I moved in with my other half on Hallow'een. I've seen a spreadsheet he made up to calculate his living costs when he took his new job and had to rent this place.
I pay him £320 a month which is...
£200 rent (half)
£20 to rent the garage (half)
£35 council tax (half)
£65 bills (We have no gas, it's electric and water... I pay half of what he was paying previously, and if it turns out it's more here, I'll pay that too, because it's going up because I live here too.
I did however refuse to pay towards his Virgin package because that'd be paid for whether I was here or not & it wouldn't be my choice to have it at the rate the OH does so I'm not paying!
He earns about double what I do and is paying off the mortgage on his previous flat. I don't contribute to that, is all his business and we've agreed never to open a joint account. If he needs my help financially, he can ask and he'll get it... a joint account is just asking for trouble IMO.
He earns about double what I do and is paying off the mortgage on his previous flat. I don't contribute to that, is all his business and we've agreed never to open a joint account. If he needs my help financially, he can ask and he'll get it... a joint account is just asking for trouble IMO.
If it's in your name he can't demand anything if you split up. If you also ask him to leave he has to and can't refuse.
That's not true to be honest from a legal point of view. If someone contributes to a mortgage/bills or perhaps to the house in some other way such as contributing towards home improvements then they may have what's called an equitable interest in the home and be able to make a claim. If you think about it it's only fair that someone who may for example have lived somewhere for x number of years and put into the house a considerable amount of money over the years then why should the person whose sole name is on the deeds reap all the rewards in the event of a split.
Also, a person cannot be forced to leave a property without a court order should they refuse to go of their own free will.
One thing to get clear. He has no right what so ever to any equity in your house unless you choose to put him on your mortgage. Your mums money is totally safe. The only thing you need to consider is day to day bills and anything that you may purchase together as a couple.
Again, not strictly true. It depends on his contribution to the household down the line and how long he has been living there in the event of a seperation. A person can build up an equitable interest in a house over the years.
Again, not strictly true. It depends on his contribution to the household down the line and how long he has been living there in the event of a seperation. A person can build up an equitable interest in a house over the years.
Then how can my will say that if I die, and my OH moves out, the house is sold and the proceeds divided between my children? He gets nothing from the sale. The will was drawn up by a solicitor.
I think there has been some great advice on here. I have been through the same thing. When my OH and I bought our house we had a legal document drawn up because I put down a £40,000 deposit out of my own money, so the document bascially states that in the event of a break up I will receive the % my deposit represented and any money left over will be split. You can have a similar agreement drawn up to say that the house is soley yours and he has no claim to it.
We split all the bills 50/50 and always have regardless of who earnt what. We have a seperate account which we transfer £800 each a month into, and that pays for all the bills etc. Then whatever is left over in our seperate accounts is our own to do with what we want. We call it our joint account but it is in fact only in my name, and my OH has never had a problem with that. I am the one who keeps on top of the finances anyway. He is so laid back about it all that if I ever need anymore to cover other expenses like holidays etc. I just log into his bank account online and transfer it to mine. But we have been living together for 12 years now so there is an increased element of trust.
Just sit down together and discuss how you are going to work it out, and how you can protect your house. Be open and honest with each other or it could come back to bite you.
There has been some excellent advice in here thank you all.
i still have a few questions though....
Punkchick are you and your partner married?
I completely understand about the equitable interest, it seems like common sense which is why i can see that many people have advised me to see a solicitor but does it make a difference if you are married or not? (im thinking no)
Why are people saying that joint accounts are more hassle than they are worth? Is this for all accounts or just current accounts? the reason i ask this is because, as i said earlier, we are looking to get married in a couple of years and we were thinking about openeing a joint savings account for it.
I agree with those who've advised a joint bills account (but retain your own personal current account).
Go through each of your monthly expenses and decide which are 'household' and which are personal. Then agree what proportion of the household expenses you are going to pay for - I wouldn't say it should be halved if you've got very different incomes - I'd say make your contributions proportionate to your salaries so that if he earns twice as much as you he contributes more.
If you are worried about him acquiring an interest in your home then continue to pay the mortgage out of your own personal account and ask him to put an amount into the pot as a contribution towards housing costs - you could use it to buy food or whatever.
This way you'll both be left with some personal disposable income but both be sharing all the boring household bills.
There has been some excellent advice in here thank you all.
i still have a few questions though....
Punkchick are you and your partner married?
I completely understand about the equitable interest, it seems like common sense which is why i can see that many people have advised me to see a solicitor but does it make a difference if you are married or not? (im thinking no)
Why are people saying that joint accounts are more hassle than they are worth? Is this for all accounts or just current accounts? the reason i ask this is because, as i said earlier, we are looking to get married in a couple of years and we were thinking about openeing a joint savings account for it.
Joint savings accounts can be set up so that it requires both of you to withdraw any money - great if you've got a spendthrift partner!
Joint current accounts are great for bills.
But although I've lived with three different people (two of whom I've married) I've always had my own current account and some form of savings in my own name - that was achieved by both of us opening ISA's in our own names any paying the same amount each into them each month. Felt very fair and nice to have some money I could get my hands on if he ran off or fell under a bus!
My boyfriend takes £400 a month off me. It's his mortgage and he's on a more a year than me. I don't contribute to bills, more to just the mortgage. He can manage fine with out my money so sets it aside as "spending money"
We both decided to have Virgin Media so part of that £400 is for that.
Dont open a joint account, ever.
Joint accounts are better when you are old. It halves the cost of nursing fees sometimes making it free.
QUOTE=Kaz159;46370886]Then how can my will say that if I die, and my OH moves out, the house is sold and the proceeds divided between my children? He gets nothing from the sale. The will was drawn up by a solicitor.[/QUOTE]
I don't know your individual circumstances but a person can build up an interest in a property depending on their contribution over the years to the property. For example if someone has shared a home and paid a proportion of monthly bills towards the mortgage etc.. perhaps doing DIY, paying towards flooring, a new heating system blah blah blah whatever then they can argue they have an interest in the property. The law makes provision for such scenarios.
Your will is just that, as open to challenge as any other will. If he chose and he had the evidence (of his contributions) to back it up then your OH could go to court and make a claim. If he succeeded or not would depend entirely on the individual circumstances. By the sounds of it though your OH is happy with the situation and so wouldn't go down this road. I do think however that perhaps your solicitor could have pointed it out to you at the time, unless of course based on his/her knowledge of your personal circumstances they thought it highly unlikely such a claim would ever be successful.
Then how can my will say that if I die, and my OH moves out, the house is sold and the proceeds divided between my children? He gets nothing from the sale. The will was drawn up by a solicitor.
People do things to make sure that their partners do not get an equitable interest by default - such as making their intentions clear in legal documents before hand (the safest option), the way they structure their finances ie no joint accounts, and their wills.
However, an OH in the position you state can still argue that he has an equitable stake or bargain with your children for a share of the procceds of the sale otherwise he will stay put. Its nice that you have considered your family turfing him out preciptiously but there is also the possibility that they may fall out because he holds them to ransom by sitting on their inheritance.
A few people have advised against joint accounts. Id be interested to know why because to e at least, a joint account for the bills is the most sensible way.
a joint account is acutally a good idea, you can still have your seperate accounts also.
For example, each of you put £500 in the joint account every month and use that for household expenses.
The rest in your OWN account is your own money.
Yes it is. My husband and I did this when we first lived together before we were married and continued with it after. We opened an account and decided how much each of us should put into it every month, then all the bills for living expenses come out of it. If we want extra for a holiday or something we both pay in more. We both also have our own private accounts.. This method works very well.
Just editing to add that of course a joint account is partly about trust but hopefully if you are living together you do trust each other.
And to the person who said they weren't paying anything towards the Virgin account, why not? You were presumably using it when you typed your post.
My parents gave me money for the deposit and my Dad insisted that we had something drawn up by the solicitor to say that if we ever split up the money would come back to me. But everything else would be split 50/50. It's not something you really want to think about and my partner was initially a bit miffed but then I think he saw my Dad's point of view (he is protecting his and my interests as we aren't married yet). We were also told by our solicitor to make wills as if one of us dies our share does not automatically go to the other it would go to the others family, which in our case is not a problem but in some cases it could be.
We have a joint bank account for the bills and mortgage and our big food shop and any energency that may arise(like something going wrong with one of our cars just before payday). It seems to work fine for us. We each put the same amount in each month. Some of the bills are in my name and some are in his(whoever got round to arranging the services). The rest of our wages stay in our own bank account and are for our persoanl bills , mobile phone, car insurance, car loan etc and anything else we want. We never use the joint account for personal bills it's just for household bills.
A few people have advised against joint accounts. Id be interested to know why because to e at least, a joint account for the bills is the most sensible way.
If you have a joint account and one of you gets in to debt for any reason and ends up with a poor credit rating, you will both end up with a poor credit rating because your finances are linked. If you have separate accounts and one of you gets into difficulties then you will still both have access to credit through the partner that has not got into bad credit.
We never use the joint account for personal bills it's just for household bills.
That works because you are both buying together but people who already have a property and want to protect that for for themselves and for example for their children from previous relationships need to ensure that their finances are not set up so that a judge could think that their partner expected a right to their home. One of the things the courts use to judge their intentions if it is not written down formally in a contract is whether they had joint finances (which is why a joint account can be a silly idea), whether they both contributed to the mortgage (so definitely don't pay this from the joint account) or whether it was clear the partner was just contributing to living costs on ie renting.
None of this applies to married couples as obviously marriage gives you rights over each others property anyway.
People do things to make sure that their partners do not get an equitable interest by default - such as making their intentions clear in legal documents before hand (the safest option), the way they structure their finances ie no joint accounts, and their wills.
However, an OH in the position you state can still argue that he has an equitable stake or bargain with your children for a share of the procceds of the sale otherwise he will stay put. Its nice that you have considered your family turfing him out preciptiously but there is also the possibility that they may fall out because he holds them to ransom by sitting on their inheritance.
Playing devils advocate here but how does someone prove they have contributed to the mortage when the mortgage is in another person's name?
If you decide for him not to contribute to mortage to stop him getting any of the house in the event of a split, how do you handle maintaince bills ?
All the bills are in my name. I keep a monthly account and we split the amount 50/50. I haven't done this to stop him getting the house as such. We agreed all of this before he moved in. He sold his house but kept his endowment going so will get a lump sum from that. Obviously I don't get any of that. I'm not his next of kin as we are not married so his family will inherit. (He does not have children.)
I have four children and had the house quite a while before my OH moved in so it's always been important that I protect them. This is not an issue for us. We discussed the money side of things long before he sold up and moved to Northumberland.
If you decide for him not to contribute to mortage to stop him getting any of the house in the event of a split, how do you handle maintaince bills ?
It's probably not if it's just for bills and you need 2 signaurest to take money out but I had a nightmare with my first husband and our joint account so vowed I would never do it again.
As I've said, my OH just transfers money into my account monthly and I pay the bills
Playing devils advocate here but how does someone prove they have contributed to the mortage when the mortgage is in another person's name?
Not directed at me I know but for example regular deposits from his account into yours from which the mortgage is paid out of. It doesn't matter that his name isn't on the mortgage and a mortgage doesn't necessarily reflect how the property is held in a legal sense anyway.
Not directed at me I know but for example regular deposits from his account into yours from which the mortgage is paid out of. It doesn't matter that his name isn't on the mortgage and a mortgage doesn't necessarily reflect how the property is held in a legal sense anyway.
I know what you are saying but what if the money paid in isn't used directly for the mortgage? I'm still not sure how you would prove someone was contributing to the mortage.
Fortunately, we sorted everything out before we lived together.
Obviously it all becomes a different ball game if we get married.
Comments
I pay him £320 a month which is...
£200 rent (half)
£20 to rent the garage (half)
£35 council tax (half)
£65 bills (We have no gas, it's electric and water... I pay half of what he was paying previously, and if it turns out it's more here, I'll pay that too, because it's going up because I live here too.
I did however refuse to pay towards his Virgin package because that'd be paid for whether I was here or not & it wouldn't be my choice to have it at the rate the OH does so I'm not paying!
He earns about double what I do and is paying off the mortgage on his previous flat. I don't contribute to that, is all his business and we've agreed never to open a joint account. If he needs my help financially, he can ask and he'll get it... a joint account is just asking for trouble IMO.
It certainly is.
That's not true to be honest from a legal point of view. If someone contributes to a mortgage/bills or perhaps to the house in some other way such as contributing towards home improvements then they may have what's called an equitable interest in the home and be able to make a claim. If you think about it it's only fair that someone who may for example have lived somewhere for x number of years and put into the house a considerable amount of money over the years then why should the person whose sole name is on the deeds reap all the rewards in the event of a split.
Also, a person cannot be forced to leave a property without a court order should they refuse to go of their own free will.
Again, not strictly true. It depends on his contribution to the household down the line and how long he has been living there in the event of a seperation. A person can build up an equitable interest in a house over the years.
Then how can my will say that if I die, and my OH moves out, the house is sold and the proceeds divided between my children? He gets nothing from the sale. The will was drawn up by a solicitor.
There has been some excellent advice in here thank you all.
i still have a few questions though....
Punkchick are you and your partner married?
I completely understand about the equitable interest, it seems like common sense which is why i can see that many people have advised me to see a solicitor but does it make a difference if you are married or not? (im thinking no)
Why are people saying that joint accounts are more hassle than they are worth? Is this for all accounts or just current accounts? the reason i ask this is because, as i said earlier, we are looking to get married in a couple of years and we were thinking about openeing a joint savings account for it.
Go through each of your monthly expenses and decide which are 'household' and which are personal. Then agree what proportion of the household expenses you are going to pay for - I wouldn't say it should be halved if you've got very different incomes - I'd say make your contributions proportionate to your salaries so that if he earns twice as much as you he contributes more.
If you are worried about him acquiring an interest in your home then continue to pay the mortgage out of your own personal account and ask him to put an amount into the pot as a contribution towards housing costs - you could use it to buy food or whatever.
This way you'll both be left with some personal disposable income but both be sharing all the boring household bills.
Joint savings accounts can be set up so that it requires both of you to withdraw any money - great if you've got a spendthrift partner!
Joint current accounts are great for bills.
But although I've lived with three different people (two of whom I've married) I've always had my own current account and some form of savings in my own name - that was achieved by both of us opening ISA's in our own names any paying the same amount each into them each month. Felt very fair and nice to have some money I could get my hands on if he ran off or fell under a bus!
Joint accounts are better when you are old. It halves the cost of nursing fees sometimes making it free.
I don't know your individual circumstances but a person can build up an interest in a property depending on their contribution over the years to the property. For example if someone has shared a home and paid a proportion of monthly bills towards the mortgage etc.. perhaps doing DIY, paying towards flooring, a new heating system blah blah blah whatever then they can argue they have an interest in the property. The law makes provision for such scenarios.
Your will is just that, as open to challenge as any other will. If he chose and he had the evidence (of his contributions) to back it up then your OH could go to court and make a claim. If he succeeded or not would depend entirely on the individual circumstances. By the sounds of it though your OH is happy with the situation and so wouldn't go down this road. I do think however that perhaps your solicitor could have pointed it out to you at the time, unless of course based on his/her knowledge of your personal circumstances they thought it highly unlikely such a claim would ever be successful.
People do things to make sure that their partners do not get an equitable interest by default - such as making their intentions clear in legal documents before hand (the safest option), the way they structure their finances ie no joint accounts, and their wills.
However, an OH in the position you state can still argue that he has an equitable stake or bargain with your children for a share of the procceds of the sale otherwise he will stay put. Its nice that you have considered your family turfing him out preciptiously but there is also the possibility that they may fall out because he holds them to ransom by sitting on their inheritance.
Why not?
Yes it is. My husband and I did this when we first lived together before we were married and continued with it after. We opened an account and decided how much each of us should put into it every month, then all the bills for living expenses come out of it. If we want extra for a holiday or something we both pay in more. We both also have our own private accounts.. This method works very well.
Just editing to add that of course a joint account is partly about trust but hopefully if you are living together you do trust each other.
And to the person who said they weren't paying anything towards the Virgin account, why not? You were presumably using it when you typed your post.
We have a joint bank account for the bills and mortgage and our big food shop and any energency that may arise(like something going wrong with one of our cars just before payday). It seems to work fine for us. We each put the same amount in each month. Some of the bills are in my name and some are in his(whoever got round to arranging the services). The rest of our wages stay in our own bank account and are for our persoanl bills , mobile phone, car insurance, car loan etc and anything else we want. We never use the joint account for personal bills it's just for household bills.
If you have a joint account and one of you gets in to debt for any reason and ends up with a poor credit rating, you will both end up with a poor credit rating because your finances are linked. If you have separate accounts and one of you gets into difficulties then you will still both have access to credit through the partner that has not got into bad credit.
That works because you are both buying together but people who already have a property and want to protect that for for themselves and for example for their children from previous relationships need to ensure that their finances are not set up so that a judge could think that their partner expected a right to their home. One of the things the courts use to judge their intentions if it is not written down formally in a contract is whether they had joint finances (which is why a joint account can be a silly idea), whether they both contributed to the mortgage (so definitely don't pay this from the joint account) or whether it was clear the partner was just contributing to living costs on ie renting.
None of this applies to married couples as obviously marriage gives you rights over each others property anyway.
Why is a joint account for the bills a problem ?
Keep your's and his spending money seperate.
If you decide for him not to contribute to mortage to stop him getting any of the house in the event of a split, how do you handle maintaince bills ?
The rest of our wages stay in our own accounts as we each have a car and phone bills.
Works for us and always has.
Not sure I understand this.I can't see how having a joint account would have any effect on nursing fees in itself.
Playing devils advocate here but how does someone prove they have contributed to the mortage when the mortgage is in another person's name?
All the bills are in my name. I keep a monthly account and we split the amount 50/50. I haven't done this to stop him getting the house as such. We agreed all of this before he moved in. He sold his house but kept his endowment going so will get a lump sum from that. Obviously I don't get any of that. I'm not his next of kin as we are not married so his family will inherit. (He does not have children.)
I have four children and had the house quite a while before my OH moved in so it's always been important that I protect them. This is not an issue for us. We discussed the money side of things long before he sold up and moved to Northumberland.
It's probably not if it's just for bills and you need 2 signaurest to take money out but I had a nightmare with my first husband and our joint account so vowed I would never do it again.
As I've said, my OH just transfers money into my account monthly and I pay the bills
Not directed at me I know but for example regular deposits from his account into yours from which the mortgage is paid out of. It doesn't matter that his name isn't on the mortgage and a mortgage doesn't necessarily reflect how the property is held in a legal sense anyway.
I know what you are saying but what if the money paid in isn't used directly for the mortgage? I'm still not sure how you would prove someone was contributing to the mortage.
Fortunately, we sorted everything out before we lived together.
Obviously it all becomes a different ball game if we get married.