This episode was the weakest yet IMO. After weeks of enjoyable filler, which finally fleshed out characters like Beth who I now care about, as soon as we get some actual forward momentum it was boring.
Daryl and the hunters? Boring. We know there are bad guys out there. We know Daryl has battled his red neck past. I want him to find Beth, who I'm guessing was taken by the undertaker/funeral home owner.
I'm beyond irritated with Glenn now. He's unrecognisable from S1 and exists only in relation to Maggie. His mindless devotion to finding her was tedious and selfish. The relationship has emasculated and stripped away those dimensions of him we saw in S1. And ditto Maggie, who doesn't seem to give a toss about her little sister. Where's the outspoken, feisty girl who first met Glenn in S2? Both characters are now cardboard cut-outs and have been since S2.
It's also been clear for 2 seasons that 16 episodes is too long, and the writing team can't sustain the AMC bean counters desire to limit budgets and sets while prolonging the show's run. Bet we stay at Terminus for all of S5.
It's just bland rubbish now. Last weeks episode redeemed itself from the dire that preceeded it. Last nights was just utter tosh.
It's hard to watch now. I've been such a fan but after watching things like Breaking Bad, House of Cards, Hannibal, True Detective...The Walking Dead is being shown up to be, well, crap.
It's just bland rubbish now. Last weeks episode redeemed itself from the dire that preceeded it. Last nights was just utter tosh.
It's hard to watch now. I've been such a fan but after watching things like Breaking Bad, House of Cards, Hannibal, True Detective...The Walking Dead is being shown up to be, well, crap.
It's never been prestige TV like those you've mentioned. The problem for me, since S1, is that it has moments of profundity and artistry but is hamstrung by poor writing. Actually no, the writing is hamstrung by AMC and an extraordinary level of influence by Kirkman.
Imagine how awesome S3 at the prison would have been if done in 12 episodes, with the action condensed into a shorter run and the finale we got mid-season 4 instead of that limp end to S3. And all because the prison had to be strung out for 24 episodes to save production costs, and Kirkman/the producers decided the Governor was worth preserving.
I was so excited when they finally left the prison, I figured it'd be more like S1, at its best when they were on the move. But no, they've strung it out again, using the same 200 square yards of forest and train tracks. The same white houses to explore with hidden zombies inside. Yawn.
I pity the show runner, Scott Gilligan. He's making the best of a poisoned chalice of a job.
Best season yet for me, and I like the longer characterisation. All about opinions though. Perhaps you should go and make your feelings known in that TWD is finished thread:)
Best season yet for me, and I like the longer characterisation. All about opinions though. Perhaps you should go and make your feelings known in that TWD is finished thread:)
I don't think it's "finished" and I too have enjoyed the stronger characterisation since Gilligan took over. But this week's episode was evidence of its maddening inconsistency, and that's been there since they cut the budgets after a fantastic S1. It goes from great to crap so fast.
I hope Gilligan continues to give us the moments of depth and beauty we've had in S4, with episodes like last week's The Grove and the one with Daryl & Beth.
Best season yet for me, and I like the longer characterisation. All about opinions though. Perhaps you should go and make your feelings known in that TWD is finished thread:)
No. I'll keep them here.
Is it too much to ask for something more from a show that clearly used to deliver more? When it first started, it was up there with the greats of TV. Unless you watch nothing else now, is it still delivering?
The thing is, it used to be prestige TV. You can see how the writing has been 'budgetised'. Scarlet nailed it, 2 posts up.
Is it too much to ask for something more from a show that clearly used to deliver more? When it first started, it was up there with the greats of TV. Unless you watch nothing else now, is it still delivering?
The thing is, it used to be prestige TV. You can see how the writing has been 'budgetised'. Scarlet nailed it, 2 posts up.
Just a suggestion, some of us are just excited for the finale.
I've mentioned before I didn't much love the first series, too cold. I do watch plenty of other TV and it's my fave show ATM. True Detective was brilliant admittedly, but it's a one-off.
I hope Gilligan continues to give us the moments of depth and beauty we've had in S4, with episodes like last week's The Grove and the one with Daryl & Beth.
The Grove and Still don't deserve to be mentioned in the same breath. Still ranks as one of the most boring episodes of TWD in its four years. The Grove, one of the best, if not a top 3.
Just a suggestion, some of us are just excited for the finale.
I've mentioned before I didn't much love the first series, too cold. I do watch plenty of other TV and it's my fave show ATM. True Detective was brilliant admittedly, but it's a one-off.
You of course can choose to post where you want:)
Don't misinterpret my comments, I too am excited for the finale
Just read the review of the last episode on Digital Spy. Even they pass similar comments.
I have to agree with the above too. The Daryl and Beth episode was pants.
What has happened to the quality of the writing this season? It is just not up to par with that of Seasons 1 & 2. Poor character development, dragging out of storylines etc. I bet you the new Games of Thrones season will wipe the floor with this season of TWD in terms of those things I just mentioned.
Such a shame. It seems to me, Frank Darabont's firing and the ever changing nature of producers and head writers has impacted this show and it shows on screen. AMC needs to leave this show alone and let the writers and producers get on with it.
I'll continue to stick with it... But I am beginning to lose my patience. I look forward to the finale with trepidation.
This may have been covered already but..... a couple of episodes ago, Rick had to hide under a bed from a bunch of guys..... was that the same bunch that Daryl has now hooked up with?
In Sunday's episode, the leader mentioned someone in their group being strangled....
This may have been covered already but..... a couple of episodes ago, Rick had to hide under a bed from a bunch of guys..... was that the same bunch that Daryl has now hooked up with?
In Sunday's episode, the leader mentioned someone in their group being strangled....
That would make sense but TBH if that is what happened it would mean we get a rubbish episode where they take Rick hostage and get him back for strangling one of them, which I personally do not want to see.
Imagine how awesome S3 at the prison would have been if done in 12 episodes, with the action condensed into a shorter run and the finale we got mid-season 4 instead of that limp end to S3. And all because the prison had to be strung out for 24 episodes to save production costs, and Kirkman/the producers decided the Governor was worth preserving.
I think you're misunderstanding how the budgeting works and seem to be extrapolating comments made in the past for the situation now.
The Prison was committed to after one episode of Season 2 when the series was greenlit for Season 3 and therefore the budget had to be set based on the ratings at that time and outline stories would be agreed in order to set the budget.. Season 1 got around 5m average (I'd assume about a 2.4 on the demographic). Excellent for basic cable but still restrained on costs.
That's when htey start budgeting and planning their next season, 16 episodes and what it will cost. And I wouldn't be surprised that a set like that would demand the whole season and some of the next based on this.
Now the ratings are just ridiculous 13m+ and a 6.8 on the demographic. Most cable shows are a smash hit if they beat a 2.0 on the demographic. this show is so far beyond that its ridiculous. It means that whatever budget the writers decide is appropriate they can have.
But you don't need huge budgets to make successful shows and carry The Walking Dead. The Grove demonstrates that tiny budgets can create moments that will be long remembered, it even got its own fanboi phrase that we will be sick of in a few years time.
If you're not enjoying the show, that's a pity, but its the most popular scripted drama in the World right now, so someone likes it.
This may have been covered already but..... a couple of episodes ago, Rick had to hide under a bed from a bunch of guys..... was that the same bunch that Daryl has now hooked up with?
In Sunday's episode, the leader mentioned someone in their group being strangled....
It was very obviously stated in the final scene of the group that they were the same group as Rick encountered.
Comments
Daryl and the hunters? Boring. We know there are bad guys out there. We know Daryl has battled his red neck past. I want him to find Beth, who I'm guessing was taken by the undertaker/funeral home owner.
I'm beyond irritated with Glenn now. He's unrecognisable from S1 and exists only in relation to Maggie. His mindless devotion to finding her was tedious and selfish. The relationship has emasculated and stripped away those dimensions of him we saw in S1. And ditto Maggie, who doesn't seem to give a toss about her little sister. Where's the outspoken, feisty girl who first met Glenn in S2? Both characters are now cardboard cut-outs and have been since S2.
It's also been clear for 2 seasons that 16 episodes is too long, and the writing team can't sustain the AMC bean counters desire to limit budgets and sets while prolonging the show's run. Bet we stay at Terminus for all of S5.
Rant over.
It's hard to watch now. I've been such a fan but after watching things like Breaking Bad, House of Cards, Hannibal, True Detective...The Walking Dead is being shown up to be, well, crap.
It's never been prestige TV like those you've mentioned. The problem for me, since S1, is that it has moments of profundity and artistry but is hamstrung by poor writing. Actually no, the writing is hamstrung by AMC and an extraordinary level of influence by Kirkman.
Imagine how awesome S3 at the prison would have been if done in 12 episodes, with the action condensed into a shorter run and the finale we got mid-season 4 instead of that limp end to S3. And all because the prison had to be strung out for 24 episodes to save production costs, and Kirkman/the producers decided the Governor was worth preserving.
I was so excited when they finally left the prison, I figured it'd be more like S1, at its best when they were on the move. But no, they've strung it out again, using the same 200 square yards of forest and train tracks. The same white houses to explore with hidden zombies inside. Yawn.
I pity the show runner, Scott Gilligan. He's making the best of a poisoned chalice of a job.
The Grove was the best TV I've seen in years.
I don't think it's "finished" and I too have enjoyed the stronger characterisation since Gilligan took over. But this week's episode was evidence of its maddening inconsistency, and that's been there since they cut the budgets after a fantastic S1. It goes from great to crap so fast.
I hope Gilligan continues to give us the moments of depth and beauty we've had in S4, with episodes like last week's The Grove and the one with Daryl & Beth.
No. I'll keep them here.
Is it too much to ask for something more from a show that clearly used to deliver more? When it first started, it was up there with the greats of TV. Unless you watch nothing else now, is it still delivering?
The thing is, it used to be prestige TV. You can see how the writing has been 'budgetised'. Scarlet nailed it, 2 posts up.
Just a suggestion, some of us are just excited for the finale.
I've mentioned before I didn't much love the first series, too cold. I do watch plenty of other TV and it's my fave show ATM. True Detective was brilliant admittedly, but it's a one-off.
You of course can choose to post where you want:)
The Grove and Still don't deserve to be mentioned in the same breath. Still ranks as one of the most boring episodes of TWD in its four years. The Grove, one of the best, if not a top 3.
Don't misinterpret my comments, I too am excited for the finale
Just read the review of the last episode on Digital Spy. Even they pass similar comments.
I have to agree with the above too. The Daryl and Beth episode was pants.
Such a shame. It seems to me, Frank Darabont's firing and the ever changing nature of producers and head writers has impacted this show and it shows on screen. AMC needs to leave this show alone and let the writers and producers get on with it.
I'll continue to stick with it... But I am beginning to lose my patience. I look forward to the finale with trepidation.
Scott M. Gimple. Are you confusing him with Vince Gilligan?
Gimple is TWD's third showrunner, after Darabont and Mazzara. They don't seem to last long...
In Sunday's episode, the leader mentioned someone in their group being strangled....
That would make sense but TBH if that is what happened it would mean we get a rubbish episode where they take Rick hostage and get him back for strangling one of them, which I personally do not want to see.
I think you're misunderstanding how the budgeting works and seem to be extrapolating comments made in the past for the situation now.
The Prison was committed to after one episode of Season 2 when the series was greenlit for Season 3 and therefore the budget had to be set based on the ratings at that time and outline stories would be agreed in order to set the budget.. Season 1 got around 5m average (I'd assume about a 2.4 on the demographic). Excellent for basic cable but still restrained on costs.
That's when htey start budgeting and planning their next season, 16 episodes and what it will cost. And I wouldn't be surprised that a set like that would demand the whole season and some of the next based on this.
Now the ratings are just ridiculous 13m+ and a 6.8 on the demographic. Most cable shows are a smash hit if they beat a 2.0 on the demographic. this show is so far beyond that its ridiculous. It means that whatever budget the writers decide is appropriate they can have.
But you don't need huge budgets to make successful shows and carry The Walking Dead. The Grove demonstrates that tiny budgets can create moments that will be long remembered, it even got its own fanboi phrase that we will be sick of in a few years time.
If you're not enjoying the show, that's a pity, but its the most popular scripted drama in the World right now, so someone likes it.
It was very obviously stated in the final scene of the group that they were the same group as Rick encountered.
Yep it definitely is, and they want to kill Rick.
Lets waste an episode on a gang of red necks getting Rick back for killing one of their own.
Rolleyes again.
Was that Terminus - cooking on the barby ?
Cant see Beth being eaten......................no meat on her !
Dave
Just need to lose Beth. Soon.