There is more justification for giving young folk travel concessions than what there are for old people.[/QUOTE]
Not sure of your reasoning for this unless you think that old folk have been working for ages and should have got some cash set by, by now. But that doesn't take into account years of paying bills, rent/a mortgage and possibly bringing up children, then perhaps working less hours so they can help out with looking after grandchildren.
But what I think is important to remember is that older folk were young once too.
Back in my youth, like a lot of other people I guess, I was once a lowly paid worker who never got travel concessions either. Now I've reached the grand old age of 60 I'm still not old enough to get any! I'd be more than happy to forego getting a bus pass though if it meant someone less fortunate than myself, of any age, would have it instead.
I am all for a fair fare system for everybody, regardless of age, who don't have a large amount of savings or money coming in and need to use buses to get about.
Yes I am, several times when the bus prices increase one of the reasons given is the reduction in the substudy paid for pensioner and disabled bus passes.
The point is they cant remove the bribe as they are scared of pensioners and don't care for the young.
They're not scared of pensioners, they're acknowledging the fact that pensioners get off their backsides and vote, unlike far too many of the young. Maybe if the young voted, they might have a political voice.
Oh, and before there are 20 million posts of, 'I'm X age and I vote,' look at the statistics of age groups and % of voters within those age groups. It might be enlightening.
No I dont pensioners bus passes should be axed at all. Its cruel petty and not required financially. Why the hell should they spend a chunk of their pensiongetting out and about?
or would some prefer them to sit indoors all day drinking tea and watchng flog it and bargain hunt
I do think MPs (spesh the fat ones) should be stopped for claiming for a kit kat though ontheir expenses! greedy feckers
And what of younger people working pet time on minimum wage where the bus fair could be the best part of an hours wages each day, can make them far far far worse off working than on the dole
Ah, another who expects old people to suffer so rich employers can get richer by underpaying their staff even more.
That is an excellent response, it gives justification for extending travel concessions beyond the relatively wealthy pensioners.
??
Travel concession are already extended beyond the minority of relatively wealthy pensioners to the majority of relatively poor pensioners, i.e. most of them.
There won't be any cash used on buses soon enough anyway, even in the rural backend of beyond where I live the buses (run by a small village based company)are all equipped with oyster style rfid card readers it's just at present theyre only used for scanning the pensioners on, won't be long before us paying customers will be paying on a card I'm sure
When youve worked and slogged for 40 plus years and paid your taxes and national insurance then you MAY have a say slagging off pensioners and saying they shouldnt get a free pass just cos YOU dontget one at the moment, so go campaign to get one....its not the pensioners fault, duh, that students are ripped off or not catered for
Travel concession are already extended beyond the minority of relatively wealthy pensioners to the majority of relatively poor pensioners, i.e. most of them.
Who would believe that there are millions of pensioners just like myself who are living quite comfortably with no mortgage to pay and also there are millions of pensioners just like my mum who are living rent free.
We all qualify for a free bus pass simply because of our age.
Compare that with folk on Job Seeker Allowance or are only working part time and have to pay the full fare with no concessions.
There is more justification for giving young folk travel concessions than what there are for old people.[/QUOTE]
Not sure of your reasoning for this unless you think that old folk have been working for ages and should have got some cash set by, by now. But that doesn't take into account years of paying bills, rent/a mortgage and possibly bringing up children, then perhaps working less hours so they can help out with looking after grandchildren.
But what I think is important to remember is that older folk were young once too.
Back in my youth, like a lot of other people I guess, I was once a lowly paid worker who never got travel concessions either. Now I've reached the grand old age of 60 I'm still not old enough to get any! I'd be more than happy to forego getting a bus pass though if it meant someone less fortunate than myself, of any age, would have it instead.
I am all for a fair fare system for everybody, regardless of age, who don't have a large amount of savings or money coming in and need to use buses to get about.
And what of younger people working pet time on minimum wage where the bus fair could be the best part of an hours wages each day, can make them far far far worse off working than on the dole
Your ignoring one of the main reasons pensioners get a bus pass, quality of life. is this generation the first generation to work for low wages. no way, min wage was introduced to improve wages for the low paid. in the past some workers would be worse off.
If you are on low pay then get a bike or walk. i am not being cruel or thinking like a Tory, this was taken for granted in the past.
I woz in an accidant wen very young i dont remembdr over the last 8yr ago i got stuck i cudt move iav a buss pass now Wot bov me ? i dont agree that evry partant weather on 100quid a week or 10000 a week they wil still get child benefit
Just my opiuion Young or Old if your getting transport if able pay PAY lol my mum got a pass OAP yet isnt loaded BUT she pays full price DUNO WHY lol must b a horrible pic ha ha
Who would believe that there are millions of pensioners just like myself who are living quite comfortably with no mortgage to pay and also there are millions of pensioners just like my mum who are living rent free.
Many of whom have had their income from savings cut to a quarter of what it was 7 years ago.
Plenty of jobless young people live rent free. With their parents, just like today's pensioners did when they were the same age.
We all qualify for a free bus pass simply because of our age.
Compare that with folk on Job Seeker Allowance or are only working part time and have to pay the full fare with no concessions.
It’s time to get it sorted.
Yes, by employers paying people enough to travel to work, not by cutting indirect subsidies to many bus routes, that's just counter productive.
And you still haven't addressed the point that even young folk on job seekers have many more travel options than most pensioners and don't have to travel for medical appointments anything like as much. In the 20 years after leaving University I visited a GP twice, my mother's done more this year and she's still fit enough to cycle round our village. But not the 5 mile round trip to the nearest GP.
Just my opiuion Young or Old if your getting transport if able pay PAY lol my mum got a pass OAP yet isnt loaded BUT she pays full price DUNO WHY lol must b a horrible pic ha ha
Your mum shouldn't worry about the photo, the bus drivers have probably seen worse, if you could see mine you'd know what I mean, and I haven't frightened any drivers to much yet
Seriously though if your mum has taken the trouble to apply for an OAP buss pass and paid for the photo she should use it, everyone else who has one does.
Very cruel to abolish bus passes especially as people who are elderly rely on public transport and disabled like myself. Well mild learning disability to be precise, after all we don't want to live in the dark ages do we?
Very cruel to abolish bus passes especially as people who are elderly rely on public transport and disabled like myself. Well mild learning disability to be precise, after all we don't want to live in the dark ages do we?
Not abolish MEANS TEST. At the moment its universal, when many other benefits arent. That's what bothers me. To me it smacks of buttering up a certain demographic. That seems unfair to me.
I woz in an accidant wen very young i dont remembdr over the last 8yr ago i got stuck i cudt move iav a buss pass now Wot bov me ? i dont agree that evry partant weather on 100quid a week or 10000 a week they wil still get child benefit
Not abolish MEANS TEST. At the moment its universal, when many other benefits arent. That's what bothers me. To me it smacks of buttering up a certain demographic. That seems unfair to me.
Are people really going to walk to a bus stop stand there in the rain or cold weather, just to use a free bus pass or are the ones who have a car going to use that instead. I dont really see the point of means testing it
Are people really going to walk to a bus stop stand there in the rain or cold weather, just to use a free bus pass or are the ones who have a car going to use that instead. I dont really see the point of means testing it
plus the fact that means testing would cost more than the savings made!
That is a good idea, saying most other counties subsidies public trasnsport in a big way, were we did this at one time when public transport was state run, but we gave that idea up and turned public tranport in profit making for the private sector, the railways are the perfect example of this, no private company would touch rail services if the subsidies were taken away
There are only 12 municipal council owned bus companies in the whole of the UK!
We have this in Edinburgh and the service is fantastic and good value - flat £1.50 fare. It also makes a profit which feeds back into the council as a dividend. It does not suffer financially from providing the concessionary passes.
I love the hypocrisy and total self interest of the views expressed on both sides of the argument on this topic and generally whenever this generation subject is raised.
So much discussion tends to ignore the actual issue and if that is that the whether the country can afford such benefits than arguments about how people have earned them is irrevelant.
On one hand young people seem to be attacked for being lazy, selfish and wanting something for nothing whereas every Pensioner is getting just a fraction of what they deserve having worked all their lives, then on the other young people have no hope and money whilst the old are living it up at their expense. No one see the irony in this and the reality doesn't fall on one side but somewhere in between?
There is a myth that all pensioners today were hardworking and never received any help not like young people today, in the 1970's many would have received benefits whilst bringing up their families a time when one parent staying at home to bring up children was affordable. During the following decades loads would have continued to receive any number of benefits and today as pensioners they continue to do so. Yes plenty would have worked hard and paid their dues but let's not forget the young of today are their and/or a result of their offspring so they have a responsibility to them and it is often their failings in doing that the state is left carrying the cost for.
Personally I think the positives that this scheme provides far outweighs the negatitives so as long as it remains like that and it is affordable then I fully support it, that is what I believe about all benefits.
As long this criteria is fulfilled I have no issue with any pensioner benefits that are provided, what people have paid in really is irrelevant because so many simply haven't contributed a fraction of what they get back, in an ideal world pensions are an area we should be always looking to invest in as surely it will benefit us all, we should defend them and only if they are unaffordable should changes be made but that should be acted upon when relevant not years down the line for someone else to pay.
Comments
They're not scared of pensioners, they're acknowledging the fact that pensioners get off their backsides and vote, unlike far too many of the young. Maybe if the young voted, they might have a political voice.
Oh, and before there are 20 million posts of, 'I'm X age and I vote,' look at the statistics of age groups and % of voters within those age groups. It might be enlightening.
or would some prefer them to sit indoors all day drinking tea and watchng flog it and bargain hunt
I do think MPs (spesh the fat ones) should be stopped for claiming for a kit kat though ontheir expenses! greedy feckers
Ah, another who expects old people to suffer so rich employers can get richer by underpaying their staff even more.
Yet you can't seem to articulate any to oppose the ones we've articulated for old people.
Travel concession are already extended beyond the minority of relatively wealthy pensioners to the majority of relatively poor pensioners, i.e. most of them.
When youve worked and slogged for 40 plus years and paid your taxes and national insurance then you MAY have a say slagging off pensioners and saying they shouldnt get a free pass just cos YOU dontget one at the moment, so go campaign to get one....its not the pensioners fault, duh, that students are ripped off or not catered for
Who would believe that there are millions of pensioners just like myself who are living quite comfortably with no mortgage to pay and also there are millions of pensioners just like my mum who are living rent free.
We all qualify for a free bus pass simply because of our age.
Compare that with folk on Job Seeker Allowance or are only working part time and have to pay the full fare with no concessions.
It’s time to get it sorted.
If you are on low pay then get a bike or walk. i am not being cruel or thinking like a Tory, this was taken for granted in the past.
Plenty of jobless young people live rent free. With their parents, just like today's pensioners did when they were the same age. Yes, by employers paying people enough to travel to work, not by cutting indirect subsidies to many bus routes, that's just counter productive.
And you still haven't addressed the point that even young folk on job seekers have many more travel options than most pensioners and don't have to travel for medical appointments anything like as much. In the 20 years after leaving University I visited a GP twice, my mother's done more this year and she's still fit enough to cycle round our village. But not the 5 mile round trip to the nearest GP.
Your mum shouldn't worry about the photo, the bus drivers have probably seen worse, if you could see mine you'd know what I mean, and I haven't frightened any drivers to much yet
Seriously though if your mum has taken the trouble to apply for an OAP buss pass and paid for the photo she should use it, everyone else who has one does.
Not abolish MEANS TEST. At the moment its universal, when many other benefits arent. That's what bothers me. To me it smacks of buttering up a certain demographic. That seems unfair to me.
Could you repeat that in English?
Are people really going to walk to a bus stop stand there in the rain or cold weather, just to use a free bus pass or are the ones who have a car going to use that instead. I dont really see the point of means testing it
plus the fact that means testing would cost more than the savings made!
There are only 12 municipal council owned bus companies in the whole of the UK!
We have this in Edinburgh and the service is fantastic and good value - flat £1.50 fare. It also makes a profit which feeds back into the council as a dividend. It does not suffer financially from providing the concessionary passes.
That's not network wide though.
So much discussion tends to ignore the actual issue and if that is that the whether the country can afford such benefits than arguments about how people have earned them is irrevelant.
On one hand young people seem to be attacked for being lazy, selfish and wanting something for nothing whereas every Pensioner is getting just a fraction of what they deserve having worked all their lives, then on the other young people have no hope and money whilst the old are living it up at their expense. No one see the irony in this and the reality doesn't fall on one side but somewhere in between?
There is a myth that all pensioners today were hardworking and never received any help not like young people today, in the 1970's many would have received benefits whilst bringing up their families a time when one parent staying at home to bring up children was affordable. During the following decades loads would have continued to receive any number of benefits and today as pensioners they continue to do so. Yes plenty would have worked hard and paid their dues but let's not forget the young of today are their and/or a result of their offspring so they have a responsibility to them and it is often their failings in doing that the state is left carrying the cost for.
Personally I think the positives that this scheme provides far outweighs the negatitives so as long as it remains like that and it is affordable then I fully support it, that is what I believe about all benefits.
As long this criteria is fulfilled I have no issue with any pensioner benefits that are provided, what people have paid in really is irrelevant because so many simply haven't contributed a fraction of what they get back, in an ideal world pensions are an area we should be always looking to invest in as surely it will benefit us all, we should defend them and only if they are unaffordable should changes be made but that should be acted upon when relevant not years down the line for someone else to pay.