Except; you members of the fairer sex might get a bit lonely without us.
What I was getting at was that for all our faults, there's no guarantee the next lot to achieve our level of animal intelligence will be nicer to the animals they use. They'd have to achieve our level of technology without the abundance of free fossil fuel we used up. And there's always those pesky Earth bound asteroids to consider. Humans may just manage to protect most of the species we haven't already destroyed - from extinction events and whatever other cosmic dangers there may be.
Except; you members of the fairer sex might get a bit lonely without us.
What I was getting at was that for all our faults, there's no guarantee the next lot to achieve our level of animal intelligence will be nicer to the animals they use. They'd have to achieve our level of technology without the abundance of free fossil fuel we used up. And there's always those pesky Earth bound asteroids to consider. Humans may just manage to protect most of the species we haven't already destroyed - from extinction events and whatever other cosmic dangers there may be.
I don't disagree with most of that. Although I'm not not holding my breath about your last sentence. I can never underestimate human greed in the grand scheme of things, outside of domestic animal abuse. I would just love to put the cruel bastards I had to deal with in a swamp and hold them down.
As for missing men, maybe you're right! Need somone to spew my rage at and my OH is the one for me. Poor sod ey? :D:D
YouTube is full of animals playing. When they feel safe and secure their sense of fun surfaces. They spend most of their lives afraid, depending where they are in the food chain.
YouTube is full of animals playing. When they feel safe and secure their sense of fun surfaces. They spend most of their lives afraid, depending where they are in the food chain.
Obviously there's different degrees and types of intelligence between different animals, but what's really amazing, if you think about it, is that none of them have advanced one miilimetre in millenia, whereas humans continue to advance apace.
We are many light years ahead of even the most intelligent.
All human achievement is down to a very small minority of talented individuals, not humans in general. 99% of us would have had no idea how to create the computer or television or get satellites into space or create modern housing or modern medicine. It was a few individuals who made the link between drinking filthy water and disease, not the public in general. Millions of people continue to view stories in the Bible as being real, not very inteligent at all.
Also, our complex hands have helped us achieve things and our eyesight too.
Inteligence in animals is more complicated than we think..
All human achievement is down to a very small minority of talented individuals, not humans in general. 99% of us would have had no idea how to create the computer or television or get satellites into space or create modern housing or modern medicine. It was a few individuals who made the link between drinking filthy water and disease, not the public in general. Millions of people continue to view stories in the Bible as being real, not very inteligent at all.
Also, our complex hands have helped us achieve things and our eyesight too.
Inteligence in animals is more complicated than we think..
Surely the point is that the human race has produced those exceptional individuals. It's a cumulative, collective process. Besides, the rest of us do contribute. Take housing. Architects may greate grand designs but it takes a whole bunch of relatively lowly construction workers to make them reality. Scientists may develop new therapies but it takes doctors, nurses and all the other workers in the health system to actually implement them.
Not sure what your point about the Bible is. There are plenty of intelligent believers out there. Faith is not a mark of low intelligence. Militant 'atheism' on the other hand...;-)
Surely the point is that the human race has produced those exceptional individuals. It's a cumulative, collective process. Besides, the rest of us do contribute. Take housing. Architects may greate grand designs but it takes a whole bunch of relatively lowly construction workers to make them reality. Scientists may develop new therapies but it takes doctors, nurses and all the other workers in the health system to actually implement them.
Not sure what your point about the Bible is. There are plenty of intelligent believers out there. Faith is not a mark of low intelligence. Militant 'atheism' on the other hand...;-)
Of course humans are the most intelligent of all living creatures but we tend to over-estimate quite how intelligent most of us actually are. Most of us 'follow the herd' with only a tiny minority looking at something in a different light - ie those who did advance the human race in some way. The first Victorians to make the link between dirty water and disease or the first people to say that the sun is at the centre of our solar system (not the Earth) were met with aggressive opposition from people 'too stuck in their ways/too stuck in the herd mentality' to see any differently.
Of course animals don't have our unique intelligence but I think many of them are more intelligent than we give them credit for and the fact that we think its OK to cage elephants and killer whales for our own entertainment (maybe not in the UK but certainly in other countries) when they show clear signs of stress, shows how ignorant we are of animal consciousness.
YouTube is full of animals playing. When they feel safe and secure their sense of fun surfaces. They spend most of their lives afraid, depending where they are in the food chain.
I wonder if species would choose to be domesticated, given the choice between that and the wild. Many domesticated cats like to kill, as if driven by instinct, regardless of their need for food. If they don't do that, if they're content to stay in with human company - I bet they dream they do. I've seen their little legs twitching as they run from the monsters in their little pussycat minds. :kitty:
Strange how they can come with different temperaments. Some would claw through a door to get out, and never play. I still have the scars. Most love to be chased.
I wonder if species would choose to be domesticated, given the choice between that and the wild. Many domesticated cats like to kill, as if driven by instinct, regardless of their need for food. If they don't do that, if they're content to stay in with human company - I bet they dream they do. I've seen their little legs twitching as they run from the monsters in their little pussycat minds. :kitty:
Strange how they can come with different temperaments. Some would claw through a door to get out, and never play. I still have the scars. Most love to be chased.
Many clades of animal have standout members in the intelligence stakes. ^_^
Until recently many people did not even believe reptiles and birds were 'capable' of playing or of having different personalities.
Which now seems totally preposterous, as all the brilliant videos and articles on this thread have proved.
I wonder if species would choose to be domesticated, given the choice between that and the wild. Many domesticated cats like to kill, as if driven by instinct, regardless of their need for food. If they don't do that, if they're content to stay in with human company - I bet they dream they do. I've seen their little legs twitching as they run from the monsters in their little pussycat minds. :kitty:
Strange how they can come with different temperaments. Some would claw through a door to get out, and never play. I still have the scars. Most love to be chased.
That's food for thought.
Christian the lion only knew domestication and was happy until his 'owners' realised he was getting too big to handle and needed to be introduced to the wild where his natural instincts could be freed. It took George Adamson a while to teach him but Christian learned to be a lion.
My last cat was a starving, cold six week old kitten when my friend's dogs discovered her on their land. She was too tiny to protest at being picked up and cuddled by me and the Vet was doubtful she'd survive. She did and I was quite amazed some months later when, by then refusing to be cuddled, she instigated hide and seek with me.
Every cat owner knows the 'prrrerp?' and she was peeping at me clearly wanting my attention. I stood, she scampered but knew I'd seen where she'd gone. I turned away and so the game began.
It went on for months until she, not me, grew fed up with it.
Someone just mentioned the tired old myth of the Goldfish's 'three second memory' on another thread about that attention seeking little prick swallowing one.
As this article (and many others on the net) prove - it is quite simply bollocks.
Comments
I'm sent to bed again? Obviously
I wondered after I posted if you were just going to send man to the bottom and the women would sort everything out. Sounds like a plan, except...
You devil!!! A pox on all your houses! >:(
Except what????? You are a buggar! ;-)
What I was getting at was that for all our faults, there's no guarantee the next lot to achieve our level of animal intelligence will be nicer to the animals they use. They'd have to achieve our level of technology without the abundance of free fossil fuel we used up. And there's always those pesky Earth bound asteroids to consider. Humans may just manage to protect most of the species we haven't already destroyed - from extinction events and whatever other cosmic dangers there may be.
I don't disagree with most of that. Although I'm not not holding my breath about your last sentence. I can never underestimate human greed in the grand scheme of things, outside of domestic animal abuse. I would just love to put the cruel bastards I had to deal with in a swamp and hold them down.
As for missing men, maybe you're right! Need somone to spew my rage at and my OH is the one for me. Poor sod ey?
YouTube is full of animals playing. When they feel safe and secure their sense of fun surfaces. They spend most of their lives afraid, depending where they are in the food chain.
Did you ever meet cookie?
http://youtu.be/rFfCa96HSxY
And someone tell me that this monkey isn't having a laugh.
http://youtu.be/rZ623u2sGUg
I agree. Lovely stuff. The penguin certainly woke one of my cats up! He was up here immediately.
All human achievement is down to a very small minority of talented individuals, not humans in general. 99% of us would have had no idea how to create the computer or television or get satellites into space or create modern housing or modern medicine. It was a few individuals who made the link between drinking filthy water and disease, not the public in general. Millions of people continue to view stories in the Bible as being real, not very inteligent at all.
Also, our complex hands have helped us achieve things and our eyesight too.
Inteligence in animals is more complicated than we think..
Surely the point is that the human race has produced those exceptional individuals. It's a cumulative, collective process. Besides, the rest of us do contribute. Take housing. Architects may greate grand designs but it takes a whole bunch of relatively lowly construction workers to make them reality. Scientists may develop new therapies but it takes doctors, nurses and all the other workers in the health system to actually implement them.
Not sure what your point about the Bible is. There are plenty of intelligent believers out there. Faith is not a mark of low intelligence. Militant 'atheism' on the other hand...;-)
Of course humans are the most intelligent of all living creatures but we tend to over-estimate quite how intelligent most of us actually are. Most of us 'follow the herd' with only a tiny minority looking at something in a different light - ie those who did advance the human race in some way. The first Victorians to make the link between dirty water and disease or the first people to say that the sun is at the centre of our solar system (not the Earth) were met with aggressive opposition from people 'too stuck in their ways/too stuck in the herd mentality' to see any differently.
Of course animals don't have our unique intelligence but I think many of them are more intelligent than we give them credit for and the fact that we think its OK to cage elephants and killer whales for our own entertainment (maybe not in the UK but certainly in other countries) when they show clear signs of stress, shows how ignorant we are of animal consciousness.
Some more wonderful posts folks.
When animals are free of the horror of the food chain they have more of a chance to relax and really show what they are capable of.
They have us at their mercy like no other domestic pet on earth! Domestication hasn't removed their natural instincts either.
Is that intelligence?
Get in first and bite him good and hard on the ear then scratch him on the nose. See how he reacts to that
Strange how they can come with different temperaments. Some would claw through a door to get out, and never play. I still have the scars. Most love to be chased.
Many clades of animal have standout members in the intelligence stakes. ^_^
Until recently many people did not even believe reptiles and birds were 'capable' of playing or of having different personalities.
Which now seems totally preposterous, as all the brilliant videos and articles on this thread have proved.
That's food for thought.
Christian the lion only knew domestication and was happy until his 'owners' realised he was getting too big to handle and needed to be introduced to the wild where his natural instincts could be freed. It took George Adamson a while to teach him but Christian learned to be a lion.
My last cat was a starving, cold six week old kitten when my friend's dogs discovered her on their land. She was too tiny to protest at being picked up and cuddled by me and the Vet was doubtful she'd survive. She did and I was quite amazed some months later when, by then refusing to be cuddled, she instigated hide and seek with me.
Every cat owner knows the 'prrrerp?' and she was peeping at me clearly wanting my attention. I stood, she scampered but knew I'd seen where she'd gone. I turned away and so the game began.
It went on for months until she, not me, grew fed up with it.
He certainly is a really crafty little bastard!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c36UNSoJenI
Love him to bits though, obviously. But I look at how clever some dogs are and look at mine and just shake my head...
Thank god the poor wee bugger can't read.
As this article (and many others on the net) prove - it is quite simply bollocks.
http://sciencebasedlife.wordpress.com/2011/06/17/goldfish-do-not-have-a-3-second-memory/