I don't know if guys think their opinions are 'important', they just think they're entitled to make them, it's part of a power game. 'Nice tits love', 'blow job mouth' etc are not compliments, they're not an overture, they're simply a bit demeaning.
I totally agree that guys turn abusive very quickly when they twig you're not interested. And you can't win: if you ignore a guy he can get aggressive because you've ignored him; but if you reply to a guy, he can take that as encouragement, carry on, and then gets aggressive because he thought he had a chance.
Agreed, especially the BIB. This has been my experience, sadly.
I just read an argument where a man posted the link to a video showing a man walking through NY for 3 hours getting just as much 'harassment' only for women to flood the comments saying its not comparable because he is being complimented, not harassed.
This is where feminism falls down. The double standards.
They won't debate that as it's not in their agenda. Not even on the horizon.
I said in a few posts back to one feminist banging on about wanting equality. They don't want equality. What they really want is 'specialness'......to pick at the bit's they like and discard that which they don't.
All women are feminists and men too if they believe in the principle of equal rights based on equality of the sexes. Do you not?
I agree, but I think one of things a part of modern feminism which a lot of people don't like is that it talks about social norms, the media etc; in other words the culture of society and how it affects women. I think many feel comfortable with women have legal rights and financial independence, but I've noticed people are far less comfortable talking about social and cultural norms, and the negative effects they can have; especially since many don't think anything is wrong with the way things are now. There are many people who do not believe sexism exists anymore (that equality has been reached and everything is now fine), or that it isn't prevalent in society, or that all women are sex objects etc. They believe feminism 'victimizes' women rather than women in certain situations already being 'victims' in the first place.
All women are feminists and men too if they believe in the principle of equal rights based on equality of the sexes. Do you not?
That's nonsense. Modern feminist groups prioritise banning 'lad's mags', page 3, pop songs and men daring to even speak to attractive women over the plight of rape gang victims, the horrors of fgm and the continued treatment of women as the property of men in some countries.
That's nonsense. Modern feminist groups prioritise banning 'lad's mags', page 3, pop songs and men daring to even speak to attractive women over the plight of rap gang victims, the horrors of fgm and the continued treatment of women as the property of men in some countries.
In my experience, I've found modern feminists care about a range of issues; both FGM, the lack of legal rights of women in many countries, as well as how women are represented in the media through page 3, lads mags. And as for men 'daring' to speak to attractive women. I don't think I've ever seen modern feminists criticise that, but rather street harassment.
Old chestnut? You equating saying hello to flashing your genitals is the most absurd point in here and there is plenty of competition. There is little point entering into tedious multi-quoting dialogue with someone who has that as their jumping off point. You're wrong and that'll do for me.
I just read an argument where a man posted the link to a video showing a man walking through NY for 3 hours getting just as much 'harassment' only for women to flood the comments saying its not comparable because he is being complimented, not harassed.
This is where feminism falls down. The double standards.
That video in here was branded as fake and not comparable. You can't win with these types of hypocrites.
I agree, but I think one of things a part of modern feminism which a lot of people don't like is that it talks about social norms, the media etc; in other words the culture of society and how it affects women. I think many feel comfortable with women have legal rights and financial independence, but I've noticed people are far less comfortable talking about social and cultural norms, and the negative effects they can have; especially since many don't think anything is wrong with the way things are now. There are many people who do not believe sexism exists anymore (that equality has been reached and everything is now fine), or that it isn't prevalent in society, or that all women are sex objects etc. They believe feminism 'victimizes' women rather than women in certain situations already being 'victims' in the first place.
You make some very good points. I think people tend to believe what suits them. Many seem to believe that women have legal rights now so job done; that's all fine as long as it doesn't impact them personally. When people start having to reassess attitudes and behaviour, that's when they get uncomfortable and shirty.
This doesn't only apply to women to be fair, also to ethnic minorities, LBGT etc.
In my experience, I've found modern feminists care about a range of issues; both FGM, the lack of legal rights of women in many countries, as well as how women are represented in the media through page 3, lads mags. And as for men 'daring' to speak to attractive women. I don't think I've ever seen modern feminists criticise that, but rather street harassment.
Feminists have been more interested in complaining about page 3 (i.e. lecturing other adult women) than the systematic rape and abuse of thousands of teenage girls by rape gangs in our towns and cities, or the tens of thousands of British girls who are sexually mutilated every year. And we all know why this is, because they can't blame white men.
That's nonsense. Modern feminist groups prioritise banning 'lad's mags', page 3, pop songs and men daring to even speak to attractive women over the plight of rape gang victims, the horrors of fgm and the continued treatment of women as the property of men in some countries.
Feel free to google the definition of feminism as you don't appear to have a clue.
Modern 'feminists' are not a homogenous group as you seem to think. Personally I think banning lads' mags or page 3 is pointless in the context of porn.
I don't know any woman who 'prioritises' the hypersexualisation and objectification of women in Western media over sex offences, trafficking & FGM. They're all problems, they're different kinds of problems.
All women are feminists and men too if they believe in the principle of equal rights based on equality of the sexes. Do you not?
FWIW....my opinion as a 'mere' male, my view on equal rights between male/female begins and ends with pay.
I used to work in an industry where many men wouldn't venture for fear of being asked to 'do the job', and the few who tried often didn't last more than a few days. Some even ran off. Women were nowhere to be seen......ever. Physically incapable....simple as that.
The other side was women doing jobs which many men couldn't handle. Jobs which needed slim nimble fingers and a sharp eye.
There will never be total equality as it's a physical impossibility and unrealistic to think otherwise. But as for pay, if doing the same type of work then yes the pay should be equal.
They won't debate that as it's not in their agenda. Not even on the horizon.
I said in a few posts back to one feminist banging on about wanting equality. They don't want equality. What they really want is 'specialness'......to pick at the bit's they like and discard that which they don't.
That video in here was branded as fake and not comparable. You can't win with these types of hypocrites.
I do wonder about some of them.
Things that make me laugh is in the comments you say a women say something like "Feminists like these make me ashamed to be a woman. We're not here to single out how awful men are when women can be just the same. Yes women get raped and taken advantage off, as do men". Which is met to replies that say - no joke - "Women being raped is more important, cause men can deal with it." How in any way is that equality?
What ALSO makes me laugh - this is going to be slightly controversial - is so called feminists saying things like "A man shouldn't speak to a woman like that" after provoking and talking to the man in a much worse way - where's the EQUALITY in that?
Another thing I see a lot is this whole men shouldn't hit women, but it's fine for women to hit men debate. How so? It isn't acceptable for anyone to hit anyone. If a man hits a woman and the woman fights back - it's self defence. But when a woman hits a man, and the mans natural reaction is to push that woman away - it's battery and assault. Again, where's the equality in that?
There are a ridiculous amount of fundamental flaws in the logic of feminists - well the majority at least.
Feminists have been more interested in complaining about page 3 (i.e. lecturing other adult women) than the systematic rape and abuse of thousands of teenage girls by rape gangs in our towns and cities, or the tens of thousands of British girls who are sexually mutilated every year. And we all know why this is, because they can't blame white men.
Really? Many feminists I know care about this issue very much - I know I do. And on page 3, feminists are not 'lecturing other adult women' - you can support someone's right to choose what they'd like even if you don't always agree with their choices, and you think those choices may have negative consequences. Feminists care about all kinds of issues that affect women - it isn't a competition between one issue all the other; I know for myself that a lot issues relate to one another. And if you really think the goal of feminism is just 'blame white men' rather than help women...well...I can't help there, I'm afraid.
Whoa, I don't really see how wanting to not be harassed on the street is looking for 'specialness'. I also haven't seen anything in feminism saying it's okay to hit anyone. Wherever these 'feminists' are, I'm not seeing them, either online or in real life.
Feminists have been more interested in complaining about page 3 (i.e. lecturing other adult women) than the systematic rape and abuse of thousands of teenage girls by rape gangs in our towns and cities, or the tens of thousands of British girls who are sexually mutilated every year. And we all know why this is, because they can't blame white men.
It would be good if at least something of what you say had some connection to reality...
Who do you think runs FGM charities like Forward and Daughters of Eve? Women.
Who do you think runs rape charities like Rape Crisis, Women against Rape who support rape and sexual abuse victims? Women.
I don't know anyone who thinks page 3 is more important than FGM or sexual abuse.
The latter two I care very much about, the former I'm not bothered about. I have personally given my time to help victims of sex offences, sex trafficking and domestic violence. Can you say the same?
Whoa, I don't really see how wanting to not be harassed on the street is looking for 'specialness'. I also haven't seen anything in feminism saying it's okay to hit anyone. Wherever these 'feminists' are, I'm not seeing them, either online or in real life.
But why is it harassment for a woman, but compliments for a man? Of course, that's when its not being deemed a fake video.
Comments
Agreed, especially the BIB. This has been my experience, sadly.
All women are feminists and men too if they believe in the principle of equal rights based on equality of the sexes. Do you not?
I don't know what you do about that one, you can never know in advance which is the right tack to take...
That makes me a feminist then.
I said in a few posts back to one feminist banging on about wanting equality. They don't want equality. What they really want is 'specialness'......to pick at the bit's they like and discard that which they don't.
I never said anything of the sort.
0/10 Christa will be in the 'C' class next year.
Quite.
I agree, but I think one of things a part of modern feminism which a lot of people don't like is that it talks about social norms, the media etc; in other words the culture of society and how it affects women. I think many feel comfortable with women have legal rights and financial independence, but I've noticed people are far less comfortable talking about social and cultural norms, and the negative effects they can have; especially since many don't think anything is wrong with the way things are now. There are many people who do not believe sexism exists anymore (that equality has been reached and everything is now fine), or that it isn't prevalent in society, or that all women are sex objects etc. They believe feminism 'victimizes' women rather than women in certain situations already being 'victims' in the first place.
That's nonsense. Modern feminist groups prioritise banning 'lad's mags', page 3, pop songs and men daring to even speak to attractive women over the plight of rape gang victims, the horrors of fgm and the continued treatment of women as the property of men in some countries.
No really, nobody comes out with the stuff you do for real, it must be a wine up (sic).
In my experience, I've found modern feminists care about a range of issues; both FGM, the lack of legal rights of women in many countries, as well as how women are represented in the media through page 3, lads mags. And as for men 'daring' to speak to attractive women. I don't think I've ever seen modern feminists criticise that, but rather street harassment.
You are a Masculinist!
Old chestnut? You equating saying hello to flashing your genitals is the most absurd point in here and there is plenty of competition. There is little point entering into tedious multi-quoting dialogue with someone who has that as their jumping off point. You're wrong and that'll do for me.
That video in here was branded as fake and not comparable. You can't win with these types of hypocrites.
You make some very good points. I think people tend to believe what suits them. Many seem to believe that women have legal rights now so job done; that's all fine as long as it doesn't impact them personally. When people start having to reassess attitudes and behaviour, that's when they get uncomfortable and shirty.
This doesn't only apply to women to be fair, also to ethnic minorities, LBGT etc.
Feminists have been more interested in complaining about page 3 (i.e. lecturing other adult women) than the systematic rape and abuse of thousands of teenage girls by rape gangs in our towns and cities, or the tens of thousands of British girls who are sexually mutilated every year. And we all know why this is, because they can't blame white men.
Feel free to google the definition of feminism as you don't appear to have a clue.
Modern 'feminists' are not a homogenous group as you seem to think. Personally I think banning lads' mags or page 3 is pointless in the context of porn.
I don't know any woman who 'prioritises' the hypersexualisation and objectification of women in Western media over sex offences, trafficking & FGM. They're all problems, they're different kinds of problems.
I used to work in an industry where many men wouldn't venture for fear of being asked to 'do the job', and the few who tried often didn't last more than a few days. Some even ran off. Women were nowhere to be seen......ever. Physically incapable....simple as that.
The other side was women doing jobs which many men couldn't handle. Jobs which needed slim nimble fingers and a sharp eye.
There will never be total equality as it's a physical impossibility and unrealistic to think otherwise. But as for pay, if doing the same type of work then yes the pay should be equal.
Completely agree.
I do wonder about some of them.
Things that make me laugh is in the comments you say a women say something like "Feminists like these make me ashamed to be a woman. We're not here to single out how awful men are when women can be just the same. Yes women get raped and taken advantage off, as do men". Which is met to replies that say - no joke - "Women being raped is more important, cause men can deal with it." How in any way is that equality?
What ALSO makes me laugh - this is going to be slightly controversial - is so called feminists saying things like "A man shouldn't speak to a woman like that" after provoking and talking to the man in a much worse way - where's the EQUALITY in that?
Another thing I see a lot is this whole men shouldn't hit women, but it's fine for women to hit men debate. How so? It isn't acceptable for anyone to hit anyone. If a man hits a woman and the woman fights back - it's self defence. But when a woman hits a man, and the mans natural reaction is to push that woman away - it's battery and assault. Again, where's the equality in that?
There are a ridiculous amount of fundamental flaws in the logic of feminists - well the majority at least.
Really? Many feminists I know care about this issue very much - I know I do. And on page 3, feminists are not 'lecturing other adult women' - you can support someone's right to choose what they'd like even if you don't always agree with their choices, and you think those choices may have negative consequences. Feminists care about all kinds of issues that affect women - it isn't a competition between one issue all the other; I know for myself that a lot issues relate to one another. And if you really think the goal of feminism is just 'blame white men' rather than help women...well...I can't help there, I'm afraid.
It would be good if at least something of what you say had some connection to reality...
Who do you think runs FGM charities like Forward and Daughters of Eve? Women.
Who do you think runs rape charities like Rape Crisis, Women against Rape who support rape and sexual abuse victims? Women.
I don't know anyone who thinks page 3 is more important than FGM or sexual abuse.
The latter two I care very much about, the former I'm not bothered about. I have personally given my time to help victims of sex offences, sex trafficking and domestic violence. Can you say the same?
But why is it harassment for a woman, but compliments for a man? Of course, that's when its not being deemed a fake video.