers. a lot of promotional websites, for bands, events etc. have a flash loader on the front screen, if you don't have flash then you can go no further.
Gormond
27-08-2008
Originally Posted by brianwilson:
“There's the solution then. The advert should say "all the parts of the internet that Gormond wants are on the iPhone", problem solved.”

I agree i'm glad we have found a common ground.
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