The Masoods are squeaky clean compared to most characters as the BBC doesn't want to upset Muslims. They show them going to the mosque as family, they've never had a Christian family who go to church. There has never even been a Christian family in Eastenders only individuals like dot who is shown as naive or Lucas who is shown as a murdering hypocrite. If they showed a Muslim killing people whilst babling on about his religion there would be outrage.
But isn't it representative of the British population - what percentage of families actually go to Church every Sunday? The future Head of CofE comitted adultary throughout his marriage. In the Southern American states they too would be deeply offended if a catholic family was portrayed like the McQueens. I think this was the first year an American soap showed two men kissing or in a relationship.
Oh and catsmeow, just for the record (and to be different) christianity states sex before marriage is a sin and I think we've seen quite a lot of eastenders christians doing the big bible nono. Shall I write to ofcom and complain they are showing christians in an unrealistic light?
Just to comment on one point. I didn't see them singing, and if they were, they weren't much, they would've been murmuring. I saw them, thought 'What're they doing there?' then saw they were barely singing. I don't think it would be an insult to my religion if I sang a muslim song?
There are no muslim songs- but you are right it would a lovely act to join in with the community. At school I sang christmas songs and hymns but would omit words to the effect that Jesus was the Son of God and at the Catholic school I went to I didn't have to say the Trinity before eating. Apart from that we have equal respect for Jesus as the prophet Mohammed.
There are no muslim songs- but you are right. At school I sang christmas songs and hymns but would omit words to the effect that Jesus was the Son of God and at the Catholic school I went to I didn't have to say the Trinity before eating. Apart from that we have equal respect for Jesus as the prophet Mohammed.
Why would you omit that Jesus is not the son of god, another way of interpreting this is that we are all in effect sons and daughters of god as he is our creator. Therefore Jesus being the son of god should not be offensive to Muslims, it is how you want to interpret this.
As a Muslim myself I interpret what it means to me and do not follow the general consensus on what it means. Religion is their to be studied and interpreted on what you think not what others say.
I really like the Masoods I don't think the gay storyline is a big deal, and Zainab and Shabnam not wearing headscarves - not all of my female relatives wear them. They actually remind me of my own family with the older generation being more strict (like Zainab and her comments about homosexuality) and the younger ones who were brought up here being a bit less strict about Islam (like Tamwar who doesn't seem to have a problem with it).
And they're just one family, they couldn't possibly represent all Muslims anyway. Some, like my dad, only bother with praying and going to the Mosque when it's Ramadan and for the rest of the year don't seem to follow the religion at all. A few other relatives are super-strict Muslims (like veiled aunts who won't even let male doctors look at them, uncles who follow this strict dress code and check their beard lengths, won't have a television in the house because it's an 'evil influence' on the kids). So I think the Masoods are a pretty fair representation of the 'average' Muslim family.
loved reading your posts by the way, always interesting to read views from someone who knows about this
LOL I'm glad it has
Yeah well, when there is a topic about Muslims for example, I need to put my view across as I am a Muslim myself so everyone else who isn't Muslim gets a better understanding. Unfortunantly it's turned into an ugly insult battle. I think the discussion's back now .
Also we all need to be opened minded about opinions and facts.
To the OP, from one Muslim to another, please show that you are a dignifying Muslim if you really want to set an example to everyone else that we are a good and peaceful religion. The reason I am still here is because I really don't want other users to think otherwise, that every Muslim has to insult other people's cultures when we are trying to make a debate over the thread title. Islam is about peace, please show it.
Yeah well, when there is a topic about Muslims for example, I need to put my view across as I am a Muslim myself so everyone else who isn't Muslim gets a better understanding. Unfortunantly it's turned into an ugly insult battle. I think the discussion's back now .
Also we all need to be opened minded about opinions and facts.
To the OP, from one Muslim to another, please show that you are a dignifying Muslim if you really want to set an example to everyone else that we are a good and peaceful religion. The reason I am still here is because I really don't want other users to think otherwise, that every Muslim has to insult other people's cultures when we are trying to make a debate over the thread title. Islam is about peace, please show it.
Totally agree
I'm not religious, but I visit church at christmas, for me it's a matter of respect.
I'm also always interested in hearing others believes and always respect them even if I don't always agree
The masoods are brilliant and a very realistic portrayal of uk living muslims, just had to add that
are the masoods bbcs idea of a positive image of muslims. for example the gay storyline, zainab and shabnam not wearing headscarves, and most recently the masoods singing carols in the square christmas night! that is outrageous and the actors involved should have refused to sing hymns.
i did not notice anyone else in the square fasting with the masoods during ramadan and i dont recall anyone wishing eid mubark to them. this is a mockery and just bbc islam, not the real islam.
Some muslims wear hadscarves, some dont. Some muslims don't sing/listen to ANY songs, some listen to/sing only religious ones and some listen to/ sing any song. All religions frown upon (at best) homosexuality, yet there are gay people in every country and every religion. Im a practicing hindu and I dont get wished happy diwali, yet I and many of my hindu friends go to church at Easter to enjoy the traditions and celebrations.
Why not stop sticking people in boxes and telling people how to think, instead accept that we are all individuals and it is our life experiences that make us who we are and guide how each one of us lives.
this is a joke, whatever christians want to believe and celebrate is fine. but why should any muslim celebrate a holiday, christmas, that everyone knows was originally a pagan holiday and no one knows when jesus was born. same like easter has its origins in paganism
this is a joke, whatever christians want to believe and celebrate is fine. but why should any muslim celebrate a holiday, christmas, that everyone knows was originally a pagan holiday and no one knows when jesus was born. same like easter has its origins in paganism
And whatever Muslims want to believe and celebrate is fine also surely, if that means singing a carol it means singing a carol......I suppose you would also try and tell us that all Muslims do not drink.......
Tell it as it is or dont tell it at all becasue it will NOT wash with those of us living in the real world that actually see what goes on.
"Do as I say and not do as I do" does not exist anymore, in any religion, free communication between all religions has seen to that thankfully.
Ok right, lets clear this up for once and for all...
I am a Pakistani Muslim exactly like the Masood family.
1.) I dont cover my head - however based on what I believe, I believe as long as my legs and chest isn't showing I'm fine. The Masoods dress more or less the same and NONE of my family, relatives, cousins or even Muslim friends, are offended by the way they dress because we all dress more or less the same.
2.) I sing carols. You seem to talk (catsmeow) as if its some great big sin. But in Islam you would know that Muslims believe in Jesus p.b.u.h as one of the Prophets. So why can't we sing about him? He is as dominant in our religion as he is in Christianity.
3.) The gay storyline between Christian and Syed is like maria said a "social" issue and is currently being sensitively handled. I'm actually totally FOR Christian and Syed getting together !!
4.) You're complaining about nobody wishing the Masood's a 'Happy Eid'... are you really that petty? Did you see them running around wishing all Christians a Happy Xmas?
5.) You complain about other characters not fasting ... why should they, they're not Muslims afterr all? Also, you should just be happy that they even extensively mentioned it how many times they did. Because that would have taught a lot of people about the month of Ramadaan.
6.) Finally, I as a young British Pakistani Muslim girl, am EXTREMELY proud to have the Masood family being represented in the way that they are. I love them and they a breath of fresh air IMO. Also, I see a lot of my own family in them which is pleasant to see. I think that the previous attempt from EE to represent an Asian family was with the Ferraria's and I utterly hated them!
Nina Wadia, Nitin Ginatra, Marc Elliot, Himesh Patel and the girl who plays Shabs (sorry I've forgotten her name) all do a FANTASIC job in showing the Masood's and I cant be any more proud!
PS - Catsmeow, you've quite conveniently forgotten to mention other things that the BBC have done to show Muslim Pakistani families in an authentic way such as: Mentioning the Mosque, Showing Syed reading Namaaz, Zainab and Masood's dialogues in Urdu/Panjabi, cooking Asian food and more ... so I think you need to look at how well they've portrayed them and stop finding silly things to pick on!!!
Although i disagree with the making of this thread, as there's so many more issues British Muslims are facing to get vexed over bloody Eastenders giving a false image, he has got a point.
I like you are a Pakistani Muslim. I like you dont wear the Hijab, however the similarity ends there. My family is nothing like the the Masoods. To be honest i have never met a Pakistani family so westernised. I've met Iranian and Egyptian families like the Masoods, and therefore if they had made them of that ethnicity it would have made it more believable. Us Pakistanis, yourself not included of course are probably the most socially conservative group of Muslims in the UK.
I really didnt want to make a post on the whole 'Gay Muslim' thing, but you are not representative and the Masoods are definately not of Pakistani Muslims, and i think it gives English people a false image of us.
I dont care if more English people have a positive image of us, or think Muslims are 'normal' because its giving a false expectation of how we dress, how we act, or how we react to Christmas!! I've never sung a Christmas Carol, I dont Celebrate it and I dont intend to, I dont give out cards and I only ever greet friends who've greeted me on Eid. Its a two way street. By the way we dont believe Jesus p.b.uh. was born on Christmas, and due to the Pagan/Polytheistic origins of the date, celebrating it is essentially a sin. So you would never see the majority of Pakistani Muslims in a sqaure singing Carols, and why should we?
Now on to the 'Gay Muslim' issue. I think there is nothing wrong with the story im particularly not interested in it, more so because i can't stand Christian, but Gay people who identify themselves as Muslims exist, i've met One. The reason why i have defined it as above, is a large chunk of Muslims in the UK wouldnt consider such a person a Muslim.I personally wouldnt as go so far, if thats how they define themselves then so be it. I dont wear the Hijab and i dont dress particularly conservatively, and although its not a major sin as being Gay it is a sin nevertheless. A sin for which i may not be forgiven, so i really shouldnt be telling someone his sin is worse than mine and takes him out of the faith.
However most Muslims would disagree with me, including most of my friends and family. Quite a few no longer watch Eastenders, others foward it, like we do in our house when 'Chyred' are on
Majority of us Pakistanis are not liberal or that westernised and its very misleading to make us look that way. No Pakistani Parents i know act like Zainab and Masood, especially the kissing and tactileness in front of the kids. And another thing, no self respecting Pakistani woman would 'show' her Pregnant bump. Its not seemed to be classy, and it invites the evil eye. We cover the bump with a dupatta or a coat. Its just not realistic to have her galavanting around like that.
Finally i have no problem with how the Masoods are depicted clearly they are a small number of Pakistanis like the poster i quoted, who act like that. A small amount, yet they are there, and therefore i guess should be represented. However its naive to think most Pakistanis are like that. And i feel Eastenders is making it look like that. However if they had a normal Pakistani family, it would be boring, it would be a family of Dots', the only possible storyline would be a terrorism one. And so i can understand why Eastenders have glamourised it.
And finally i would have thought, there would be a lot more going than just a tv show to make you proud of who you are. Just because some English people are suddenly nice about Pakistanis or we have a cool Muslim family on a soap, doesnt alter anything that happens to me day to day, and wont change the image or 'coolness' of Muslims in the long run
What the??? How are the Masoods not being portrayed properly because as far I can see, they are being portrayed respectfully. Ok they do not wear Headscarf's or Hats, so doesn't a lot of Muslims in this country so it's real to see them without a headscarf for the women or a hat for the men in the family, just as long as they are also dressed appropriately. They did Ramadan, what more can I say?
There's a lot more points I could say but ChryedCrazy has already pointed them out (Big Shoutout to you :P).
They may be the 'West Version' of a typical muslim family but a lot of muslim families are 'western' influenced too like myself and I'm sure a lot more other familes too so therefore it would be realistic.
They're realistic if they are portraying westernised (maybe a proportion of London Muslims, i know you're from Birmingham.) muslims like yourself. But they are definately not realistic if portraying the majority of British Pakistani Muslims.I may dress westernised, same with my friends, but we all have an Asian/Pakistani/Eastern/Muslim view on how to act and live our lives. Its amazing apart from Yasmin Alibhai Brown and Laila Rouass, you and the other lady poster on here, are the most westernised Muslims i know. Not sure why, maybe down to the fact i live Up North.
Im repeating myself now, lol, but I have never met any muslim family like the Masoods or of any family accepting of a gay child. I know of two Gay men, one his family dont know yet as he's from out of town at Uni. The other his family is no longer in contact with him. If they have any Pakistani friends its not much, and its solely girls. Pakistanis (Up North at least, as going from posters here, a different breed inhabit Down South)at the moment are not very accepting of Gays amongst their midst. Its weird they're more accepting if the gay person is Caucasian. Its seen ironically seen as normal then.
Although i disagree with the making of this thread, as there's so many more issues British Muslims are facing to get vexed over bloody Eastenders giving a false image, he has got a point.
I like you are a Pakistani Muslim. I like you dont wear the Hijab, however the similarity ends there. My family is nothing like the the Masoods. To be honest i have never met a Pakistani family so westernised. I've met Iranian and Egyptian families like the Masoods, and therefore if they had made them of that ethnicity it would have made it more believable. Us Pakistanis, yourself not included of course are probably the most socially conservative group of Muslims in the UK.
I really didnt want to make a post on the whole 'Gay Muslim' thing, but you are not representative and the Masoods are definately not of Pakistani Muslims, and i think it gives English people a false image of us.
I dont care if more English people have a positive image of us, or think Muslims are 'normal' because its giving a false expectation of how we dress, how we act, or how we react to Christmas!! I've never sung a Christmas Carol, I dont Celebrate it and I dont intend to, I dont give out cards and I only ever greet friends who've greeted me on Eid. Its a two way street. By the way we dont believe Jesus p.b.uh. was born on Christmas, and due to the Pagan/Polytheistic origins of the date, celebrating it is essentially a sin. So you would never see the majority of Pakistani Muslims in a sqaure singing Carols, and why should we?
Now on to the 'Gay Muslim' issue. I think there is nothing wrong with the story im particularly not interested in it, more so because i can't stand Christian, but Gay people who identify themselves as Muslims exist, i've met One. The reason why i have defined it as above, is a large chunk of Muslims in the UK wouldnt consider such a person a Muslim.I personally wouldnt as go so far, if thats how they define themselves then so be it. I dont wear the Hijab and i dont dress particularly conservatively, and although its not a major sin as being Gay it is a sin nevertheless. A sin for which i may not be forgiven, so i really shouldnt be telling someone his sin is worse than mine and takes him out of the faith.
However most Muslims would disagree with me, including most of my friends and family. Quite a few no longer watch Eastenders, others foward it, like we do in our house when 'Chyred' are on
Majority of us Pakistanis are not liberal or that westernised and its very misleading to make us look that way. No Pakistani Parents i know act like Zainab and Masood, especially the kissing and tactileness in front of the kids. And another thing, no self respecting Pakistani woman would 'show' her Pregnant bump. Its not seemed to be classy, and it invites the evil eye. We cover the bump with a dupatta or a coat. Its just not realistic to have her galavanting around like that.
Finally i have no problem with how the Masoods are depicted clearly they are a small number of Pakistanis like the poster i quoted, who act like that. A small amount, yet they are there, and therefore i guess should be represented. However its naive to think most Pakistanis are like that. And i feel Eastenders is making it look like that. However if they had a normal Pakistani family, it would be boring, it would be a family of Dots', the only possible storyline would be a terrorism one. And so i can understand why Eastenders have glamourised it.
And finally i would have thought, there would be a lot more going than just a tv show to make you proud of who you are. Just because some English people are suddenly nice about Pakistanis or we have a cool Muslim family on a soap, doesnt alter anything that happens to me day to day, and wont change the image or 'coolness' of Muslims in the long run
I fear that humility and the real world are evading some posting on this forum.
I am white, I watch eastenders and funnily enough, not one white person within the show is anything like me either, strange that ;-)
Do you think that I assimilate with being depicted as a being boozed up, uncouth, swearing, scruffy chav and totally lacking in any morals?
Everything is larger than life and then some on top for good measure to make a storyline, any storyline and any characters they wish to make an effect.
If anyone actually watches a programme such as eastenders and then assimilates all nationalities with what they see in the script, they should be banned from watching TV because it is obviously far to dangerous a media for some naieve people to watch.
Although i disagree with the making of this thread, as there's so many more issues British Muslims are facing to get vexed over bloody Eastenders giving a false image, he has got a point.
I like you are a Pakistani Muslim. I like you dont wear the Hijab, however the similarity ends there. My family is nothing like the the Masoods. To be honest i have never met a Pakistani family so westernised. I've met Iranian and Egyptian families like the Masoods, and therefore if they had made them of that ethnicity it would have made it more believable. Us Pakistanis, yourself not included of course are probably the most socially conservative group of Muslims in the UK.
I really didnt want to make a post on the whole 'Gay Muslim' thing, but you are not representative and the Masoods are definately not of Pakistani Muslims, and i think it gives English people a false image of us.
I dont care if more English people have a positive image of us, or think Muslims are 'normal' because its giving a false expectation of how we dress, how we act, or how we react to Christmas!! I've never sung a Christmas Carol, I dont Celebrate it and I dont intend to, I dont give out cards and I only ever greet friends who've greeted me on Eid. Its a two way street. By the way we dont believe Jesus p.b.uh. was born on Christmas, and due to the Pagan/Polytheistic origins of the date, celebrating it is essentially a sin. So you would never see the majority of Pakistani Muslims in a sqaure singing Carols, and why should we?
Now on to the 'Gay Muslim' issue. I think there is nothing wrong with the story im particularly not interested in it, more so because i can't stand Christian, but Gay people who identify themselves as Muslims exist, i've met One. The reason why i have defined it as above, is a large chunk of Muslims in the UK wouldnt consider such a person a Muslim.I personally wouldnt as go so far, if thats how they define themselves then so be it. I dont wear the Hijab and i dont dress particularly conservatively, and although its not a major sin as being Gay it is a sin nevertheless. A sin for which i may not be forgiven, so i really shouldnt be telling someone his sin is worse than mine and takes him out of the faith.
However most Muslims would disagree with me, including most of my friends and family. Quite a few no longer watch Eastenders, others foward it, like we do in our house when 'Chyred' are on
Majority of us Pakistanis are not liberal or that westernised and its very misleading to make us look that way. No Pakistani Parents i know act like Zainab and Masood, especially the kissing and tactileness in front of the kids. And another thing, no self respecting Pakistani woman would 'show' her Pregnant bump. Its not seemed to be classy, and it invites the evil eye. We cover the bump with a dupatta or a coat. Its just not realistic to have her galavanting around like that.
Finally i have no problem with how the Masoods are depicted clearly they are a small number of Pakistanis like the poster i quoted, who act like that. A small amount, yet they are there, and therefore i guess should be represented. However its naive to think most Pakistanis are like that. And i feel Eastenders is making it look like that. However if they had a normal Pakistani family, it would be boring, it would be a family of Dots', the only possible storyline would be a terrorism one. And so i can understand why Eastenders have glamourised it.
And finally i would have thought, there would be a lot more going than just a tv show to make you proud of who you are. Just because some English people are suddenly nice about Pakistanis or we have a cool Muslim family on a soap, doesnt alter anything that happens to me day to day, and wont change the image or 'coolness' of Muslims in the long run
bold bit 1. = such a generalisation about a person you know little about, no one person or type of person represents a whole community, am not a pakistani muslim, am half Indian and half Arabian, but have very close Pakistani friends, and they would disagree with you. westernisation is a concept of culture not religion.. hence the original poster noting its a insult to islam, I strongly disagree .
Bold bit 2 re christmas repost the islamic view on this.. you may take a cultural stance on this but the following stands
Christmas is an annual Christian religious holiday commemorating the birth of Prophet Jesus, peace be upon him. For many Muslims who even do not celebrate the birthday of the Prophet Muhammad, peace be upon him, it becomes an issue of what stand they should take.
There have been a number of legitimate criticisms of the holiday from Muslims and non-Muslims based on theological and cultural considerations. However, this cannot be used to disregard the holiday as merely an exercise in ancient pagan practices, for instance, or excessive consumerism. Muslims have to remember that for practicing Christians, Christmas really is about Jesus.
Prophet Muhammad, peace be upon him, was so accommodating of Christians that according to the two earliest Islamic historians, Ibn e Saad and Ibn Hisham, the Prophet even allowed a delegation of 60 Byzantine Christians from Najran in Yemen to worship in his own mosque in Madinah. Lead by their bishop (Usquf), they had come to discuss a number of issues with him. When time of their prayer came, they asked the Prophet's permission to perform this in the mosque. He answered, "conduct your service here in the mosque. It is a place consecrated to God."
God expects us to stay away from mocking the religious beliefs of others, no matter how much we disagree with them. He says in the Quran: "And insult not those whom they (disbelievers) worship besides God, lest they insult God wrongfully without knowledge. Thus We have made fair-seeming to each people its own doings; then to their Lord is their return and He shall then inform them of all that they used to do" (Quran, 6:108).
Bold bit 3 - seriously ... am not sure i understood clearly. so a pakistani muslim family and terrorism is the correct and perfect image.. am not sure you meant that
Bold bit 4 - its a soap its not meant to .. there bigger issues in the political arena whether in relation to equality, race, color and religion.. a soap isn't the place to fix it.
In conclusion - The original poster noted it insulted islam and though I dont believe the masoods are a perfect example of every muslim family any more then Dot and lucas are a representation of every christian family, I don't believe they are insultive or a unfair watered down version of a muslim family
Im repeating myself now, lol, but I have never met any muslim family like the Masoods or of any family accepting of a gay child. I know of two Gay men, one his family dont know yet as he's from out of town at Uni. The other his family is no longer in contact with him. If they have any Pakistani friends its not much, and its solely girls. Pakistanis (Up North at least, as going from posters here, a different breed inhabit Down South)at the moment are not very accepting of Gays amongst their midst. Its weird they're more accepting if the gay person is Caucasian. Its seen ironically seen as normal then.
I think that you are misunderstanding of white UK residents. It is NOT seen as "normal" to be be gay, it IS "allowed" and "tolerated" which is very different.
The main reason for this non acceptance of gay as being "normal", with all religions, is the ("normal", "straight") males of the species. They do not wish to be associated with producing a child that will NOT carry on the family genes, they see this as failure in a most basic and neanderthal way.
Secondly, they also do not wish for others to look upon themselves as in any way not "normal" or "straight", therefore for some they have to cast them out (no doubt a relief for some).
For me, the most important thing that my parents, Mother and Father have given me is love, acceptance and pride in me being me. Not being bothered about what others think of me or them as they are totally unimportant when real love is given and recieved.
come on. this is the wests version of islam. be more like us and we will like you. this is the fact
LOL! No thanks, I'm fine the way I am LOL!
And who's to say what Muslims should do/and how they should act/ be portrayed on tv? Every Muslims family, though the basic fundamentals of Islam would be adhered to, will have major similarities and more importantly differences between them all.
but why not let them be a perfect muslim family, quoting the quran and living by the sunnahs and in that way teaching something about islam that the view maybe does not know
How many soaps show devout Christain families going about their everyday lives? none!
And, if ITV or BBC made such, there would be an outcry no doubt........
Now, can I go to a Muslin country, build and open a Christian church and have Christian actors with Christain views quoting the Bible and fitting in as "normal" on Muslim television channels?
They're realistic if they are portraying westernised (maybe a proportion of London Muslims, i know you're from Birmingham.) muslims like yourself. But they are definately not realistic if portraying the majority of British Pakistani Muslims.I may dress westernised, same with my friends, but we all have an Asian/Pakistani/Eastern/Muslim view on how to act and live our lives. Its amazing apart from Yasmin Alibhai Brown and Laila Rouass, you and the other lady poster on here, are the most westernised Muslims i know. Not sure why, maybe down to the fact i live Up North.
Im repeating myself now, lol, but I have never met any muslim family like the Masoods or of any family accepting of a gay child. I know of two Gay men, one his family dont know yet as he's from out of town at Uni. The other his family is no longer in contact with him. If they have any Pakistani friends its not much, and its solely girls. Pakistanis (Up North at least, as going from posters here, a different breed inhabit Down South)at the moment are not very accepting of Gays amongst their midst. Its weird they're more accepting if the gay person is Caucasian. Its seen ironically seen as normal then.
Lol Let me elaborate on this. I dress moderately and appropriately but I also know how to behave like a Muslim should. I don't drink, I don't smoke, I've never taken drugs. To sum it up I dress in a western manner but everyday I always do remember that I am Muslim therefore I know how to behave and act as a British Pakistani Female Muslim living in the UK. I don't think me and the other posters are the only ones that are the most western. I know a lot of Muslim females who do dress in a western manner but have always maintained that they should be dress moderately. I need to point out that the only times I don't wear western clothing, basically my Pakistani clothing is when I'm visiting a relative, we have visitors or I'm at home. However sometimes I might wear my Pakistani clothing while I'm out, depending on my mood lol.
Can I quickly point out that Masood and Zainab don't know that there son is gay lol.
Comments
But isn't it representative of the British population - what percentage of families actually go to Church every Sunday? The future Head of CofE comitted adultary throughout his marriage. In the Southern American states they too would be deeply offended if a catholic family was portrayed like the McQueens. I think this was the first year an American soap showed two men kissing or in a relationship.
I'm feeling left out, I have no religion
Oh and catsmeow, just for the record (and to be different) christianity states sex before marriage is a sin and I think we've seen quite a lot of eastenders christians doing the big bible nono. Shall I write to ofcom and complain they are showing christians in an unrealistic light?
awww Give me a Hug, I'm here for you :P
((((((((((((((((((((((((((HUG)))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))
There are no muslim songs- but you are right it would a lovely act to join in with the community. At school I sang christmas songs and hymns but would omit words to the effect that Jesus was the Son of God and at the Catholic school I went to I didn't have to say the Trinity before eating. Apart from that we have equal respect for Jesus as the prophet Mohammed.
loved reading your posts by the way, always interesting to read views from someone who knows about this
Why would you omit that Jesus is not the son of god, another way of interpreting this is that we are all in effect sons and daughters of god as he is our creator. Therefore Jesus being the son of god should not be offensive to Muslims, it is how you want to interpret this.
As a Muslim myself I interpret what it means to me and do not follow the general consensus on what it means. Religion is their to be studied and interpreted on what you think not what others say.
And they're just one family, they couldn't possibly represent all Muslims anyway. Some, like my dad, only bother with praying and going to the Mosque when it's Ramadan and for the rest of the year don't seem to follow the religion at all. A few other relatives are super-strict Muslims (like veiled aunts who won't even let male doctors look at them, uncles who follow this strict dress code and check their beard lengths, won't have a television in the house because it's an 'evil influence' on the kids). So I think the Masoods are a pretty fair representation of the 'average' Muslim family.
LOL I'm glad it has
Yeah well, when there is a topic about Muslims for example, I need to put my view across as I am a Muslim myself so everyone else who isn't Muslim gets a better understanding. Unfortunantly it's turned into an ugly insult battle. I think the discussion's back now
Also we all need to be opened minded about opinions and facts.
To the OP, from one Muslim to another, please show that you are a dignifying Muslim if you really want to set an example to everyone else that we are a good and peaceful religion. The reason I am still here is because I really don't want other users to think otherwise, that every Muslim has to insult other people's cultures when we are trying to make a debate over the thread title. Islam is about peace, please show it.
Totally agree
I'm not religious, but I visit church at christmas, for me it's a matter of respect.
I'm also always interested in hearing others believes and always respect them even if I don't always agree
The masoods are brilliant and a very realistic portrayal of uk living muslims, just had to add that
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Some muslims wear hadscarves, some dont. Some muslims don't sing/listen to ANY songs, some listen to/sing only religious ones and some listen to/ sing any song. All religions frown upon (at best) homosexuality, yet there are gay people in every country and every religion. Im a practicing hindu and I dont get wished happy diwali, yet I and many of my hindu friends go to church at Easter to enjoy the traditions and celebrations.
Why not stop sticking people in boxes and telling people how to think, instead accept that we are all individuals and it is our life experiences that make us who we are and guide how each one of us lives.
I'm going to let you in on a little secret, I know a Jew who eats Pork :eek:
Another secret, I know a Christian who doesn't go to Church :eek:
Religion is poison, be your own god.
Dont agree.
And whatever Muslims want to believe and celebrate is fine also surely, if that means singing a carol it means singing a carol......I suppose you would also try and tell us that all Muslims do not drink.......
Tell it as it is or dont tell it at all becasue it will NOT wash with those of us living in the real world that actually see what goes on.
"Do as I say and not do as I do" does not exist anymore, in any religion, free communication between all religions has seen to that thankfully.
Although i disagree with the making of this thread, as there's so many more issues British Muslims are facing to get vexed over bloody Eastenders giving a false image, he has got a point.
I like you are a Pakistani Muslim. I like you dont wear the Hijab, however the similarity ends there. My family is nothing like the the Masoods. To be honest i have never met a Pakistani family so westernised. I've met Iranian and Egyptian families like the Masoods, and therefore if they had made them of that ethnicity it would have made it more believable. Us Pakistanis, yourself not included of course are probably the most socially conservative group of Muslims in the UK.
I really didnt want to make a post on the whole 'Gay Muslim' thing, but you are not representative and the Masoods are definately not of Pakistani Muslims, and i think it gives English people a false image of us.
I dont care if more English people have a positive image of us, or think Muslims are 'normal' because its giving a false expectation of how we dress, how we act, or how we react to Christmas!! I've never sung a Christmas Carol, I dont Celebrate it and I dont intend to, I dont give out cards and I only ever greet friends who've greeted me on Eid. Its a two way street. By the way we dont believe Jesus p.b.uh. was born on Christmas, and due to the Pagan/Polytheistic origins of the date, celebrating it is essentially a sin. So you would never see the majority of Pakistani Muslims in a sqaure singing Carols, and why should we?
Now on to the 'Gay Muslim' issue. I think there is nothing wrong with the story im particularly not interested in it, more so because i can't stand Christian, but Gay people who identify themselves as Muslims exist, i've met One. The reason why i have defined it as above, is a large chunk of Muslims in the UK wouldnt consider such a person a Muslim.I personally wouldnt as go so far, if thats how they define themselves then so be it. I dont wear the Hijab and i dont dress particularly conservatively, and although its not a major sin as being Gay it is a sin nevertheless. A sin for which i may not be forgiven, so i really shouldnt be telling someone his sin is worse than mine and takes him out of the faith.
However most Muslims would disagree with me, including most of my friends and family. Quite a few no longer watch Eastenders, others foward it, like we do in our house when 'Chyred' are on
Majority of us Pakistanis are not liberal or that westernised and its very misleading to make us look that way. No Pakistani Parents i know act like Zainab and Masood, especially the kissing and tactileness in front of the kids. And another thing, no self respecting Pakistani woman would 'show' her Pregnant bump. Its not seemed to be classy, and it invites the evil eye. We cover the bump with a dupatta or a coat. Its just not realistic to have her galavanting around like that.
Finally i have no problem with how the Masoods are depicted clearly they are a small number of Pakistanis like the poster i quoted, who act like that. A small amount, yet they are there, and therefore i guess should be represented. However its naive to think most Pakistanis are like that. And i feel Eastenders is making it look like that. However if they had a normal Pakistani family, it would be boring, it would be a family of Dots', the only possible storyline would be a terrorism one. And so i can understand why Eastenders have glamourised it.
And finally i would have thought, there would be a lot more going than just a tv show to make you proud of who you are. Just because some English people are suddenly nice about Pakistanis or we have a cool Muslim family on a soap, doesnt alter anything that happens to me day to day, and wont change the image or 'coolness' of Muslims in the long run
They're realistic if they are portraying westernised (maybe a proportion of London Muslims, i know you're from Birmingham.) muslims like yourself. But they are definately not realistic if portraying the majority of British Pakistani Muslims.I may dress westernised, same with my friends, but we all have an Asian/Pakistani/Eastern/Muslim view on how to act and live our lives. Its amazing apart from Yasmin Alibhai Brown and Laila Rouass, you and the other lady poster on here, are the most westernised Muslims i know. Not sure why, maybe down to the fact i live Up North.
Im repeating myself now, lol, but I have never met any muslim family like the Masoods or of any family accepting of a gay child. I know of two Gay men, one his family dont know yet as he's from out of town at Uni. The other his family is no longer in contact with him. If they have any Pakistani friends its not much, and its solely girls. Pakistanis (Up North at least, as going from posters here, a different breed inhabit Down South)at the moment are not very accepting of Gays amongst their midst. Its weird they're more accepting if the gay person is Caucasian. Its seen ironically seen as normal then.
I fear that humility and the real world are evading some posting on this forum.
I am white, I watch eastenders and funnily enough, not one white person within the show is anything like me either, strange that ;-)
Do you think that I assimilate with being depicted as a being boozed up, uncouth, swearing, scruffy chav and totally lacking in any morals?
Everything is larger than life and then some on top for good measure to make a storyline, any storyline and any characters they wish to make an effect.
If anyone actually watches a programme such as eastenders and then assimilates all nationalities with what they see in the script, they should be banned from watching TV because it is obviously far to dangerous a media for some naieve people to watch.
bold bit 1. = such a generalisation about a person you know little about, no one person or type of person represents a whole community, am not a pakistani muslim, am half Indian and half Arabian, but have very close Pakistani friends, and they would disagree with you. westernisation is a concept of culture not religion.. hence the original poster noting its a insult to islam, I strongly disagree .
Bold bit 2 re christmas repost the islamic view on this.. you may take a cultural stance on this but the following stands
Christmas is an annual Christian religious holiday commemorating the birth of Prophet Jesus, peace be upon him. For many Muslims who even do not celebrate the birthday of the Prophet Muhammad, peace be upon him, it becomes an issue of what stand they should take.
There have been a number of legitimate criticisms of the holiday from Muslims and non-Muslims based on theological and cultural considerations. However, this cannot be used to disregard the holiday as merely an exercise in ancient pagan practices, for instance, or excessive consumerism. Muslims have to remember that for practicing Christians, Christmas really is about Jesus.
Prophet Muhammad, peace be upon him, was so accommodating of Christians that according to the two earliest Islamic historians, Ibn e Saad and Ibn Hisham, the Prophet even allowed a delegation of 60 Byzantine Christians from Najran in Yemen to worship in his own mosque in Madinah. Lead by their bishop (Usquf), they had come to discuss a number of issues with him. When time of their prayer came, they asked the Prophet's permission to perform this in the mosque. He answered, "conduct your service here in the mosque. It is a place consecrated to God."
God expects us to stay away from mocking the religious beliefs of others, no matter how much we disagree with them. He says in the Quran: "And insult not those whom they (disbelievers) worship besides God, lest they insult God wrongfully without knowledge. Thus We have made fair-seeming to each people its own doings; then to their Lord is their return and He shall then inform them of all that they used to do" (Quran, 6:108).
Bold bit 3 - seriously ... am not sure i understood clearly. so a pakistani muslim family and terrorism is the correct and perfect image.. am not sure you meant that
Bold bit 4 - its a soap its not meant to .. there bigger issues in the political arena whether in relation to equality, race, color and religion.. a soap isn't the place to fix it.
In conclusion - The original poster noted it insulted islam and though I dont believe the masoods are a perfect example of every muslim family any more then Dot and lucas are a representation of every christian family, I don't believe they are insultive or a unfair watered down version of a muslim family
I think that you are misunderstanding of white UK residents. It is NOT seen as "normal" to be be gay, it IS "allowed" and "tolerated" which is very different.
The main reason for this non acceptance of gay as being "normal", with all religions, is the ("normal", "straight") males of the species. They do not wish to be associated with producing a child that will NOT carry on the family genes, they see this as failure in a most basic and neanderthal way.
Secondly, they also do not wish for others to look upon themselves as in any way not "normal" or "straight", therefore for some they have to cast them out (no doubt a relief for some).
For me, the most important thing that my parents, Mother and Father have given me is love, acceptance and pride in me being me. Not being bothered about what others think of me or them as they are totally unimportant when real love is given and recieved.
LOL! No thanks, I'm fine the way I am LOL!
And who's to say what Muslims should do/and how they should act/ be portrayed on tv? Every Muslims family, though the basic fundamentals of Islam would be adhered to, will have major similarities and more importantly differences between them all.
So therefore this topic IMHO is moot.
How many soaps show devout Christain families going about their everyday lives? none!
And, if ITV or BBC made such, there would be an outcry no doubt........
Now, can I go to a Muslin country, build and open a Christian church and have Christian actors with Christain views quoting the Bible and fitting in as "normal" on Muslim television channels?
Lol Let me elaborate on this. I dress moderately and appropriately but I also know how to behave like a Muslim should. I don't drink, I don't smoke, I've never taken drugs. To sum it up I dress in a western manner but everyday I always do remember that I am Muslim therefore I know how to behave and act as a British Pakistani Female Muslim living in the UK. I don't think me and the other posters are the only ones that are the most western. I know a lot of Muslim females who do dress in a western manner but have always maintained that they should be dress moderately. I need to point out that the only times I don't wear western clothing, basically my Pakistani clothing is when I'm visiting a relative, we have visitors or I'm at home. However sometimes I might wear my Pakistani clothing while I'm out, depending on my mood lol.
Can I quickly point out that Masood and Zainab don't know that there son is gay lol.