I am LOVING reading everyone's posts.
And even more I am LOVING the fact that I know so many of you in real life now!
I LOVE THIS PLACE SOOOOOO MUCH!
/post ChryedCon soppiness
I think all that 'softened' Syed up. And I don't think it would have happened without it.
But I saw interest from Syed, seriously. And that's why he tried to fess that up to Christian.
It wasn't 'just a kiss', it was more important than that - it was Syed responding emotionally and sexually to someone else.
Circumstances can explain it, but it happened.
But he responding to the kiss and anything else that may have happened when he was under a great deal of pressure, worry and with a low self esteem. He was looking to be anyone but himself and lost himself in a make believe world. Human beings make very rash decisions when under stress and act very out of character. Syed always loved Christian, wanted to be with him. It was a moment in time not a life time.
But he responding to the kiss and anything else that may have happened when he was under a great deal of pressure, worry and with a low self esteem. He was looking to be anyone but himself and lost himself in a make believe world. Human beings make very rash decisions when under stress and act very out of character. Syed always loved Christian, wanted to be with him. It was a moment in time not a life time.
That's true, and it's understandable, but it was there and it happened, and that is what they both know.
And Christian forgave that...but it didn't stop as far as he knew, because Syed was not honest with him. And Christian doesn't know whether Syed actually wants to be with him.
That's true, and it's understandable, but it was there and it happened, and that is what they both know.
And Christian forgave that...but it didn't stop as far as he knew, because Syed was not honest with him. And Christian doesn't know whether Syed actually wants to be with him.
That's the rub.
I think Christian has been around the block enough to know that people act out of character due to external pressures, and that was why he forgave the kiss on the wedding morning and I think would understand if it went further. But for him it is the lies, not knowing were he stands with Syed. If he knows he was always the one Syed loved and loves he can put it behind him in time. But Danny has made him doubt that and reinforced all the fears he has towards their relationship. Mirroring in a way what Danny also did to Syed before the wedding.
I've been thinking about Danny telling Syed that he told Christian the 'truth' on Friday - maybe what he told Christian is what he perceives to be the truth - that Syed could do better and he takes risks and isn't a homebody and he'll get bored etc. Danny didn't explicitly say to Christian he and Syed slept together, nor do I think it was actually said in the DS spoilers. That may not have been what he meant but it's what Christian took it as. And Danny let him because he wanted to hurt him.
I also think Syed not denying anything to Danny isn't necessarily an admission of guilt. His priority is to free Christian and he's not going to waste time denying something to Danny if a) Danny already knows the truth and b) he doesn't need to deny anything to Danny because he's not important; he can think whatever the hell he wants. :sleep:
I think Christian has been around the block enough to know that people act out of character due to external pressures, and that was why he forgave the kiss on the wedding morning and I think would understand if it went further. But for him it is the lies, not knowing were he stands with Syed. If he knows he was always one Syed loved and loves he can put it behind him. But Danny has made him doubt that and reinforced all the fears he has towards their relationship. Mirroring what Danny did to Syed before the wedding.
Yes.
Have to say though, that 'going round the block' can make you forgiving. But though the understanding is there, the hurt never changes.
Have to say though, that 'going round the block' can make you forgiving. But though the understanding is there, the hurt never changes.
I agree, just because as we get older we see things less black and white does not mean it does not hurt any less. And that is why I think it's very important that Syed chooses to go to USA with Christian and not Christian follow Syed. Christian needs to know that Syed has to be with him and will do anything to make that happen. Even spending time with the mother and sister in law who know what has happen and may not greet him with open arms. Syed is not taking the easy way out or running away he is fighting for the man he loves.
I agree, just because as we get older we see things less black and white does not mean it does not hurt any less. And that is why I think it's very important that Syed chooses to go to USA with Christian and not Christian follow Syed. Christian needs to know that Syed has to be with him and will do anything to make that happen. Even spending time with the mother and sister in law who know what has happen and may not greet him with open arms. Syed is not taking the easy way out or running away he is fighting for the man he loves.
Yes, and he needs to. Because I think he does, but Christian needs to know, and know.
I think Danny basically represents a lot of Christian's fears
Absolutely! In many ways Danny represents the path not taken for Syed, the person he could have been if he hadn't come back to his family and had continued the dodgy deals and the property business and the conman stuff. There is a dark side to Syed's character that stays hidden most of the time and I can't help but wonder if Christian worries that Danny's character chimes with the dark side of Syed that Christian personally can't stand. Syed isn't that person around him, but that side of his character is there and I don't think Christian could live with Syed if Syed had taken other paths and had become someone like Danny instead of coming back to his family and falling in love with Christian. I don't think its just about 'sowing wild oats' or 'wanting something else' I think its also that Danny represents for Syed the path not taken. Syed doesn't regret pushing that away just as he's pushing Danny away, but Christian doesn't know that.
I can cope with Danny much better if I see him as metaphor (:sleep:) for Syed's dark side and yes, the picture of Christian at the end was shocking but that's because its easy to be shocked by physical pain. Its not so easy to see all the emotional pain Christian has been feeling because of Syed and because of Syed's failure to communicate. Which is inevitable when a character never speaks. :sleep:
Very angsty episode. It was interesting when Syed wanted to stay home and Christian encouraged him to go out. Danny seems to think Christian is the one holding him back, whereas Christian is always up for fun.
Didn't like the line from Syed saying they are married and show a united front or something like that. I thought that was sad.
Thursday's ep is going to be hard to watch with Christian emotionally and physically hurt.
Sorry I'm a bit late to the party but thank you so much for this!!! : D
Absolutely! In many ways Danny represents the path not taken for Syed, the person he could have been if he hadn't come back to his family and had continued the dodgy deals and the property business and the conman stuff. There is a dark side to Syed's character that stays hidden most of the time and I can't help but wonder if Christian worries that Danny's character chimes with the dark side of Syed that Christian personally can't stand. Syed isn't that person around him, but that side of his character is there and I don't think Christian could live with Syed if Syed had taken other paths and had become someone like Danny instead of coming back to his family and falling in love with Christian. I don't think its just about 'sowing wild oats' or 'wanting something else' I think its also that Danny represents for Syed the path not taken. Syed doesn't regret pushing that away just as he's pushing Danny away, but Christian doesn't know that.
I can cope with Danny much better if I see him as metaphor (:sleep:) for Syed's dark side and yes, the picture of Christian at the end was shocking but that's because its easy to be shocked by physical pain. Its not so easy to see all the emotional pain Christian has been feeling because of Syed and because of Syed's failure to communicate. Which is inevitable when a character never speaks. :sleep:
I quite enjoyed the drama last night even if it was horrible and painful to watch at the same time and it was.
I think I've realised that if there's one good thing to come from this Danny business, it's that Syed's love for Christian has only strengthend. After realising how cold Danny is, he's realised that the high-life isn't what he wants and it never really has been - he did tell Christian in 2010 after meeting with some property businessmen at the Vic that it was "awful" as he sat contentedly in Christian's arms - but Michael calling him "nothing" hit a nerve and made him think that he wanted to return to that life.
I thought the line from DTW to Christian, "it was more...much more" was clever and damaging. He never explicitly said they did anything more than kiss, it was purposely ambiguous, but it could easily have meant more emotionally as much as/ rather than physically. The wording mirrors how Syed himself described it: "In my head...in my heart it was more." This will have been like a stab to the heart; the hideous reminder that Syed was, and the possibility that perhaps he still is emotionally drawn to DTW and away from their relationship, their life together will be worse for Christian than any physical infidelity.
The way Christian turned round at the end revealing his bloodied face was very apt for the Halloween episode. The look on his face was horrible, it was like he was devoid of emotion and was wearing a mask. No way would DTW have been able to inflict that kind of damage, especially not after Christian had floored him with that first punch. I reckon Christian actually allowed Danny to fight back, either because he wanted to be hurt physically to detract temporarily from the emotional pain, or because he didn't care enough to put a stop to it.
I agree with all this, it played on Christian's worst fears and insecurities, and he had justification for feeling like that from his POV. And Syed WAS in an emotional state, he did reach out to DTW for help, for some sort of validation of himself, but at the same time escape from himself. It was reckless, foolish, desperate, almost a cry for help. He was confused, vulnerable and isolated. That is no excuse of course, he could have and should have turned to Christian. I'm not condoning it. But I can find understanding and sympathy there about why he didn't, and why he did what he did. At the same time I completely feel for Christian and the situation he has been put in.
Your second paragraph, I totally agree. Christian was already beaten. He didn't fight back because of this. He almost welcomed it, as a distraction, a numbing of the emotional pain, or even as a physical manifestation of what he felt inside but could not express, because it was so awful. His mind can't face it outwardly, can't bring it into the real world because it is so painful and he doesn't want it to be true, but he believes that it is, because it is what he feared all along. Hence he doesn't confront Syed about it. But the physical pain, his broken appearance is his own cry/scream out to the world, and to Syed. It also confirms his insecurities and not being good enough, that he himself is not enough for Syed, hence the not caring about himself and what was happening to him, the self-destruction via DTW.
See, I rewatched it the other day and it just made me even more convinced that he was telling the truth. Syed doesn't back off when people get angry, he backs off when people get hurt. If Christian had gone all quiet and serious like he does when he's talking about Syed having feelings for Danny, then I would buy Syed feeling awful and backing off. But he doesn't, he reacts with anger, and I don't think that would make Syed back off.
Also, Syed wasn't pulling any punches and hurt Christian repeatedly during that conversation. He hurt him far more by saying that Danny made him feel like he could be someone, for example. The way he stands up, too, and won't let Christian just forgive him for a kiss- that's not the way a person reacts when they're lying.
I'll be really surprised if Danny's not lying tbh.
This is how I saw it too, good points about the way Syed reacts:)
I've been thinking about Danny telling Syed that he told Christian the 'truth' on Friday - maybe what he told Christian is what he perceives to be the truth - that Syed could do better and he takes risks and isn't a homebody and he'll get bored etc. Danny didn't explicitly say to Christian he and Syed slept together, nor do I think it was actually said in the DS spoilers. That may not have been what he meant but it's what Christian took it as. And Danny let him because he wanted to hurt him.
I also think Syed not denying anything to Danny isn't necessarily an admission of guilt. His priority is to free Christian and he's not going to waste time denying something to Danny if a) Danny already knows the truth and b) he doesn't need to deny anything to Danny because he's not important; he can think whatever the hell he wants.
Good points Jenn, it could be that:)
BIB Totally agree with this too. I'm not expecting to have confirmation from Syed that he didn't sleep with DTW in his confrontation with him. And I can see this being believable and in character, plus of course it will also facilitate tptb's aim to keep this nonsense going and drag it out as long as possible:sleep: If there is, then great, it will be a bonus, but I don't think no denial will be an admission of guilt either. I can see the dialogue between them being left ambiguous, DTW and Syed already know the truth as you say, so there is no need realistically to explicitly say it out loud. I can also see Syed being shocked, and his first thoughts going to Christian, and everything falling into place about what happened, and DTW not being important. Syed also knows that it is about the power trip for DTW, so it could be about not giving him the satisfaction, not playing into his hands again.
I quite enjoyed the drama last night even if it was horrible and painful to watch at the same time and it was.
I think I've realised that if there's one good thing to come from this Danny business, it's that Syed's love for Christian has only strengthend. After realising how cold Danny is, he's realised that the high-life isn't what he wants and it never really has been - he did tell Christian in 2010 after meeting with some property businessmen at the Vic that it was "awful" as he sat contentedly in Christian's arms - but Michael calling him "nothing" hit a nerve and made him think that he wanted to return to that life.
I quite enjoyed it too:o It was horrible and painful, yes, but interesting, and dramatic, and you felt so much for Christian
Probably still would have rathered it didn't happen though, or that this storyline as a whole had played out differently:sleep:
Comments
And even more I am LOVING the fact that I know so many of you in real life now!
I LOVE THIS PLACE SOOOOOO MUCH!
/post ChryedCon soppiness
Off to bed. Bracing myself for Thursday's ep...
But he responding to the kiss and anything else that may have happened when he was under a great deal of pressure, worry and with a low self esteem. He was looking to be anyone but himself and lost himself in a make believe world. Human beings make very rash decisions when under stress and act very out of character. Syed always loved Christian, wanted to be with him. It was a moment in time not a life time.
I know:(
Christian is broken.
That's true, and it's understandable, but it was there and it happened, and that is what they both know.
And Christian forgave that...but it didn't stop as far as he knew, because Syed was not honest with him. And Christian doesn't know whether Syed actually wants to be with him.
That's the rub.
I think Christian has been around the block enough to know that people act out of character due to external pressures, and that was why he forgave the kiss on the wedding morning and I think would understand if it went further. But for him it is the lies, not knowing were he stands with Syed. If he knows he was always the one Syed loved and loves he can put it behind him in time. But Danny has made him doubt that and reinforced all the fears he has towards their relationship. Mirroring in a way what Danny also did to Syed before the wedding.
I also think Syed not denying anything to Danny isn't necessarily an admission of guilt. His priority is to free Christian and he's not going to waste time denying something to Danny if a) Danny already knows the truth and b) he doesn't need to deny anything to Danny because he's not important; he can think whatever the hell he wants. :sleep:
Yes.
Have to say though, that 'going round the block' can make you forgiving. But though the understanding is there, the hurt never changes.
I agree, just because as we get older we see things less black and white does not mean it does not hurt any less. And that is why I think it's very important that Syed chooses to go to USA with Christian and not Christian follow Syed. Christian needs to know that Syed has to be with him and will do anything to make that happen. Even spending time with the mother and sister in law who know what has happen and may not greet him with open arms. Syed is not taking the easy way out or running away he is fighting for the man he loves.
Yes, and he needs to. Because I think he does, but Christian needs to know, and know.
Lovely to talk to you.:)
It was lovely to chat to you too
I was just about to log off the thread, but had to say what a wonderful gif.:D I also loved the goodbye kisses in that scene
Lovely
I think I just melted .......:D
Thank you.
Sooooooooooooooooooooooooo cute
You're welcome!
Loads of great posts tonight, I'm very much in agreement with Lovesy and MT this evening with their thoughts.
Elphie, thank you for the screencaps and Jenn thank you for the adorable gif!
Not stopping, just popped back to say goodnight all and Love is Prevailing.....xxx....:yawn::sleep::)
Sorry I'm a bit late to the party
Absolutely! In many ways Danny represents the path not taken for Syed, the person he could have been if he hadn't come back to his family and had continued the dodgy deals and the property business and the conman stuff. There is a dark side to Syed's character that stays hidden most of the time and I can't help but wonder if Christian worries that Danny's character chimes with the dark side of Syed that Christian personally can't stand. Syed isn't that person around him, but that side of his character is there and I don't think Christian could live with Syed if Syed had taken other paths and had become someone like Danny instead of coming back to his family and falling in love with Christian. I don't think its just about 'sowing wild oats' or 'wanting something else' I think its also that Danny represents for Syed the path not taken. Syed doesn't regret pushing that away just as he's pushing Danny away, but Christian doesn't know that.
I can cope with Danny much better if I see him as metaphor (:sleep:) for Syed's dark side and yes, the picture of Christian at the end was shocking but that's because its easy to be shocked by physical pain. Its not so easy to see all the emotional pain Christian has been feeling because of Syed and because of Syed's failure to communicate. Which is inevitable when a character never speaks. :sleep:
Yay! More gif!!
Not such a happy one for Christian unfortunately.
Very angsty episode. It was interesting when Syed wanted to stay home and Christian encouraged him to go out. Danny seems to think Christian is the one holding him back, whereas Christian is always up for fun.
Didn't like the line from Syed saying they are married and show a united front or something like that. I thought that was sad.
Thursday's ep is going to be hard to watch with Christian emotionally and physically hurt.
You're welcome
You're welcome
I quite enjoyed the drama last night
I think I've realised that if there's one good thing to come from this Danny business, it's that Syed's love for Christian has only strengthend. After realising how cold Danny is, he's realised that the high-life isn't what he wants and it never really has been - he did tell Christian in 2010 after meeting with some property businessmen at the Vic that it was "awful" as he sat contentedly in Christian's arms
I agree with all this, it played on Christian's worst fears and insecurities, and he had justification for feeling like that from his POV. And Syed WAS in an emotional state, he did reach out to DTW for help, for some sort of validation of himself, but at the same time escape from himself. It was reckless, foolish, desperate, almost a cry for help. He was confused, vulnerable and isolated. That is no excuse of course, he could have and should have turned to Christian. I'm not condoning it. But I can find understanding and sympathy there about why he didn't, and why he did what he did. At the same time I completely feel for Christian and the situation he has been put in.
Your second paragraph, I totally agree. Christian was already beaten. He didn't fight back because of this. He almost welcomed it, as a distraction, a numbing of the emotional pain, or even as a physical manifestation of what he felt inside but could not express, because it was so awful. His mind can't face it outwardly, can't bring it into the real world because it is so painful and he doesn't want it to be true, but he believes that it is, because it is what he feared all along. Hence he doesn't confront Syed about it. But the physical pain, his broken appearance is his own cry/scream out to the world, and to Syed. It also confirms his insecurities and not being good enough, that he himself is not enough for Syed, hence the not caring about himself and what was happening to him, the self-destruction via DTW.
Thank you, we will:D
This is how I saw it too, good points about the way Syed reacts:)
Good points Jenn, it could be that:)
BIB Totally agree with this too. I'm not expecting to have confirmation from Syed that he didn't sleep with DTW in his confrontation with him. And I can see this being believable and in character, plus of course it will also facilitate tptb's aim to keep this nonsense going and drag it out as long as possible:sleep: If there is, then great, it will be a bonus, but I don't think no denial will be an admission of guilt either. I can see the dialogue between them being left ambiguous, DTW and Syed already know the truth as you say, so there is no need realistically to explicitly say it out loud. I can also see Syed being shocked, and his first thoughts going to Christian, and everything falling into place about what happened, and DTW not being important. Syed also knows that it is about the power trip for DTW, so it could be about not giving him the satisfaction, not playing into his hands again.
Awww, thank you:)
I quite enjoyed it too:o It was horrible and painful, yes, but interesting, and dramatic, and you felt so much for Christian
Probably still would have rathered it didn't happen though, or that this storyline as a whole had played out differently:sleep:
It was horrible having to look at Christian's battered face:(:cry:
Can't get it out of my head.
Was it really necessary?:(
Thanks for the screencaps elphie and for the cute gif jenn