I hope you don't find me patronising but it's refreshing to come across a 23 year old with passion and who cares about the way things are. Owning my own home is no longer an ambition. I rent but at 44 am bidding for social housing. That is the only way I can even consider obtaining a home for life. Life isn't about material things. It isn't about how much money you have. That in part has caused this economic mess. People wanting the best stuff. Living above their means. Demanding the best furniture. Having a sense of entitlement even though they couldn't afford it. Now when there's no money left it has become everyone elses fault.
I think life is about having something to laugh about. You don't need money for that. My saying this year is "There's always 2013 reasons to be cheerful".
I wish you luck and applaud you for caring about your future. With regards to having to work longer, it is what it is. I do too. And if you lose your job, it will be terrible at first. But you will cope and adapt. Life is like that. Best wishes though, and go for it with regards to contacting your MP.
Thanks, I really appreciate that. You're right about material things. I never have any money, I live from one wage to the next. I will treat myself to something every now and then, if and when I can afford it, but most of my money is spent on food, bills, and going out places with my friends. I would love to think that one day I could own my own home, but even at 23, it feels like a pipe dream. I live the lady I rent a room from and would love nothing more than to earn enough to rent my own place; but sadly, once I count in the cost of bills, and the fact food is becoming more and more expensive, it's just not feasible. I think the only way I would ever afford a mortgage, or to rent somewhere of my own, would be with a partner (and I'm still looking for them, lol). Something HAS to be done. All that is happening right now, is that the rich are getting richer and the poor are getting poorer. And the more we lose chains such as HMV, the more this will continue. How will we ever get out of recession if we're all spending our money in Tesco and Amazon? Simple answer is, we won't. As much as it's the greed of the consumer that's landed us in this mess, I think it's the greed of giant companies such as these too. Pushing everyone else out, running with minimal staff, evading taxes; the recession was bound to happen eventually and it's astounding that no one saw it coming sooner. I sure as Hell don't want to live in a world where half the population is out of work and don't have their own homes. But it's up to us to do something about it. We are the current generation (and when I say generation, I don't literally mean generation, I mean EVERYONE that's alive right now) and we can't just sit back, like the government, and hope things fix themselves. Sometimes things need a little push in the right direction and it's up to those incharge to do something. And, if they're sat back twiddling their thumbs, then it's up to US, the public, to make them aware of the situation and that we're not happy and MAKE them do something about it. I don't feel that the loss of the high street is a byproduct of the recession; I actually think it's a contributor towards the recession. It's about time someone did something and we're the ones that have to make that something happen. ALL of us.
Thanks again for your comments and I'll be sure to keep you posted on any developments.
I have never used Amazon for anything and I will never use Amazon - based on principle.
Why should everyone have to use Amazon? Is there no such thing as consumer choice anymore?
Unfortunately the internet has taken over the lives of many people that they conduct a large number of their business online. Its not just about cost. People are less social nowadays and many now have a fake existence online.
HMV was screwed regardless of whatever they tried as the high street store has no chance when the target market dont step outside their house. Although stuff is cheaper online (due to less overheads), the drop in social interaction is the biggest pitfall of the growth of the internet, and the high street is taking a pounding as a result. We now have a population of hermits.
Last couple of years I have gone into HMV before Christmas to see what I could get. I noticed was especially box sets were at a lower price leading up to Christmas, then after with a sale sign added to it they we're at a higher price. When I asked why, they said people see sale sign and grab it don't actually think of the price!
There will be nowhere to browse anymore, online ordering is all there will be unless its a chart item. But in 5 years time i dont even think blu rays will exist, everything will be digital or streamed. Blockbuster next.
There will be nowhere to browse anymore, online ordering is all there will be unless its a chart item. But in 5 years time i dont even think blu rays will exist, everything will be digital or streamed. Blockbuster next.
i hate that prospect, that's the reason that HMV is still my first choice for buying CD's and Blu Ray's
Beleave me if you have any feeling for other people you would support the workers who are going to be without a job your birthday wasn't ruined by the company you ruined your own birthday if you buy your DVDs and CDs online then you've helped to ruwin your own birthday this is why hmv is closeing as we all buy online
I've just been into my local hmv and there all sad they are waiting on a call from hmv head office to see if they have to close the doors
This morning I went to my local store to use my gift cards and they said sorry no we can't do anything over the till except cash
I'm sorry to see HMV go but to be honest they only have themselves to blame - we all buy online partly because HMV's prices were ridiculous, and for ease of use.
Just a couple of points. I bought from Amazon long before it became popular, in those days everything came from America and even with air transport costs CD's etc were cheaper than the UK.
The biggest problem HMV etc have is the overhead costs, especially rent and local taxes. It's greedy councils putting up costs and also driving people away from the high street with expensive parking. People go to out of town supermarkets instead.
Who will councils rip off next once it's just charity and coffee shops left?
I'm sorry to see HMV go but to be honest they only have themselves to blame - we all buy online partly because HMV's prices were ridiculous, and for ease of use.
For ll the reasons people have explained.
The record companies didn't want HMV to fail and had supported them, as had the banks. They still couldn't compete on price.
However, as Amazon now have no competition, what do you think will happen to their prices?
A comment above mentions the price of £10 for CDs in HMV...if only they were, that was why I stopped buying from them! I haven't been in one for ages, as there are none where I go shopping anyway but the last time I went, I firstly struggled to find the CDs I was looking for and if I did see one, it was £15+ - 16.99 seemed to be a regular price charged. Made a CD a luxury item.
I am assuming if you just liked top 40 chart music, prices were a bit lower and availability a bit better? What I never got was, IF the record labels and banks supported them, WHY could they not do better on prices? I get all the overheads of running a high street store but even so, if something on Amazon was, say, £8 and the same CD in HMV was £15, that is nowhere near the same. I bet lots of people wouldn't mind up to a couple of quid, if it meant they could buy something there and then. But I will always wait a few days for something if the difference is huge.
Their specialist music sections were next to useless too. I often couldn't find what I wanted in the rock section for example, even stuff that was pretty much a new release and been in Kerrang! that week. When I got more into blues music, that section was ridiculously poor, just a few old 1920s artists mainly!
I really hope they survive in some form, it does seem terrible to end up with no major high street record stores. But they will need to adapt...they need to make sure they compete properly on all CDs, they need to embrace downloads [ maybe people can have access to download direct to mp3s in store ], they need to make it a social activity to go in, browse and buy music and the other things they sell too.
One other thing, a friend of mine runs his own record shop and reports a rise in these opening, a quest for vinyl is behind this, so that is one positive perhaps, a return of the independent record shop.
Just a couple of points. I bought from Amazon long before it became popular, in those days everything came from America and even with air transport costs CD's etc were cheaper than the UK.
The biggest problem HMV etc have is the overhead costs, especially rent and local taxes. It's greedy councils putting up costs and also driving people away from the high street with expensive parking. People go to out of town supermarkets instead.
Who will councils rip off next once it's just charity and coffee shops left?
So did I, I think I bought from Amazon.com as long ago as 1998/99
One other thing, a friend of mine runs his own record shop and reports a rise in these opening, a quest for vinyl is behind this, so that is one positive perhaps, a return of the independent record shop.
I posted this link in the HMV thread in General Discussion but maybe it would have been more appropriate here:
It's an independent record shop's perspective on the HMV issue. This bit stood out:
But my real concern is for the continuation of the physical format. If you’re reading this you probably understand that physical formats are important to many people, probably you but not necessarily you. If its not important to you, then it will be to people whose music you buy. So it should matter. The immediate fear is that some labels just don’t bother to put out physical releases anymore, thinking that people no longer want them. Or they do so and completely cut out the record shop.
If HMV is not there to sell music in its physical formats, will the big labels still produce CDs? Even if they do, will they bother to deal with the small record shops, or just sell online (including Amazon)? If the small record shops can no longer source big-selling CDs, will they make enough money to carry on trading?
It's a more complex issue than simply saying "it's OK, we'll still have independent record shops". And of course many towns no longer have a record shop of any sort. My local high street used to have at least five; now it has none.
I don't like the comments in this thread that claim it's because of the "online generation". It's simply not true. HMV stores are always packed full of people - you can go into the majority of HMV stores now and see this. The problem is wholly their prices. Their stores are full and people aren't buying there for a reason. That reason is prices. Sure, they have some good deals on sometimes (such as the 5 for £30 on blu rays), but as a whole, they are extremely overpriced.
No one in a sane mind is going to spend £10+ more per item purchase just so they can "support the high street"...
There will be nowhere to browse anymore, online ordering is all there will be unless its a chart item. But in 5 years time i dont even think blu rays will exist, everything will be digital or streamed. Blockbuster next.
Actually I think people are starting to realise that you rent rather than own. I know many who have turned their back on downloading after learning this. My whole family will never rely on downloading.
There will be nowhere to browse anymore, online ordering is all there will be unless its a chart item. But in 5 years time i dont even think blu rays will exist, everything will be digital or streamed. Blockbuster next.
Blockbuster - 2 new releases for 2 nights for £10. Complete rip off. I'd never rent from them. I thought they went bust anyway? They closed their stores in my local town.
What about those that don't have computers or any device to connect to the internet? Or those that don't have the internet? These people do exist.
What about choice and those that prefer physical media to a file on a HDD or SD card?
And if (really hoping they are saved) HMV does go, that means less competition, meaning online retailers have free reign on what to charge, meaning everyone precious Amazon and their cheap prices - who don't pay tax - may go up.
More job losses means, more people on JSA (and more people for the media and governement to complain about through the "workshy scroungers"), more jobs going than being created, this means people have less money through not working, meaning money isn't going back into the economy and people aren't buying things, meaning more businesses go out of business, meaning more job losses .... you get the gist. Vicious circle and so no, it will affect more then a few people.
If it does go, that's over 4,000 people it will affect straight away.
Downloading will not appeal to everyone, all my family love a physical DVD and CD. Bought online though as cheaper.
More sad news this week about another high street brand going to the wall. This time HMV which for many evokes childhood and youthful memories of walking up down the aisles searching out various music on differing formats, and for some older folk the name goes back even further to the heady days of the HMV record label.
Whilst it is undoubtedly sad about the potential closures and job losses it feels somewhat closed minded, ignorant and just wrong to try and guilt trip the consumer into feeling responsible for the loss of another High Street brand.
The media, even quarters of the consumer sector try and lay blame squarely at our door for not physically frequenting the establishment, not 'doing our bit' and trying to make us feel like we have avoided a moral responsibility by going elsewhere or just staying online for our shopping.
In short, the market can't have it all ways and the fact is in this current climate, not just the digital age, but this brutal money squeezing recession it's a consumer market.
It's not fundamental laziness that makes us want to shop online and It's not just the convenience, but quite simply the cheaper cost vs the high street shop.
Without trying to over state the obvious the online retailer doesn't have the same overhead costs a physical shop has. For many there have also been tax breaks for lower cost items such as CD's and items under £15 ( ok some of those breaks have been lost in recent times but they have still been a factor in recent years)
If an online retailer can sell the same product a shop can noticeably cheaper without you having to leave the house, pay to park near the shop (on the same road if you're lucky!) Or by using public transport to get there, what are you going to do?
Throw into the mix the fact that the cost of living keeps going up and we are all desperately trying to save money where we can and retain any kind of disposable income through realistic means necessary, and it's a real no brainer.
We will do what is best for our bank balance and our lives going forward, and rightfully so. No one will do it for us and we should do it guilt free without being made to feel a collective sense of moral failing because we chose not to spend more than we needed to to see one less high street brand go to the wall.
'It's a sign of the times' is a cliche phrase thrown around too easily these days, but it's a cliche for a reason......because it's true.
The irony of the HMV situation is that for many they see the brand as being responsible for single handedly killing off the independent high street music shop over the past 15-30 years and that this is some kind of karma balancing act.
Wrong maybe, but a sign of the times......? Definitely!
Its a good write up and they obviously will know the business way more than the likes of me! I guess its a hard one to call, there are so many sections of the public that like music and they will all want it in a different form. The 'kids' will probably be happy with downloading NOW 600! directly from iTunes for example. Or choosing individual tracks and not whole albums. I know friends in their 20s that still like to buy CDs as they want to listen to them in the car [ yes, I know they can burn music onto a blank CD but thats fiddly ]. I also read another comment about the older generation, who don't have mp3s and like to still buy music from a record shop.
Who is now buying vinyl? From what I can tell, again, its a mix. People my age [ 40s or so ], will be nostalgic about albums that came out when we were teenagers for example. Youngsters will want the latest dance remix 12" singles too.
The area I now mix in, still produce CDs but these are mainly for them to sell at their own gigs, not necessarily in a high street record store. And for them, downloads are also massive now, both for people that want the music right now and for distributing to radio shows for airplay.
The independent record store won't take the place of the bigger shops such as HMV but like the article says, IF HMV does bite the dust, it could just open doors for them to attract customers who might want to re-discover the joys of buying physical products?
In fairness, there have been reports of HMV struggling and suggestions they could be the next High Street casualty for some time. I always avoid buying gift cards for more than £20. It just isn't worth the risk anymore.
If they are in a certain amount of trouble and know it, giftcards should not be available!!
I don't like the comments in this thread that claim it's because of the "online generation". It's simply not true. HMV stores are always packed full of people - you can go into the majority of HMV stores now and see this. The problem is wholly their prices. Their stores are full and people aren't buying there for a reason. That reason is prices. Sure, they have some good deals on sometimes (such as the 5 for £30 on blu rays), but as a whole, they are extremely overpriced.
No one in a sane mind is going to spend £10+ more per item purchase just so they can "support the high street"...
I go in there to browse if I'm out shopping, but I'll pretty much exclusively buy blurays online because it's cheaper. The reason HMV on the high street are more expensive is because their overheads are higher. This means they cannot compete with online shopping. So I have to disagree with your post.
Beleave me if you have any feeling for other people you would support the workers who are going to be without a job your birthday wasn't ruined by the company you ruined your own birthday if you buy your DVDs and CDs online then you've helped to ruwin your own birthday this is why hmv is closeing as we all buy online
I've just been into my local hmv and there all sad they are waiting on a call from hmv head office to see if they have to close the doors
This morning I went to my local store to use my gift cards and they said sorry no we can't do anything over the till except cash
Sad day
ummm, i dont. i spend a hell alot in hmv but i cant be expected to keep everyone in work.
as i said, its my birthday. your reply has ruined it further
I go in there to browse if I'm out shopping, but I'll pretty much exclusively buy blurays online because it's cheaper. The reason HMV on the high street are more expensive is because their overheads are higher. This means they cannot compete with online shopping. So I have to disagree with your post.
I understand they have to be higher, however, they aren't just higher they are ridiculous prices. To buy a brand new release Bluray, you'd be paying around £20 in HMV, in a supermarket, around £15 and online even cheaper. I post this earlier, but there have been 3 instances where I've went into HMV recently. Firstly, the JCS blu ray release, on Amazon it was £13, but I'm impatient and went to HMV where it was £21 and in Tesco it was £14. I bought Brave on 3D Blu ray a few weeks back where it was £39 (yeah, £39!!!) in HMV and £21 in Tesco. I bought a Wii U a few days after Christmas, at HMV for the deal I wanted, it was £350, Amazon £320 and in Game £310.
If I was to buy all of this from HMV, I'd have spent £410. By shopping at alternatives (and not just online), I spent £344 plus my game reward points which came to around £6 on my rewards card.
brb - I agree...its not just the fact they were more expensive, its that they were/are way more expensive. Most people would accept a couple of quid more but when a CD is £5/6/7 extra, they are bound to go online or to a supermarket. A friend last night posted a picture of Radiohead 'The Bends' CD with a price tag of £16.99. For a single CD. And that is from a big name band and makes it a luxury item for many people.
Comments
Thanks, I really appreciate that. You're right about material things. I never have any money, I live from one wage to the next. I will treat myself to something every now and then, if and when I can afford it, but most of my money is spent on food, bills, and going out places with my friends. I would love to think that one day I could own my own home, but even at 23, it feels like a pipe dream. I live the lady I rent a room from and would love nothing more than to earn enough to rent my own place; but sadly, once I count in the cost of bills, and the fact food is becoming more and more expensive, it's just not feasible. I think the only way I would ever afford a mortgage, or to rent somewhere of my own, would be with a partner (and I'm still looking for them, lol). Something HAS to be done. All that is happening right now, is that the rich are getting richer and the poor are getting poorer. And the more we lose chains such as HMV, the more this will continue. How will we ever get out of recession if we're all spending our money in Tesco and Amazon? Simple answer is, we won't. As much as it's the greed of the consumer that's landed us in this mess, I think it's the greed of giant companies such as these too. Pushing everyone else out, running with minimal staff, evading taxes; the recession was bound to happen eventually and it's astounding that no one saw it coming sooner. I sure as Hell don't want to live in a world where half the population is out of work and don't have their own homes. But it's up to us to do something about it. We are the current generation (and when I say generation, I don't literally mean generation, I mean EVERYONE that's alive right now) and we can't just sit back, like the government, and hope things fix themselves. Sometimes things need a little push in the right direction and it's up to those incharge to do something. And, if they're sat back twiddling their thumbs, then it's up to US, the public, to make them aware of the situation and that we're not happy and MAKE them do something about it. I don't feel that the loss of the high street is a byproduct of the recession; I actually think it's a contributor towards the recession. It's about time someone did something and we're the ones that have to make that something happen. ALL of us.
Thanks again for your comments and I'll be sure to keep you posted on any developments.
Unfortunately the internet has taken over the lives of many people that they conduct a large number of their business online. Its not just about cost. People are less social nowadays and many now have a fake existence online.
HMV was screwed regardless of whatever they tried as the high street store has no chance when the target market dont step outside their house. Although stuff is cheaper online (due to less overheads), the drop in social interaction is the biggest pitfall of the growth of the internet, and the high street is taking a pounding as a result. We now have a population of hermits.
i hate that prospect, that's the reason that HMV is still my first choice for buying CD's and Blu Ray's
Beleave me if you have any feeling for other people you would support the workers who are going to be without a job your birthday wasn't ruined by the company you ruined your own birthday if you buy your DVDs and CDs online then you've helped to ruwin your own birthday this is why hmv is closeing as we all buy online
I've just been into my local hmv and there all sad they are waiting on a call from hmv head office to see if they have to close the doors
This morning I went to my local store to use my gift cards and they said sorry no we can't do anything over the till except cash
Sad day
The biggest problem HMV etc have is the overhead costs, especially rent and local taxes. It's greedy councils putting up costs and also driving people away from the high street with expensive parking. People go to out of town supermarkets instead.
Who will councils rip off next once it's just charity and coffee shops left?
For ll the reasons people have explained.
The record companies didn't want HMV to fail and had supported them, as had the banks. They still couldn't compete on price.
However, as Amazon now have no competition, what do you think will happen to their prices?
I am assuming if you just liked top 40 chart music, prices were a bit lower and availability a bit better? What I never got was, IF the record labels and banks supported them, WHY could they not do better on prices? I get all the overheads of running a high street store but even so, if something on Amazon was, say, £8 and the same CD in HMV was £15, that is nowhere near the same. I bet lots of people wouldn't mind up to a couple of quid, if it meant they could buy something there and then. But I will always wait a few days for something if the difference is huge.
Their specialist music sections were next to useless too. I often couldn't find what I wanted in the rock section for example, even stuff that was pretty much a new release and been in Kerrang! that week. When I got more into blues music, that section was ridiculously poor, just a few old 1920s artists mainly!
I really hope they survive in some form, it does seem terrible to end up with no major high street record stores. But they will need to adapt...they need to make sure they compete properly on all CDs, they need to embrace downloads [ maybe people can have access to download direct to mp3s in store ], they need to make it a social activity to go in, browse and buy music and the other things they sell too.
One other thing, a friend of mine runs his own record shop and reports a rise in these opening, a quest for vinyl is behind this, so that is one positive perhaps, a return of the independent record shop.
So did I, I think I bought from Amazon.com as long ago as 1998/99
I posted this link in the HMV thread in General Discussion but maybe it would have been more appropriate here:
http://banquetrecords.tumblr.com/post/40545302784/retail-is-detail-my-thoughts-on-hmv
It's an independent record shop's perspective on the HMV issue. This bit stood out:
But my real concern is for the continuation of the physical format. If you’re reading this you probably understand that physical formats are important to many people, probably you but not necessarily you. If its not important to you, then it will be to people whose music you buy. So it should matter. The immediate fear is that some labels just don’t bother to put out physical releases anymore, thinking that people no longer want them. Or they do so and completely cut out the record shop.
If HMV is not there to sell music in its physical formats, will the big labels still produce CDs? Even if they do, will they bother to deal with the small record shops, or just sell online (including Amazon)? If the small record shops can no longer source big-selling CDs, will they make enough money to carry on trading?
It's a more complex issue than simply saying "it's OK, we'll still have independent record shops". And of course many towns no longer have a record shop of any sort. My local high street used to have at least five; now it has none.
No one in a sane mind is going to spend £10+ more per item purchase just so they can "support the high street"...
Actually I think people are starting to realise that you rent rather than own. I know many who have turned their back on downloading after learning this. My whole family will never rely on downloading.
Blockbuster - 2 new releases for 2 nights for £10. Complete rip off. I'd never rent from them. I thought they went bust anyway? They closed their stores in my local town.
Downloading will not appeal to everyone, all my family love a physical DVD and CD. Bought online though as cheaper.
Whilst it is undoubtedly sad about the potential closures and job losses it feels somewhat closed minded, ignorant and just wrong to try and guilt trip the consumer into feeling responsible for the loss of another High Street brand.
The media, even quarters of the consumer sector try and lay blame squarely at our door for not physically frequenting the establishment, not 'doing our bit' and trying to make us feel like we have avoided a moral responsibility by going elsewhere or just staying online for our shopping.
In short, the market can't have it all ways and the fact is in this current climate, not just the digital age, but this brutal money squeezing recession it's a consumer market.
It's not fundamental laziness that makes us want to shop online and It's not just the convenience, but quite simply the cheaper cost vs the high street shop.
Without trying to over state the obvious the online retailer doesn't have the same overhead costs a physical shop has. For many there have also been tax breaks for lower cost items such as CD's and items under £15 ( ok some of those breaks have been lost in recent times but they have still been a factor in recent years)
If an online retailer can sell the same product a shop can noticeably cheaper without you having to leave the house, pay to park near the shop (on the same road if you're lucky!) Or by using public transport to get there, what are you going to do?
Throw into the mix the fact that the cost of living keeps going up and we are all desperately trying to save money where we can and retain any kind of disposable income through realistic means necessary, and it's a real no brainer.
We will do what is best for our bank balance and our lives going forward, and rightfully so. No one will do it for us and we should do it guilt free without being made to feel a collective sense of moral failing because we chose not to spend more than we needed to to see one less high street brand go to the wall.
'It's a sign of the times' is a cliche phrase thrown around too easily these days, but it's a cliche for a reason......because it's true.
The irony of the HMV situation is that for many they see the brand as being responsible for single handedly killing off the independent high street music shop over the past 15-30 years and that this is some kind of karma balancing act.
Wrong maybe, but a sign of the times......? Definitely!
Who is now buying vinyl? From what I can tell, again, its a mix. People my age [ 40s or so ], will be nostalgic about albums that came out when we were teenagers for example. Youngsters will want the latest dance remix 12" singles too.
The area I now mix in, still produce CDs but these are mainly for them to sell at their own gigs, not necessarily in a high street record store. And for them, downloads are also massive now, both for people that want the music right now and for distributing to radio shows for airplay.
The independent record store won't take the place of the bigger shops such as HMV but like the article says, IF HMV does bite the dust, it could just open doors for them to attract customers who might want to re-discover the joys of buying physical products?
If they are in a certain amount of trouble and know it, giftcards should not be available!!
I go in there to browse if I'm out shopping, but I'll pretty much exclusively buy blurays online because it's cheaper. The reason HMV on the high street are more expensive is because their overheads are higher. This means they cannot compete with online shopping. So I have to disagree with your post.
ummm, i dont. i spend a hell alot in hmv but i cant be expected to keep everyone in work.
as i said, its my birthday. your reply has ruined it further
I understand they have to be higher, however, they aren't just higher they are ridiculous prices. To buy a brand new release Bluray, you'd be paying around £20 in HMV, in a supermarket, around £15 and online even cheaper. I post this earlier, but there have been 3 instances where I've went into HMV recently. Firstly, the JCS blu ray release, on Amazon it was £13, but I'm impatient and went to HMV where it was £21 and in Tesco it was £14. I bought Brave on 3D Blu ray a few weeks back where it was £39 (yeah, £39!!!) in HMV and £21 in Tesco. I bought a Wii U a few days after Christmas, at HMV for the deal I wanted, it was £350, Amazon £320 and in Game £310.
If I was to buy all of this from HMV, I'd have spent £410. By shopping at alternatives (and not just online), I spent £344 plus my game reward points which came to around £6 on my rewards card.