The worse one was Murder She Wrote set in Ireland not Britain though, so bad it's good.
The Remington Steel episode set in Ireland was so Dire Brosnan apologised to the Irish and quit the show (as far as I remember - must wiki it to confirm).
How many British shows are abundant in characters whose speech is difficult to understand? With all the choices Americans have for things to watch on TV, with audiences for any particular programme shrinking year by year, there is no point in giving members of the target audience (Americans) one more reason to switch the channel. These prgrammes live or die by American ratings, not by what British people think of them.
No, "patronising" suggests an assumed superiority on the part of the producers to their audience. I explained above the very practical reasons for doing something a particular way, and the way it is done is not one the audience of Americans can see as in any way insulting. As a Brit YOU seem to be insulted, but that is something different than "patronising."
It's not just Americans who are ignorant, English Southerners genuinely seem to believe that the North is full of grinding poverty, cobbled streets and men in flat caps walking whippets.
Some of the excuses from BBC staff for not moving to Salford were;"there is only only specialist cheese shop" , "my boyfriend is a professional hair stylist and won't be able to get a job" and "I can't move to Salford because I'm a vegetarian."
It's not just Americans who are ignorant, English Southerners genuinely seem to believe that the North is full of grinding poverty, cobbled streets and men in flat caps walking whippets.
Some of the excuses from BBC staff for not moving to Salford were;"there is only only specialist cheese shop" , "my boyfriend is a professional hair stylist and won't be able to get a job" and "I can't move to Salford because I'm a vegetarian."
:D:D
I must say up north there isn't really a general stereotype of southerners, it's more fragmented into cockneys, Essex people and country bumpkins.
It's not just Americans who are ignorant, English Southerners genuinely seem to believe that the North is full of grinding poverty, cobbled streets and men in flat caps walking whippets.
Some of the excuses from BBC staff for not moving to Salford were;"there is only only specialist cheese shop" , "my boyfriend is a professional hair stylist and won't be able to get a job" and "I can't move to Salford because I'm a vegetarian."
Same could be said of Northerners views of London?
I don't like the way alot of American shows depict Britain. One I actually didn't mind was Buffy. Giles was British and thankfully they had a British actor rather than an American putting on a posh accent.
It's funny how America does seem to think most people here speak in a very posh way and drink tea all the time. Lol
It's funny how America does seem to think most people here speak in a very posh way and drink tea all the time. Lol
I already explained the accent business above (to reiterate, and in short, no, Americans don't think British janitors and the like speak like the Queen).
As for tea drinking, define "all the time?" On a per capita basis, Brits drink over FIVE TIMES as much tea as Americans (1.89 kg to 0.33 kg), and Ireland and the UK are both in the Top 6 for world tea consumption, while no other Western nation is in the Top 40. So I don't think Americans are out of line in thinking that you drink a lot of tea. Looking at the figures, the thing that surprises me is how much more tea the Irish drink than UK people: 3.22 kg to your 1.89 kg per capita, when nobody stereotypes the Irish as bigger tea drinkers than Brits.
I already explained the accent business above (to reiterate, and in short, no, Americans don't think British janitors and the like speak like the Queen).
As for tea drinking, define "all the time?" On a per capita basis, Brits drink over FIVE TIMES as much tea as Americans (1.89 kg to 0.33 kg), and Ireland and the UK are both in the Top 6 for world tea consumption, while no other Western nation is in the Top 40. So I don't think Americans are out of line in thinking that you drink a lot of tea. Looking at the figures, the thing that surprises me is how much more tea the Irish drink than UK people: 3.22 kg to your 1.89 kg per capita, when nobody stereotypes the Irish as bigger tea drinkers than Brits.
But we drink 2.8kg of coffee per capita, so it's not accurate to portray Brits as always drinking tea when it's more likely to be coffee.
But we drink 2.8kg of coffee per capita, so it's not accurate to portray Brits as always drinking tea when it's more likely to be coffee.
But that gets back to my challenge to the other FM: define "all the time?" American TV shows and movies are not setting out to represent a picture of how much coffee is consumed relative to how much tea. In depicting a British movie or TV character for an American audience, the character is going to be more interesting if he is shown to have some differences from the typical American. The disparity between the popularity of coffee and tea in the US is so severe (4.2 kg to 0.33 kg consumed per capita) that Brits liking tea as much as they do is an interesting oddity, to an American. I don't see why this should bother Brits, as it is not like the Americans are ridiculing Brits in any way for drinking a lot of tea.
Why is is so often foggy when Britain is depicted in American films/TV programmes when we get a bit of mist on a few winter mornings and that's about it.
I already explained the accent business above (to reiterate, and in short, no, Americans don't think British janitors and the like speak like the Queen).
As for tea drinking, define "all the time?" On a per capita basis, Brits drink over FIVE TIMES as much tea as Americans (1.89 kg to 0.33 kg), and Ireland and the UK are both in the Top 6 for world tea consumption, while no other Western nation is in the Top 40. So I don't think Americans are out of line in thinking that you drink a lot of tea. Looking at the figures, the thing that surprises me is how much more tea the Irish drink than UK people: 3.22 kg to your 1.89 kg per capita, when nobody stereotypes the Irish as bigger tea drinkers than Brits.
I wasn't planning on thinking about it to that extent to be honest.
Why is is so often foggy when Britain is depicted in American films/TV programmes when we get a bit of mist on a few winter mornings and that's about it.
I haven't noticed that in MODERN films or TV series (the ones I see anyway, as I don't see everything). I recall a lot of old movies with that feature, a kind of visual signature for Britain. I wonder how many places in the US get foggy at all, ever. Just the fact that Britain gets some fog, occasionally, may strike Americans as interesting enough that it has been put in films as something novel.
Not really a depiction but I watched the first episode of "falling skies" and one of the characters, who if I remember was a history professor, is telling someone about "the Scottish fighting the British at Stirling bridge". That would be impossible as if you're Scottish then you're British, not to mention that battle took place 410 years before great Britain was formed! I realise thats petty and it's just a tv show but if you're going to reference something you clearly don't know anything about then google it or something.
Actually, technically speaking, if you're being very pedantic, Britain is the union of England and Wales. It becomes GREAT Britain when you add Scotland (and the United Kingdom when you throw in Northern Ireland) but fundamentally your point is correct.
I haven't noticed that in MODERN films or TV series (the ones I see anyway, as I don't see everything). I recall a lot of old movies with that feature, a kind of visual signature for Britain. I wonder how many places in the US get foggy at all, ever. Just the fact that Britain gets some fog, occasionally, may strike Americans as interesting enough that it has been put in films as something novel.
Well if you're talking 1950s and early 60s it's probably smog rather than fog. Sherlock Holmes is always seen leaping in and out of smog. Not very charming stuff though. Bit of a killer for those with breathing issues. London was a hideous place to live in when the smog was bad. Sometimes these images just stick around. Maybe the US hasn't heard of the Clean Air Act:D
Another vote for ER, and I'd also add Friends UK episodes - I don't care who they consulted- it was risible, and Daphnes family with their wandering accents in Frasier.
ER was particularly bad in the episode they set in London 2002. Although set in contemporary London the characters attitudes and script were straight out of Victorian times. At one point a hospital consultant queries why his colleague is not wearing a black dress, this because she's a fairly recent widow- unbelievable!
I think that it's interesting how many of these issues occur when the characters involved are being played by British actors. Do they not think of questioning the anachronisms in their scripts? Or is it that they are not encouraged or expected to do so and (more likely) are perhaps just grateful to have a job.
I do understand why the US producers may not care whether they annoy a UK audience. In a TV world where your show can be cut immediately on bad ratings, it's their US viewers they want to keep happy, anyone else is a bonus. Some UK accents can be notoriously difficult to understand. Is it any wonder that they try to homogenise them?
In the Friends ep in London most of the people in it were british, I didn't see many stereotypes.
So were the actors in the ER episode. In fact, most US shows tend to use British actors when filming here or depicting the UK. Doesn't mean they get it right though. Perhaps a British script editor would be a better investment.
So were the actors in the ER episode. In fact, most US shows tend to use British actors when filming here or depicting the UK. Doesn't mean they get it right though. Perhaps a British script editor would be a better investment.
Agreed.
I totally agree ,it dosn't matter who they had in the Friends episodes or who they consulted it dosn't stop them being totally awful !, and I saw plenty of stereotypes of the upper class toff with plums in their mouths as if that is the only way people in Britain talk :rolleyes:.
This is not an anti American rant BTW. Just for fun - and I am well aware that UK shows will have reflected visits to America in similarly dire fashion (indeed add them in if you like).
But the TV depictions of british settings and people are no worse than TV depictions of everything else.
You think cops spend all their time chasing round at high speed and shooting people? Ha! they spend most of it sitting in cars chatting to each other, or (more often) filling in forms, preparing statements and other administrivia. But that's not exciting enough so it gets edited out.
You think "ordinary people" in soaps spend all their lives fighting and arguing, then making up? No of course not - they spend most of their home-time watching TV - but that's not what people want to watch.
Same with doctors, nurses, firemen, private detectives, soldiers, lawyers and all the rest. No TV character is anything like their "real-life" counterpart. So it goes with the plots, the dialog, the accents and the locations. None of them are true to life - they're all meant to be shallow fantasy - what the viewers expect or want - not what reality is like.
All you're doing, by criticising the way the UK is shown is taking one aspect of a story and saying "it's not like that in real life". Well, none if it's like that in real life. Just remember that, next time you see a howler or a trite and lazy location cliche. it's not just the locations that are wrong - it's the whole dam' story as well.
Maybe TV sets should come with a large sign above the screen saying:
There was a drama on VH1 a couple of years ago about the band Def Leppard which showed how the band formed in Sheffield, the depiction of Sheffield was beyond bad, looked more like Brooklyn!
Comments
The Remington Steel episode set in Ireland was so Dire Brosnan apologised to the Irish and quit the show (as far as I remember - must wiki it to confirm).
errrm....so basically Yes, it is patronising?
Don't get me wrong, I loved the episode. But it was just full to the brim with stereotypes. It wasn't even filmed in London!
No, "patronising" suggests an assumed superiority on the part of the producers to their audience. I explained above the very practical reasons for doing something a particular way, and the way it is done is not one the audience of Americans can see as in any way insulting. As a Brit YOU seem to be insulted, but that is something different than "patronising."
Some of the excuses from BBC staff for not moving to Salford were;"there is only only specialist cheese shop" , "my boyfriend is a professional hair stylist and won't be able to get a job" and "I can't move to Salford because I'm a vegetarian."
I must say up north there isn't really a general stereotype of southerners, it's more fragmented into cockneys, Essex people and country bumpkins.
I must say the last episode portrayed London in a positive light, and as a British fan, I loved it
Same could be said of Northerners views of London?
It's funny how America does seem to think most people here speak in a very posh way and drink tea all the time. Lol
I already explained the accent business above (to reiterate, and in short, no, Americans don't think British janitors and the like speak like the Queen).
As for tea drinking, define "all the time?" On a per capita basis, Brits drink over FIVE TIMES as much tea as Americans (1.89 kg to 0.33 kg), and Ireland and the UK are both in the Top 6 for world tea consumption, while no other Western nation is in the Top 40. So I don't think Americans are out of line in thinking that you drink a lot of tea. Looking at the figures, the thing that surprises me is how much more tea the Irish drink than UK people: 3.22 kg to your 1.89 kg per capita, when nobody stereotypes the Irish as bigger tea drinkers than Brits.
But we drink 2.8kg of coffee per capita, so it's not accurate to portray Brits as always drinking tea when it's more likely to be coffee.
But that gets back to my challenge to the other FM: define "all the time?" American TV shows and movies are not setting out to represent a picture of how much coffee is consumed relative to how much tea. In depicting a British movie or TV character for an American audience, the character is going to be more interesting if he is shown to have some differences from the typical American. The disparity between the popularity of coffee and tea in the US is so severe (4.2 kg to 0.33 kg consumed per capita) that Brits liking tea as much as they do is an interesting oddity, to an American. I don't see why this should bother Brits, as it is not like the Americans are ridiculing Brits in any way for drinking a lot of tea.
Why is is so often foggy when Britain is depicted in American films/TV programmes when we get a bit of mist on a few winter mornings and that's about it.
I wasn't planning on thinking about it to that extent to be honest.
I haven't noticed that in MODERN films or TV series (the ones I see anyway, as I don't see everything). I recall a lot of old movies with that feature, a kind of visual signature for Britain. I wonder how many places in the US get foggy at all, ever. Just the fact that Britain gets some fog, occasionally, may strike Americans as interesting enough that it has been put in films as something novel.
Actually, technically speaking, if you're being very pedantic, Britain is the union of England and Wales. It becomes GREAT Britain when you add Scotland (and the United Kingdom when you throw in Northern Ireland) but fundamentally your point is correct.
It's funny how the British think this is true! lol
Well if you're talking 1950s and early 60s it's probably smog rather than fog. Sherlock Holmes is always seen leaping in and out of smog. Not very charming stuff though. Bit of a killer for those with breathing issues. London was a hideous place to live in when the smog was bad. Sometimes these images just stick around. Maybe the US hasn't heard of the Clean Air Act:D
ER was particularly bad in the episode they set in London 2002. Although set in contemporary London the characters attitudes and script were straight out of Victorian times. At one point a hospital consultant queries why his colleague is not wearing a black dress, this because she's a fairly recent widow- unbelievable!
I think that it's interesting how many of these issues occur when the characters involved are being played by British actors. Do they not think of questioning the anachronisms in their scripts? Or is it that they are not encouraged or expected to do so and (more likely) are perhaps just grateful to have a job.
I do understand why the US producers may not care whether they annoy a UK audience. In a TV world where your show can be cut immediately on bad ratings, it's their US viewers they want to keep happy, anyone else is a bonus. Some UK accents can be notoriously difficult to understand. Is it any wonder that they try to homogenise them?
It reminds me of this US TV parody of British gangster films.
As for the Simpsons they take piss out of every country they go to
So were the actors in the ER episode. In fact, most US shows tend to use British actors when filming here or depicting the UK. Doesn't mean they get it right though. Perhaps a British script editor would be a better investment.
Agreed.
I totally agree ,it dosn't matter who they had in the Friends episodes or who they consulted it dosn't stop them being totally awful !, and I saw plenty of stereotypes of the upper class toff with plums in their mouths as if that is the only way people in Britain talk :rolleyes:.
You think cops spend all their time chasing round at high speed and shooting people? Ha! they spend most of it sitting in cars chatting to each other, or (more often) filling in forms, preparing statements and other administrivia. But that's not exciting enough so it gets edited out.
You think "ordinary people" in soaps spend all their lives fighting and arguing, then making up? No of course not - they spend most of their home-time watching TV - but that's not what people want to watch.
Same with doctors, nurses, firemen, private detectives, soldiers, lawyers and all the rest. No TV character is anything like their "real-life" counterpart. So it goes with the plots, the dialog, the accents and the locations. None of them are true to life - they're all meant to be shallow fantasy - what the viewers expect or want - not what reality is like.
All you're doing, by criticising the way the UK is shown is taking one aspect of a story and saying "it's not like that in real life". Well, none if it's like that in real life. Just remember that, next time you see a howler or a trite and lazy location cliche. it's not just the locations that are wrong - it's the whole dam' story as well.
Maybe TV sets should come with a large sign above the screen saying:
Nothing you see on this set is real