I'm a bit confused. I have just seen the father of the little boy being interviewed on BBC. He was saying that the boat overturned and he gathered his wife and kids in his arms but they were all dead. Surely he didn't let go of the bodies and let them float away. I suppose if he was in really deep water he might have felt he had a better chance on his own but I thought it happened not too far from shore. Didn't anyone else see it as I might have misunderstood.
The family left Syria last year and been living in Istanbul according to the father's Facebook profile, in photos they all appear healthy, well fed and clearly safe, sticking his wife and kids on that death trap dinghy was nothing short of criminal >:(
The family left Syria last year and been living in Istanbul according to the father's Facebook profile, in photos they all appear healthy, well fed and clearly safe, sticking his wife and kids on that death trap dinghy was nothing short of criminal >:(
Why head south and risk a sea crossing? It's a much shorter route by land.
Istanbul is Turkey's largest city near the land border with Greece. It is approximately a four-hour drive to Alexandroupolis, which is the largest city on the Greek side of the land border. The E84 motorway travels through the Turkish side of the border, and the E90 is on the Greek side.
Why head south and risk a sea crossing? It's a much shorter route by land.
Istanbul is Turkey's largest city near the land border with Greece. It is approximately a four-hour drive to Alexandroupolis, which is the largest city on the Greek side of the land border. The E84 motorway travels through the Turkish side of the border, and the E90 is on the Greek side.
Exactly, why?
Actually I think it's because the E9 has quite a rigorous border check, like a lot of migrants they want to travel without passports, visas, documents etc.
Actually I think it's because the E9 has quite a rigorous border check, like a lot of migrants they want to travel without passports, visas, documents etc.
If they don't have an exit visa then they are not allowed out - and Turkey is not giving such visas. There are fences and walls (and a river as well) that are well patrolled so it is much easier to go by boat to the islands at night, because it is much harder to stop them..
The family left Syria last year and been living in Istanbul according to the father's Facebook profile, in photos they all appear healthy, well fed and clearly safe, sticking his wife and kids on that death trap dinghy was nothing short of criminal >:(
Sadly, he made the mistake of not putting his family in life jackets, he should have demanded the smugglers provide them. Smugglers are mainly to blame for these tragedies.
Amazing that the father, fleeing persecution and heart wringingly on the breadline, had time to be updating his Facebook profile.
The fault of his children dying lie squarely on his irresponsible shoulders for trying to cross a body of water in an unsuitable vehicle with little or no consideration of safety.
For all of it's logic, the dad might as well have handed a lit firework to the child.
It's a perception problem. The media's playing with people's emotions by running sob stories about the plight of the migrants. Most of the public assumes that asylum seekers are people who are genuinely fleeing some kind of danger of violence or persecution.
So the Bbc runs a sob story about this woman-
For two years in Istanbul, she enjoyed a comfortable life. Nour found work in a hair transplant salon, and later with Turkish state TV. She learnt Turkish, went horse-riding and dyed her hair blonde for the summer
That doesn't sound like a terrible life meaning we should offer them shelter until it's safe for them to return to their home country. But then she also states she does not want to be Syrian any more. The article also points out the coaching she had so she could make her bogus claim.
So it's rather hard to feel any sympathy for her plight given it was entirely self-inflicted and due to her choice to pay criminals to help her travel illegally across Europe. It's also hard to feel any sympathy for the Bbc if they really think this woman was a genuine refugee that we should be helping.
And the worst part.. Because of people like this, there'll be less sympathy for Syrians who don't have the money to pay people smugglers, or who are stuck in refugee camps or in ISIL controlled parts of Syria.
Thats right, in her case she is presumably claiming persecution, so again I ask what her economic status would have to do with the decision on a claim. The decision is based on whether someone flees persecution THAT and only that is the basis of a claim for asylum.
So again, what is the relevance of her (or any refugee's) social standing, economic standing?
Sadly, he made the mistake of not putting his family in life jackets, he should have demanded the smugglers provide them. Smugglers are mainly to blame for these tragedies.
I think the west must take the blame.
instead of picking up all the boat people for rescue, they should take them straight back to the nearest country.
and they should execute lorry drivers involved in the smuggling.
too soft. soft on crime, soft on the causes of crime. liberal hand-wringers have a lot to answer for.
This is going to be an incredibly unpopular opinion but i feel compelled to say
You simply cannot just let EVERYONE into a country that's already struggling to sustain itself.
The latest pictures of that poor child have no created overwhelming social pressure! We are a vastly overcrowded country, current waiting list for council homes are 25yrs long.
Waiting for doctors appointments is now two weeks
We moan about the NHS then do everything in our power to overwhelm it, prove that it doesn't work and its sold off and we've lost it forever.
The situation is horrible but theres only so much we as a country can do
The 'bleeding hearts' outcries on FB are really starting to irritate me
People starting petitions that we should do more to help
We are fulfilling our 7% quota
Its nice that people care but you are creating a rod for your own back
Images like this aren't released without intent.
Of course they want more refugees here. Of course they want the NHS overwhelmed. It makes it easier to sell off when it 'isn't working anymore'
You are all being manipulated emotionally
Time for the rest of Europe to pick up the slack and allow people to settle.
Quite why these refugees don't stop in Greece or turkey etc ill never know. They've reached Europe, they're already safe and out of the 'war torn country'
They come to the furthest reaches of Europe because they know they will get an easy ride here
Sorry guys game over me. My sympathy only runs so far and i refuse to be manipulated by press and media.
They're not economic migrants who will come here to contribute. They're refugees who want to be looked after and provided for. And frankly charity begins at home as far as I'm concerned.
They've no interest in integrating either
They want to bring their ideals, and lifestyles and religions here, isolate themselves from us as a society but still take the handouts we provide
Thats right, in her case she is presumably claiming persecution, so again I ask what her economic status would have to do with the decision on a claim. The decision is based on whether someone flees persecution THAT and only that is the basis of a claim for asylum.
So again, what is the relevance of her (or any refugee's) social standing, economic standing?
Your opinion is far from 'incredibly unpopular' - in fact quite the opposite.
I was listening to 5Live's discussion about migrants, and they seemed to be taking alternative calls from pro and anti-migrant callers, so it seemed a bit of a split, but at the end the presenter admitted that the overwhelming response via email and text was from those NOT wanting to take in migrants.
It doesn't always seem that way with the BBC due to their biased pro-migrant reporting. Also, forums like this have a disproportionate number of bleeding hearts willing to preach hare-brained schemes from their leafy villages (ie very unlikely to be affected by mass immigration) as how to 'solve' the migrant crisis.
But fear not, there are many people in this country (not just based on the 5Live programme - that was just a snapshot), who share the same sensible fears and views as you do.
I'm amazed they allowed a 50-50 split to have their views....
Then again, the BBC wouldn't want to be seen as biased with an upcoming licence review now would they....
Iain Dale on LBC only took talks from those favouring migrants, it was the most left-wing thing I've ever heard.
Because they want money and won't get it in hungry! You'd think they'd be happy because their safe! Obviously not!
They want to pick and choose where to go .
They a proberbly not who they claim to be either, hence the reluctance of giving out information
It's the cherry-picking that gets to me too as regards where they demand they can go...
One minute they are seconds from death and/or starvation with nothing to their name except the clothes on their back... the next they are well-fed and groomed, clutching smart phones and have thousands to pay people smugglers....
I'm a bit confused. I have just seen the father of the little boy being interviewed on BBC. He was saying that the boat overturned and he gathered his wife and kids in his arms but they were all dead. Surely he didn't let go of the bodies and let them float away. I suppose if he was in really deep water he might have felt he had a better chance on his own but I thought it happened not too far from shore. Didn't anyone else see it as I might have misunderstood.
I thought exactly as you did. Of course the bleedin' hearts won't question anything he said.
If my spouse and children were in the water I'd be straight in after them.
I've experienced this first hand today, commented on a post asking why the campaigners refuse to acknowledge that thousands of homeless people are literally dying on our streets each year, yet they want us to take in more migrants and provide them with accommodation and food (the same resources we refuse to offer to homeless people...) and I'm a racist apparently.....
I also didn't see the same humanitarian offering their own home as a place for migrants to move into, and live alongside his family and eat his food either.... but my view doesn't count as it's "racist"
Why can't we help the homeless and asylum seekers? It doesn't have to be an either/or. If there aren't enough homes, build more – relax the planning laws if necessary. There's no food shortage in the UK – a lot of it is wasted, however.
Why can't we help the homeless and asylum seekers? It doesn't have to be an either/or. If there aren't enough homes, build more – relax the planning laws if necessary. There's no food shortage in the UK – a lot of it is wasted, however.
So food banks are a figment of peoples' imagination?
And we do not have plenty of food, we import food by the ton because we cannot provide enough for the population already living here.
So food banks are a figment of peoples' imagination?
And we do not have plenty of food, we import food by the ton because we cannot provide enough for the population already living here.
We throw away tons of food every day. To suggest there is a food shortage in the UK is lunacy. Food banks are for those who cannot afford food and not because of any shortages.
Anyhow, for what it's worth, my practical solution to the crisis would be to take more refugees… from countries neighbouring war zones, such as Turkey. And probably send back any who have crossed illegally into Europe.
This would dissuade people from making risky sea crossings (as they know they would be sent back) and help to eradicate the people-smuggling business, since the only asylum seekers accepted by the West would be those residing in countries neighbouring war zones.
Anyhow, for what it's worth, my practical solution to the crisis would be to take more refugees… from countries neighbouring war zones, such as Turkey. And probably send back any who have crossed illegally into Europe.
This would dissuade people from making risky sea crossings (as they know they would be sent back) and help to eradicate the people-smuggling business, since the only asylum seekers accepted by the West would be those residing in countries neighbouring war zones.
Someone who is saying what I am thinking!!!! Great post.
I am becoming really irritated by these migrants in Budapest screaming that they want to go to Germany. You are in Hungary! A democratic and safe EU state! Now that you are in Hungary you have escaped (past tense!) from the horrors of the Syrian civil war!
We throw away tons of food every day. To suggest there is a food shortage in the UK is lunacy. Food banks are for those who cannot afford food and not because of any shortages.
Precisely. Lunacy is the word for some of the comments I've seen on this forum today. Some people appear to live in an alternate reality where human life is utterly dispensable and no one has an ounce of compassion. I suppose it's just how they think, so they believe everyone else thinks that way too?
the bbc did worse the other day in a phone in about disability assessments. (I started a thread on it) every phone call was from people unhappy with the assessment process.
just a couple of emails read out, against the standard view.
the BBC seem to love hovering around the entry points. "Welcome to Europe", it was, on one Greek Island.
Comments
The family left Syria last year and been living in Istanbul according to the father's Facebook profile, in photos they all appear healthy, well fed and clearly safe, sticking his wife and kids on that death trap dinghy was nothing short of criminal >:(
This shows the reality
Why head south and risk a sea crossing? It's a much shorter route by land.
Istanbul is Turkey's largest city near the land border with Greece. It is approximately a four-hour drive to Alexandroupolis, which is the largest city on the Greek side of the land border. The E84 motorway travels through the Turkish side of the border, and the E90 is on the Greek side.
Exactly, why?
Actually I think it's because the E9 has quite a rigorous border check, like a lot of migrants they want to travel without passports, visas, documents etc.
If they don't have an exit visa then they are not allowed out - and Turkey is not giving such visas. There are fences and walls (and a river as well) that are well patrolled so it is much easier to go by boat to the islands at night, because it is much harder to stop them..
Sadly, he made the mistake of not putting his family in life jackets, he should have demanded the smugglers provide them. Smugglers are mainly to blame for these tragedies.
Don't you find it odd that the normal route for ISIL supporters still seems to be via Turkey?
Don't you find it odd that the ISIL supporters manage to get through borders where PKK were typically most active, and thus should have more security?
Of course. They know who their friends are.
The fault of his children dying lie squarely on his irresponsible shoulders for trying to cross a body of water in an unsuitable vehicle with little or no consideration of safety.
For all of it's logic, the dad might as well have handed a lit firework to the child.
Thats right, in her case she is presumably claiming persecution, so again I ask what her economic status would have to do with the decision on a claim. The decision is based on whether someone flees persecution THAT and only that is the basis of a claim for asylum.
So again, what is the relevance of her (or any refugee's) social standing, economic standing?
I think the west must take the blame.
instead of picking up all the boat people for rescue, they should take them straight back to the nearest country.
and they should execute lorry drivers involved in the smuggling.
too soft. soft on crime, soft on the causes of crime. liberal hand-wringers have a lot to answer for.
You are not alone.
Saudi Arabia is one of the richest countries on the planet but takes none of this exodus. Not even a few hundred:
https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2014/12/facts-figures-syria-refugee-crisis-international-resettlement/
Too busy channelling its money to ISIS.
She's a chancer.
I'm amazed they allowed a 50-50 split to have their views....
Then again, the BBC wouldn't want to be seen as biased with an upcoming licence review now would they....
Iain Dale on LBC only took talks from those favouring migrants, it was the most left-wing thing I've ever heard.
It's the cherry-picking that gets to me too as regards where they demand they can go...
One minute they are seconds from death and/or starvation with nothing to their name except the clothes on their back... the next they are well-fed and groomed, clutching smart phones and have thousands to pay people smugglers....
I thought exactly as you did. Of course the bleedin' hearts won't question anything he said.
If my spouse and children were in the water I'd be straight in after them.
I think that picture was so awful and shocking that some people aren't really thinking things through. They're still in shock.
Like this video .... It puts a whole new slant on things. Watch it all.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=QZUuoaq1MLM
Why can't we help the homeless and asylum seekers? It doesn't have to be an either/or. If there aren't enough homes, build more – relax the planning laws if necessary. There's no food shortage in the UK – a lot of it is wasted, however.
So food banks are a figment of peoples' imagination?
And we do not have plenty of food, we import food by the ton because we cannot provide enough for the population already living here.
We throw away tons of food every day. To suggest there is a food shortage in the UK is lunacy. Food banks are for those who cannot afford food and not because of any shortages.
This would dissuade people from making risky sea crossings (as they know they would be sent back) and help to eradicate the people-smuggling business, since the only asylum seekers accepted by the West would be those residing in countries neighbouring war zones.
Definitely not alone.
Someone who is saying what I am thinking!!!! Great post.
I am becoming really irritated by these migrants in Budapest screaming that they want to go to Germany. You are in Hungary! A democratic and safe EU state! Now that you are in Hungary you have escaped (past tense!) from the horrors of the Syrian civil war!
Precisely. Lunacy is the word for some of the comments I've seen on this forum today. Some people appear to live in an alternate reality where human life is utterly dispensable and no one has an ounce of compassion. I suppose it's just how they think, so they believe everyone else thinks that way too?
just a couple of emails read out, against the standard view.
the BBC seem to love hovering around the entry points. "Welcome to Europe", it was, on one Greek Island.