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Can somebody make me a "clash detector"? |
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#1 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: London postcode
Posts: 347
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Can somebody make me a "clash detector"?
Does anybody please know of a simple way to work out in advance what programme I can still watch while recording two others? I've seen the list of what channels are configured for each of the possible LNB configurations, but it's a real pain working it out in advance, and equally painful when the Foxsat comes up with the 'clash' window and you've got about ten seconds to decide what to do. A hand held slide-rule type thing, so I punch in the channels I am recording and it tells me what I can still watch, would be great.
I'll explain what a slide-rule is to younger members in a separate thread. ![]() I am surprised that the Foxsat cannot flag up this information when originally setting up the recordings from the guide. |
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#2 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Fife
Posts: 4,038
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I'm sure Graham will be able to come up with something... He knows how to use his Excel and VB, and knows his channels on transponders list
![]() BTW, good idea
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#3 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Redditch Worcs
Posts: 17,289
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I will have a go, watch this space
![]() Do you want times checking or just to enter 2 channels to record and a 3rd channel to watch with a straight yes/no. It might be possible to suggest recording a different region to make some suggestions possible. For instance you can always record BBC HD and BBC 1 (CI or E) and watch anything. A vey quick and easy test would simply be to look for more than 2 transponders which would be an automatic no. |
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#4 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 135
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Quote:
Does anybody please know of a simple way to work out in advance what programme I can still watch while recording two others? I've seen the list of what channels are configured for each of the possible LNB configurations.
If there's a demand for this, I can polish it up a bit and get it up online somewhere. (It uses Graham's data by the way...) |
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#5 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: London postcode
Posts: 347
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Quote:
I started working on exactly this just after the HDR was released -- it already does a pretty good job of showing what can be watched when two programmes are recording, but there are a few rough edges and I hadn't worked out how to deal with regional variations when I ran out of time before Christmas.
If there's a demand for this, I can polish it up a bit and get it up online somewhere. (It uses Graham's data by the way...) What I (and presumably others) would find useful is the following: * if I select two channels to record, then some software or gizmo gives me a list of what I cannot watch (or a list of what I can, either way). * in the event of a clash, some suggestions on what to do about it: for example, I found a couple of days ago that to avoid a clash I could watch my target programme on BBC1 in SD but not my original choice of BBCHD. Does the solution have to be software? - I would prefer something at hand by the TV remote. That's why I mentioned the 'slide rule' idea. |
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#6 |
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Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 19,460
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Quote:
It might be possible to suggest recording a different region to make some suggestions possible. For instance you can always record BBC HD and BBC 1 (CI or E) and watch anything.
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#7 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Redditch Worcs
Posts: 17,289
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Given this some preliminary thought.
The main problem is the ITV regional variations, the BBC regions all appear in the freesat epg. The ITV regions do not appear, if I understand it correctly the you get your local region as 103 and london ITV in case you are in a non ITV owned area (eg STV) for ITV HD. The list I have posted has always used LCN's for my local post code and will only be accurate for a West Midlands post code. For a truly universal application an accurate database of which regional channels are allocated to your regionally based lcn's is required. An alternative would be a user selected setup where you specify which channels are used for the local channel nos for where you live. Get's more complicated the more you think about it
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#8 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 135
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Quote:
The main problem is the ITV regional variations, the BBC regions all appear in the freesat epg. The ITV regions do not [all] appear ... For a truly universal application an accurate database of which regional channels are allocated to your regionally based lcn's is required. An alternative would be a user selected setup where you specify which channels are used for the local channel nos for where you live. Get's more complicated the more you think about it
![]() The solution I came up with, but haven't yet implemented, is a one-time setup which asks BBC1 and ITV1 regions and sets a cookie (since my system is web based). It uses the BBC1 region only to put the correct region on channel 101 (I think!). Implementing this isn't simple of course and as you suggest, the data needs to be expanded to cover all ITV1 regions. I guess this is why my enthusiasm waned a bit before this got online! |
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#9 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 135
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Quote:
What I (and presumably others) would find useful is the following:
* if I select two channels to record, then some software or gizmo gives me a list of what I cannot watch (or a list of what I can, either way). Quote:
* in the event of a clash, some suggestions on what to do about it: for example, I found a couple of days ago that to avoid a clash I could watch my target programme on BBC1 in SD but not my original choice of BBCHD.
Giving all options to avoid clashing is much more complicated. A system would have to know, for example, that all the BBC1s were essentially the same channel (most of the time!) to be able to offer alternatives.Quote:
Does the solution have to be software? - I would prefer something at hand by the TV remote. That's why I mentioned the 'slide rule' idea.
A nice idea, but that sounds like one complicated slide rule!A web based system could easily include a version formatted for small devices, though not everyone has a wifi iPod or similar. |
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#10 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: London postcode
Posts: 347
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I wasn't aware that the region 'copies' of programmes are on different transponders until Graham mentioned it earlier on in this thread. This certainly potentially opens up the flexibility, but I understand the complexity it also adds.
As I now see it, a simple table for each region (London in my case) showing separate columns of channels by transponder would be very useful. This can be on a piece of paper: all I then have to do is make sure that the three 'clash' programmes in question (two being recorded and one watched) appear in no more than two of the columns. As for clash avoidance, this piece of paper will have all the BBC regions listed as well as the two HD options, so I might be able to work out a cunning clash avoidance scheme by hand from that. Trying to change to another ITV region for clash avoidance seems too fiddly - I would either have to go into non-Freesat mode or change my postcode. Can somebody more knowledgable than I am on all things transponder-like list all the stations in separate columns as I have suggested, please? |
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#11 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Redditch Worcs
Posts: 17,289
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Quote:
I wasn't aware that the region 'copies' of programmes are on different transponders until Graham mentioned it earlier on in this thread. This certainly potentially opens up the flexibility, but I understand the complexity it also adds.
As I now see it, a simple table for each region (London in my case) showing separate columns of channels by transponder would be very useful. This can be on a piece of paper: all I then have to do is make sure that the three 'clash' programmes in question (two being recorded and one watched) appear in no more than two of the columns. As for clash avoidance, this piece of paper will have all the BBC regions listed as well as the two HD options, so I might be able to work out a cunning clash avoidance scheme by hand from that. Trying to change to another ITV region for clash avoidance seems too fiddly - I would either have to go into non-Freesat mode or change my postcode. Can somebody more knowledgable than I am on all things transponder-like list all the stations in separate columns as I have suggested, please? http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/forums/s...2&postcount=41 As mentioned earlier the local channel numbers for the regional variations will need updating if you are not in the West Midlands. You can copy the correct BBC1 and BBC2 from the list to channels 101 and 102 as all the BBC regions are in the epg (and therefore listed). Your local ITV region will need a little research since you normally only get your local region on 103 plus ITV london so the alternatives are not in the epg (and not listed). You can easily get the data though, simply tune to the channel you want info for, choose diagnostics from the menu and you will get the transponder data. Last edited by grahamlthompson : 05-02-2009 at 08:30. Reason: extra info |
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#12 |
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Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 1,247
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Quote:
You can easily get the data though, simply tune to the channel you want info for, choose diagnostics from the menu and you will get the transponder data.
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#13 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Redditch Worcs
Posts: 17,289
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Current thinking
Excel application (what else )Data Worksheet with channels & transponder data. This will need a small mod for your area as detailed in my post above. Two additional worksheets - one for dual cable and one for single cable working. Each sheet to have the following pull down list boxes. Record 1 list box offering None plus complete list of available channels. Record 2 list box offering none plus complete list of available channels, the list will change dynamically for the single cable sheet reflecting the limitatations of the choice made in Record 1 Watch List Box showing all possible programmes you can watch based on Record 1 and Record 2 choices. This to be flagged with a time shift yes/no option Three more list boxes with a command button "Suggest Alternatives" This command to check your recording choices for BBC 1 and 2 and ITV 1 for alternatives to give the maximum choice of channels to watch, and display these in the same format as your original choice. As onlylee says this will be a little more complicated than the fairly easy option to display what you can watch based on your recording choice. Indeed you could probably do this without vba code using only Excel's spreadsheet functions. Before I start will anyone want this, as I only use the foxsat for HD recording so it's merely a bit of mental amusement for me ? |
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#14 |
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Join Date: May 2005
Location: Redditch Worcs
Posts: 17,289
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Quote:
Not near my unit at the moment, but I think pressing the opt+ button (whilst tuned to the channel) will also display the transponder data.
.Thanks for this great tip. |
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#15 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Nottingham
Posts: 372
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Quote:
Before I start will anyone want this, as I only use the foxsat for HD recording so it's merely a bit of mental amusement for me ?
Also, would you please explain the regional mods required, for someone like me who's not the sharpest knife in the drawer! Geoff PS - I'm in the East Midlands region. Last edited by Geoff_W : 05-02-2009 at 10:33. Reason: Added Postscript |
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#16 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: London postcode
Posts: 347
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Quote:
You can copy and paste the data you need from here
http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/forums/s...2&postcount=41 On the software, I would certainly like to have a program that can suggest clash avoidance, especcially as it will keep your grey cells young and fresh.
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#17 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Redditch Worcs
Posts: 17,289
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Quote:
Yes please, sounds like a very useful piece of reference data.
Also, would you please explain the regional mods required, for someone like me who's not the sharpest knife in the drawer! Geoff PS - I'm in the East Midlands region. |
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#18 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Redditch Worcs
Posts: 17,289
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Quote:
Great, this is just what I wanted, thanks Graham. I assume I can only watch/record channels that are in one or in two of the four blocks to avoid clashes.
On the software, I would certainly like to have a program that can suggest clash avoidance, especcially as it will keep your grey cells young and fresh. ![]() The application (hopefully ) will sort this out automatically
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#19 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Cambs
Posts: 874
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Record 2 & Watch 3rd Project
Re the recording/watching clash project, there is another complication that is going to make the "slide rule" 4 dimensional !
Or needing the spreadsheet to be dynamically linked to the EPG. If you we you are going to switch to a different region's ITV or BBC1, for recordibility, then you will still have check on the EPG (If you can read it!) to ensure it is the same program at exactly the same time. If we can simultaneously record ANY 2 programs then I would watch the 3rd on my ex-Sky+ Set Top Box. Thanks, Graham, for http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/forums/s...2&postcount=41 I also missed the cunning OPT button option! I had only today started assembling similar for another purpose which I'll post separately. |
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#20 |
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Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Hawkwell, Essex
Posts: 2,186
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Definitely gets a vote from me . i.e., yes I will use it.
Thanks for doing this (in advance )Les. |
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#21 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Redditch Worcs
Posts: 17,289
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Mark one now ready. Currently only dual cable working.
Table now contains a 4th column containg a group number that relates channels with possible same content using 1 for BBC 1, 2 for BBC 2 and 3 for ITV. One minor bug so far, you can select same channel to record on both tuners. Not bothered correcting this as it's very obvious and quite hard to eliminate. In the finest Humax traditions anyone using is a beta-tester ![]() PM with e-mail for return of application. Graham |
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#22 |
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Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Hawkwell, Essex
Posts: 2,186
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Quote:
Mark one now ready. Currently only dual cable working.
Quote:
In the finest Humax traditions anyone using is a beta-tester He He
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#23 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Hawkwell, Essex
Posts: 2,186
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Graham, 1st small buglet ![]() Quote:
Watch List Box showing all possible programmes you can watch based on Record 1 and Record 2 choices. This to be flagged with a time shift yes/no option
The first Watch List Box does not show the (ts) option. This is only shown when you ask for alternatives.Thx. Les edit : Yes it does if you choose the right channels -
Last edited by savvy : 05-02-2009 at 16:15. Reason: Being a right muppet !! |
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#24 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Redditch Worcs
Posts: 17,289
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Quote:
Graham,
1st small buglet ![]() The first Watch List Box does not show the (ts) option. This is only shown when you ask for alternatives. Thx. Les What channel choice did you input ? Sent you a minor mod. Clicking on none after selecting a channel in 2nd record failed to refresh watch list. |
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#25 |
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Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Hawkwell, Essex
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Yes I caught my faux pas and edited my post as you were posting.
2nd version with minor mod appears OK too. Cheers. Les. |
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