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Grumpy Len's '8' for Rachel's AS ........
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reginald1981
16-12-2008
For me...

Rachel was marked right.

Lisa was dramatically overmarked.

Tom was slightly undermarked.

....and the judges with Len in particulary had odd marking.
workshylady
16-12-2008
Rachel and Vincents AT was great, but it didn't have much story in the dance. Some very impressive lifts and steps though. I also don't think they could match the chemistry of Mark and Karen which is quite a rare thing to come by. It's not exactly something you can learn!
Yasmin26
16-12-2008
Originally Posted by workshylady:
“Rachel and Vincents AT was great, but it didn't have much story in the dance. Some very impressive lifts and steps though. I also don't think they could match the chemistry of Mark and Karen which is quite a rare thing to come by. It's not exactly something you can learn!”

Absolutely.
Sid_1979
16-12-2008
Originally Posted by Yasmin26:
“ILoved Mark and Karen.”

They had a rare chemistry, They brought out the best in one another
gorlagon
16-12-2008
I think everyone's overmarked every week, but I think the leaderboard should have read: Rachel, Lisa, Tom.
beauty-1
16-12-2008
Mark and Karen were good. I did love their argentine Tango too. Mark and Karen had raw sexual chemisrty and Mark was sexy, masterful. Rachel and Vicent had good chemisrty too in their AT, just a bit more under the surface if I'm making any sense.
Yasmin26
16-12-2008
Originally Posted by Sid_1979:
“They had a rare chemistry, They brought out the best in one another ”

They sure did.

Originally Posted by beauty-1:
“Mark and Karen were good. I did love their argentine Tango too. Mark and Karen had raw sexual chemisrty and Mark was sexy, masterful. Rachel and Vicent had good chemisrty too in their AT, just a bit more under the surface if I'm making any sense.”

It makes sense to me.
uptowngirl
16-12-2008
Gonna give up on this one, as I can see when I'm not getting through. Good luck to everyone on Saturday. I'll be voting for Lisa because, for me, she's the best at ballroom, the most improved from the beginning of the series and the most fun to watch. If she is knocked out first, I'll switch my votes to Rachel because she's an all-round better dancer than Tom (and I love Vincent)
CaptainSensible
16-12-2008
I can see why someone might vote for Lisa (and Brendan); I just think she was overmarked by a couple of points last Saturday.
pickledgherkin
16-12-2008
Originally Posted by Master Aquarius:
“caused the all the problems on Saturday. If he hadn't been so tetchy (should have given at least a '9' IMHO) then the scores would not have been tied. ”

I don't think tetchiness has anything to do with it on this occasion. He genuinely felt that a Foxtrot themed American Smooth should have had more foxtrot in it = but he did say he liked the performance and 8 is hardly a bad score. I thought it was amazing dance but I am not a ballroom expert, though I know something about ballroom. Anyway the overall scores all balanced out, Rachel and Lisa were top of the leaderboard after all.
alexgr
16-12-2008
I was with Len on her AS, it didn't have the so called 'Hollywood' that the judges are looking for and it was quite boring. However, I do think Lisa only deserved an 8 for her QS also.
Psychosis
16-12-2008
Originally Posted by Yasmin26:
“Thank you. I thought I was the only one in love with this dance. Didn't you love the song choice.

But I still love the beautiful Waltz the best.”

I thought the song choice was going to be cringeworthy but it worked well.
Tissy
16-12-2008
Originally Posted by gorlagon:
“I think everyone's overmarked every week, but I think the leaderboard should have read: Rachel, Lisa, Tom.”

The judges would have never allowed that to happen because then it would mean having to vote off either Lisa or Rachel if the stories going around about the public vote are true!


Would love to have seen Bruno`s reaction though it if did
Sid_1979
16-12-2008
Originally Posted by beauty-1:
“Rachel and Vicent had good chemisrty too in their AT, just a bit more under the surface if I'm making any sense.”

You're making perfect sense

It was simmering underneath, teasing us, and that's the way I like it.
CaptainSensible
16-12-2008
Originally Posted by Tissy:
“The judges would have never allowed that to happen because then it would mean having to vote off either Lisa or Rachel if the stories going around about the public vote are true!”

Only if Lisa was more popular than Rachel, but that would not surprise me.
beauty-1
16-12-2008
Originally Posted by Sid_1979:
“You're making perfect sense

It was simmering underneath, teasing us, and that's the way it should be.”

I think Rachel's fiance noticed it too. He generally looks quite miserable, it can't be easy to see such genuine closeness and chemistry between Rachel and Vincent. I don't know how the partners do it, I would be wildly jealous.
Sid_1979
16-12-2008
Originally Posted by beauty-1:
“I think Rachel's fiance noticed it too. He generally looks quite miserable, it can't be easy to see such genuine closeness and chemistry between Rachel and Vincent. I don't know how the partners do it, I would be wildly jealous.”

lol It's funny you should say that, as I get the impression the fiance is quite comfortable about it all. He knows it's just plutonic and appreciates that they are merely in character - however convincing they are.

Vincent doesn't strike me as Rachel's type build-wise (she's always gone for taller men). They seem more like brother/sister - very playful with one another, but there's nothing deeper.
WWWombat
16-12-2008
Originally Posted by workshylady:
“Rachel and Vincents AT was great, but it didn't have much story in the dance. Some very impressive lifts and steps though. I also don't think they could match the chemistry of Mark and Karen which is quite a rare thing to come by. It's not exactly something you can learn!”

Our family have acquired an anti-Rachel bias now; we tend to find her performances too wooden, and we dislike the fact that once Vincent found the formula that Rachel can appeal in (the soft, romantic, head draped on shoulder style), he's stuck to it. Their dances now, mostly, come over very samey. And their AS fit into the mould unfortunately... I much preferred their QS-based AS earlier in the series. So in comparison, we loved Lisa's QS.

Their AT suffered a different problem for me - that Vincent out-danced Rachel. As far as I could see, Vincent was the one doing the tricky leg movements and the gauchos. Yes, their legs were doing AT movements, but it always seemed to be that Vincent was putting his leg into a tricky position, and Rachel was taking hers out.

Alongside the wooden performance from the top-half, and a poor choice in music, this brought Rachel's dance right down for us - to match Tom's. Tom had more performance and decent music, but wasn't good on the content - but it felt a better story. Lisa and Brendan then just had a thoroughly engaging performance and dance, with balance between the two... so Lisa won out on that one too.

Don't mention the jive. I said it once, but I think I got away with it...

So, recognising we have the bias, we still think Lisa was best last week.

For next week, I'm hoping we get at least one WOW dance out there. One that grabs you emotionally, and drags you into the story and the music, ala Austin's paso. Twee, soft, romantic numbers may be enough to save people from the dance-off in the middle of the series, but they won't be enough to deserve to win.
Tissy
16-12-2008
Originally Posted by CaptainSensible:
“Only if Lisa was more popular than Rachel, but that would not surprise me.”

But the judges couldn`t take the risk so the drew them equal on the leaderboard
anna123
16-12-2008
i think Rachel was undermarked and Lisa was overmarked.
Here is Aleshas quickstep from the semi final last year.... http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=BOGj11exAB4
now compare it to Lisas semi final quickstep who got two points more then alesha http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=xrHUQ_...e=channel_page

I dont think it deserved more marks then Aleshas effort.
Sid_1979
16-12-2008
Originally Posted by anna123:
“i think Rachel was undermarked and Lisa was overmarked.
Here is Aleshas quickstep from the semi final last year.... http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=BOGj11exAB4
now compare it to Lisas semi final quickstep who got two points more then alesha http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=xrHUQ_...e=channel_page

I dont think it deserved more marks then Aleshas effort.”

It's near-impossible for the judges to compare this year's performances with previous years'.

As it stood, I couldn't fault Lisa's QS. It was no better or worse than Rachel's Foxtrot which also received a string of 10s.

The AT was a whole different story though and just one mark could have made such a big difference to the final!
anna123
16-12-2008
Originally Posted by Sid_1979:
“It's near-impossible for the judges to compare this year's performances with previous years'.

!”

how can you not compare? Its the same dance just done by different people.
I dont see any footwork or gapping problems in Aleshas nor do i see any in Lisas but the fact lisa got two more marks does make me question the overmarking.
Puffle
16-12-2008
Originally Posted by anna123:
“i think Rachel was undermarked and Lisa was overmarked.
Here is Aleshas quickstep from the semi final last year.... http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=BOGj11exAB4
now compare it to Lisas semi final quickstep who got two points more then alesha http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=xrHUQ_...e=channel_page

I dont think it deserved more marks then Aleshas effort.”

Sorry but Lisa's did deserve more than Alesha's effort - for a start Lisa and Brendan went into the dance after an 8 second intro, Alesha spent nearly one third of the time allotted faffing around with the intro on the steps (Alesha spent 25 seconds before actually going into hold and dancing) AND there was plenty of gapping in Alesha's dance which there clearly wasn't in Lisa and Brendans until the end when they justifiably split apart to finish the dance.
Tissy
16-12-2008
Originally Posted by anna123:
“how can you not compare? Its the same dance just done by different people.
I dont see any footwork or gapping problems in Aleshas nor do i see any in Lisas but the fact lisa got two more marks does make me question the overmarking.”

Also there doesn`t seem to be a problem comparing everyone`s jive with Jills
Puffle
16-12-2008
Originally Posted by anna123:
“how can you not compare? Its the same dance just done by different people.
I dont see any footwork or gapping problems in Aleshas nor do i see any in Lisas but the fact lisa got two more marks does make me question the overmarking.”

You can quite clearly see the lights of the stairs or the audience between Alesha and Matt as the go past the Judges on their first pass - Also there is gapping as they go into the charlston steps in the middle of the floor and that's just two instances I can be bothered to point out.
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