Any indication Bob on what features are currently being worked on for implementation, and a time when we could expect to see them / hear more about them?

Paddy

Actually the concept of open source development works rather well, often producing far more stable (and feature rich) results than proprietary code.

Not quite sure what you mean?, unless it's hand assembling the code?.

Paddy,

If I told you then everyone would know and then it wouldn't be a surprise. The surprise is essential because otherwise we loose a competitive edge.

Open source development isn't entirely off my mind for some products, however it is a very difficult business to be in and can be difficult to build a business case on.

Bob

That's interesting ... any CE examples..

Spelling mistake aside , you can tell me in PM!

I won't tell a soul, honest! And that way no-one knows and you don't lose any competitiveness!

Just joking about, I don't expect to hear anything, but am quite excited as to what improvements to the system you guys have planned. From what I have seen and read the Foxsat HDR's are wonderful pieces of kit but I would like to see some new features introduced, (which are already been talked about by myself and others in other threads), before I would commit to purchase one. And I *really* want to purchase one!

Paddy

Seeing as Humax software is built from Open Source software (busybox, linux kernel, etc) then they're already in the Open Source business

Cross-Compiling - the Broadcom chip is based on the MIPS32 which GCC will cross-compile. Its the rest of the chipset - DSP, graphics, etc that will cause more problems

Playing the files externally - VLC (personally I use the PortableApps version) http://portableapps.com/apps/music_video/vlc_portable after copying the files onto my web server at home.

My hope would be that the Foxsat-HDR has its own httpd (already built into busybox) and have a few cgi scripts to generate the pages containing the programs and an icon from the images so I don't need to copy them off the box onto another box so I can watch them while the wife is watching CSI (again).

An example of what the Open Source community can do is OpenWRT - take a standard (Broadcom chip based) Linksys WRT wireless router which was based on Linux and then create a more functional box - better VPN intergration, Mesh networking, etc. and is now available on a much wider range of hardware.

The foxsat-hdr is a fantastic box. I just want the software to push the hardware to do the best possible.

I've now got cross-compiler, kernel code, other bits of code.

I now just need the wife to be out long enough for me to brick the box

stiggle,

Perhaps the time has come to treat the wife to a couple of days at a health spa. That should give you plenty of time to turn the box into a door stop

We look forward to the reults

Nick

Or just send her in the kitchen to make a cup of tea, that should be long enough to trash it

In fact,

What's she doing out of the kitchen in the first place!!

"Look luv, it's a gadget! You wouldn't understand anyway!"

Nick

Anyone can use Linux as the base OS and release products which run on it without having to open source the applications (assuming they are all their own work).

The only things Humax would be required to make the source code available to are modifications to existing GPL'd code.

Yes quite. They have to release all GPL code.

Noones expecting them to release their interface that they've stuck on the top. It's just interesting to see the changes made to the kernel and busybox etc.

If the code is GPL, or based on GPL, then that code has to be released to their customers (you don't have to release GPL code to non-customers). So if you haven't got a Foxsat-HDR box, then you have no claim to the code they use in the box.

I'm looking at getting myself another box which I can risk bricking so I can then leave the wife and her CSI/NCIS box

Got some code compiled (just some little utils), now I just need to get them run on the box.

The wife is out all day tomorrow, so I should get some time to play and a second box should be arriving beginning of the week.

How did this ^ go stiggle?

Didn't get as much time as I'd have liked - had a quick poke about with the UI, simple things like seeing if when you changed a name to "name ; busybox httpd" and a couple of other things.

What are you thinking of doing? Could this be like TAPS user-written applications on the Topfield freeview box?

It would be a major undertaking with a lot of hacking to get anything approaching that onto a system without any existing mechanism.

With no UI to load applications, for example, even just getting them in there is going to be hard. If there's no access to a command line, for example, how do you even begin to get in there?

The answer is that it's a lot of brute force - trying to rename a file and see if, perhaps, the browser for media files is slack enough to be fooled by a semicolon into not just playing a media file, but actually loading a Linux executable (assuming you get the name right, and it's in the path). And that, even though we know the network code isn't all 100% yet, you can actually then gain access to the box.

If you can't find a way to do that, then you're probably a bit stuck; unless you start unpacking firmware images, and you really enjoy MIPS assembler.

And even when you do manage all that, you may not have the right libraries against which to link anything you try to build yourself.

Not something for the casual tinkerer, I suspect. TAPS work because the manufacturer supports and API, and provides helpful things like a file browser to launch the applications, as well as a library to link against.

As it stands a box like the HDR is a long way away from having any of those things. Don't go holding your breath - blue's not your colour.

Ha ha--nice one.

But thanks for the detailed reply, which leads to my supplementary question: What can realistically be expected in terms of a benefit in obtaining the GPLd source code? Anything at all?

At the moment - knowing the version of the uclibc installed and seeing if they have more recent version of the stb linux kernel that I have (2.6.12 from Sony & Sharp - also using the BCM7403 chip)

Not sure why you would think MIPS assembly is needed seeing as most people these days use cross-compiled C.

Do we know the network code isn't all there? It picks up DHCP and gives it an address - so thats enough of the network stack to get stuff running over it. The included busybox includes almost all the utils you'll want, so no need to compile anything just yet, a few shell cgi scripts would be able to do enough over a httpd. But there is a cross-compiler available and a nice set of tools to build a full system if thats what you really want to do.

I meant that if you can't actually get into the box via the network or serial port, then digging around with MIPS assembly code, and patching firmware images is the 'traditional' way to go about tweaking firmwares - which some Topfield users also go in for; rather laborious but lots of fun, if you like that sort of thing.

As for the network code, there have been some reports that while it grabs an IP address via DHCP, it doesn't set all the other options correctly. I'd have to hunt around the forums to find out which ones it was getting wrong; hopefully nothing crucial...

So assuming you can get into the box, what might that mean in terms of practical benefit? Would it still be massively more difficult to programme than TAPs?

I'm not living for the moment that the Humax equivalent of MyStuff (an all-singing EPG extension) is released; I don't even have one of these boxes. I'm just interested to know what might be possible in this case starting from gpl'd software.

It looks like those German iCORD owners have patched their firmware to run Linux services (FTP/SAMBA/Web) on the box.

The interesting thing, is that there's Telnet and SSH services enabled so you can get on the box and have a poke around...

I wonder if anyone is smart enough or brave enough to get this patch working on the HDR..?

See here: http://www.icordforum.com/index.php?...&threadID=6035

Or here for a translation: http://www.hummy.org.uk/forums/showp...0&postcount=15

Shame they didn't notice that the request was for the Foxsat-HDR, not the iCord - or that when I had spoken with their Helpdesk staff back in August the manager stated that they didn't need to provide the code as the end user was unable to change the software on the box.


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Also, you can find the codes by clicking the below link.



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