OK now that you've said that. What is your opinion on the fact that he used religion as a tool to assist him in winning the game and his 'wad of cash' (ie reading to us in the diary room) why didn't he just read it in private?.

i don't see how he did use it as a tool.

i think he probably does consider himself a christian, goes to church etc, and so probably does like to consider himself *a good person*. in many ways he probably is a good person, but also, there probably is an element of bigotry in his character.

all of this came across during BB.

i don't see what particular devious use he made of religion.

Iain

But Cam did read his Bible in private and apparently he does just that everyday in life and has done so for years. Also he attends a discovery class once a week where they discuss the teachings of the bible.

He did read out from the bible but for someone who thinks it is so important I don't think thats so bad.

I don't know that it was a tool to assist winning. I think it would have put a lot of people off as a matter of fact. Previous winners have been quite different to Cam so why would he assume that reading from his bible would appeal to the type of audience that responded to the excesses of BB3 ? Also, the diary room is a controlled environment so some of the stuff he came out with in there would have been elicited in response to questioning.

did someone mention tea ?

*hopeful*

Just had a look for chief "masher" Grim - she's got the tea on and I have biscuits!
Meanwhile just read all the above, very intersting and I need to think a bit before replying. Hmm..

What I expect to happen regarding Cam’s “ineluctable downfall” is that his manufactured charm and pleasantness cannot be held in check forever, and he will revert to his inexorable and innate darker side (that we saw more than a few glimpses of) as he’s not tenacious or clever enough to conceal his bile from many of us.
What happens when a sanctimonious and hypocritical person like this is then seen to be reading a bible out loud as “instructions” for life makes the cynic in me go “well, what a surprise!” Rather like those that “turn to god” when in prison, shame they didn’t prior to finding themselves in prison is it not? This is where I see what is meant by him using the bible as a tool, or his religious affectations in general. Like everyone was dancing around the CIN thing trying not to offend “as it’s all in a good cause” he played the bible card as a “but how could you knock someone who is trying to be a good christian?” and that is my interpretation of why he did it, in keeping with his pretence of never having done anything more adventurous than riding a bike “no hands”.
He walks like a duck and talks like one and I await the DNA test that reveals he has in fact escaped from the Park duck pond!

*hands out tea* did someone mention biccies? give!

Cor ta for the tea ----- c|_|
You're in luck - I have choccy chip cookies!!

yes - but how do you expect this to manifest itself, in any significant way, that will be in some way newsworthy in its magnitude that will be his *downfall*, or will he just generally not achieve people's lofty expectations of him being such a thoroughly nice guy [b]all['/B] the time, ie human, just like the rest of us?

Iain

No, not as a human, but as this "Really pleasant chap as Winner of BB and a christian" pedastal he is exulting in and as that is a pretend persona eventually his true self will manifest itself via either his temper, bigotry, homophobia or another example like his Asylum seekers one.
He's human life Iain, but not as we know it!

But you seem to think that now that Cam has gone back to real life his inexorable and innate darker side is going to come to the fore.

The reality is that he has the necessary people skills to make him a successful business man and he has many friends , some of whom date back as far as school and university (such as his friends in Chicago and Burundi) so in real life the people he deals with don't seem to see him as having some kind of split personality and an offputing darker side.

I expect that when he can make more money going back to work than he currently does from his p.a.s he'll just go back to work and we won't hear much about him again.


ps thanks for the tea Grim ....mmm choccy chips , my faves!

Disnae' there's the rub.
As you say, he does all that in "real life" and would have us all believe in the BB house that he'd never strayed further than the Orkney Isle Newsagents and all that eye-rolling stupefaction at the most prosaic of things made us think what a pretence he was putting up. It's the hypocrisy, the pretence of being naive to viewers in/of the house but actually being a lot more worldly-wise.
Best example for me was his reaction to the S Africa trip which was supposed to make one think:

a) He's never been abroad before
b) Like he'd never been in an aeroplane! Och! Mental!
c) Like he'd never been to S Africa before!
He went right OTT about it, but it was a busman's holiday.

Its that duplicity I could not stomach.

(Have another biccy! I brought loads!)

And that's where C4's selective editing came in. C4 viewers never got to see his nastiness towards Lisa and Jon - those late-night bitching sessions he would happily instigate. Jade and Adele were at least presented "warts and all".


No, I do understand. It is your assumption that he was a "victim" of some of the editing that is utterly ridiculous.

*turns off light and closes door*

Sorry I've had enough of this thread now, I'll leave you folks to it someone else will have to make the tea from now on

Indeed. His speech on gay marriages - only repeating what's in the Bible (ho hum) - finally saw him really put on the spot for the first time. Oh yes, and we had Steph as well ignorantly pontificating about the death penalty ("just a lethal injection").

This is the sort of thing that should happen in the first week not the ninth.

Yes. The mask has slipped a little. Take a look at his article on Britain's immigration policy for starters - those people who voted for him should really be ashamed for supporting such a vile reactionary bigot.

This is interesting, this editting business.
Lots of us sat around a chat room during BB4 and we had Channel 4 on showing BB and also those with E4 would let everyone else know what was going on after/during the televised Channel 4 offerings. What a difference!!
Basically wacthing the "live" stuff on C4 would have told those who only saw the editted programmes something was amiss with Camoron's behaviour.
It was so obvious that editting was in Cam's favour that many of us all knew he'd be picked for that trip (easy to manufacture) well in advance.
Also the 2 weeks off being nominated made us all whince - that was so blatant they wanted him to win we could only gasp at the audacity of the producers!

Yes. The rampant cynicism and prefabrication present in both BB3 and 4 was nauseating. I remember watching the many stays of execution for Jade - Adele being edited in a bad light during the week they were both up for eviction and then PJ and Kate up for the chop for seeing a message from their families - and thought "this is not what BB is all about".

Then again, after the machinations of Nick in BB1 and Helen and Paul's relationship in BB2 proved so popular, BB happily abandoned its more serious psychological/anthropological roots and embraced an aesthetic more akin to soap opera.

Of course, Ms. Goody was box office gold - that's why they chose her. Both she and to a lesser extent Tim were completely set up by the producers.

Same with BB4. The popularity of Jon was the only genuine thing in that show. Stout was propped up by his "storyline" potential (personal journey etc.) and how interesting it was to note how desperately the producers tried to capitalise on the closeness of Nush and Scott in those final few weeks.

I fully accept that Stout is just human. I just happen to think he is one of the most unpleasant people ever to darken the door of the BB house.

then he shouldn't have mentioned his business trips to Japan or told them about a train journey in Morocco involving chickens or about how he went to school in Norway when he was 15, or about his trips to Puerto Rico and South America then...those sound like the sort of things that would certainly have blown that cover.

Iain

this isn't about C4 editing.

this about people on the one hand accusing Cameron of being dishonest and on the other criticising him for things he says or does that suggest he was being, if nothing else, entirely honest.

you can criticise him for one or the other - but not both.

surely?

Iain

The whole point about BB is voyeurism, but there is nevertheless a line to be drawn about what is appropriate content and what is not.

You can argue that bullying is normal forever, but that does not make it acceptable behaviour.

The business of "keeping Jade in" was where myself and actually voting for this farce parted company. They altered the rules to allow her to stay, it was a "get rid of Adele now, Jade's bound to go next week" but how that didn't happen!
The attempt to manufacture the Nush/Scott thing was hilarious in it's ineptitude including the printed media! Also Davina's futile attempts to draw both parties on something that only lived inside a producer's head!
Yes, we have come a very long way from BB1, because as well as it being the nearest to it's ostensible purpose it was the only BB where I was bothered who actually won, and even then that wasn't the best part of it at all for me.
Subsequently, who cares who wins? Or in fact, what they do?
That this year was a farce is typified by who "won" it.

thats the thing - *real life* doesn't seem to count.


you don't think far darker and more sinister events are likely?

Iain

What pleasant behaviour.

From your description, I feel rather sorry for your colleague. Annoying she might have been, but she probably deserves better than to work with - what sounds like - a bunch of superior, self-satisfied tossers.

Oh, does your boss know you spend so much company time posting on message boards? Perhaps he/she should be informed...

That's exactly what it's about. The C4 broadcasts were the main medium for the presentation of the housemates for many viewers.

Don't be so obtuse.