I suppose I was defining 'success' in Strictly as 'the best dancer' as opposed to 'the winner', in particular reference to whether someone with a lot of dance experience is really a ringer.
Another one who has hugely enjoyed DiamondBetty's post and analysis of the contestants.
So interesting to hear from someone who has had experience in teaching dance and being able to see the potential/potential struggles someone might have.
Ben lifting Iveta - obviously the eye goes to her but I tried to focus on Ben - love his arm extension and posture, feet as mentioned by SCD Observer definitely need some work, his hips could be a problem in Latin (no natural isolation) but I think he'll do well at ballroom with a nice top line. Kristina will be able to choreograph to his strengths so I expect at least a semi final run here, the fact they are both gorgeous will only help and the sportsman work ethic usually creates contenders. If he gets a 'journey' he might even win,
Natalie looks fab with Aljazz, obviously has great body awareness and grace. If she works hard she'll be way better than DVO - hope she can find a nice way to deal with the inevitable 'ringah!' chorus. Thought her neck/head looked a little awkward but was probably frozen with first dance fear, her extended arm needed to be a little higher during the lift but I'm being ultra picky due to her high starting level. She's beautiful with a lovely dancers shape and great extension so again, I expect her to do well - with the popular Artem as a partner, at least the semis, probably the final.
The old dude trio - Mark's west end experience (was it mentioned on the show tonight? I mean, he is no DVO but he has bags more dance experience than any other current or previous older, bigger male) meant he deserved the front spot, in time and well acted, considering it was a pants vignette for the pants dancers. Dave gets a point for facial expression and loses it again for poor timing, Tony is a dance horror, let's hope he is a nice chap!
Vanessa is not comfortable in her own body, she will be compared to Lisa Riley due to their physical similarities but Lisa has a self awareness and natural rhythm that Vanessa does not. I think she'll work hard but could ungraciously blame James for her inevitable failures - might be a sparky partnership! Horrible hands here too.
Deborah looked good in comparison to Vanessa but appeared to be leaning back on her heels when in hold, this will make her hard to lead and slow down her momentum - Robin is used to dancing with girls with plenty of oomph (even Anita had momentum!) so this might be a big challenge. She seems likeable though and has some natural elegance, hands much, much better than Vanessa's.
Sophie is fit and lithe and as mentioned in the OP has good strength (bet she does a lot of yoga/pilates!) I think Brendan will treasure her after a difficult couple of series so as long as she works hard, they'll get a good run, might struggle with the isolations required for Latin and the letting go aspect. A lady Louis? Probably did some ballet in childhood.
Rachel looks (and I hesitate over typing the word!) flaccid. She needs to work on her own in front of a mirror to get some idea as to what her body is actually doing.*Her bit with Anton was odd, he should have been leading that body rhythm, but she was doing it independently (and badly) - suspect this is due to poor frame caused by the floppy arms and shoulders, as no one can lead without connection...Of course, it was Anton and they didn't have much rehearsal time so she *might* not be as dire as appeared here.*She's Pasha's first duffer but I bet he still does quite well with her, he's a nurturing teacher and as long as he spends lots of time on frame, connection, posture and strength before even attempting moves, she will improve.*
Julian is good for a comedy turn and will be better than most that get pigeonholed into that category, he looked utterly joyful - I hope he gets some good outfits! I have no knowledge of Janette but if she takes the challenge with humour and panache it'll do well for her future. His timing was spot on, which is something the worst, most comedic celebs usually can't manage (think of Nancy)!
If Patrick can get the fitness and speed required for the later stages, I think he'll do well. He has a great body for a man of his age but I think he's been working out for looks rather than functionality (understandable, he's an actor) so I expect him to lose some muscle mass during the show - the big question, will he be a dad dancer or will he have enough natural rhythm to adapt to the different dances? Can't tell yet.
Split second of Abby in a Jive lift, nice legs! She's petite, I predict she'll be in the air at every available opportunity (maybe Aljazz is more sophisticated a choreographer than that, but I don't know yet). Did anyone else notice Peter Crouch's nervous swallow when the pairing was announced? That man looks a little worried that his pretty wife is with the handsome new boy.
Tony and Dave again, this time with Ben instead of Mark. Dave gets onto the wrong foot but at least puts some energy into it and keeps going even though he knows he's wrong, making him miles better than Tony. Ben is clearly best but it's too painful to look closely. Mercifully short section
Ben gets a close up with Aliona, he appears to be genuinely leading the salsa-esque cross body hold move and she looks genuinely happy to be dancing with him. Suspect this is the celeb she would've picked given the opportunity - this would also suggest he's quite a contender as Aliona is pretty competitive.
Sophie seems to be leaning back in this segment, like Deborah earlier. She needs to loosen up, relax and find her natural movement, she's poker straight! Natalie is her opposite in the formation and the opposite in technique too, she looks almost pro, hand position was a bit too extreme for my taste but it looked like a conscious choice, not an accident.
Dave has Kristina piggy back style, he's still a bit rubbish but seems up for anything. He won't be first out at least.
Vanessa's big lift (Lisa did it last year, no?) she's sagging in the middle like an old mattress, no core strength. Seems like the only strictly desirable trait she has is determination. James is in for a tough time but I suspect she'll be out fairly fast, maybe first, depends if the public want to punish James or not.
Ashley with Karen, too close to front of shot for a proper look but his posture seems bad, another saggy mid section, which affects his shoulders too. He leans back over his heels when leading her in, rather than moving his hips and shoulders back together (body leading). Core strength exercises required pronto!*
Manages to appear suitably manly though, never easy in sequins, Bruno will like him and Ola will work him like a dog (as she suspects this could be one of her last chances to make the finals)!
Fiona and Susanna with Aljazz and Kevin, both look pretty good, Fiona has a hesitation post turn where it looks like she's second guessing herself and not responding to Kevin- Susanna seems relaxed and in the moment, probably less nervous due to CIN experience (not seen it, will YouTube in a bit). She knows what is expected of her so she could be one to watch.*
Patrick in formation with male dancers, not quite in sync, his arms are quite different to the others, might be partly due to bulky biceps. Makes a nice shape in the 'partners bottom appraisal' moment and it's well acted too. Ben less good at this, probably just because it's actor v sportsman.
The three celeb girls in the tumbling lift all look obviously not pro, even Natalie. She's the best still, but doesn't keep her legs together. Abby's legs are even worse, her weak spot is going to be calm, cool control, right now her Rhumba would be shocking! *
Rachel is rubbish in this lift. She's a sack of spuds in the air and her landing is stumbly and awkward, again due to that lack of understanding where her body is in the world. Working with a mirror will hopefully help but her start point is way behind the other young, fit ladies. She doesn't hold her end pose long enough either, and as she is supported by James, she hasn't allowed him to lead her out of it much when like she didn't follow Anton earlier, but just went for it alone. She reminds me of a foal, sometimes overly giddy, sometimes terrified, not quite in charge of her body.
Full dance floor now so I'll just comment on where my eyes naturally go, either due to the choreography or who is shining, maybe even costume colour, who knows? My eyes pick out Patrick who is definitely putting together a complete package, Mark who is as Len might say, 'Giving it some welly', Fiona who is responding very well to Robin's lead and looks *lovely and elegant (this would have been a nice partnership, I suspect) and Susanna, who sparkles and has a great emotive camera face - she perhaps needs some posture help especially around the upper back/shoulder area but I'm pretty impressed with her so far.
As always, wish the camera work was better, there were several bits I'd have liked to have seen more clearly, like Abby and Robin's Grease 'Hand Jive' tribute (behind Julian and Anton's lift).
My current ranking order:*
Chaps (not a great starting point for anyone really)
1. Patrick
2. Ben
3. Ashley
4 *Julien
5. Mark
6. Dave
7. Tony
Chapettes
1. Natalie
2. Susanna
3.Sophie/Abby (two ends of the spectrum, ultra composed, stiff and wooden v fidgety, wriggly party girl)
5. Fiona
6. Deborah
7. Vanessa
8. Rachel (more potential for improvement than Vanessa though!)
Predicted last 4 standing - Susanna, Natalie, Ben, Ashley.
(I've lurked here religiously for two years but this is my first post, talk about letting it all out at once!)
Wow what a wonderful post! Thankyou so much, it was such an interesting read, please keep up the good work each week
I agree with that. I think that Artem is a good pairing for a celeb with dance experience because he won't go easy on her and he'll push her to her limits and beyond. I don't care what previous experience celebs have as long as they're open about it, like Natalie was, and as long as they put in the effort, work hard and we see them improving. It doesn't matter how good they might be at the start, there's still room for improvement. I have a feeling Artem will make sure Natalie improves, so we should still see some kind of journey (much as I hate the j-word!).
Yes, we should have a Diamond Betty thread where she gives her analysis of how the celebs are progressing/how the partner is choreographing them and if it's working or if they're doing the wrong thing, asking too much of them or whatever!
I love dance myself (can only do latin, in particular jive, hopeless at ballroom!) and find it really interesting about how some people can click with some dances and struggle with others.
I think it's also got to do not just with physicality, but also psychology - jive is a bouncy dance and although it's led (hopefully strongly) by the man, there's space in it as well and it feels 'free-er' than the whole having to stay in total step and be ladylike thing you get in ballroom.
The vitriol directed at DVO was because she consistently lied about her past experience, played it down, moaned that people weren't voting for her because of it and it wasn't fair... then as soon as she shut her mouth, James would start up. You said it yourself, the audience doesn't care about past experience since they voted Jill and Kara to win. It's nothing to do with that, and everything to do with DVO's personality.
Totally agree, what narked me about Denise, while appreciating her dancing, was the bollocks about her role in Chicago not being a "dancing" one. While Roxy's not the main dancer, she absolutely does as damn sight more than just "sit on a stool".
BIB - Weren't you around in Emma Bunton's year?? or Kelly Brook's? They were both dragged over the coals for previous experience Louisa Lytton managed to fly under the radar because Emma was catching all the flak that year!
Totally agree, I really felt for Emma Bunton because she was a lovely dancer to watch and some of her routines with Darren are among my favourite. Not as keen on Kelly Brook but I did enjoy watching her dance.
As another innpossession of said ovaries - I will admit to never voting for a male celeb (or pro for that matter!) based on his hotness/ physique/ looks etc.
I've got ovaries and they're technically still working and I've never voted for a cleb or a pro dancer based on looks. There can be a variety of reasons for me as to why I like one celebrity over another, sometimes it's their talent, sometimes it's the journey, sometimes it can be just one single stand out routine which emotionally connects me to them.
DiamondBetty - loved your first post! I too am a long time lurker and first time poster today! It was killing me that I had to wait 24 hours before I could post! Had so much I wanted to say and really wanted join in the fun after the launch show!
I am a complete novice to dance and so my critique will be no where near as good as DB as is more based on how the celebs came across but here goes:
Sophie and Brendan - wasn't sure at first. She seems like she would be good being a pop singer and is certainly graceful and elegant but I thought she seemed a bit too stiff in the group dance. Not sure how Brendan will get on with her but think getting married and becoming a dad has brought his softer side out so think this might work.
Deborah and Robin - felt sorry for Robin at first as I really like him and wanted him to get a 'contender' this year but I think TPTB recognise his talent for connecting with his partners and making them feel confident and so will enjoy watching these 2 blossom as a fun partnership.
Rachel and Pasha - dont think she is nearly as good as everyone makes her out to be. She is warm and fun and will defo try hard and love the experience but I think she will struggle at first. But if anyone can bring out the dancer in her, it will be lovely Pasha!
Natalie and Artem - she is obviously a strong contender and I don't normally warm to these as I prefer the 'journey' but I think she will go down a lot better than DVO for all the reasons that have been mentioned here. Lovely lines and effortless dancing from what I could see in the group dance. Also pleased Artem will get a chance to show off his skills with a good dancer this year.
Abbey and Aljaz - think she will be flung about a lot in order to impress the judges but that's all she has to offer. Can't warm to herand really wish she would stop pouting and just smile for once!
Susannah and Kevin - really like this pair but can't figure out why. Loved their intro and have slightly fallen in love with the boy from Grimsby! Slow start but will pick up speed mid way I think.
Fiona and Anton - pleasantly surprised, Fiona seems confident and has rhythm. Hope Anton doesn't go down the comedy route as she has potential. Reminds me of Cherie and James a few years back.
Vanessa and James - was prepared to hate them but think they could be amazing but for all the wrong reasons! Can't deny they will be fun to watch! Think she will be a good 'actor' dancer to cover her lack of ability.
Now onto the boys:
Ben and Kristina - Hot! Love Ben, think he could be a bit clunky to start with but am hoping Kristina will bring him out of his shell.
Ashley and Ola - another strong contender. The boy can dance and think they will be a cute couple together.
Patrick and Anya - didn't really elicit much from me to be honest. Think Patrick can move but might take this too seriously.
Tony and Aliona - really have nothing to say abut them and feel bad. Although I do like her new hair but she has been too tainted by her past behaviour for me to start liking her.
Dave and Karen - another surprise. Karen has a big job on her hands but I am hoping for another Michael Vaughn and Natalie Lowe journey. Loved the group dance rehearsal footage... '1, 2, beans on toast' Karen really endeared herself to me with this as wasn't crazy for her last year but she could be one of my faves this time.
Mark and Iveta - lovely personality and funny! Hope Iveta doesn't write him off straight away. Hoping his musical background will see him through for a few weeks.
Julien and Jeanne - bit too much, but loving his enthusiasm. Less arm flapping is needed.
DiamondBetty - loved your first post! I too am a long time lurker and first time poster today! It was killing me that I had to wait 24 hours before I could post! Had so much I wanted to say and really wanted join in the fun after the launch show!
I am a complete novice to dance and so my critique will be no where near as good as DB as is more based on how the celebs came across but here goes:
Sophie and Brendan - wasn't sure at first. She seems like she would be good being a pop singer and is certainly graceful and elegant but I thought she seemed a bit too stiff in the group dance. Not sure how Brendan will get on with her but think getting married and becoming a dad has brought his softer side out so think this might work.
Deborah and Robin - felt sorry for Robin at first as I really like him and wanted him to get a 'contender' this year but I think TPTB recognise his talent for connecting with his partners and making them feel confident and so will enjoy watching these 2 blossom as a fun partnership.
Rachel and Pasha - dont think she is nearly as good as everyone makes her out to be. She is warm and fun and will defo try hard and love the experience but I think she will struggle at first. But if anyone can bring out the dancer in her, it will be lovely Pasha!
Natalie and Artem - she is obviously a strong contender and I don't normally warm to these as I prefer the 'journey' but I think she will go down a lot better than DVO for all the reasons that have been mentioned here. Lovely lines and effortless dancing from what I could see in the group dance. Also pleased Artem will get a chance to show off his skills with a good dancer this year.
Abbey and Aljaz - think she will be flung about a lot in order to impress the judges but that's all she has to offer. Can't warm to herand really wish she would stop pouting and just smile for once!
Susannah and Kevin - really like this pair but can't figure out why. Loved their intro and have slightly fallen in love with the boy from Grimsby! Slow start but will pick up speed mid way I think.
Fiona and Anton - pleasantly surprised, Fiona seems confident and has rhythm. Hope Anton doesn't go down the comedy route as she has potential. Reminds me of Cherie and James a few years back.
Vanessa and James - was prepared to hate them but think they could be amazing but for all the wrong reasons! Can't deny they will be fun to watch! Think she will be a good 'actor' dancer to cover her lack of ability.
Now onto the boys:
Ben and Kristina - Hot! Love Ben, think he could be a bit clunky to start with but am hoping Kristina will bring him out of his shell.
Ashley and Ola - another strong contender. The boy can dance and think they will be a cute couple together.
Patrick and Anya - didn't really elicit much from me to be honest. Think Patrick can move but might take this too seriously.
Tony and Aliona - really have nothing to say abut them and feel bad. Although I do like her new hair but she has been too tainted by her past behaviour for me to start liking her.
Dave and Karen - another surprise. Karen has a big job on her hands but I am hoping for another Michael Vaughn and Natalie Lowe journey. Loved the group dance rehearsal footage... '1, 2, beans on toast' Karen really endeared herself to me with this as wasn't crazy for her last year but she could be one of my faves this time.
Mark and Iveta - lovely personality and funny! Hope Iveta doesn't write him off straight away. Hoping his musical background will see him through for a few weeks.
Julien and Jeanne - bit too much, but loving his enthusiasm. Less arm flapping is needed.
DiamondBetty - loved your first post! I too am a long time lurker and first time poster today! It was killing me that I had to wait 24 hours before I could post! Had so much I wanted to say and really wanted join in the fun after the launch show!
I am a complete novice to dance and so my critique will be no where near as good as DB as is more based on how the celebs came across but here goes:
Sophie and Brendan - wasn't sure at first. She seems like she would be good being a pop singer and is certainly graceful and elegant but I thought she seemed a bit too stiff in the group dance. Not sure how Brendan will get on with her but think getting married and becoming a dad has brought his softer side out so think this might work.
Deborah and Robin - felt sorry for Robin at first as I really like him and wanted him to get a 'contender' this year but I think TPTB recognise his talent for connecting with his partners and making them feel confident and so will enjoy watching these 2 blossom as a fun partnership.
Rachel and Pasha - dont think she is nearly as good as everyone makes her out to be. She is warm and fun and will defo try hard and love the experience but I think she will struggle at first. But if anyone can bring out the dancer in her, it will be lovely Pasha!
Natalie and Artem - she is obviously a strong contender and I don't normally warm to these as I prefer the 'journey' but I think she will go down a lot better than DVO for all the reasons that have been mentioned here. Lovely lines and effortless dancing from what I could see in the group dance. Also pleased Artem will get a chance to show off his skills with a good dancer this year.
Abbey and Aljaz - think she will be flung about a lot in order to impress the judges but that's all she has to offer. Can't warm to herand really wish she would stop pouting and just smile for once!
Susannah and Kevin - really like this pair but can't figure out why. Loved their intro and have slightly fallen in love with the boy from Grimsby! Slow start but will pick up speed mid way I think.
Fiona and Anton - pleasantly surprised, Fiona seems confident and has rhythm. Hope Anton doesn't go down the comedy route as she has potential. Reminds me of Cherie and James a few years back.
Vanessa and James - was prepared to hate them but think they could be amazing but for all the wrong reasons! Can't deny they will be fun to watch! Think she will be a good 'actor' dancer to cover her lack of ability.
Now onto the boys:
Ben and Kristina - Hot! Love Ben, think he could be a bit clunky to start with but am hoping Kristina will bring him out of his shell.
Ashley and Ola - another strong contender. The boy can dance and think they will be a cute couple together.
Patrick and Anya - didn't really elicit much from me to be honest. Think Patrick can move but might take this too seriously.
Tony and Aliona - really have nothing to say abut them and feel bad. Although I do like her new hair but she has been too tainted by her past behaviour for me to start liking her.
Dave and Karen - another surprise. Karen has a big job on her hands but I am hoping for another Michael Vaughn and Natalie Lowe journey. Loved the group dance rehearsal footage... '1, 2, beans on toast' Karen really endeared herself to me with this as wasn't crazy for her last year but she could be one of my faves this time.
Mark and Iveta - lovely personality and funny! Hope Iveta doesn't write him off straight away. Hoping his musical background will see him through for a few weeks.
Julien and Jeanne - bit too much, but loving his enthusiasm. Less arm flapping is needed.
Awwww thanks SCD-Observer, think I'm going to like it here!
We are generally quite well behaved, but as the series progresses and we have firmer favourites, we may grow more protective towards our fave and sometimes snap at others when we perceive they are unfairly attacked. You'll see we'll need to grow thicker skins as the series moves on.
Comments
Ah I see now. Thanks for the clarification.
So interesting to hear from someone who has had experience in teaching dance and being able to see the potential/potential struggles someone might have.
I love dance myself (can only do latin, in particular jive, hopeless at ballroom!) and find it really interesting about how some people can click with some dances and struggle with others.
I think it's also got to do not just with physicality, but also psychology - jive is a bouncy dance and although it's led (hopefully strongly) by the man, there's space in it as well and it feels 'free-er' than the whole having to stay in total step and be ladylike thing you get in ballroom.
Totally agree, what narked me about Denise, while appreciating her dancing, was the bollocks about her role in Chicago not being a "dancing" one. While Roxy's not the main dancer, she absolutely does as damn sight more than just "sit on a stool".
Totally agree, I really felt for Emma Bunton because she was a lovely dancer to watch and some of her routines with Darren are among my favourite. Not as keen on Kelly Brook but I did enjoy watching her dance.
I've got ovaries and they're technically still working and I've never voted for a cleb or a pro dancer based on looks. There can be a variety of reasons for me as to why I like one celebrity over another, sometimes it's their talent, sometimes it's the journey, sometimes it can be just one single stand out routine which emotionally connects me to them.
I am a complete novice to dance and so my critique will be no where near as good as DB as is more based on how the celebs came across but here goes:
Sophie and Brendan - wasn't sure at first. She seems like she would be good being a pop singer and is certainly graceful and elegant but I thought she seemed a bit too stiff in the group dance. Not sure how Brendan will get on with her but think getting married and becoming a dad has brought his softer side out so think this might work.
Deborah and Robin - felt sorry for Robin at first as I really like him and wanted him to get a 'contender' this year but I think TPTB recognise his talent for connecting with his partners and making them feel confident and so will enjoy watching these 2 blossom as a fun partnership.
Rachel and Pasha - dont think she is nearly as good as everyone makes her out to be. She is warm and fun and will defo try hard and love the experience but I think she will struggle at first. But if anyone can bring out the dancer in her, it will be lovely Pasha!
Natalie and Artem - she is obviously a strong contender and I don't normally warm to these as I prefer the 'journey' but I think she will go down a lot better than DVO for all the reasons that have been mentioned here. Lovely lines and effortless dancing from what I could see in the group dance. Also pleased Artem will get a chance to show off his skills with a good dancer this year.
Abbey and Aljaz - think she will be flung about a lot in order to impress the judges but that's all she has to offer. Can't warm to herand really wish she would stop pouting and just smile for once!
Susannah and Kevin - really like this pair but can't figure out why. Loved their intro and have slightly fallen in love with the boy from Grimsby! Slow start but will pick up speed mid way I think.
Fiona and Anton - pleasantly surprised, Fiona seems confident and has rhythm. Hope Anton doesn't go down the comedy route as she has potential. Reminds me of Cherie and James a few years back.
Vanessa and James - was prepared to hate them but think they could be amazing but for all the wrong reasons! Can't deny they will be fun to watch! Think she will be a good 'actor' dancer to cover her lack of ability.
Now onto the boys:
Ben and Kristina - Hot! Love Ben, think he could be a bit clunky to start with but am hoping Kristina will bring him out of his shell.
Ashley and Ola - another strong contender. The boy can dance and think they will be a cute couple together.
Patrick and Anya - didn't really elicit much from me to be honest. Think Patrick can move but might take this too seriously.
Tony and Aliona - really have nothing to say abut them and feel bad. Although I do like her new hair but she has been too tainted by her past behaviour for me to start liking her.
Dave and Karen - another surprise. Karen has a big job on her hands but I am hoping for another Michael Vaughn and Natalie Lowe journey. Loved the group dance rehearsal footage... '1, 2, beans on toast' Karen really endeared herself to me with this as wasn't crazy for her last year but she could be one of my faves this time.
Mark and Iveta - lovely personality and funny! Hope Iveta doesn't write him off straight away. Hoping his musical background will see him through for a few weeks.
Julien and Jeanne - bit too much, but loving his enthusiasm. Less arm flapping is needed.
Have I got everybody?!
Blimmin' marvellous!!!
I think so lol
Awwww thanks SCD-Observer, think I'm going to like it here!
We are generally quite well behaved, but as the series progresses and we have firmer favourites, we may grow more protective towards our fave and sometimes snap at others when we perceive they are unfairly attacked. You'll see we'll need to grow thicker skins as the series moves on.