I think there is a difference between saying hello, hi, you alright, or a nod and smile, = acceptable to me
It's the wolf whistles, "dayum" "hey baby" sh1te that it not acceptable to me and it is bloody annoying when you get it on a daily basis.
However, when I was in Manhattan, I do not recall any catcalls except when I stormed off, after a row with a boyfriend, into some undesirable area and a man offered to tattoo my "fine ass"
Frankie - any time you would like to return to the question, feel free. You're the one insisting that there should be hard and fast rules and now you're running from a hypothecial situation, where two consenting people could have legal intercourse and indeed marry.
Yet you feel uncomfortable with this particular situation. Why?
Yes they could of course but then so could a 98 year old woman and a 16 year old boy. Do these ridiculous extremes show your arguments strength? Were any 50 year old men in the video approaching 16 year old schoolgirls?
Reductio ad absurdum doesn't get you anywhere and only discredits your own argument. I want to hear more about your rules on where you can approach someone. List more examples.
Yes exactly. I've spoken to women I've found attractive sexually but there was no chemistry or not enough interest there after the conversation progressed to make me want to see them again to take the relationship to the next level. You are saying hello to them, not forcing them into an arranged marriage.
Frankly I doubt you've ever stopped a complete stranger on the street to impose your implied offer of sexual adventures in the future. However taking you at face value - isn't it funny that not one of these complete strangers apparently had a partner either? It was always a lack of chemistry or interest to prevent you from taking the relationship further.
Yes they could of course but then so could a 98 year old woman and a 16 year old boy. Do these ridiculous extremes show your arguments strength? Were any 50 year old men in the video approaching 16 year old schoolgirls?
Reductio ad absurdum doesn't get you anywhere and only discredits your own argument. I want to hear more about your rules on where you can approach someone. List more examples.
Well the example I gave at the bus stop where I was a witness he was in his 50's (or looked it) and she looked between 16 and 18 she had a school/college uniform on so it's not that absurd as I have seen it happen.
Yes they could of course but then so could a 98 year old woman and a 16 year old boy.
What makes you think I wasn't talking about a woman and a boy in the first place? You're still uncomfortable about that situation. Why?
Do these ridiculous extremes show your arguments strength? Were any 50 year old men in the video propositioning 16 year old schoolgirls?
You're the person claiming that you should be able to impose on any stranger. Why does the above cause you issues then?
Reductio ad absurdum doesn't get you anywhere and only discredits your own argument.
How is my argument absurd? Please demonstrate. You are after hard and fast rules apparently from us, coming from a position that you should be able to impose on any stranger, yet you have trouble with a hypothetical situation where one stranger imposes on another? There are either rules, or there is not. Which is it to be?
I want to hear more about your rules on where you can approach someone. List more examples.
Why do I need to list more examples? Which parts of the existing ones did you not understand?
Those morons are off topic, unless you'd like to start a thread. These morons kept it up for hours, and there were a great deal of them.
Morons are morons. Ginger people walk down the street everyday and get bullied as do gay people as do just people in general. If you want to outrage at this then outrage at all morons, be it from both genders. I don't feel like just picking out men is a fair debate at all, especially as females can be just as bad.
Frankly I doubt you've ever stopped a complete stranger on the street to impose your implied offer of sexual adventures in the future. However taking you at face value - isn't it funny that not one of these complete strangers apparently had a partner either? It was always a lack of chemistry or interest to prevent you from taking the relationship further.
Odd, given the laws of averages.
You make saying hello sound like men are unzipping their fly, turning their pockets out and showing a woman their elephant impression. The only odd thing is your desire to curtail free speech and make simple communication between adults taboo.
Morons are morons. Ginger people walk down the street everyday and get bullied as do gay people as do just people in general. If you want to outrage at this then outrage at all morons, be it from both genders. I don't feel like just picking out men is a fair debate at all, especially as females can be just as bad.
It's the subject of this thread. Other threads are available.
You make saying hello sound like men are unzipping their fly, turning their pockets out and showing a woman their elephant impression. The only odd thing is your desire to curtail free speech and make simple communication between adults taboo.
On the other hand you want people to have unwanted attention forced upon them
Maybe that's why the women didn't respond to your advances.
You make saying hello sound like men are unzipping their fly, turning their pockets out and showing a woman their elephant impression.[
Well isn't that what is implied by approaching or commenting on a random stranger that passes you in the street which you could find sexually attractive?
The only odd thing is your desire to curtail free speech
How have I done that? I don't think you understand what free speech is.
and make simple communication between adults taboo.
Taboo? I hope to make simple sexual harassment taboo to be frank.
Then say hello to the the ugly girls say hello to the men say hello to everybody if you are only doing to be friendly
Even the women have said they know the difference between the two ways of saying it
I'm sorry but who are you to say who I say hello to. Would you rather go down that road of picking who random people can and can't say hello to? I'm me, a normal human being who knows how to behave and knows boundaries. I'll say hello to who I want in a public space. They don't have any right to privacy. If they don't want to talk then I'll deal with that.
Do you wear a t-shirt with " Miserable Git " written on it.:)
FFS most of these blokes were being complimentary and polite... When she didn't respond that was the end of it, with maybe the odd remark about her rudeness.
They didn't know she purposely intended to ignore them to prove a point.
No-one forced her to engage with them and she was allowed to go on her way.
All those going on about rules etc. well the USA are very protective of their right to free speech, which these guys were exercising.
The world doesn't revolve around prudish women.
Yes, but folk just love making a mountain out of a mole hill, when you consider the very real and frightening harassment women experience on the streets of Cairo, as seen on Channel 4's Reported World a few months ago, then a man saying 'hi' being seen as harassment is quite frankly ludicrous.
Yes, it's a pain for women to get continual catcalls ("harassment" if you like) but what is to be expected? It is what men do. In a perfect world, they shouldn't, but what do people want? A law to stop men saying "hello" or whistling at a passing female? How would that operate?
It is a man thing, and sexuality doesn't have anything to do with it. I remember being 18 on the gay scene in London, and it was an assault course every time I went out. I didn't like it from men (usually older) in whom I had no interest, but that's life. I appreciate a male-male situation has a slightly different dynamic, but there is a parallel.
As others have said - in many parts of the world, behaviour that would constitute an assault in the US or UK, are the norm. There can be no question about tolerating anything physical, but how you stop behaviour like that in the video I know not.
Yes, but folk just love making a mountain out of a mole hill, when you consider the very real and frightening harassment women experience on the streets of Cairo, as seen on Channel 4's Reported World a few months ago, then a man saying 'hi' being seen as harassment is quite frankly ludicrous.
So, because women get gang raped in Delhi and Mumbai, people should suck up sexual harassment in New York, because at least she wasn't touched?
Don't see the logic in "things are worse elsewhere" as justification for seeing somethings as acceptable.
You're the one insinuating it's negative by this post. It would be a good explanation for his strange behaviour and struggling socially, it's not meant in a negative way.
Deflect away, I think it's quite clear how you poorly attempted to execute it as an insult.
I'm sorry but who are you to say who I say hello to. Would you rather go down that road of picking who random people can and can't say hello to? I'm me, a normal human being who knows how to behave and knows boundaries. I'll say hello to who I want in a public space. They don't have any right to privacy. If they don't want to talk then I'll deal with that.
I was only advising on how to be friendly person which is what you said you did it for with no other motive in mind if there was no other motive when why not try to be friendly to everyone?
BIB Why don't they because you say they don't and you will; talk to them if they want you to or not just because they dared to leave their house they gave that right up.
Yes, it's a pain for women to get continual catcalls ("harassment" if you like) but what is to be expected? It is what men do. In a perfect world, they shouldn't, but what do people want? A law to stop men saying "hello" or whistling at a passing female? How would that operate?
It is a man thing, and sexuality doesn't have anything to do with it. I remember being 18 on the gay scene in London, and it was an assault course every time I went out. I didn't like it from men (usually older) in whom I had no interest, but that's life. I appreciate a male-male situation has a slightly different dynamic, but there is a parallel.
As others have said - in many parts of the world, behaviour that would constitute an assault in the US or UK, are the norm. There can be no question about tolerating anything physical, but how you stop behaviour like that in the video I know not.
That is a point how would these straight men who do it to women feel if gay men kept on doing to them that they couldn't even go to the shop without having a few gay men trying to chat them up even if they made it clear they were straight.
Yes, but folk just love making a mountain out of a mole hill, when you consider the very real and frightening harassment women experience on the streets of Cairo, as seen on Channel 4's Reported World a few months ago, then a man saying 'hi' being seen as harassment is quite frankly ludicrous.
Conflating saying hi with gang rape? Are you serious?
No but not so long ago getting groped in the street or workplace was considered ok and the norm doesn't mean to say it was.
And like this the women who didn't like it were told they were prudes or stuck up and the men thought well if I want to do it why not and if she says no then I'll leave it.
Comments
It's the wolf whistles, "dayum" "hey baby" sh1te that it not acceptable to me and it is bloody annoying when you get it on a daily basis.
However, when I was in Manhattan, I do not recall any catcalls except when I stormed off, after a row with a boyfriend, into some undesirable area and a man offered to tattoo my "fine ass"
It was. Thank you
Yes they could of course but then so could a 98 year old woman and a 16 year old boy. Do these ridiculous extremes show your arguments strength? Were any 50 year old men in the video approaching 16 year old schoolgirls?
Reductio ad absurdum doesn't get you anywhere and only discredits your own argument. I want to hear more about your rules on where you can approach someone. List more examples.
Frankly I doubt you've ever stopped a complete stranger on the street to impose your implied offer of sexual adventures in the future. However taking you at face value - isn't it funny that not one of these complete strangers apparently had a partner either? It was always a lack of chemistry or interest to prevent you from taking the relationship further.
Odd, given the laws of averages.
Well the example I gave at the bus stop where I was a witness he was in his 50's (or looked it) and she looked between 16 and 18 she had a school/college uniform on so it's not that absurd as I have seen it happen.
What makes you think I wasn't talking about a woman and a boy in the first place?
You're the person claiming that you should be able to impose on any stranger. Why does the above cause you issues then?
How is my argument absurd? Please demonstrate. You are after hard and fast rules apparently from us, coming from a position that you should be able to impose on any stranger, yet you have trouble with a hypothetical situation where one stranger imposes on another? There are either rules, or there is not. Which is it to be?
Why do I need to list more examples? Which parts of the existing ones did you not understand?
Morons are morons. Ginger people walk down the street everyday and get bullied as do gay people as do just people in general. If you want to outrage at this then outrage at all morons, be it from both genders. I don't feel like just picking out men is a fair debate at all, especially as females can be just as bad.
You make saying hello sound like men are unzipping their fly, turning their pockets out and showing a woman their elephant impression. The only odd thing is your desire to curtail free speech and make simple communication between adults taboo.
It's the subject of this thread. Other threads are available.
On the other hand you want people to have unwanted attention forced upon them
Maybe that's why the women didn't respond to your advances.
Well isn't that what is implied by approaching or commenting on a random stranger that passes you in the street which you could find sexually attractive?
How have I done that? I don't think you understand what free speech is.
Taboo? I hope to make simple sexual harassment taboo to be frank.
I'm sorry but who are you to say who I say hello to. Would you rather go down that road of picking who random people can and can't say hello to? I'm me, a normal human being who knows how to behave and knows boundaries. I'll say hello to who I want in a public space. They don't have any right to privacy. If they don't want to talk then I'll deal with that.
No James, that's you making things up again.
Yes, but folk just love making a mountain out of a mole hill, when you consider the very real and frightening harassment women experience on the streets of Cairo, as seen on Channel 4's Reported World a few months ago, then a man saying 'hi' being seen as harassment is quite frankly ludicrous.
Yes, it's a pain for women to get continual catcalls ("harassment" if you like) but what is to be expected? It is what men do. In a perfect world, they shouldn't, but what do people want? A law to stop men saying "hello" or whistling at a passing female? How would that operate?
It is a man thing, and sexuality doesn't have anything to do with it. I remember being 18 on the gay scene in London, and it was an assault course every time I went out. I didn't like it from men (usually older) in whom I had no interest, but that's life. I appreciate a male-male situation has a slightly different dynamic, but there is a parallel.
As others have said - in many parts of the world, behaviour that would constitute an assault in the US or UK, are the norm. There can be no question about tolerating anything physical, but how you stop behaviour like that in the video I know not.
So, because women get gang raped in Delhi and Mumbai, people should suck up sexual harassment in New York, because at least she wasn't touched?
Don't see the logic in "things are worse elsewhere" as justification for seeing somethings as acceptable.
Deflect away, I think it's quite clear how you poorly attempted to execute it as an insult.
I was only advising on how to be friendly person which is what you said you did it for with no other motive in mind if there was no other motive when why not try to be friendly to everyone?
BIB Why don't they because you say they don't and you will; talk to them if they want you to or not just because they dared to leave their house they gave that right up.
You don't deserve a reply. You're just putting words into my as I've never even said that.
Depends on no situation. I'll talk to someone when I see fit. If they don't want to communicate, that's up to them. Not me and certainly not you.
Conflating saying hi with gang rape? Are you serious?
That's not the poster who wrote it.
That is a point how would these straight men who do it to women feel if gay men kept on doing to them that they couldn't even go to the shop without having a few gay men trying to chat them up even if they made it clear they were straight.
And I'm pointing out that it's not a fair debate. Don't like that, then report it.
Are you talking about the video in the OP.
No but not so long ago getting groped in the street or workplace was considered ok and the norm doesn't mean to say it was.
And like this the women who didn't like it were told they were prudes or stuck up and the men thought well if I want to do it why not and if she says no then I'll leave it.