I've been discussing this on another thread. I don't think we should be afraid of discussing racism in relation to BB, just like we shouldn't be afraid of discussing bullying. BB is a microcosm of our society, with all it's prejudices and behaviours. You see that particularly in the way the groups interact.
My feeling is that BB is racist because it doesn't fairly reflect the number of black people in our society, and when it does include them in BB, they are portrayed to be bad or stupid. This is institutionalised racism, and many of the viewers go along with it without even consciously realising it.
Darren, Mel, Alision, Lee, Dean, Anouska, Tickle, Victor, Jonathan, Derek, Mo, Darnell, Rachael, Ife, -- thats just off the top of my head but none of those people came across as bad or stupid. Do you not think a large amount of housemates are portrayed in such a way to boost ratings? How many people go out to cheers these days...regardless of race people are looking for hate figures all the time?
It's a thread about racism, but I used the example of black people and the way BB brother treats them and the way the public treats them.
My opinion is that there is institutionalised racism inherent in BB and in some of the viewers, and that we shouldn't be afraid to discuss the subject.
Darren, Mel, Alision, Lee, Dean, Anouska, Tickle, Victor, Jonathan, Derek, Mo, Darnell, Rachael, Ife, -- thats just off the top of my head but none of those people came across as bad or stupid. Do you not think a large amount of housemates are portrayed in such a way to boost ratings? How many people go out to cheers these days...regardless of race people are looking for hate figures all the time?
lol ife was strongly disliked mate she was 4th to be evicted last year too or 5th. i still dont evan know what race tickle was, also racheal 1 and 2 were evicted as soon as they were up but with racheal 1 its more because she was pretty ill admit and she arued with john james who women loved, also mo might not have been hated badly but he was still hated by many and seen as greedy mo and darnell was an albino so many felt sorry for him. anoushka was evicted as soon as she was up but again for the same reasons as racheal white and evan victor was seen as agrresive by many which is understandable of course. derek admitted to disliking most black people and allison again evicted so early. i dont know much about mel or dean so cant comment on them.
gentleguy - could you go back to Kewpee's excellent 16.31 post of today and quote and respond to his/her points?
'Cos I don't follow where you're coming from on this.
I don't see where there's a 'race' issue in BB selection of candidates or how BB candidates have been received (both inside their Houses and outside by the public) or performed.
gentleguy - could you go back to Kewpee's excellent 16.31 post of today and quote and respond to his/her points?
'Cos I don't follow where you're coming from on this.
I don't see where there's a 'race' issue in BB selection of candidates or how BB candidates have been received (both inside their Houses and outside by the public) or performed.
Please clarify.
well kewpee is in obvuois denial because most of those hms were hated.
i cant speak for mel or dean on bb1 as i hardly watched that, but come on how can she say makosi was loved.
there are exceptions to the rules of course, people loved brian belo and science but all the rest were seen as hated or boring.
lol ife was strongly disliked mate she was 4th to be evicted last year too or 5th. i still dont evan know what race tickle was, also racheal 1 and 2 were evicted as soon as they were up but with racheal 1 its more because she was pretty ill admit and she arued with john james who women loved, also mo might not have been hated badly but he was still hated by many and seen as greedy mo and darnell was an albino so many felt sorry for him. anoushka was evicted as soon as she was up but again for the same reasons as racheal white and evan victor was seen as agrresive by many which is understandable of course. derek admitted to disliking most black people and allison again evicted so early. i dont know much about mel or dean so cant comment on them.
Excuse me... the post was most 'black people are portrayed as bad or stupid'... Im saying none of these people were portrayed as either, regardless of when they left thats not the way they came across...so what does your post have to do with what Im saying?
And why do you always bleat on about how these housemates were evicted at first opportunity?? Do you not realise that is the case for a very high number of evictions, particuarly if you're looking at women or if you take out when the whole house was up (as naturally nobody after for the rest of the series will be up for the first time). Ife wasnt 'strongly' disliked, noway was Mo 'hated' but it was unfair how he was portrayed as greedy, Victor may have had an agressive streak (but then so did many in that house) but he was also portrayed as funny and probably one of the most intelligent HMs that's been in there IMO...same with Derek.
Excuse me... the post was most 'black people are portrayed as bad or stupid'... Im saying none of these people were portrayed as either, regardless of when they left thats not the way they came across...so what does your post have to do with what Im saying?
And why do you always bleat on about how these housemates were evicted at first opportunity?? Do you not realise that is the case for a very high number of evictions, particuarly if you're looking at women or if you take out when the whole house was up (as naturally nobody after for the rest of the series will be up for the first time). Ife wasnt 'strongly' disliked, noway was Mo 'hated' but it was unfair how he was portrayed as greedy, Victor may have had an agressive streak (but then so did many in that house) but he was also portrayed as funny and probably one of the most intelligent HMs that's been in there IMO...same with Derek.
either way my point is they were not liked, ive accepted that a few black hms over the years were liked but like i said its only a few. like it or not the statistics that wonkeydonkey provided are there so people can keep denyng all they want. considering statistics proove black people are the most likely to be unemployed in the uk why would anything else be different, again only speaking on actualy statistics not he say she say.
Makosi was loved till near the end, and she lost popularity, but was still loved by some. So I agree she wasnt actually loved the whole way through.
which BB series have you actually watched?
i already said i agre science was loved which was a suprise tbh. makosi was liked until she did one thing wrong, like ive said from what i see black hms have to be very carefull to win the public, all hms do in fact but black people have to work harder as there is the stereotype about them already. same way i will argue attrative women have to work harder to win the publics due to stereotypes.
i didnt watch the first 2 series or bb5, but hae seen lots of clips from bb5 and know people who have watched it. ive seen all the rest either online or when they were on tv.
Don't think Heaven can be taken as indicator of anything other than how people (HMs and public voters all) react to a slightly unhinged, distant, fairly non-contributing HM is treated.
Have you been watching the same programme as me?!
The main thing everyone is talking about at the moment is the Heaven/Rebeckah argument!
It's the best thing that's happened in the house so far, IMO.
If you think that equates to Heaven being non-contributing.......then i can't help ya.
i already said i agre science was loved which was a suprise tbh. makosi was liked until she did one thing wrong, like ive said from what i see black hms have to be very carefull to win the public, all hms do in fact but black people have to work harder as there is the stereotype about them already. same way i will argue attrative women have to work harder to win the publics due to stereotypes.
Spot on gg.
Black HM's do have to tread very carefully.....Victor (BB5) has said this too.
I think we both know Heaven is "holding it down" with this Rebeckah incident.
Spot on gg.
Black HM's do have to tread very carefully.....Victor (BB5) has said this too.
I think we both know Heaven is "holding it down" with this Rebeckah incident.
i think heaven may go this week tbh but then gain the only thing tht might save her is the fact that rebecca is an attractive woman and heaven isnt so its a tough one this week, but had heaven been an attarctive black woman like sylvia or racheal she would definately been out this week.
I really don't think people would dislike Heaven as much if she was a white female or even less likely to dislike her if she was a good looking white male
either way my point is they were not liked, ive accepted that a few black hms over the years were liked but like i said its only a few. like it or not the statistics that wonkeydonkey provided are there so people can keep denyng all they want. considering statistics proove black people are the most likely to be unemployed in the uk why would anything else be different, again only speaking on actualy statistics not he say she say.
i already said i agre science was loved which was a suprise tbh. makosi was liked until she did one thing wrong, like ive said from what i see black hms have to be very carefull to win the public, all hms do in fact but black people have to work harder as there is the stereotype about them already. same way i will argue attrative women have to work harder to win the publics due to stereotypes.
i didnt watch the first 2 series or bb5, but hae seen lots of clips from bb5 and know people who have watched it. ive seen all the rest either online or when they were on tv.
Perharps... she was loved but that stopped fairly quickly so maybe she was at an advantage but I feel if any female acted in that way they would be seen as a villian on BB. In some cases women have been hated, when all theyve done is flirt, kiss someone or simply be pretty.
I think the earlier series, in general the HMs were nicer and not so controversial. Certainly out of black HMs I always viewed Darren, Mel, Dean, Lee, Alision to be some of the nicer housemates and I think they were well liked. In later series things seemed to have changed, like including Alex BB9 and Sylvia BB9, I think both were unpleasant HMs and I wonder what motive BB had for putting in two black female housemates that were undoubtly going to be seen in a negative light, especially after Charly the year before.
I really don't think people would dislike Heaven as much if she was a white female or even less likely to dislike her if she was a good looking white male
Yep I heard the Mary, Sada, Sunshine (all seen as different or spiritual HMs) were really well liked.
Of course she'd be more liked if she was male... that could be applied to most of the women who go in...they do one thing wrong and they're out.
Perharps... she was loved but that stopped fairly quickly so maybe she was at an advantage but I feel if any female acted in that way they would be seen as a villian on BB. In some cases women have been hated, when all theyve done is flirt, kiss someone or simply be pretty.
I think the earlier series, in general the HMs were nicer and not so controversial. Certainly out of black HMs I always viewed Darren, Mel, Dean, Lee, Alision to be some of the nicer housemates and I think they were well liked. In later series things seemed to have changed, like including Alex BB9 and Sylvia BB9, I think both were unpleasant HMs and I wonder what motive BB had for putting in two black female housemates that were undoubtly going to be seen in a negative light, especially after Charly the year before.
Have you been watching the same programme as me?!
The main thing everyone is talking about at the moment is the Heaven/Rebeckah argument!
It's the best thing that's happened in the house so far, IMO.
If you think that equates to Heaven being non-contributing.......then i can't help ya.
Probably watching the same show...;)
Suspect our definitions of 'contributing' are different though... :rolleyes:
She's more interesting now, for sure, but up until this latest spat with Rebeckah she was the least interesting HM imho. Spat generated 'cos she's without golden cape and swimsuit this week I suspect...:rolleyes:
Anyway - if she goes this week it won't be because she's black - that is the sole point I was seeking to make on this thread.
I don't think race is an issue at all. It's all down to personality. You either like the person for the way they behave, the things they say and their attitude in the house, towards the rest of the other HM's.
I don't think race is an issue at all. It's all down to personality. You either like the person for the way they behave, the things they say and their attitude in the house, towards the rest of the other HM's.
Well said. That's the things I base my opinion on, I couldn't care less about colour or race.
Yep I heard the Mary, Sada, Sunshine (all seen as different or spiritual HMs) were really well liked.
Of course she'd be more liked if she was male... that could be applied to most of the women who go in...they do one thing wrong and they're out.
If she was male, the girls would think she was quirky and cute, for example if Mark was a black female he'd be labelled "fake"
I don't think Sada was well liked but I know I did and Mary was lovely, wish she'd beaten Craig that week
well kewpee is in obvuois denial because most of those hms were hated.
i cant speak for mel or dean on bb1 as i hardly watched that, but come on how can she say makosi was loved.
there are exceptions to the rules of course, people loved brian belo and science but all the rest were seen as hated or boring.
I'm not in denial at all thanks.:)
All Hms are loved or disliked, regardless of their sex, race or age.
If you made a list of hated HMs people like Stuart (BB2) Jade, Johnny, Emma, Saskia & Maxwell, Grace, Lesleh (who was torn to shreds when she posted on here) Carole :eek:, Dennis (the spitter), Dave (the Lord lover), JJ would grace the top slots along with Alexandra and Derek, etc.
Boring you would get Andy (BB1), PJ, the whole of BB4, Bonneh, Kitten (well she bored me:D), Mikey (Grace's bf) etc etc...
I made a fair argument against your point, and you can only accuse me of being in denial, which to me says that you don't want to look any further than your own theory.
Comments
Darren, Mel, Alision, Lee, Dean, Anouska, Tickle, Victor, Jonathan, Derek, Mo, Darnell, Rachael, Ife, -- thats just off the top of my head but none of those people came across as bad or stupid. Do you not think a large amount of housemates are portrayed in such a way to boost ratings? How many people go out to cheers these days...regardless of race people are looking for hate figures all the time?
ok fair enough:)
lol ife was strongly disliked mate she was 4th to be evicted last year too or 5th. i still dont evan know what race tickle was, also racheal 1 and 2 were evicted as soon as they were up but with racheal 1 its more because she was pretty ill admit and she arued with john james who women loved, also mo might not have been hated badly but he was still hated by many and seen as greedy mo and darnell was an albino so many felt sorry for him. anoushka was evicted as soon as she was up but again for the same reasons as racheal white and evan victor was seen as agrresive by many which is understandable of course. derek admitted to disliking most black people and allison again evicted so early. i dont know much about mel or dean so cant comment on them.
'Cos I don't follow where you're coming from on this.
I don't see where there's a 'race' issue in BB selection of candidates or how BB candidates have been received (both inside their Houses and outside by the public) or performed.
Please clarify.
well kewpee is in obvuois denial because most of those hms were hated.
i cant speak for mel or dean on bb1 as i hardly watched that, but come on how can she say makosi was loved.
there are exceptions to the rules of course, people loved brian belo and science but all the rest were seen as hated or boring.
Excuse me... the post was most 'black people are portrayed as bad or stupid'... Im saying none of these people were portrayed as either, regardless of when they left thats not the way they came across...so what does your post have to do with what Im saying?
And why do you always bleat on about how these housemates were evicted at first opportunity?? Do you not realise that is the case for a very high number of evictions, particuarly if you're looking at women or if you take out when the whole house was up (as naturally nobody after for the rest of the series will be up for the first time). Ife wasnt 'strongly' disliked, noway was Mo 'hated' but it was unfair how he was portrayed as greedy, Victor may have had an agressive streak (but then so did many in that house) but he was also portrayed as funny and probably one of the most intelligent HMs that's been in there IMO...same with Derek.
NO they werent.
Makosi was loved till near the end, and she lost popularity, but was still loved by some. So I agree she wasnt actually loved the whole way through.
which BB series have you actually watched?
either way my point is they were not liked, ive accepted that a few black hms over the years were liked but like i said its only a few. like it or not the statistics that wonkeydonkey provided are there so people can keep denyng all they want. considering statistics proove black people are the most likely to be unemployed in the uk why would anything else be different, again only speaking on actualy statistics not he say she say.
i already said i agre science was loved which was a suprise tbh. makosi was liked until she did one thing wrong, like ive said from what i see black hms have to be very carefull to win the public, all hms do in fact but black people have to work harder as there is the stereotype about them already. same way i will argue attrative women have to work harder to win the publics due to stereotypes.
i didnt watch the first 2 series or bb5, but hae seen lots of clips from bb5 and know people who have watched it. ive seen all the rest either online or when they were on tv.
Have you been watching the same programme as me?!
The main thing everyone is talking about at the moment is the Heaven/Rebeckah argument!
It's the best thing that's happened in the house so far, IMO.
If you think that equates to Heaven being non-contributing.......then i can't help ya.
Spot on gg.
Black HM's do have to tread very carefully.....Victor (BB5) has said this too.
I think we both know Heaven is "holding it down" with this Rebeckah incident.
i think heaven may go this week tbh but then gain the only thing tht might save her is the fact that rebecca is an attractive woman and heaven isnt so its a tough one this week, but had heaven been an attarctive black woman like sylvia or racheal she would definately been out this week.
Which statistics?
Perharps... she was loved but that stopped fairly quickly so maybe she was at an advantage but I feel if any female acted in that way they would be seen as a villian on BB. In some cases women have been hated, when all theyve done is flirt, kiss someone or simply be pretty.
I think the earlier series, in general the HMs were nicer and not so controversial. Certainly out of black HMs I always viewed Darren, Mel, Dean, Lee, Alision to be some of the nicer housemates and I think they were well liked. In later series things seemed to have changed, like including Alex BB9 and Sylvia BB9, I think both were unpleasant HMs and I wonder what motive BB had for putting in two black female housemates that were undoubtly going to be seen in a negative light, especially after Charly the year before.
Yep I heard the Mary, Sada, Sunshine (all seen as different or spiritual HMs) were really well liked.
Of course she'd be more liked if she was male... that could be applied to most of the women who go in...they do one thing wrong and they're out.
http://forums.digitalspy.co.uk/showthread.php?t=1537205
Probably watching the same show...;)
Suspect our definitions of 'contributing' are different though... :rolleyes:
She's more interesting now, for sure, but up until this latest spat with Rebeckah she was the least interesting HM imho. Spat generated 'cos she's without golden cape and swimsuit this week I suspect...:rolleyes:
Anyway - if she goes this week it won't be because she's black - that is the sole point I was seeking to make on this thread.
The fact you feel the need to ask the question is the answer to your question.
Sounds like you're trying to make this thread about you.
Maybe the moderators could see your initial intention of deliberately trying to stir up tension on the forums when there clearly is none.
Well said. That's the things I base my opinion on, I couldn't care less about colour or race.
Don't buy into hype.
Race is an illusion anyway; we are the EXACT SAME conscienceness.
If she was male, the girls would think she was quirky and cute, for example if Mark was a black female he'd be labelled "fake"
I don't think Sada was well liked but I know I did and Mary was lovely, wish she'd beaten Craig that week
I'm not in denial at all thanks.:)
All Hms are loved or disliked, regardless of their sex, race or age.
If you made a list of hated HMs people like Stuart (BB2) Jade, Johnny, Emma, Saskia & Maxwell, Grace, Lesleh (who was torn to shreds when she posted on here) Carole :eek:, Dennis (the spitter), Dave (the Lord lover), JJ would grace the top slots along with Alexandra and Derek, etc.
Boring you would get Andy (BB1), PJ, the whole of BB4, Bonneh, Kitten (well she bored me:D), Mikey (Grace's bf) etc etc...
I made a fair argument against your point, and you can only accuse me of being in denial, which to me says that you don't want to look any further than your own theory.
Fair enough, I'll move on.:)