That's not what Bob said - my reading of it anyway. Humax will release updates that will support BBC iPlayer. When BBC implement it at their end is up to them.
Presumably BBC will want the updates to take place a while before the service goes live (in the autumn), they wouldn't want the updates to be just a couple of days before or something like that in case something goes horribly wrong:rolleyes:.
Presumably BBC will want the updates to take place a while before the service goes live (in the autumn), they wouldn't want the updates to be just a couple of days before or something like that in case something goes horribly wrong:rolleyes:.
Surely it can't be normal to go this long between updates?
Does anybody have any concrete info as to whether Humax are still developing this product further, or is this it?
What's the point in rushing updates......When the updates are done they will release them.They don't want products out there with bugs etc.It's in Humax interest to get things right,the better the product the more sales.
No point in pushing.they will come when they are ready.
... it has to be said - they didn't show that much concern about bugs and unfinished work before releasing the product did they? :eek:
I do agree though there is no point rushing them now.. I would rather it was an excellent release in a month or two, than something incomplete now... and to be positive it does appear they are working hard on the firmware for when it finally arrives..
I wonder how many people like me have held off buying the HDR in the hope that the bug fixes and GUI issues are resolved? I keep reading about HDR owners who didn't have any issues, that have suddenly got issues and owners who are returning boxes for replacement or refunds. Sure this happens in the Sky box box but it doesn't inspire much hope in me that this firmware release will stop this occuring.
All I can say is Sky have got months more money out of me due to there being no firmware update. Had there been an interim release addressing some of the known issues then perhaps I'd be owning a HDR already knowing that the product appeared to be supported on an ongoing basis. I could then own a HDR expecting further issues to be addressed in a managed fix rollout. (Obviously not forever but at least for a 12 month period). As it is at present I don't have that confidence and so I'm not a Humax customer but still a Sky one.
I wonder how many people like me have held off buying the HDR in the hope that the bug fixes and GUI issues are resolved? I keep reading about HDR owners who didn't have any issues, that have suddenly got issues and owners who are returning boxes for replacement or refunds. Sure this happens in the Sky box box but it doesn't inspire much hope in me that this firmware release will stop this occuring.
All I can say is Sky have got months more money out of me due to there being no firmware update. Had there been an interim release addressing some of the known issues then perhaps I'd be owning a HDR already knowing that the product appeared to be supported on an ongoing basis. I could then own a HDR expecting further issues to be addressed in a managed fix rollout. (Obviously not forever but at least for a 12 month period). As it is at present I don't have that confidence and so I'm not a Humax customer but still a Sky one.
There are very few issues, a patch release was issued just before launch and the boxes picked it up. This release has been really stable - I've had a couple of lock-ups but for this kind of product to be expected. The fact that the iplayer release is actively being worked on is a big plus. Can't frankly see what you are waiting for if you don't want to continue paying for Sky.
I said it with special emphasis in March as there were rumours that they were planning on releasing the update in May.
In April I didn't say much as I was still hoping for a May update.
May came and went and now we're back to hoping for something solid 'in a month or two'.
Well I hope I don't have to repeat the same thing as you in a months time! and then a month after that and then a month after that too or I will be really fed up!
After a powercycle or power cut that returns the box to standby, timers are not loaded and schedules will not record, until the box is brought out of standby.
This is the main one as we tend to suffer a few power outages. Had one today for 2 hours. A factor of living in rural Ireland. No I'm not about to buy a UPS to resolve and complaining to the power company (as was suggested by another poster) isn't going to change anything - Ah yes Sir we'll rush around a generator especially for you.....
So it's a catch-22 thing. Until the HDR can do the same as the Sky box does now (which the HDR can't in my opinion) there's little point in currently "downgrading" to a lesser end result experience. I'd love to be proven wrong by this pending firmware upgrade which I'm sure will fix all issues because of the 7 months development time.
I don't even own one and I'm getting annoyed! Hah gotta refocus on priorities I think. It's only TV after all.
Probably the worst bug on a day to day basis is that the 'infobar' will not go away when the user asks the box to do someting s/he decides is not possible whilst said inforbar is displayed.
Worse, the fact that the user had the effrontery to try and do what they - the customer wanted whilst the infobar is displayed means that Humax decides, in it's very finite wisdom. to extend the time that the bl**dy thing stays on the screen.
This is something that is taught in the very first week of CS courses. The UI should be designed to do what the user wants it to do, not what the designer wants it to do.
This release has been really stable - I've had a couple of lock-ups but for this kind of product to be expected.
Lock ups are to be expected ?? ................ really ... ?? ....... well not by me and I imagine not by most people either.
When I buy a product in the 21st century I expect it to work. OK there might be a FEW that have a problem but certainly not on the scale we are seeing.
I've had my Foxsat since Christmas and TBH I don't see what most of this "unfixed bugs" fuss is about.
99% of the time I just get on and use it without any issue.
It damn well works and I wouldn't want to put anyone off buying one because it does a great job.
Alright my experience was a 1st generation Pace Twins (needed padding) and a Vestel-based Hitachi bought from Argos for my mother (it has "accurate record"). I've never had Sky so I'm not well placed to compare, but the Humax UI looks good, it does HD, it records its timers accurately and I can navigate media smoothly and accurately even though it is often HD being played.
The timers record ok. They record on-time. I wouldn't want 10 minutes of padding anyway (I left that behind with my Pace 1st generation PVR with start-2 mins and end+5 minutes). Nearly all of the recordings start with a good few seconds to go and just occasionally I'll find a recording has started with a few seconds missing. It seems to me that the accurate record works, so any record errors that we see are down to bad signalling by the broadcaster. If I had the option I might add a minute at each end, but nearly all the programming I watch is caught correctly even when off time. I only have one cable fed to the box, so back-to-back recordings on different LNB quadrants are going to have occasional issues. Even there I've observed that the library list has a warning which warns me of a potential problem, it is often ok though. (I forget the words) The 2nd recording may be incomplete because by the time it switched channel (after waiting for the signalled ending of the 1st recording) it found it had missed the transition from 'next' to 'now' of the 2nd. I guess the effects of this on the user depend on what channels they tend to watch and how much effort they may make to find another showing.
Deletion seems to take too many button presses and the wait whilst it does it is a bit of a pain. It would be so much nicer if a coloured button allowed deletion when viewing the Media list and the default option was to "Delete" which would be carried out later and alternate choice "Delete Now" for which you would have to wait.
I agree that there are niggles around key-press sequences, but through avoidance they hardly ever affect me.
The manual and UI (from memory only) is incorrect in saying EXT2 is supported for files over 4GB, whereas it actuallyrequires EXT3 (either way it is likely to stop most consumers in their tracks). BTW opening an SMB share or FTP server on the ethernet port would be my preferred solution anyway.
The reason I bring up EXT2 (among the other genuine bugs) is because it illustrates what happens when your product differs from your documentation.
We'd all like to see our preferred points fixed and many of them look like quick-fixes, but that would make the user-experience different to the manual. That is going to bring up lots of issues. I'd presume that Humax are wary of releasing multiple over-air downloads which makes the product different to the documentation..
(BTW that point worries me)
... I hope that what we are seeing is an accumulation of changes and bug-fixes which are worth going to the printers with - otherwise we are stuck with some of those UI "features".
Still - its a shame that there haven't been more more interim releases available to download and try (rather than OAD) - Perhaps they have concerns about their software loader mechanism allowing re-flashing if the user somehow gets it wrong and the box ends up dead as a result.
Perhaps Bob could comment. I thought I remembered Humax being one of the better manufacturers which used to do this with their Freview boxes.
Anyway, sorry for the long post, the summary being it does the job and I experience very little trouble. Occam's razor says that the differences which we experience are down to the broadcaster and our own patterns of use.
I tend to leave the box on 24hr-running channels and put it into standby whenever not using it.
I have seen a few post from people complaining about freezes. Apart from one example regarding recording two TV programes and then trying to listen to a radio program on a third multiplex (which Humax have agreed is a bug), none of them are echoed by other users. Some have replaced their box and no longer suffer from freezes. I, like RobinB above, have never had this freeze. I have a unit from last November and IT JUST WORKS. Yes, deletes take a while, and if the broadcasters get their data wrong the box does what it's told, not what I want.
If your box does not do the basics (record programes against the schedule - mostly), then take the hint from those of us that for whom it does work and get it changed. Don't assume that some magical firmware update will solve a problem that many (and based on the Which? report, most) don't have and is not acknowledged by Humax.
I'm more and more convinced there was a duff batch produced, as all the people who have reported these freezes and had their boxes changed now don't have the problem (await response from those who got another duff box).
Just because this forum exists, and Bob_Cat participates, does not mean that every problem is one that all suffer. Any new product has some level of problem, and manufacturers have systems in place to monitor and cope with them. Not every box works to spec. If your's does not then either 1) get it replaced or 2) get you money back. It's your choice, but don't 'just live with it' if others don't agree thaqt there is a problem.
Apart from the small number of people who inadvertantly bought a unit from the stolen batch who have had a problem with the 'return it to the retailer' Humax have no negative reports about exchanging units.
Get your units replaced and enjoy the Humax as it is with no freeezes or lock-outs, and live in anticipation as to how much better it will be when the promised upgrade finally appears.
Having spent more than the last two years trying to use a TUTV Freeview PVR - with frequent crashes, hangs, missed recordings and most recently a bug which turned a lot of boxes into a brick and required a HD re-format (all recordings lost and no backup capability) I am more than happy to wait for Humax to bring out a stable new feature release!
I have had almost zero problems with my Foxsat box (just a couple of missed recording for an unknown reason and one hang that required a power off/on to resolve) and now rely on it and can trust it to do the job. Yes it would be nice to have a few new features (iPlayer being one) and a couple of minor UI improvements but once you have experienced an very unstable PVR you get a lot of satisfaction in just having one that works, and works well!
What percentage of people who have bought the HDR have complained on here and other forums about problems do you think?
Happy to wait a little longer(2)
Personally i think a very low percentage of any STB users post on forums. The average user probably doesn't realise they exist.
For myself, I have had my Hummy with firmware 1.003 for a few months now. I have had no lockups at all. The only annoyance I have is the time it takes to delete recordings. That doesn't bother me , it is just a niggle.
I do find it annoying that so many people critisize Humax and Bob Cat, when he is only trying to help. How often do Sky and BT Vision, issue software releases? Not that often, so Humax are no different.
I would rather wait and have as many bugs as possible eliminated before release of the next upgrade.
What percentage of people who have bought the HDR have complained on here and other forums about problems do you think?
No major problems with my Humax, it works great and I'm very happy with it. Only niggles are the broadcasters mucking up programme timings (not Humax's fault, obviously), deleting being too convoluted and the guide re-populating every time I open it (unless something's recording).
No major problems with my Humax, it works great and I'm very happy with it. Only niggles are the broadcasters mucking up programme timings (not Humax's fault, obviously), deleting being too convoluted and the guide re-populating every time I open it (unless something's recording).
If you press schedule and red you get the buffered epg without loading a new one
I have seen a few post from people complaining about freezes.
If your box does not do the basics (record programes against the schedule - mostly), then take the hint from those of us that for whom it does work and get it changed. Don't assume that some magical firmware update will solve a problem that many (and based on the Which? report, most) don't have and is not acknowledged by Humax.
That is exactly what I did with my Freeview + PVR ........ I got Humax to change it but it was also defective. I had 4 boxes/replacements in total from them and they were ALL defective in the same way so yes I did get my money back.
Sadly it took a complaint to the CEO to get my money due to Humax customer service ignoring emails.
My Foxsat HDR has been returned to Humax and is being repaired at the moment.
It was their customer service who told me the problem is being caused by the loader software and it would be cured by an update so I am not assuming anything ......... I am expecting Humax to do what they say they will do.
Comments
Rgds.
Les.
Not an option, for me, I'm afraid.
(Not getting the router, using the service. 'Twoud be a case of do what I say, not what I do.)
What's the point in rushing updates......When the updates are done they will release them.They don't want products out there with bugs etc.It's in Humax interest to get things right,the better the product the more sales.
No point in pushing.they will come when they are ready.
Well, seven months isn't really 'rushing', is it?
Quite, so you would think they would have released the first major bug fixes in a timely manner.
Quite, so you would think they would have released the first major bug fixes in a timely manner.
There's no point in pushing because it is now perfectly clear that Humax have no great concern for their customers.
2-3 months would have been quite acceptable.
4-5 would have been tardy but not too bad.
6 months was really pushing the boundaries of reasonable.
But we are now close to 7 months since the initial release and we still haven't even got a date yet.
That line made me laugh.
... it has to be said - they didn't show that much concern about bugs and unfinished work before releasing the product did they? :eek:
I do agree though there is no point rushing them now.. I would rather it was an excellent release in a month or two, than something incomplete now... and to be positive it does appear they are working hard on the firmware for when it finally arrives..
Patrick
All I can say is Sky have got months more money out of me due to there being no firmware update. Had there been an interim release addressing some of the known issues then perhaps I'd be owning a HDR already knowing that the product appeared to be supported on an ongoing basis. I could then own a HDR expecting further issues to be addressed in a managed fix rollout. (Obviously not forever but at least for a 12 month period). As it is at present I don't have that confidence and so I'm not a Humax customer but still a Sky one.
I think the new Sky+ HD EPG really SUCKS and am very tempted to cancel my sub.
The Humax is so much nicer on the eyes and navigation of the menus works in a fairly normal manner.
Automan.
That's exactly what I said in December.
I said it again in January.
Then I said it in February.
I said it with special emphasis in March as there were rumours that they were planning on releasing the update in May.
In April I didn't say much as I was still hoping for a May update.
May came and went and now we're back to hoping for something solid 'in a month or two'.
Which one has to say is not an easy thing to do.
It looks more as if they've got some junior engineer on it part time and he's not in any hurry.
What's most annoying is that they said way back that they were going to do a bug fix release before a release with a load of new features.
It now seems they've reneged on that and everyone is having to wait for some unspecified new features.
It's a very poor way to treat customers who just want the basic PVR to work without the UI clunkiness and subtitle bugfest.
There are very few issues, a patch release was issued just before launch and the boxes picked it up. This release has been really stable - I've had a couple of lock-ups but for this kind of product to be expected. The fact that the iplayer release is actively being worked on is a big plus. Can't frankly see what you are waiting for if you don't want to continue paying for Sky.
Well I hope I don't have to repeat the same thing as you in a months time! and then a month after that and then a month after that too or I will be really fed up!
Patrick
Well there's quite a lot of them if you look here
After a powercycle or power cut that returns the box to standby, timers are not loaded and schedules will not record, until the box is brought out of standby.
This is the main one as we tend to suffer a few power outages. Had one today for 2 hours. A factor of living in rural Ireland. No I'm not about to buy a UPS to resolve and complaining to the power company (as was suggested by another poster) isn't going to change anything - Ah yes Sir we'll rush around a generator especially for you.....
So it's a catch-22 thing. Until the HDR can do the same as the Sky box does now (which the HDR can't in my opinion) there's little point in currently "downgrading" to a lesser end result experience. I'd love to be proven wrong by this pending firmware upgrade which I'm sure will fix all issues because of the 7 months development time.
I don't even own one and I'm getting annoyed! Hah gotta refocus on priorities I think. It's only TV after all.
Sadly, that isn't nearly comprehensive.
Probably the worst bug on a day to day basis is that the 'infobar' will not go away when the user asks the box to do someting s/he decides is not possible whilst said inforbar is displayed.
Worse, the fact that the user had the effrontery to try and do what they - the customer wanted whilst the infobar is displayed means that Humax decides, in it's very finite wisdom. to extend the time that the bl**dy thing stays on the screen.
This is something that is taught in the very first week of CS courses. The UI should be designed to do what the user wants it to do, not what the designer wants it to do.
Lock ups are to be expected ?? ................ really ... ?? ....... well not by me and I imagine not by most people either.
When I buy a product in the 21st century I expect it to work. OK there might be a FEW that have a problem but certainly not on the scale we are seeing.
99% of the time I just get on and use it without any issue.
It damn well works and I wouldn't want to put anyone off buying one because it does a great job.
Alright my experience was a 1st generation Pace Twins (needed padding) and a Vestel-based Hitachi bought from Argos for my mother (it has "accurate record"). I've never had Sky so I'm not well placed to compare, but the Humax UI looks good, it does HD, it records its timers accurately and I can navigate media smoothly and accurately even though it is often HD being played.
The timers record ok. They record on-time. I wouldn't want 10 minutes of padding anyway (I left that behind with my Pace 1st generation PVR with start-2 mins and end+5 minutes). Nearly all of the recordings start with a good few seconds to go and just occasionally I'll find a recording has started with a few seconds missing. It seems to me that the accurate record works, so any record errors that we see are down to bad signalling by the broadcaster. If I had the option I might add a minute at each end, but nearly all the programming I watch is caught correctly even when off time. I only have one cable fed to the box, so back-to-back recordings on different LNB quadrants are going to have occasional issues. Even there I've observed that the library list has a warning which warns me of a potential problem, it is often ok though. (I forget the words) The 2nd recording may be incomplete because by the time it switched channel (after waiting for the signalled ending of the 1st recording) it found it had missed the transition from 'next' to 'now' of the 2nd. I guess the effects of this on the user depend on what channels they tend to watch and how much effort they may make to find another showing.
Deletion seems to take too many button presses and the wait whilst it does it is a bit of a pain. It would be so much nicer if a coloured button allowed deletion when viewing the Media list and the default option was to "Delete" which would be carried out later and alternate choice "Delete Now" for which you would have to wait.
I agree that there are niggles around key-press sequences, but through avoidance they hardly ever affect me.
The manual and UI (from memory only) is incorrect in saying EXT2 is supported for files over 4GB, whereas it actuallyrequires EXT3 (either way it is likely to stop most consumers in their tracks). BTW opening an SMB share or FTP server on the ethernet port would be my preferred solution anyway.
The reason I bring up EXT2 (among the other genuine bugs) is because it illustrates what happens when your product differs from your documentation.
We'd all like to see our preferred points fixed and many of them look like quick-fixes, but that would make the user-experience different to the manual. That is going to bring up lots of issues. I'd presume that Humax are wary of releasing multiple over-air downloads which makes the product different to the documentation..
(BTW that point worries me)
... I hope that what we are seeing is an accumulation of changes and bug-fixes which are worth going to the printers with - otherwise we are stuck with some of those UI "features".
Still - its a shame that there haven't been more more interim releases available to download and try (rather than OAD) - Perhaps they have concerns about their software loader mechanism allowing re-flashing if the user somehow gets it wrong and the box ends up dead as a result.
Perhaps Bob could comment. I thought I remembered Humax being one of the better manufacturers which used to do this with their Freview boxes.
Anyway, sorry for the long post, the summary being it does the job and I experience very little trouble. Occam's razor says that the differences which we experience are down to the broadcaster and our own patterns of use.
I tend to leave the box on 24hr-running channels and put it into standby whenever not using it.
When it works I like it but it is NOT acceptable in this day and age for a product to malfunction so often.
If your box does not do the basics (record programes against the schedule - mostly), then take the hint from those of us that for whom it does work and get it changed. Don't assume that some magical firmware update will solve a problem that many (and based on the Which? report, most) don't have and is not acknowledged by Humax.
I'm more and more convinced there was a duff batch produced, as all the people who have reported these freezes and had their boxes changed now don't have the problem (await response from those who got another duff box).
Just because this forum exists, and Bob_Cat participates, does not mean that every problem is one that all suffer. Any new product has some level of problem, and manufacturers have systems in place to monitor and cope with them. Not every box works to spec. If your's does not then either 1) get it replaced or 2) get you money back. It's your choice, but don't 'just live with it' if others don't agree thaqt there is a problem.
Apart from the small number of people who inadvertantly bought a unit from the stolen batch who have had a problem with the 'return it to the retailer' Humax have no negative reports about exchanging units.
Get your units replaced and enjoy the Humax as it is with no freeezes or lock-outs, and live in anticipation as to how much better it will be when the promised upgrade finally appears.
I have had almost zero problems with my Foxsat box (just a couple of missed recording for an unknown reason and one hang that required a power off/on to resolve) and now rely on it and can trust it to do the job. Yes it would be nice to have a few new features (iPlayer being one) and a couple of minor UI improvements but once you have experienced an very unstable PVR you get a lot of satisfaction in just having one that works, and works well!
Happy to wait a little longer(2)
Personally i think a very low percentage of any STB users post on forums. The average user probably doesn't realise they exist.
For myself, I have had my Hummy with firmware 1.003 for a few months now. I have had no lockups at all. The only annoyance I have is the time it takes to delete recordings. That doesn't bother me , it is just a niggle.
I do find it annoying that so many people critisize Humax and Bob Cat, when he is only trying to help. How often do Sky and BT Vision, issue software releases? Not that often, so Humax are no different.
I would rather wait and have as many bugs as possible eliminated before release of the next upgrade.
If you press schedule and red you get the buffered epg without loading a new one
That is exactly what I did with my Freeview + PVR ........ I got Humax to change it but it was also defective. I had 4 boxes/replacements in total from them and they were ALL defective in the same way so yes I did get my money back.
Sadly it took a complaint to the CEO to get my money due to Humax customer service ignoring emails.
My Foxsat HDR has been returned to Humax and is being repaired at the moment.
It was their customer service who told me the problem is being caused by the loader software and it would be cured by an update so I am not assuming anything ......... I am expecting Humax to do what they say they will do.
Or is that also unrealistic