So you don't think Lemar, Leona Lewis, Will Young , Girls Aloud are talented then?

The way I look at it is that some of these people are hugely talented and it's deadly serious for them. I tend to identify with them rather than see them as objects for my amusement.

And as for becoming pawns, that may be true of some, but Will Young, Lemar, Leona and Girls Aloud have very respectable careers now and people don't associate them with the shows any more.

I think Lemar and Leona Lewis have talent. Will Young - a bit but Girls Aloud not in the slightest bit at all.

Anyway, the thread is about how people approach the show and yeah, cool you see talent and you focus on that but the point I'm making is, they chose one person (Will, Leona) and eliminate all others in a massive TV charade but people take the people seriously.

Now taking what you just said, do you think there are other people like that out there? Could there be others out there instead of these. In fact, I even think Lemar went the distance and disappeared and I think Leona has a certain mileage as well because I think she'll struggle after some time too.

Many are living off the massive craving the public have for publicity so taking it back to your view, of talent - you'd seek that talent on the radio or unsigned bands if the public or the publishing industry didn't make a massive market for pap based activity and PR stunts which X Factor works from too.

It's all connected and the point is - people take it extremely seriously like it is what is being staged and they don't see it is being staged.

I essentially agree with Beer in this thread.
Yes, success can follow a reality show but the topic here is really about how the machine is stage managed. I think so, anyway.

I quite like Leona's and Kelly Clarkson's music, by the way. Just thought I'd throw that in.

I think most people see that it's staged, but that doesn't make the contestants any less real. I don't need to be told about their auditions over and over again or their sob stories and I find that part of it boring and annoying. I would prefer it if they concentrated on the singing instead of the background stories. However, I'm genuinely interested in the talent and think there are about 6 this year who could make it in the real world.

Lemar's still going strong BTW. He is just set to release his 4th album and won two Brit awards in 2006
Last edited by Reality Sucks : 05-10-2008 at 02:34

I am not that interested in the talent maybe due to my perception of talent. For example, I enjoyed watching Rhydian last year but I have seen baritone, I have seen opera, I have seen some great musical theatre - so I'm saying I've seen better. All these people make a decent living in touring or generally arts industries and however they can get work - some just go part time.

Otherwise talent for me is somebody who is considerably unique. If you're a mathematician, anybody can do equations and simplify and correct and develop - but the difference is doing something unique, something out of the blue and great.

Now this I feel is the crux of the thread. There are a lot of singers out there. A lot of singing performers out there but for me, who is really unique this year, or last, or the year before that? Nobody.

I liked what Kelly Clarkson did. Not so much Leona. I think Kelly Clarkson really had a great a deal of attitude about her.

Leona Lewis had a publishing deal long before she was invited to appear on the X Factor.

'Because Of You' cuts me up every time.
sob...


Yes, Leona and those girls that 'trill and warble' a bit like Christina generally annoy me. I think Leona has some good songs though and quite like her voice.

Christina has a fantastic voice and like Kelly Clarkson is somebody you just listen to regardless.

I like Leona's new one and I like what I hear about the new album. The first one with Simon I was disappointed with.

I like Mali's voice, very unique and identifiable - I think Hannah's a great singer - Rachel could be fantastic with a bit of vocal coaching, Alexandra is already brilliant.

I like the first three but I don't like the last one. I've heard a lot of Alexander as but the other three have distinctive voices. Hannah doesn't but very very few people come along with a voice like Hannah's but then again she barely puts a foot wrong vocally and doesn't get carried away either.

I love Mali's voice.....but I'm Al Green's number one fan and I wasn't impressed with Mali's version of it.

I think Alexandra should have made it before XFactor.

Hannah and Rachel are more what XF should be about. I.e. raw and unrehearsed talent.

I enjoyed earlier versions of shows like this when they took this raw talent and helped them reach their potential.....but now I just feel it is all hype with a preordained winner in mind, despite any raw talent.

It's a shame that the show has become more about media hype, the judges and sob stories. The raw talent has almost gone right out the window.

This show will have at least one candidate with raw talent (out of loads) and the others are sort of polished or sob stories or cute factors. It makes a mockery out of it all really.

It would be good if the show stuck to its principle of finding a genuine XFactor instead of whom Simon wants to stick a flag pole on and market. I already see signs of him giving up on his group because he doesn't want competition from whom he sees as the likely winning category....i.e the girls.

So to me, it all seems to be so predictable which is a shame.

The best thing that could happen would be for some other production company to take over and let Simon off the hook...because his greed exceeds him. Sorry Simon fans, but it's the truth.

Hundreds of bands and singers get breaks in their careers by entering competitions often through various venues, record companies or radio stations.

One example is an Australian band named Silverchair who won a competition on Australian radio their prize was to have a single and video recorded that single launced their career and got them a US number 1 that was in 1994 and they are still going and they were all 15 at the time.

The X Factor is just an extension of these many competitions whilst I agree it is manipulated very much behind the scenes I genuinely believe that it does produce talent and give many people a shot at a music career.

The first few weeks of each X - Factor series is like 1 unscripted soap with the over emotional contestants & their *yawn* sob stories, singing the same songs over & over, as well as the comical auditions who think they are gods gift.

I normally start taking it more seriously when the live shows start with a weekly theme where you get to know what style is most suited per finalist.

Excellent post

Nadine and Nicola in particular were excellent singers when on PSTR. They have talent.

Kimberley and Sarah were competent and Cheryl is just gorgeous.

As a whole, GA are good, I'd say.

Good post.

But isn't that exactly how the entertainment industry works now and has done for the past 30 or 40 years. These days its about how much you can sell & the things that drive the masses to buy are not particularly driven by 'talent'.


The whole mainstream entertainment industry from film to music is dominated by executives in studios who pick up marketable people and use their sheer marketing power to sell these people and their cookie cutter products to the world.


Take High School Musical, its not popular because its an awesome series of movies, its popular because the teens fancy the actors, its made by Disney who have epic selling power and it plays up to teen culture.


Take just about every girl group out there; sod singing ability or good songs, throw in some scantily clad women and it will sell.


All these teen movies... crappy scripts with average acting but people who will sell the cinema tickets and DVD's.

Britney Spears is hardly an awesome singer, but shes one of the most famous artists in the world and has the media and a collosal fan base watching her every move.

X-Factors hardly gonna be any different is it, if it was then it would be working to a method that went out many, many years ago.



As for the OP; sorry mate but its not a farse, its actually pretty close to how mainstream entertainment works; what will sell the most - everything else is out the window. While I accept the majority in the entertainment industry are in cruise ships and clubs; the vast majority will never enter mainstream entertainment. It's the ones who are manufactured or are very similar to what a manufactured act is like, that make it into the mainstream.

*cough* What?? Down to earth? I think not.

yep JTW, The one thing that really annoys me is the way they won't have two of the same type in a group. Therefore if you have a singer like Hannah and Laura who are somewhat in the same ballpark vocally, they wouldn't put them both through even if the judge thought they were both more talented than Amy and Diana. IT should be about talent, not about variety, and that's what I dislike about the show.

IN Simon's group you just know he'll put through one for the girlie's, probably Alan , the weakest vocally. Out of the singers it'll be between Mali and Austin and I think he'll pick Austin.: I'm hoping he doesn't put Liam through instead of Eoghan as I think Eoghan has a more interesting voice.

A hard stool can affect anybody's singing voice.

LMAO

I am for the entertainment factor
This year will be boring if the spoiler is true...
14 girls for only 9 guys...hmmm I like my eye candy and there will be none. People here are looking for a new "LEONA" blah I am sick and tired of the big diva belter singers.

Well this is what the thread is about. That people see the show as the "big break" when in fact it is a huge manipulation made by the media and how much you can big somebody up.

I wouldn't call it talent. I'd say it's the ability to fool the masses as much as you can and give them what they want. People underestimate TV. In fact, I don't think it's underestimate - people survive and thrive and live through TV and believe it undoubtedly. Where I see TV as just a TV, many people still see being on TV as something huge.

There are lots of singers out there but the manipulation of X Factor is, as illustrated, the "big break" illusion (when in fact singers earn a living as singing, which is why they are singers because they sing for a living and this "big break" is in fact a massive business and marketing ploy created to give people jobs and industry by making an illusion around a group.

Now, that last paragraph - that is what Simon is in the business of. Making people believe they want something (in this case somebody) that they don't really need.

I think most people disappear from X Factor to do their shopping and move on to the next thing but there is, as I've noticed, people who really "need" what this programme sells.

So it's like a grouping of market into sub markets
[LIST][*]Those who want entertainment from what is sold.
[*]Those who need an attachment and bond with what is sold.[/LIST]
Of course there are further sub markets in this but I'd say they are the two main groups.