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Hollyoaks: Is John Paul gay? (Part 26) |
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#101 |
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Tracey, I'm no expert in television politics, but I believe they write the storylines the way they believe it's right, the way they believe it's more fitting for the story they have in mind to tell, not for a group of fans or another. Whatever the outcome of this sl is, it's what they decided to do from an artistic point of view; they'll do what they want to do. Certainly they aren't set on punishing or rewarding parts of their fandom!
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#102 |
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hun if you want me to pm you on what HO had planned for priesty i will , but take it from me they have changed their minds on this FACT!!!!! sorry but they have!!!!
Kieron being killed off was ALWAYS a rumour, or am I wrong? I don't remember many people on this thread saying they knew for certain he was going to be killed off, in fact most said they didn't know, so how come you are so certain that they have changed their minds on something that just seemed to be a rumour anyway? |
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#103 |
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hun if you want me to pm you on what HO had planned for priesty i will , but take it from me they have changed their minds on this FACT!!!!! sorry but they have!!!!
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#104 |
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Well, they are entitled to change a sl while it's running, as long as it's artistic choice. If they did to accomodate the new fans, well, that's pretty spineless, indeed!
I agree with your post Francy but definitely this bit in bold! I never thought anyone was entitled to the SE, I just got the impression from watching the show that they had a tremendous regard for the SL and that if they wanted to end JP's story, they would end it this way, but not for a group of fans - and no disrespect to you fantastic people, I love that the torch is burning bright on this SL but I don't think it would sway them to such a degree, unless they were already planning that ending themselves.
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#105 |
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tbh as well this thread has gone very quite now , since this announcement , normally at this time it would be buzzin, folk are more worried by this news than they are letting on ,!!!! mcdeaners will know what i mean , we have kicked in the teeth sooo many times ,. we bounce back only for BK and HO to kick us again, when that has happened to you for over 9 months yes , it all becomes bigger than it should and yes it is only a soap fot christ sake, but all out loyalty to HO , BK ,
Mcdean Guy and James , never get rewarded at all, only with little snippets and nods and winks, the aww shippers now get leaks from Lime, and announcements on this morning , jesus , how sad am i to let myself be bothered, by this BK and Ho dont care, so why should we, i just wish he would put us out of our misery and have the curteousy, to tell us before we are all gone |
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#106 |
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I honestly don't get this.
Kieron being killed off was ALWAYS a rumour, or am I wrong? I don't remember many people on this thread saying they knew for certain he was going to be killed off, in fact most said they didn't know, so how come you are so certain that they have changed their minds on something that just seemed to be a rumour anyway?
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#107 |
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tbh aswell this thread has gone very quite now , since this announcement , normally attime it would be buzzin, folk are more worried by this news than they are letting on ,!!!! mcdeaners will know what i mean , we have kicked in the teeth sooo many times ,. we bounce back only for BK aand HO to kick us again, when that has happened to you for over 9 months yes , it all becomes bigger than it should and yes it is only asoap fot christ sake, but all out loyalty to HO , BK ,
Mcdean Guy and James , never get rewardedat all, only with little snippets and nods and winks, the aww shippers now get leaks from Lime, and announcements on this morning , jesus , how sad am i to let myself be bothered, by this BK and Ho dont care, so why should we, i just wish he would put us out of our misery and have the curteousy, to tell us before we are all gone this thread goes through quiet periods and busy periods all the time, much like other threads....don't think the posters are huddled away somewhere else panicking about the news!! I now have to head off but don't think it is because of panic!!!
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#108 |
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tbh aswell this thread has gone very quite now , since this announcement , normally attime it would be buzzin, folk are more worried by this news than they are letting on ,!!!! mcdeaners will know what i mean , we have kicked in the teeth sooo many times ,. we bounce back only for BK aand HO to kick us again, when that has happened to you for over 9 months yes , it all becomes bigger than it should and yes it is only asoap fot christ sake, but all out loyalty to HO , BK ,
Mcdean Guy and James , never get rewardedat all, only with little snippets and nods and winks, the aww shippers now get leaks from Lime, and announcements on this morning , jesus , how sad am i to let myself be bothered, by this BK and Ho dont care, so why should we, i just wish he would put us out of our misery and have the curteousy, to tell us before we are all gone |
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#109 |
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I agree with your post Francy but definitely this bit in bold! I never thought anyone was entitled to the SE, I just got the impression from watching the show that they had a tremendous regard for the SL and that if they wanted to end JP's story, they would end it this way, but not for a group of fans - and no disrespect to you fantastic people, I love that the torch is burning bright on this SL but I don't think it would sway them to such a degree, unless they were already planning that ending themselves. ![]() ) post about it on that ugly 'Get over McDean' thread a while back when a poster spoke about how unfair it was to put pressure on the actors and producers to get the SE! I simply said more or less what you said: that a group of fans couldn't force their hand in that way UNLESS it was in their best interests to do the SL that way. Stating the obvious? Well apparently it needed to be said!
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#110 |
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erm, what?!!!
this thread goes through quiet periods and busy periods all the time, much like other threads....don't think the posters are huddled away somewhere else panicking about the news!! I now have to head off but don't think it is because of panic!!! ![]() |
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#111 |
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good morning MS, how are we today? Kind of, had to pack it in early last night, and it is quite muggy in these parts! MEH! I see that many of us seem to agree on the "love at first sight" tip. one big fat reply to get me day started! Quote:
Oh Marrow why must you make me argue with you?
![]() I can't agree with you re JP's expectations about Craig. No, he's not expecting anything from Craig right now, but what I meant was: what will he expect from Craig BEFORE he gets back with him? You surely agree that he'll need something before he'll let himself go there again. I think that's a HUGE thing Marrow given what I see as JP's new 'rule' about relationships. If Craig's the one, the experience with Craig the factor that's given rise to the way he seems to have developed a tick list in his head about what he now expects from relationships then I do think we HAVE to see him tackle Craig on this same basis. That's what's interesting to me because we'll either see him throw it away soon as he clocks on that Craig's still interested or we'll see him struggle with it, hold out until he's absolutely f***ing sure! I favour the latter scenario myself... (in the sense that I think that's what they'll go with) I see what you mean about having to buy cool confident JP or else the SL falls apart LOL Well I absolutely don't want to go into it all but my point is that I DO buy that cool confident JP - that's the point - he's absolutely genuine. What I get though is that it DOESN'T apply to his romantic life - that is the point, that's what I see and why I say he has issues in this arena and why I also say people are bamboozled by that confident guy. We all know that confidence doesn't extend to EVERY area of one's life and some of the most confident and sorted people are disasters when it comes to their love lives! Since it's all to do with the way I read the text it's a perspective thing innit and no-one else is required to share it. What it does though is obviously slant my perception of this guy in a different direction and thus I'll read events differently, based on this ...slanted...perspective ![]() Okay so I see JP as pretty clueless when it comes to the romantic side of things - he doesn't have a clue with girls - or boys - and why the hell not! I mean yeah we find out he's gay, but why before now has he not pursued girls? You yourself said that he too was startled by the fact that he was developing feelings for another boy - taken aback by the fact that he seemed to be that way inclined. I know that everyone develops at different rates, but I do think that his very obvious lack of experience with both sex and girls in general tells me something interesting about him - and not just that he's gay and still in the closet. too long and complex for now, but family for me as always plays a role. I don't understand why you think that the fact that he's the favoured one, the apple of mum's eye, the adored little brother doesn't factor into what I'm saying. It doesn't change anything since I'm not talking about him not feeling worthy in terms of who he is - as a person - BUT and it's an enormous BUT - if all you SEE is a certain pattern of romantic relationships during your formative years and you yourself have no means to 'test' yourself in a way, possibly break the pattern since you're hopeless with girls and haven't yet come to terms with your sexuality then the... template...remains...unchallenged, the 'pattern' unbroken. And Marrow, we have no way of knowing how hard Myra fell for her men. How do we know that JP hasn't seen this deep falling in love many times before? How do we know that THIS isn't what he thinks love is - because his mother fell head over heels in love with ALL of them? You think that the thing with Craig was this startling, startling one off thing that took him completely off guard, changed him and I agree absolutely, but I also have no reason to believe that this isn't what he KNOWS, what he expects and why it means so much to him because that is the template for love he's used to. Now if we keep going in this direction then we can only guess at the behaviour his mum displayed 'in love' with her men - behaviour little JP saw, internalised etc etc. Oh gosh you know what? I just cannot be arsed... ![]() ![]() ![]() Let's just say that that reading of JP and JPC is there in the text for me and in lots of ways makes sense of JP's behaviour both during JPC and NOW! ![]() ![]() well, if Elliot is being brought into the mix to bridge the gap between JP and Sarah, the result being JP/Sarah have a big old fashioned row, and Sarah mentions how Craig chose JP not only once, but twice. I think that would already get the ball rolling as far as JP ditching his "rules of romantic engagement". That revelation would throw everything JP thought from Airport-onward into question. So, in that I'd say already JP's "Craig is straight" perception would be sharply altered in such a way that he'd be much, much more receptive of Craig's romantic advances. I'm totally of the mind that Craig will go through a self-imposed "wooing JP process" in which he'll aim to win JP over, on dif. terms. In light of their past relationship... now, this all hinges on that Sarah dealio coming off. lmao But tbt, I never took JP's "rules" all that serious anyway, seeing as JP/FK aren't exactly "out and proud", eh? Also, though time has gone by- I'm reminded that all it took was a kiss to wipe the slate clean with regard to the footie-practice-fight for JP. So, when it comes to Craig, I really do believe all bets are off as far as JP's concerned. JP's really unpredictable in a predictable way when it comes to Craig.oh, and Dee! John Paul IS cool and confident when he's in a relationship he genuinely WANTS to be in. We saw cool/confident JP in McDean all the time, most of the time, actually. But that was our only taste of JP in a relationship he wanted to be in, with no ulterior motives whatsoever. To use JP's "relationship" with Hannah, or Kieron as anything but throwaway distractions from the way JP felt/feels about Craig is a laugh to me ( ). JP was also pretty cool and confident with Spike, but again, I see that mostly as rebound driven and experimentation. So, new territory and all that. are you sensing a pattern emerging that I seem to attribute most every move JP's made since he fell for Craig as in-love-with-Craig-driven? Ahahahaha! familial influence, and all that is a given in any/all relationships especially when McQueen is your last name! But (there is ALWAYS a but, eh Dee?) at the same time Dee JP/Craig being a male|male relationship, I'm cautious to attribute JP's approach towards Craig to any sort of familial conditioning, or what he "learned" from watching his mum's romantic exploits on the notion that all relationships are NOT created equal, especially when it's male|male - something you've NEVER seen before, let alone experienced - and it even veers from the "norm" in THAT respect. You see, Dee I had always thought JP came into McDean with a somewhat "blank canvas" as far as approach and experience went because it was something our JP had never "experienced" either as a bystander or participant, so it was on another level: feelings wise and relationship wise. That's why JP sought the "aid" of gay magazines when he was dating Spike. I don't think that was a one-off thing, I think that was JP's general outlook on homosexual relationships- he knew NOTHING. Now, I can totally see your point, and I'm not even attempting to convince you otherwise; I even agree with you as far as JP's view of heterosexual relationships go, but when it comes to JP's homosexual relationships and where/what JP draws from I find that JP doesn't meet them with any sort of "witnessed" template in mind. Does that make sense? <3 Dee! |
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#112 |
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I never really wanted Kieron to die since I thought it would cause far more problems than it would solve.
As for whether a petition with a few thousand names on it would result in Kieron not being killed off, I find that a wee bit hard to believe. When it gets down to it, it's all business--and the only thing that I think would really motivate the producers of a show to suddenly switch direction is if a particular storyline resulted in an influx of new viewers--but that's not been the case for Hollyoaks--it looks like it's still getting about 2 millions combined between the E4 and C4 showings (which is definitely not an increase over last summer). As for whether or not James (and thus John Paul) should have left last September, it's all a moot point. James had a contract that he had to fulfill. Guy could have chosen to renew last year for a longer contract but didn't (a fact I have absolutely no problem with--he'd done something for 5 years and wanted to try something else). There's nothing that could be done about the fact that Craig had to be written out of the show while John Paul had to stay. While we can debate whether the ending was the right one, Hollyoaks being a soap, they kind of had to leave the door open for John Paul to pursue other relationships. That said, I think there's probably a much greater likelihood that Kieron will still be in the village come Autumn than John Paul will be . . . |
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#113 |
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good morning MS, how are we today? Kind of, had to pack it in early last night, and it is quite muggy in these parts! MEH! I see that many of us seem to agree on the "love at first sight" tip.
one big fat reply to get me day started! mmm, talk dirty to me s'more, Dee! ![]() ![]() well, if Elliot is being brought into the mix to bridge the gap between JP and Sarah, the result being JP/Sarah have a big old fashioned row, and Sarah mentions how Craig chose JP not only once, but twice. I think that would already get the ball rolling as far as JP ditching his "rules of romantic engagement". That revelation would throw everything JP thought from Airport-onward into question. So, in that I'd say already JP's "Craig is straight" perception would be sharply altered in such a way that he'd be much, much more receptive of Craig's romantic advances. I'm totally of the mind that Craig will go through a self-imposed "wooing JP process" in which he'll aim to win JP over, on dif. terms. In light of their past relationship... now, this all hinges on that Sarah dealio coming off. lmao But tbt, I never took JP's "rules" all that serious anyway, seeing as JP/FK aren't exactly "out and proud", eh? Also, though time has gone by- I'm reminded that all it took was a kiss to wipe the slate clean with regard to the footie-practice-fight for JP. So, when it comes to Craig, I really do believe all bets are off as far as JP's concerned. JP's really unpredictable in a predictable way when it comes to Craig.oh, and Dee! John Paul IS cool and confident when he's in a relationship he genuinely WANTS to be in. We saw cool/confident JP in McDean all the time, most of the time, actually. But that was our only taste of JP in a relationship he wanted to be in, with no ulterior motives whatsoever. To use JP's "relationship" with Hannah, or Kieron as anything but throwaway distractions from the way JP felt/feels about Craig is a laugh to me ( ). JP was also pretty cool and confident with Spike, but again, I see that mostly as rebound driven and experimentation. So, new territory and all that. are you sensing a pattern emerging that I seem to attribute most every move JP's made since he fell for Craig as in-love-with-Craig-driven? Ahahahaha! familial influence, and all that is a given in any/all relationships especially when McQueen is your last name! But (there is ALWAYS a but, eh Dee?) at the same time Dee JP/Craig being a male|male relationship, I'm cautious to attribute JP's approach towards Craig to any sort of familial conditioning, or what he "learned" from watching his mum's romantic exploits on the notion that all relationships are NOT created equal, especially when it's male|male - something you've NEVER seen before, let alone experienced - and it even veers from the "norm" in THAT respect. You see, Dee I had always thought JP came into McDean with a somewhat "blank canvas" as far as approach and experience went because it was something our JP had never "experienced" either as a bystander or participant, so it was on another level: feelings wise and relationship wise. That's why JP sought the "aid" of gay magazines when he was dating Spike. I don't think that was a one-off thing, I think that was JP's general outlook on homosexual relationships- he knew NOTHING. Now, I can totally see your point, and I'm not even attempting to convince you otherwise; I even agree with you as far as JP's view of heterosexual relationships go, but when it comes to JP's homosexual relationships and where/what JP draws from I find that JP doesn't meet them with any sort of "witnessed" template in mind. Does that make sense? <3 Dee! ![]() The entire point, marrow, and one we're probably not going to agree on is that JP acts exactly like one half of a het couple - as illustrated with Kieron in yesterday's ep. I have no reason to think he wouldn't be the same with Craig - you might see my later post on that. We just have very different perceptions of this character - in this particular sense anyway - and I personally think that you separate JP too much from the family - in lots of ways. I tend to see him very much entwined, part and parcel even when it's not obvious! I just cannot seem to explain what I mean about JP not being cool and confident in relationships and how the relationship with Hannah tells us more than you seem to think so I'll not even bother LOL BUT I will say that I DON'T agree with you about JP's view of homosexual relationships at all!!!!!!! I am in stitches cos we're both so argumentative on this one little thing - that cannot be proved one way or another! What are we like??? |
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#114 |
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Anyone who thinks an online petition saved a character from being knocked off is deluding themselves (I just read the thread)
Apart from anything else, anyone can sign an online petition with a lot of false names. I find it very hard to believe 1,000 people signed it, and I'm sure HO is awarre it's probably a few dozen people at the most. But as someone said, making them think they persuaded the writers to change a storyline planned a year ago, is a very clever way of keeping people sweet!
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#115 |
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Greetings, what have i missed?
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#116 |
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It's an obvious thing to mention, of course, but I was thinking it probably sums up this priest, that he knows he is breaking God's laws with gay abandon (ha!) but more than that, he clearly has no guilt about the fact he is shagging someone named after a pope! He must surely be reminded of that every time JP's name is mentioned. John Paul is not exactly an everyday name.
Or, who knows, he's weird enough, maybe it turns him on! How different to Craig's reaction, when Sarah was reading out loud from her book about the joys of Dublin to come, to a not particularly interested Craig, but he let her witter on while he was cleaning the boat .... until she mentioned how many people had turned up on one occasion to meet 'Pope John Paul' and the moment the name 'John Paul' was mentioned, Craig's manner changeed completely. He looked very uncomfortable - and when she added that their John Paul would love to have that many people turn up to see HIM ... he told her to shut the hell up and stop going on about Dublin! lol! ![]() Not the same kind of situation of course, but the mention of John Paul touched a nerve for Craig, the knowledge that John Paul was the name of one of his popes does nothing to the priest. That says a lot about his 'conscience'. ![]() Quote:
Just watched the ep!
Must say I didn't feel the unalloyed disgust for Kieron I expected to. What upsets me is the fact that the affair continues; that he and John Paul continue to make a mockery of her! Kieron is a spineless excuse for a human being because the minute he heard her say those things about herself, about her kids it should have made him have a severe attack of conscience and simply resolve to end it with John Paul. I don't know how a person with even an ounce of humanity within couldn't NOT do that. That he's also a Priest simply beggars belief! John Paul - what can I say? All the stuff he should have been doing when he was having an affair with Craig seems to have come for a visit now, clamouring for a second chance to turn him into a thoughtless, self-centred little toe rag! But his attitude didn't trouble me as much as it did the other day when he was shouting the odds and acting like a knob all round. This time he came across as a bratty teen, acting the big man cos he's just discovered he's got a dick and knows how to use it The contrasts between the JP now and the JP with Craig couldn't be any clearer. JP and Kieron know they're doing wrong - it's stark on both their faces during the Niall convos; Kieron during the convo with Myra. I love Kieron's face when Myra says something about having his hands full with the McQueen family.. Kieron's 'I love him' to Niall's query about taking the risk was beyond pathetic, truly, and couldn't have sounded any more like Craig during ILY when he says of Sarah: I love her, she's my girlfriend - said with no conviction whatever, like an empty mantra. I see Kieron's words in much the same way. He has to say that, believe that otherwise how on earth does he justify his behaviour? But I think he's starting to understand somewhere deep inside John Paul's 'worth it' comment; starting to understand just when something might just not BE worth it. Niall broke my heart... So did Myra. Quote:
Rather!
I cannot wait to see JP and Fk living together - in Niall's flat! How disastrous will that be! And oh my god if Craig does return during this phase of the JP/K relationship! Ooo JP I just do not know what you're gonna do with yourself! ![]() ![]()
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#117 |
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I feel miles behind everyone else! is it true they aren't killing off FK?! GOOD! Then when JP chooses Craig...HA!
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#118 |
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tbh as well this thread has gone very quite now , since this announcement , normally at this time it would be buzzin, folk are more worried by this news than they are letting on ,!!!! mcdeaners will know what i mean , we have kicked in the teeth sooo many times ,. we bounce back only for BK and HO to kick us again, when that has happened to you for over 9 months yes , it all becomes bigger than it should and yes it is only a soap fot christ sake, but all out loyalty to HO , BK ,
Mcdean Guy and James , never get rewarded at all, only with little snippets and nods and winks, the aww shippers now get leaks from Lime, and announcements on this morning , jesus , how sad am i to let myself be bothered, by this BK and Ho dont care, so why should we, i just wish he would put us out of our misery and have the curteousy, to tell us before we are all gone ![]() We can handle I wont be giving up anytime soon and am still as confident as ever that JP will leave with Craig, it cant happen any other way and it wont.....
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#119 |
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You have to hand it to Lime , more clever PR .They know that this week all the evidence has pointed to McPriestDoom and to McDean SE - from BK's interview , James's " ends badly" and the background of the murder of Fr K .
So what do they do - they leak to a soap journo - that they have changed their mind following a petition . Hysterically funny . As if a storyline planned way in advance would be changed on a petition of a few hundred out of an audience of 2 million ? They must think we are suckers to fall for this . I would not rule out Father K dying still . I think more likely they have decided as Gem suggested earlier to go for the soap cliche of soap cliches the love triangle -which will end up in an SE but that the audience will be meant to think it could end up with a JP/K ending - they are manipulating the audience in a pretty crude and obvious way IMO. |
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#120 |
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Agree with the first bit re Craig - to a certain extent - but you are not going to shake me on the 'template bit' especially after seeing yesterday's ep!
![]() The entire point, marrow, and one we're probably not going to agree on is that JP acts exactly like one half of a het couple - as illustrated with Kieron in yesterday's ep. I have no reason to think he wouldn't be the same with Craig - you might see my later post on that. We just have very different perceptions of this character - in this particular sense anyway - and I personally think that you separate JP too much from the family - in lots of ways. I tend to see him very much entwined, part and parcel even when it's not obvious! I just cannot seem to explain what I mean about JP not being cool and confident in relationships and how the relationship with Hannah tells us more than you seem to think so I'll not even bother LOL BUT I will say that I DON'T agree with you about JP's view of homosexual relationships at all!!!!!!! I am in stitches cos we're both so argumentative on this one little thing - that cannot be proved one way or another! What are we like??? first bold, no, no I do agree with you that JP's filling a "role" in the JP/FK relationship, totally. JP is playing a PART. I don't think that's genuinely JP in any way shape or form, tbt. BUT I digress! ![]() second bold I KNOW! <3 Dee! ![]() Quote:
I feel miles behind everyone else! is it true they aren't killing off FK?! GOOD! Then when JP chooses Craig...HA!
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#121 |
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All i can say is: BRING ON THE SE!!!
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#122 |
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Join Date: Jun 2006
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I'd like to see the smile wiped off FK's face...which it will be...as soon as Craig returns!
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#123 |
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Join Date: Oct 2007
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Hi, can I just say, I have NO idea what's gonna happen to "Father" Kieron...and I kind of love it!! lol, and I make it a personal mission to avoid surprises (even prezzies - can't stand not knowing
) but I love the fact that this could go any way (expect JPC SE, coz, you know, blatant ). I agree it's better if Kieron doesn't die because of the guilt JP would feel, but it would have made great viewing, if only to see Niall's evil face again! After reading some fab posts here, I think it's a possibility (if Kieron's fate has indeed been altered by viewers) that HO decided to keep him alive, not to live happily ever after with JP ( ?! would be such a waste of a FAB character/actor.thoughts of a random, if you're interested Emma x
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#124 |
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Loving your thoughts Emma!
Think you could be on to something with Niall too..it would be an awful waste to lose him! He's one of my favourite actors in HO - and i love his character! |
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#125 |
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Join Date: Apr 2008
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I honestly don't get this.
Kieron being killed off was ALWAYS a rumour, or am I wrong? I don't remember many people on this thread saying they knew for certain he was going to be killed off, in fact most said they didn't know, so how come you are so certain that they have changed their minds on something that just seemed to be a rumour anyway? Quote:
Hi, can I just say, I have NO idea what's gonna happen to "Father" Kieron...and I kind of love it!! lol, and I make it a personal mission to avoid surprises (even prezzies - can't stand not knowing
) but I love the fact that this could go any way (expect JPC SE, coz, you know, blatant ). I agree it's better if Kieron doesn't die because of the guilt JP would feel, but it would have made great viewing, if only to see Niall's evil face again! After reading some fab posts here, I think it's a possibility (if Kieron's fate has indeed been altered by viewers) that HO decided to keep him alive, not to live happily ever after with JP ( ?! would be such a waste of a FAB character/actor.thoughts of a random, if you're interested Emma x![]() i gotta go, go, go. But I'll be back by the time today's HO episode has concluded! Woohoo, we get the comedic stylings of JP/Elliot! I fully expect to see more chemistry between the "fake" couple than the "real".
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) post about it on that ugly 'Get over McDean' thread a while back when a poster spoke about how unfair it was to put pressure on the actors and producers to get the SE! I simply said more or less what you said: that a group of fans couldn't force their hand in that way UNLESS it was in their best interests to do the SL that way. Stating the obvious? Well apparently it needed to be said!
I wont be giving up anytime soon and am still as confident as ever that JP will leave with Craig, it cant happen any other way and it wont.....

