Does anybody please know of a simple way to work out in advance what programme I can still watch while recording two others? I've seen the list of what channels are configured for each of the possible LNB configurations, but it's a real pain working it out in advance, and equally painful when the Foxsat comes up with the 'clash' window and you've got about ten seconds to decide what to do. A hand held slide-rule type thing, so I punch in the channels I am recording and it tells me what I can still watch, would be great.
I'll explain what a slide-rule is to younger members in a separate thread.
I am surprised that the Foxsat cannot flag up this information when originally setting up the recordings from the guide.

I'm sure Graham will be able to come up with something... He knows how to use his Excel and VB, and knows his channels on transponders list

BTW, good idea

I will have a go, watch this space

Do you want times checking or just to enter 2 channels to record and a 3rd channel to watch with a straight yes/no. It might be possible to suggest recording a different region to make some suggestions possible. For instance you can always record BBC HD and BBC 1 (CI or E) and watch anything.

A vey quick and easy test would simply be to look for more than 2 transponders which would be an automatic no.

I started working on exactly this just after the HDR was released -- it already does a pretty good job of showing what can be watched when two programmes are recording, but there are a few rough edges and I hadn't worked out how to deal with regional variations when I ran out of time before Christmas.

If there's a demand for this, I can polish it up a bit and get it up online somewhere.

(It uses Graham's data by the way...)

Thanks to you both, you & Graham, for the replies.
What I (and presumably others) would find useful is the following:
* if I select two channels to record, then some software or gizmo gives me a list of what I cannot watch (or a list of what I can, either way).
* in the event of a clash, some suggestions on what to do about it: for example, I found a couple of days ago that to avoid a clash I could watch my target programme on BBC1 in SD but not my original choice of BBCHD.

Does the solution have to be software? - I would prefer something at hand by the TV remote. That's why I mentioned the 'slide rule' idea.

That would be a very useful feature, for those that don't know about this 'cheat', or simply forget.

Given this some preliminary thought.

The main problem is the ITV regional variations, the BBC regions all appear in the freesat epg. The ITV regions do not appear, if I understand it correctly the you get your local region as 103 and london ITV in case you are in a non ITV owned area (eg STV) for ITV HD. The list I have posted has always used LCN's for my local post code and will only be accurate for a West Midlands post code. For a truly universal application an accurate database of which regional channels are allocated to your regionally based lcn's is required. An alternative would be a user selected setup where you specify which channels are used for the local channel nos for where you live. Get's more complicated the more you think about it

It does indeed, and this is where things slowed down. My system currently works with your data (as noted above) so actually gives results for your area -- which is a bit odd for me in the South/SW!

The solution I came up with, but haven't yet implemented, is a one-time setup which asks BBC1 and ITV1 regions and sets a cookie (since my system is web based). It uses the BBC1 region only to put the correct region on channel 101 (I think!).

Implementing this isn't simple of course and as you suggest, the data needs to be expanded to cover all ITV1 regions. I guess this is why my enthusiasm waned a bit before this got online!

This bit is (relatively) easy. (My system does the latter.)


Giving all options to avoid clashing is much more complicated. A system would have to know, for example, that all the BBC1s were essentially the same channel (most of the time!) to be able to offer alternatives.


A nice idea, but that sounds like one complicated slide rule!

A web based system could easily include a version formatted for small devices, though not everyone has a wifi iPod or similar.

I wasn't aware that the region 'copies' of programmes are on different transponders until Graham mentioned it earlier on in this thread. This certainly potentially opens up the flexibility, but I understand the complexity it also adds.

As I now see it, a simple table for each region (London in my case) showing separate columns of channels by transponder would be very useful. This can be on a piece of paper: all I then have to do is make sure that the three 'clash' programmes in question (two being recorded and one watched) appear in no more than two of the columns.

As for clash avoidance, this piece of paper will have all the BBC regions listed as well as the two HD options, so I might be able to work out a cunning clash avoidance scheme by hand from that.
Trying to change to another ITV region for clash avoidance seems too fiddly - I would either have to go into non-Freesat mode or change my postcode.

Can somebody more knowledgable than I am on all things transponder-like list all the stations in separate columns as I have suggested, please?

You can copy and paste the data you need from here

http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/forums/s...2&postcount=41

As mentioned earlier the local channel numbers for the regional variations will need updating if you are not in the West Midlands. You can copy the correct BBC1 and BBC2 from the list to channels 101 and 102 as all the BBC regions are in the epg (and therefore listed). Your local ITV region will need a little research since you normally only get your local region on 103 plus ITV london so the alternatives are not in the epg (and not listed).

You can easily get the data though, simply tune to the channel you want info for, choose diagnostics from the menu and you will get the transponder data.
Last edited by grahamlthompson : 05-02-2009 at 08:30

Not near my unit at the moment, but I think pressing the opt+ button (whilst tuned to the channel) will also display the transponder data.

Current thinking

Excel application (what else )
Data Worksheet with channels & transponder data.
This will need a small mod for your area as detailed in my post above.

Two additional worksheets - one for dual cable and one for single cable working.

Each sheet to have the following pull down list boxes.

Record 1 list box offering None plus complete list of available channels.

Record 2 list box offering none plus complete list of available channels, the list will change dynamically for the single cable sheet reflecting the limitatations of the choice made in Record 1

Watch List Box showing all possible programmes you can watch based on Record 1 and Record 2 choices. This to be flagged with a time shift yes/no option

Three more list boxes with a command button "Suggest Alternatives"

This command to check your recording choices for BBC 1 and 2 and ITV 1 for alternatives to give the maximum choice of channels to watch, and display these in the same format as your original choice.

As onlylee says this will be a little more complicated than the fairly easy option to display what you can watch based on your recording choice. Indeed you could probably do this without vba code using only Excel's spreadsheet functions.

Before I start will anyone want this, as I only use the foxsat for HD recording so it's merely a bit of mental amusement for me ?

By George you are absolutely right. Wish I had known that before building my list it would have saved some button pressing .

Thanks for this great tip.

Yes please, sounds like a very useful piece of reference data.

Also, would you please explain the regional mods required, for someone like me who's not the sharpest knife in the drawer!

Geoff

PS - I'm in the East Midlands region.
Last edited by Geoff_W : 05-02-2009 at 10:33

Great, this is just what I wanted, thanks Graham. I assume I can only watch/record channels that are in one or in two of the four blocks to avoid clashes.
On the software, I would certainly like to have a program that can suggest clash avoidance, especcially as it will keep your grey cells young and fresh.

When the application is done there is a table of channels. The first 3 entries for channels 101, 102 and 103 will vary according to your post code. Simply tune to 101 press opt+ and make a note of the channel name, frequency and polarisation. Replace the 101 data with yours and repeat for 102 and 103. That's it.

Assuming you have 2 cables you can watch any channel on the same transponder as either recording. If you happen to be recording 2 channelson the same transponder you can watch any other channel (which is where the alternate suggestion comes from). The bands only become significant when using one cable with a loop through.
The application (hopefully ) will sort this out automatically

Re the recording/watching clash project, there is another complication that is going to make the "slide rule" 4 dimensional !
Or needing the spreadsheet to be dynamically linked to the EPG.

If you we you are going to switch to a different region's ITV or BBC1, for recordibility, then you will still have check on the EPG (If you can read it!) to ensure it is the same program at exactly the same time.

If we can simultaneously record ANY 2 programs then I would watch the 3rd on my ex-Sky+ Set Top Box.

Thanks, Graham, for
http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/forums/s...2&postcount=41
I also missed the cunning OPT button option!

I had only today started assembling similar for another purpose which I'll post separately.

Definitely gets a vote from me . i.e., yes I will use it.

Thanks for doing this (in advance )

Les.

Mark one now ready. Currently only dual cable working.

Table now contains a 4th column containg a group number that relates channels with possible same content using 1 for BBC 1, 2 for BBC 2 and 3 for ITV.

One minor bug so far, you can select same channel to record on both tuners. Not bothered correcting this as it's very obvious and quite hard to eliminate.

In the finest Humax traditions anyone using is a beta-tester

PM with e-mail for return of application.

Graham

Wow, that was quick.


He He

Graham,

1st small buglet


The first Watch List Box does not show the (ts) option. This is only shown when you ask for alternatives.

Thx.

Les

edit : Yes it does if you choose the right channels -
Last edited by savvy : 05-02-2009 at 16:15

It does on mine. Enter 108 as first choice and 951 as 2nd choice as test.
What channel choice did you input ?
Sent you a minor mod. Clicking on none after selecting a channel in 2nd record failed to refresh watch list.

Yes I caught my faux pas and edited my post as you were posting.

2nd version with minor mod appears OK too.

Cheers.

Les.