Boundary between PVRs and DVDRs?

goggled · 10-11-2008, 16:46

Where does the boundary lie, seeing that some DVDRs are sporting EPGs and series link, as per the example.

What can one do that the other cannot?

Nigel Goodwin · 10-11-2008, 16:58

A PVR is a digital recorder, it records ONLY a direct digital datastream, from Freeview or satellite (depending on type) - you can record nothing else.

A DVDR is an analogue recorder, it converts the incoming analogue signal to digital, MPEG encodes it, then records to the disc - this means you can record external AV inputs. A DVDR with Freeview built-in probably converts the digital to analogue, then converts it back to digital to record - in this way you can have different recording qualities, something you can't on a PVR.

russellelly · 10-11-2008, 17:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nigel Goodwin

A PVR is a digital recorder, it records ONLY a direct digital datastream, from Freeview or satellite (depending on type) - you can record nothing else.

A DVDR is an analogue recorder, it converts the incoming analogue signal to digital, MPEG encodes it, then records to the disc - this means you can record external AV inputs. A DVDR with Freeview built-in probably converts the digital to analogue, then converts it back to digital to record - in this way you can have different recording qualities, something you can't on a PVR.

I'm sure many wouldn't see it as clear cut as that. By your definition TiVo wouldn't qualify as a PVR!

goggled · 10-11-2008, 18:46

I was thinking in terms of functionality. In some respects from the answers it could appear that a DVDR that included EPG and series link, as per the link, might have greater use than a single tuner PVR with the ability to record record external AV inputs.

Am I misunderstanding or missing something?

Chris Frost · 10-11-2008, 19:49

Does it really matter that much?

You'd choose a PVR if you wanted a freeview or sky receiver & recorder and weren't bothered about archiving to disc.

The EPG feature of a DVDR is simply another enhancement - same as a Freeview tuner, or same as adding a hard disc; it's just an evolution of the form factor.

I suppose the biggest factor for most people is ease of use. PVRs tend to make recording a doddle because you are dealing with just a single source - Freeview or Sky. DVDRs are more flexible but also more complex - are you recording from internal analogue or Freeview, or externally from Freeview or Sky. And if external then how to ensure control of the source box. There's a lot that can go wrong.

goggled · 10-11-2008, 20:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Frost

.... - are you recording from internal analogue or Freeview, or externally from Freeview or Sky. And if external then how to ensure control of the source box. There's a lot that can go wrong.

Personally I know what you mean as I use both my old vCR and a DVDR to deal with my FSFS/analogue recording, when I want to record 2 progs simultaneously and may be watch a second analogue

Within a reasonable time I will be getting a Freesat PVR, but looking for info for a friend who is less tecchie than even I, caused me to think that not all is on the side of the PVR

Chris Frost · 10-11-2008, 22:52

Not sure I understood your last statement.

I've got quite a few non-techie customers. I can't think of a single one that doesn't find Sky+/Sky+HD or a dual tuner PVR such as a Topfield or Humax much much easier than programming a DVDR.

Most of them have bought DVD Recorders because they thought they'd archive stuff to disc. But in reality they just can't be bothered with the hassle.

Nigel Goodwin · 10-11-2008, 22:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by russellelly

I'm sure many wouldn't see it as clear cut as that. By your definition TiVo wouldn't qualify as a PVR!

Exactly, I don't consider the TiVo qualifies as a PVR

goggled · 11-11-2008, 09:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Frost

Not sure I understood your last statement.

I meant that the DVDR has on its side things other than its PVRs TV recoding functions.

Willie Wontie · 11-11-2008, 09:34

When all is said and done, a DVDR offers one thing that no PVR does - the ability to archive recordings to an external media, which can then be taken away and viewed anywhere that has a DVD player. All the other whistles and bells that most DVDRs now encapsulate (digital tuners, hard drives, fancy EPGs) are there to try to encourage people to buy one of those rather than a PVR, but they are all icing on the cake. What a DVDR is, it's reason for being is, is to be able to record to DVD disc.

goggled · 11-11-2008, 09:46

Can/will the two technologies ever merge in to one with the advantages of each?

Chris Frost · 12-11-2008, 08:20

Well, they already have.

But as I said before, the ease-of-use of a DVDR (with hard drive) is compromised by the fact that does so much.

goggled · 12-11-2008, 08:30

Is that absolutely true? Isn't it possible to record on PVR without subtitles being requested, but get them on playback. but with DVDR they have to be set when setting up recording?

Chris Frost · 12-11-2008, 09:44

It might depend on the DVDR, I guess. I had a Thomson VCR (VPH7090) that could record subtitles. If there's a sufficient market for the feature then there will probably be a product with it.

10-11-2008, 16:46	#1
goggled Forum Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Hants (New Forest) Posts: 1,665	Boundary between PVRs and DVDRs? Where does the boundary lie, seeing that some DVDRs are sporting EPGs and series link, as per the example. What can one do that the other cannot?

10-11-2008, 16:58	#2
Nigel Goodwin Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: North Derbyshire Posts: 41,789	A PVR is a digital recorder, it records ONLY a direct digital datastream, from Freeview or satellite (depending on type) - you can record nothing else. A DVDR is an analogue recorder, it converts the incoming analogue signal to digital, MPEG encodes it, then records to the disc - this means you can record external AV inputs. A DVDR with Freeview built-in probably converts the digital to analogue, then converts it back to digital to record - in this way you can have different recording qualities, something you can't on a PVR.

10-11-2008, 17:43	#3
russellelly Forum Member Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Scotland Posts: 10,720	Quote: Originally Posted by Nigel Goodwin A PVR is a digital recorder, it records ONLY a direct digital datastream, from Freeview or satellite (depending on type) - you can record nothing else. A DVDR is an analogue recorder, it converts the incoming analogue signal to digital, MPEG encodes it, then records to the disc - this means you can record external AV inputs. A DVDR with Freeview built-in probably converts the digital to analogue, then converts it back to digital to record - in this way you can have different recording qualities, something you can't on a PVR. I'm sure many wouldn't see it as clear cut as that. By your definition TiVo wouldn't qualify as a PVR!

10-11-2008, 18:46	#4
goggled Forum Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Hants (New Forest) Posts: 1,665	I was thinking in terms of functionality. In some respects from the answers it could appear that a DVDR that included EPG and series link, as per the link, might have greater use than a single tuner PVR with the ability to record record external AV inputs. Am I misunderstanding or missing something?

10-11-2008, 19:49	#5
Chris Frost Forum Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Cheshire Posts: 6,462	Does it really matter that much? You'd choose a PVR if you wanted a freeview or sky receiver & recorder and weren't bothered about archiving to disc. The EPG feature of a DVDR is simply another enhancement - same as a Freeview tuner, or same as adding a hard disc; it's just an evolution of the form factor. I suppose the biggest factor for most people is ease of use. PVRs tend to make recording a doddle because you are dealing with just a single source - Freeview or Sky. DVDRs are more flexible but also more complex - are you recording from internal analogue or Freeview, or externally from Freeview or Sky. And if external then how to ensure control of the source box. There's a lot that can go wrong.

10-11-2008, 20:16	#6
goggled Forum Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Hants (New Forest) Posts: 1,665	Quote: Originally Posted by Chris Frost .... - are you recording from internal analogue or Freeview, or externally from Freeview or Sky. And if external then how to ensure control of the source box. There's a lot that can go wrong. Personally I know what you mean as I use both my old vCR and a DVDR to deal with my FSFS/analogue recording, when I want to record 2 progs simultaneously and may be watch a second analogue Within a reasonable time I will be getting a Freesat PVR, but looking for info for a friend who is less tecchie than even I, caused me to think that not all is on the side of the PVR

10-11-2008, 22:52	#7
Chris Frost Forum Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Cheshire Posts: 6,462	Not sure I understood your last statement. I've got quite a few non-techie customers. I can't think of a single one that doesn't find Sky+/Sky+HD or a dual tuner PVR such as a Topfield or Humax much much easier than programming a DVDR. Most of them have bought DVD Recorders because they thought they'd archive stuff to disc. But in reality they just can't be bothered with the hassle.

10-11-2008, 22:59	#8
Nigel Goodwin Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: North Derbyshire Posts: 41,789	Quote: Originally Posted by russellelly I'm sure many wouldn't see it as clear cut as that. By your definition TiVo wouldn't qualify as a PVR! Exactly, I don't consider the TiVo qualifies as a PVR

11-11-2008, 09:11	#9
goggled Forum Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Hants (New Forest) Posts: 1,665	Quote: Originally Posted by Chris Frost Not sure I understood your last statement. I meant that the DVDR has on its side things other than its PVRs TV recoding functions.

11-11-2008, 09:34	#10
Willie Wontie Inactive Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 2,847	When all is said and done, a DVDR offers one thing that no PVR does - the ability to archive recordings to an external media, which can then be taken away and viewed anywhere that has a DVD player. All the other whistles and bells that most DVDRs now encapsulate (digital tuners, hard drives, fancy EPGs) are there to try to encourage people to buy one of those rather than a PVR, but they are all icing on the cake. What a DVDR is, it's reason for being is, is to be able to record to DVD disc.

11-11-2008, 09:46	#11
goggled Forum Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Hants (New Forest) Posts: 1,665	Can/will the two technologies ever merge in to one with the advantages of each?

12-11-2008, 08:20	#12
Chris Frost Forum Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Cheshire Posts: 6,462	Well, they already have. But as I said before, the ease-of-use of a DVDR (with hard drive) is compromised by the fact that does so much.

12-11-2008, 08:30	#13
goggled Forum Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Hants (New Forest) Posts: 1,665	Is that absolutely true? Isn't it possible to record on PVR without subtitles being requested, but get them on playback. but with DVDR they have to be set when setting up recording?

12-11-2008, 09:44	#14
Chris Frost Forum Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Cheshire Posts: 6,462	It might depend on the DVDR, I guess. I had a Thomson VCR (VPH7090) that could record subtitles. If there's a sufficient market for the feature then there will probably be a product with it.

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Boundary between PVRs and DVDRs?