There is, which you have just reaffirmed in this post.
How exactly are you inferring that the device "could have sold 10% of that figure", what are you basing this on? It's an unrealistic assumption when considering all the factors, and there is no comparable performance to such low figures for an Apple product in recent years. It's just a wild statement thrown into your argument in an attempt to add credibility.
I could say that the S4 "could have sold 10% of that figure", but it's pretty obvious that there would have to be extenuating circumstances for that to happen. I don't think attempting to ignore that to suit your argument is the right way to go.
The 5C was always going to sell some amount due to the logo on the back of it and that's before factoring cannibalisation of 5 and 5S sales. I don't think there's any strong argument against the fact that it has been a huge flop by Apple's standards, particularly in markets like China, a market which Apple seriously targeted with the 5C, yet it failed miserably there.
I'm afraid this nonsense does you no favours and just makes you look foolish. Apple's push of the 5c always meant it would sell many millions, probably would have just because it was apple.
However your silly assumptions that it could have sold 1.3 million just puts you in a minority of one CP. You're just floundering around desperately looking for some safe apple land to plant your flag.
You have now resorted to argue a statement all because you refuse to accept simple facts, sad really
It's unlikely that it would have, bit it certainly could have, if the 5C actually was as bad a phone as some people would like to suggest.
Contrary to popular mythology I'm sure most people don't actually buy Apple products because of the logo. Or if they do, they could in this case have bought the 5S.
You can't have it both ways - argue that the 5C didn't do as well as other models, and then ague that it was bound to sell well simply because it's an iPhone. If Apple products really did just sell because they are Apple products then the 5C should have done as well as any previous model.
The extenuating circumstances would surely be that the phone was a flop on account of being as uncharacteristically terrible as the 5C apparently is.
No one is disputing it's done badly relative to what Apple might have expected.
Software is as important. Why is it iPhone camera tests frequently come out on top for picture quality. Nexus is low down.
Are you being serious?
The iphone 5S is £500+. The Nexus 5 is £270. The hardware in the Nexus is just as good as the iphone if not better in some areas, but, they have to cut some corners to get it to that price!
Want an Android phone with a good camera, spend the money! Simple as that.
WRONG!!! You can download the song onto the phone for offline play.
People bang on about the android file system..., when you want to use if for example loading a song purchased and downloaded on Google play music.. Why is it the files saved are some obscurely worded file hidden away in the phone. ?
You have to download on a PC in order to get a proper mp3.
Its not hidden away ffs. People don't bang on about the file system in Android. What they DO say, is it can be accessed via root or a file explorer if you feel the need to which i never have. On the iphone you cant do anything with the file system either. So really, what's your point here?
As for the music, please read and stop making things up as you go along. They encrypt the songs. Google music do the same as Spotify or most other MP3 places.
You can download the songs from google music onto your PC like you can on itunes Perfectly easy and simple On the phone, you can download the tracks to the handset for offline play.
And as we speak,mates just let text.. Swapped his HTC one for a iPhone 5. !
Well that's a downgrade!
I'm sorry but even as a android user my self, the system and hardware overall is not as good.
THE HARDWARE IS THE SAME AS IN ANY PHONE.
Learn to read.
Apple don't make the hardware! They buy it from other suppliers like Samsung, LG, Sony etc.
In fact, Apple don't make anything!! Apple design the things, they buy the components from Samsung, LG, sony etc and have yet another company assemble it.
Again, please stop making things up. You are looking very foolish.
It's unlikely that it would have, bit it certainly could have, if the 5C actually was as bad a phone as some people would like to suggest.
Contrary to popular mythology I'm sure most people don't actually buy Apple products because of the logo. Or if they do, they could in this case have bought the 5S.
You can't have it both ways - argue that the 5C didn't do as well as other models, and then ague that it was bound to sell well simply because it's an iPhone. If Apple products really did just sell because they are Apple products then the 5C should have done as well as any previous model.
The extenuating circumstances would surely be that the phone was a flop on account of being as uncharacteristically terrible as the 5C apparently is.
No one is disputing it's done badly relative to what Apple might have expected.
Unlikely it would have but certainly could have great stuff
I think 13 million people buying the 5c show they probably do.
It didn't do as well as other models simple fact, but again if you going to quote people don't twist it to suit your agenda. No one said it was bound to sell well not that it has sold well, the point was that there will always relatively good sales of iPhones compared to other phones (at least for a while). As said there is a good proportion of people who will by apple regardless, clearly the rest are a little more deserning than apple thought.
Rest of your post makes no sense.
I posted earlier than recent research shows buyers becoming more and more tech savvy and price aware, this will present significant challenges to apple going forward.
Unlikely it would have but certainly could have great stuff
I think 13 million people buying the 5c show they probably do.
It didn't do as well as other models simple fact, but again if you going to quote people don't twist it to suit your agenda. No one said it was bound to sell well not that it has sold well, the point was that there will always relatively good sales of iPhones compared to other phones (at least for a while). As said there is a good proportion of people who will by apple regardless, clearly the rest are a little more deserning than apple thought.
Rest of your post makes no sense.
I posted earlier than recent research shows buyers becoming more and more tech savvy and price aware, this will present significant challenges to apple going forward.
You're tying yourself in knots again.
You said above it was "bound to sell well because it's Apple". And now you're saying that "no-one said it was bound to sell well".
Obviously it could have sold fewer - why should there always be good sales of iPhones? There's absolutely no reason for that to be true.
The only thing that makes no sense here is this contradictory argument whereby you think that Apple will always sell lots of iPhones, that it's possible for an iPhone (eg the 5C) to sell fewer units than another iPhone (eg the 5S) but that it's not possible for an iPhone to sell (significantly) fewer than the 5C has sold.
It's unlikely that it would have, bit it certainly could have, if the 5C actually was as bad a phone as some people would like to suggest.
Contrary to popular mythology I'm sure most people don't actually buy Apple products because of the logo. Or if they do, they could in this case have bought the 5S.
You can't have it both ways - argue that the 5C didn't do as well as other models, and then ague that it was bound to sell well simply because it's an iPhone. If Apple products really did just sell because they are Apple products then the 5C should have done as well as any previous model.
The extenuating circumstances would surely be that the phone was a flop on account of being as uncharacteristically terrible as the 5C apparently is.
No one is disputing it's done badly relative to what Apple might have expected.
You quoted me in this, but I didn't say that at all. I said that it was always going to sell "an amount" because of the association with Apple and its brand image, just as any Galaxy device is going to automatically sell an amount due to Samsung's brand image. Nowhere did I imply that the 5C should have sold out instantly on Apple's name alone.
You also keep glossing over the fact that cannibalisation is a very real factor with the 5C. It is a direct competitor with the iPhone 5 and it also drew sales from the 5S as evidenced by the lower launch figures for the 5S compared to the 5. The same happened when the iPad Mini launched.
I think the truth here is that you can't have it both ways. I'm not trying to paint the 5C as a success, the numbers speak for themselves and it hasn't done well at all in a global context. You keep arguing that the 5C was neither a success nor a failure, but the truth is that its failures outweighed any success it had. And considering that such success was limited to very few markets, the UK barely included due to the vast under-performance there, it is just a weak argument to say that the 5C is a success just because it supposedly sold 13 million units during a given timeframe.
Its home market the US has over 250 million inhabitants, so in context, these are poor sales for a globally launched device, especially when Apple was revealed to be forcing aggressive contracts on mobile vendors to push the 5C in the UK. And particularly poor in China also, where 5C adoption was reported in the region of 2% in a country of over 1 billion inhabitants.
As a result, Apple has resorted to restarting production of the iPhone 4. If that's not a clear sign of disaster for Apple and the 5C, then I don't know what is.
You quoted me in this, but I didn't say that at all. I said that it was always going to sell "an amount" because of the association with Apple and its brand image, just as any Galaxy device is going to automatically sell an amount due to Samsung's brand image. Nowhere did I imply that the 5C should have sold out instantly on Apple's name alone.
You also keep glossing over the fact that cannibalisation is a very real factor with the 5C. It is a direct competitor with the iPhone 5 and it also drew sales from the 5S as evidenced by the lower launch figures for the 5S compared to the 5. The same happened when the iPad Mini launched.
I think the truth here is that you can't have it both ways. I'm not trying to paint the 5C as a success, the numbers speak for themselves and it hasn't done well at all in a global context. You keep arguing that the 5C was neither a success nor a failure, but the truth is that its failures outweighed any success it had. And considering that such success was limited to very few markets, the UK barely included due to the vast under-performance there, it is just a weak argument to say that the 5C is a success just because it supposedly sold 13 million units during a given timeframe.
Its home market the US has over 250 million inhabitants, so in context, these are poor sales for a globally launched device, especially when Apple was revealed to be forcing aggressive contracts on mobile vendors to push the 5C in the UK. And particularly poor in China also, where 5C adoption was reported in the region of 2% in a country of over 1 billion inhabitants.
As a result, Apple has resorted to restarting production of the iPhone 4. If that's not a clear sign of disaster for Apple and the 5C, then I don't know what is.
I'm not trying to paint it as a success - clearly it hasn't been as successful as was hoped.
All this has ever been about was a bit of perspective - given that it's been amongst the top 3 biggest selling phones in the US and has outsold much of the competition globally, then it hasn't been as big a disaster as some would like to suggest. It clearly hasn't been "as far from record breaking success as is possible" as It clearly could have been much worse.
Why that point has proved so controversial and is still even being debated when it is pretty much irrefutable.
You said above it was "bound to sell well because it's Apple". And now you're saying that "no-one said it was bound to sell well".
Obviously it could have sold fewer - why should there always be good sales of iPhones? There's absolutely no reason for that to be true.
The only thing that makes no sense here is this contradictory argument whereby you think that Apple will always sell lots of iPhones, that it's possible for an iPhone (eg the 5C) to sell fewer units than another iPhone (eg the 5S) but that it's not possible for an iPhone to sell (significantly) fewer than the 5C has sold.
this is so embarrassing for you, your just inventing stuff as you go along fascinating to watch someone so clueless struggling so much.
I believe I said an iPhone will always sell in the millions but you take that any way you wish not going to be dragged into your desperate invented points because you have no idea how to defend the 5c's failure.
As you keep repeating above and has been explained to you very simply sales relative to other phones or on their own do not make it a success or failure, seems difficult for you to comprehend that simple fact doesn't it.
What is contradictory though is someone admitting 30 million would be a good figure for the 5c to have sold but cannot see a third of that is a massive failure ;-)
Setting aside the fact that's no more true for a droid than an iPhone, do you find that happens a lot? If you're anywhere near a town or city, I'd hazard that doesn't happen very often. I find that almost all pubs, offices and cafes, and even some buses have WiFi and where they don't, most of the time I've got 3G, so it's a scenario that rarely happens unless you're out in the sticks and even then, an iPhone is going to be just as much of a brick.
Comments
I'm sorry but even as a android user my self, the system and hardware overall is not as good.
It's unlikely that it would have, bit it certainly could have, if the 5C actually was as bad a phone as some people would like to suggest.
Contrary to popular mythology I'm sure most people don't actually buy Apple products because of the logo. Or if they do, they could in this case have bought the 5S.
You can't have it both ways - argue that the 5C didn't do as well as other models, and then ague that it was bound to sell well simply because it's an iPhone. If Apple products really did just sell because they are Apple products then the 5C should have done as well as any previous model.
The extenuating circumstances would surely be that the phone was a flop on account of being as uncharacteristically terrible as the 5C apparently is.
No one is disputing it's done badly relative to what Apple might have expected.
Are you being serious?
The iphone 5S is £500+. The Nexus 5 is £270. The hardware in the Nexus is just as good as the iphone if not better in some areas, but, they have to cut some corners to get it to that price!
Want an Android phone with a good camera, spend the money! Simple as that.
Jesus...How many times!!...
WRONG!!! You can download the song onto the phone for offline play.
Its not hidden away ffs. People don't bang on about the file system in Android. What they DO say, is it can be accessed via root or a file explorer if you feel the need to which i never have. On the iphone you cant do anything with the file system either. So really, what's your point here?
As for the music, please read and stop making things up as you go along. They encrypt the songs. Google music do the same as Spotify or most other MP3 places.
You can download the songs from google music onto your PC like you can on itunes
Well that's a downgrade!
THE HARDWARE IS THE SAME AS IN ANY PHONE.
Learn to read.
Apple don't make the hardware! They buy it from other suppliers like Samsung, LG, Sony etc.
In fact, Apple don't make anything!! Apple design the things, they buy the components from Samsung, LG, sony etc and have yet another company assemble it.
Again, please stop making things up. You are looking very foolish.
Unlikely it would have but certainly could have
I think 13 million people buying the 5c show they probably do.
It didn't do as well as other models simple fact, but again if you going to quote people don't twist it to suit your agenda. No one said it was bound to sell well not that it has sold well, the point was that there will always relatively good sales of iPhones compared to other phones (at least for a while). As said there is a good proportion of people who will by apple regardless, clearly the rest are a little more deserning than apple thought.
Rest of your post makes no sense.
I posted earlier than recent research shows buyers becoming more and more tech savvy and price aware, this will present significant challenges to apple going forward.
You're tying yourself in knots again.
You said above it was "bound to sell well because it's Apple". And now you're saying that "no-one said it was bound to sell well".
Obviously it could have sold fewer - why should there always be good sales of iPhones? There's absolutely no reason for that to be true.
The only thing that makes no sense here is this contradictory argument whereby you think that Apple will always sell lots of iPhones, that it's possible for an iPhone (eg the 5C) to sell fewer units than another iPhone (eg the 5S) but that it's not possible for an iPhone to sell (significantly) fewer than the 5C has sold.
You quoted me in this, but I didn't say that at all. I said that it was always going to sell "an amount" because of the association with Apple and its brand image, just as any Galaxy device is going to automatically sell an amount due to Samsung's brand image. Nowhere did I imply that the 5C should have sold out instantly on Apple's name alone.
You also keep glossing over the fact that cannibalisation is a very real factor with the 5C. It is a direct competitor with the iPhone 5 and it also drew sales from the 5S as evidenced by the lower launch figures for the 5S compared to the 5. The same happened when the iPad Mini launched.
I think the truth here is that you can't have it both ways. I'm not trying to paint the 5C as a success, the numbers speak for themselves and it hasn't done well at all in a global context. You keep arguing that the 5C was neither a success nor a failure, but the truth is that its failures outweighed any success it had. And considering that such success was limited to very few markets, the UK barely included due to the vast under-performance there, it is just a weak argument to say that the 5C is a success just because it supposedly sold 13 million units during a given timeframe.
Its home market the US has over 250 million inhabitants, so in context, these are poor sales for a globally launched device, especially when Apple was revealed to be forcing aggressive contracts on mobile vendors to push the 5C in the UK. And particularly poor in China also, where 5C adoption was reported in the region of 2% in a country of over 1 billion inhabitants.
As a result, Apple has resorted to restarting production of the iPhone 4. If that's not a clear sign of disaster for Apple and the 5C, then I don't know what is.
I'm not trying to paint it as a success - clearly it hasn't been as successful as was hoped.
All this has ever been about was a bit of perspective - given that it's been amongst the top 3 biggest selling phones in the US and has outsold much of the competition globally, then it hasn't been as big a disaster as some would like to suggest. It clearly hasn't been "as far from record breaking success as is possible" as It clearly could have been much worse.
Why that point has proved so controversial and is still even being debated when it is pretty much irrefutable.
I believe I said an iPhone will always sell in the millions but you take that any way you wish not going to be dragged into your desperate invented points because you have no idea how to defend the 5c's failure.
As you keep repeating above and has been explained to you very simply sales relative to other phones or on their own do not make it a success or failure, seems difficult for you to comprehend that simple fact doesn't it.
What is contradictory though is someone admitting 30 million would be a good figure for the 5c to have sold but cannot see a third of that is a massive failure ;-)
Setting aside the fact that's no more true for a droid than an iPhone, do you find that happens a lot? If you're anywhere near a town or city, I'd hazard that doesn't happen very often. I find that almost all pubs, offices and cafes, and even some buses have WiFi and where they don't, most of the time I've got 3G, so it's a scenario that rarely happens unless you're out in the sticks and even then, an iPhone is going to be just as much of a brick.